• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:13
CEST 00:13
KST 07:13
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru2BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL47Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4
Community News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack0Weekly Cups (June 2-8): herO doubles down1[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates9GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th13Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0
StarCraft 2
General
Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation StarCraft 1 & 2 Added to Xbox Game Pass
Tourneys
[GSL 2025] Code S:Season 2 - RO8 - Group A Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Bellum Gens Elite: Stara Zagora 2025 $3,500 WardiTV European League 2025 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance
Brood War
General
BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu BW General Discussion StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans?
Tourneys
[ASL19] Grand Finals [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET NA Team League 6/8/2025 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread What do you want from future RTS games? Armies of Exigo - YesYes? Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 26405 users

Current State of Affairs

Blogs > Aegraen
Post a Reply
Normal
Aegraen
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1225 Posts
July 08 2009 19:16 GMT
#1
Demagogue - a person, esp. an orator or political leader, who gains power and popularity by arousing the emotions, passions, and prejudices of the people.

- to treat or manipulate (a political issue) in the manner of a demagogue; obscure or distort with emotionalism, prejudice, etc.


The current state of affairs on Capital Hill is not only appalling from a Constitutional standpoint, but on the very premise of how the government operates.

Is it not too much to ask of our representatives to actually read legislation before voting on said legislation. Does it not make logical sense to do this? How can anyone know the full scope, or hell even know what the bill contains if they do not read it? How then can any sane person come to vote for something they have not read.

This is the current situation currently in our nation's capital. Compounded by a President who seeks action 2 seconds ago, on a rush to destroy every institution that built this nation. From attacks on private citizens, to attacks on our Private markets, to disregarding bankruptcy laws in favor of constituency groups to blatantly bypassing senate treaty ratification laws that are etched into the Constitution itself, to numerous other atrocious attacks on the people of this country.

How much more are we going to take before we are pushed too far? Cap and Trade? Here's a little excerpt:

Here’s what the Democrats have planned for you. The program requires that states label their buildings so that we can all know how efficient every building (that includes residential and non-residential buildings) is and it requires that the information be made public. To that end, the bill suggests a number of circumstances under which the states could inspect a building, including:

(A) preparation, and public disclosure of the label through filing with tax and title records at the time of–

(i) a building audit conducted with support from Federal or State funds;

(ii) a building energy-efficiency retrofit conducted in response to such an audit;

(iii) a final inspection of major renovations or additions made to a building in accordance with a building permit issued by a local government entity;

(iv) a sale that is recorded for title and tax purposes consistent with paragraph (8);

(v) a new lien recorded on the property for more than a set percentage of the assessed value of the property, if that lien reflects public financial assistance for energy-related improvements to that building; or

(vi) a change in ownership or operation of the building for purposes of utility billing; or

(B) other appropriate means.

Pay close attention to (iii), (iv), and (vi) because those hit you right where you live. What that’s saying is the state will be empowered to inspect your home if you want to 1) renovate your house in any way that requires a building permit, 2) sell your house, or 3) change the name of the person responsible for any utility bill.

By now, if you haven’t swallowed your tongue and are in need of medical attention, you’re probably wondering if there’s a penalty for not being in compliance with the new efficiency ratings. The answer is no, and yes. Here’s where the bill gets really sneaky. So far as I can tell, there is no direct penalty if your house does not meet the bill’s target. However, it does require that the number of buildings inspected by the state meet certain percentage targets and if they do not, the state loses out on a significant portion of the money it could get from Washington. In other words, the bill demands certain things from the states, but ties funding for those demands to compliance with the demands.


If this is not scary in a supposed free country, then you are what I eloquently call a drone. Chirping along with the deathknell of your own freedom and liberty in the name of pseudo-science and an ill-fated ideology. You don't have to look farther than East Germany, USSR, Modern day Britain (Who by the way, is worst off than the US financially, which is hard to imagine seeing as how 1/5th of our GDP will be going to interest payments on our debt).

Do statements like this not make you cringe?

“If every member pledged to not vote for it if they hadn’t read it in its entirety, I think we would have very few votes,” Hoyer told CNSNews.com at his regular weekly news conference.

Hoyer was responding to a question from CNSNews.com on whether he supported a pledge that asks members of the Congress to read the entire bill before voting on it and also make the full text of the bill available to the public for 72 hours before a vote.

In fact, Hoyer found the idea of the pledge humorous, laughing as he responded to the question. “I’m laughing because a) I don’t know how long this bill is going to be, but it’s going to be a very long bill,” he said.

“Members clearly–and staff and review boards, they read them in their entirety. They go over it with members, and members read substantial portions of the bill themselves, but the issue is–I don’t know who signed this (pledge), but frankly the opposition has been very vociferous, not of the verbiage and bill, but on the concept that it incorporates,” Hoyer said.

Let Freedom Ring, a Delaware-based conservative organization, is circulating a pledge that asks members of Congress to promise to read the entirety of the final text of a health-care reform bill before they vote on it. They also are asking that the full bill be made available for review by the public for 72 hours before Congress votes on it.


So much for the most deliberative body politic in the world. How do people like this represent you? The answer: They Don't. When will America wake up? Is it going to take the total collapse and destruction of the dollar and everything you hold dear before people wake up? That day is fast approaching. Once they get ahold of your health, your home, your property (Well, it seems like in todays world you lease even when you buy, go figure), your energy, well, that leaves you with destitution. We know DOJ E. Holder wants to confiscate your weapons. We know that FEMA camps were recently approved on military installations. We know recently circulated memos hint at the future.

Wake up people! If you don't act now, and soon the situation will become so much more dire (Which is hard to imagine). For a budget trillions in deficit (They have all ready doubled the deficit they inherited in 6 months! Can only imagine how much higher it will go if the Healthcare fiasco ever gets passed), how do you expect to keep spending like this and not ending up like the Weimar Republic or Zimbabwe?

Back to the point on incessant attacks on private citizens. How, or why is it any part of the governments responsibility to police, or to confiscate the property and earnings of private citizens solely on the basis they make more? I'm not sure if people realize, but when you attack the wealth creators and those people who start enterprises you are attacking yourself and your future. These are the people who create opportunities, jobs, capital, and drive the foundation of what made America the economic power it used to be. On a deeper level however, it is abhorrent for the citizens of a country to turn on other citizens and deny them, confiscate, or otherwise steal their labor. This is fundamental in the Declaration of Independence, US Constitution, and Bill of Rights. It is quite appalling.

Well, I'll leave it at that. As a parting word:

"A spirit of innovation is generally the result of a selfish temper and confined views. People will not look forward to posterity, who never look backward to their ancestors." - Edmund Burke

*
"It is easy to be conspicuously 'compassionate' if others are being forced to pay the cost." -- Murray N. Rothbard -- Rand Paul 2010 -- Ron Paul 2012
motbob
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States12546 Posts
July 08 2009 19:37 GMT
#2
source? (besides incredibly biased news sites?)
ModeratorGood content always wins.
triangle
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3803 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-08 19:58:44
July 08 2009 19:48 GMT
#3
Most of this is entirely copypasted from here.

Let's look at how garbage that source is:

From the website:

" We believe in and will champion the conservative values that make the United States of America a blessed nation: small government, a strong and ready national defense, low taxes, and a government that encourages entrepreneurship and new job creation in America. We also know how critical it is for America to win the war against the radical Islamic extremists abroad so we do not have to fight them here on American soil.

Not too long ago, Ronald Reagan inspired a generation of Americans to renew their sense of patriotism and faith in America by supporting economic expansion and a strong national defense.

Today, we find those uniquely American values under attack and once again need to turn to strong, effective leadership to solve the many problems our nation faces.

The bottom line: American Issues Project will always stand strong for the American ideals that make this country special and promote conservative values that have stood the test of time."

Incredibly biased right wing rants ftw!

Edit:
If this is not scary in a supposed free country, then you are what I eloquently call a drone. Chirping along with the deathknell of your own freedom and liberty in the name of pseudo-science and an ill-fated ideology.
Demagogue - a person, esp. an orator or political leader, who gains power and popularity by arousing the emotions, passions, and prejudices of the people. - to treat or manipulate (a political issue) in the manner of a demagogue; obscure or distort with emotionalism, prejudice, etc.
Seriously?
Also known as waterfall / w4terfall
Caller
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Poland8075 Posts
July 08 2009 19:57 GMT
#4
this is why i support a libertarian monarchy

Fact: a monarch has one ruler. Democracy has "the people," meaning everyone rules or there are lots of "rulers."
Fact: a minority of people are not stupid.

Therefore: under monarchy, you have at least have a small chance of being ruled by intelligent people. Under democracy, you have no chance of being ruled by intelligent people.
Watch me fail at Paradox: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=397564
Aegraen
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1225 Posts
July 08 2009 19:59 GMT
#5
On July 09 2009 04:57 Caller wrote:
this is why i support a libertarian monarchy

Fact: a monarch has one ruler. Democracy has "the people," meaning everyone rules or there are lots of "rulers."
Fact: a minority of people are not stupid.

Therefore: under monarchy, you have at least have a small chance of being ruled by intelligent people. Under democracy, you have no chance of being ruled by intelligent people.


I prefer a Constitutional Republic. If only people weren't so apathetic, we would actually enforce our constitution, like honduras.
"It is easy to be conspicuously 'compassionate' if others are being forced to pay the cost." -- Murray N. Rothbard -- Rand Paul 2010 -- Ron Paul 2012
triangle
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3803 Posts
July 08 2009 20:00 GMT
#6
Personally I support an Anarcho- fascist government. Common political science framework for governance.
Also known as waterfall / w4terfall
Aegraen
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1225 Posts
July 08 2009 20:01 GMT
#7
On July 09 2009 04:48 triangle wrote:
Most of this is entirely copypasted from here.

Let's look at how garbage that source is:

From the website:

" We believe in and will champion the conservative values that make the United States of America a blessed nation: small government, a strong and ready national defense, low taxes, and a government that encourages entrepreneurship and new job creation in America. We also know how critical it is for America to win the war against the radical Islamic extremists abroad so we do not have to fight them here on American soil.

Not too long ago, Ronald Reagan inspired a generation of Americans to renew their sense of patriotism and faith in America by supporting economic expansion and a strong national defense.

Today, we find those uniquely American values under attack and once again need to turn to strong, effective leadership to solve the many problems our nation faces.

The bottom line: American Issues Project will always stand strong for the American ideals that make this country special and promote conservative values that have stood the test of time."

Incredibly biased right wing rants ftw!

Edit:
Show nested quote +
If this is not scary in a supposed free country, then you are what I eloquently call a drone. Chirping along with the deathknell of your own freedom and liberty in the name of pseudo-science and an ill-fated ideology.
Show nested quote +
Demagogue - a person, esp. an orator or political leader, who gains power and popularity by arousing the emotions, passions, and prejudices of the people. - to treat or manipulate (a political issue) in the manner of a demagogue; obscure or distort with emotionalism, prejudice, etc.
Seriously?


What does any of that have to do with the fact of the matter of what is actually written in the bill. Do you have a different analysis of the prospects of the atrocious cap and trade bill? Do you support government intrusion into your personal property which is a founding tenant of Liberty and Freedom?
"It is easy to be conspicuously 'compassionate' if others are being forced to pay the cost." -- Murray N. Rothbard -- Rand Paul 2010 -- Ron Paul 2012
Xe(-_-)Ro
Profile Joined June 2009
Canada69 Posts
July 08 2009 20:31 GMT
#8
On July 09 2009 05:01 Aegraen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2009 04:48 triangle wrote:
Most of this is entirely copypasted from here.

Let's look at how garbage that source is:

From the website:

" We believe in and will champion the conservative values that make the United States of America a blessed nation: small government, a strong and ready national defense, low taxes, and a government that encourages entrepreneurship and new job creation in America. We also know how critical it is for America to win the war against the radical Islamic extremists abroad so we do not have to fight them here on American soil.

Not too long ago, Ronald Reagan inspired a generation of Americans to renew their sense of patriotism and faith in America by supporting economic expansion and a strong national defense.

Today, we find those uniquely American values under attack and once again need to turn to strong, effective leadership to solve the many problems our nation faces.

The bottom line: American Issues Project will always stand strong for the American ideals that make this country special and promote conservative values that have stood the test of time."

Incredibly biased right wing rants ftw!

Edit:
If this is not scary in a supposed free country, then you are what I eloquently call a drone. Chirping along with the deathknell of your own freedom and liberty in the name of pseudo-science and an ill-fated ideology.
Demagogue - a person, esp. an orator or political leader, who gains power and popularity by arousing the emotions, passions, and prejudices of the people. - to treat or manipulate (a political issue) in the manner of a demagogue; obscure or distort with emotionalism, prejudice, etc.
Seriously?


What does any of that have to do with the fact of the matter of what is actually written in the bill. Do you have a different analysis of the prospects of the atrocious cap and trade bill? Do you support government intrusion into your personal property which is a founding tenant of Liberty and Freedom?

I Imagine this website was quite fine with the patriot act.
She's got a secret............. SHHHH its a dick LOL
Atrioc
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States1865 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-08 20:37:41
July 08 2009 20:35 GMT
#9
lol

so the bill will allow them to inspect your house if you are making modifications to it, presumedly to convince you to make green / energy efficient changes because the state has a monetary incentive to do so

if you choose not to comply there are no penalties.

yeah that sounds pretty fucking horrendous. truly the same as East Germany and the USSR

i personally am proud of the fact that my country guzzles energy in the most completely ineffecient way possible with absolutely no regard for the future complications that is gonna create. Who the hell wants to have a cleaner environment and a more energy independant country

fucking democrats am i right?
Writerman what
rredtooth
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
5459 Posts
July 08 2009 20:37 GMT
#10
Have you ever been bothered by "government intrusion into your personal property?" If you have nothing to hide (aka aren't a terrorist) you should have nothing to worry about with the government snooping around.
[formerly sponsored by the artist formerly known as Gene]
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7215 Posts
July 08 2009 21:01 GMT
#11
On July 09 2009 05:37 redtooth wrote:
Have you ever been bothered by "government intrusion into your personal property?" If you have nothing to hide (aka aren't a terrorist) you should have nothing to worry about with the government snooping around.



Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
triangle
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3803 Posts
July 08 2009 21:04 GMT
#12
I like how you put the part where you look like a hypocrite in spoiler tags :p
So far as I can tell, there is no direct penalty if your house does not meet the bill’s target. However, it does require that the number of buildings inspected by the state meet certain percentage targets and if they do not, the state loses out on a significant portion of the money it could get from Washington. In other words, the bill demands certain things from the states, but ties funding for those demands to compliance with the demands.
Correct me if I misunderstand:
1. States have an incentive to be more energy efficient but
2. They can't force you to do anything
I don't see the problem with that... Basically this tries to make America more energy efficient. Ok...

From a summer job working with a health analysis company, let me tell you there is a LOT of personal information floating around that is very easy to access. If you are this panicked about personal "liberty" (which seems to be more like privacy), I would be far more terrified of other stuff.
Also known as waterfall / w4terfall
BWdero
Profile Joined February 2008
Netherlands476 Posts
July 08 2009 21:06 GMT
#13
On July 09 2009 05:37 redtooth wrote:
Have you ever been bothered by "government intrusion into your personal property?" If you have nothing to hide (aka aren't a terrorist) you should have nothing to worry about with the government snooping around.


If I have nothing to hide what gives the government the right to snoop around?
Stars fighting! Member #43 of Violet fan cafe. Fuck Kespa.
CrimsonLotus
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Colombia1123 Posts
July 08 2009 21:18 GMT
#14
To be honest Aegraen, i think the biggest problem with the U.S. is people like you, who put their personal ideological views as the ultimate source of logic and sense, doesn't matter if you are liberal, conservative, from the left, right or any other nonsense. People who put ideology before everything else and are willing to twist the facts, use scare tactics and maybe even just lie to support it are the real issue with your country.

Sorry mods for the ad hominem, but to be honest im not even arguing, just expresing my dislike for this type of attitude.
444 444 444 444
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32274 Posts
July 08 2009 21:19 GMT
#15
successful troll
Moderator<:3-/-<
Aegraen
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1225 Posts
July 08 2009 21:20 GMT
#16
On July 09 2009 06:18 CrimsonLotus wrote:
To be honest Aegraen, i think the biggest problem with the U.S. is people like you, who put their personal ideological views as the ultimate source of logic and sense, doesn't matter if you are liberal, conservative, from the left, right or any other nonsense. People who put ideology before everything else and are willing to twist the facts, use scare tactics and maybe even just lie to support it are the real issue with your country.

Sorry mods for the ad hominem, but to be honest im not even arguing, just expresing my dislike for this type of attitude.


God forbid we have our representatives read legislation. So much for transparency.
"It is easy to be conspicuously 'compassionate' if others are being forced to pay the cost." -- Murray N. Rothbard -- Rand Paul 2010 -- Ron Paul 2012
triangle
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3803 Posts
July 08 2009 21:26 GMT
#17
...You didn't respond to him at all.
successful troll
Also known as waterfall / w4terfall
MoltkeWarding
Profile Joined November 2003
5195 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-08 21:41:05
July 08 2009 21:39 GMT
#18
The kind of bureaucratic society which will succeed democracy will not be comparable to the Soviet Union, which was after all, the manifestation of modernity in a form particular to Russian traditions. In America, the same advance of bureaucracy will enter stroking particularly American weaknesses.

I think the succession of democracy by bureaucracy extremely likely, and that in America at least, this will be abetted by her surreal optimism. American optimism is much the same thing as American fatalism, characterized as it is by this liberal avoidance of thinking about unpleasant things, and taking responsibility for them. It is a particularly American belief that the unpleasant side of life can be taken care of by someone else.

Relating more to the topic, I think people should read and re-read Tocqueville's chapters on What Sort Of Despotism Democratic Nations Have To Fear, as it describes what is happening to the relationship between government and society with uncanny prescience.
Mastermind
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada7096 Posts
July 08 2009 21:41 GMT
#19
I got something completely different out of the OP then everyone else it seems. Th issue I see being brought up in the OP is that the elected officials dont read what they are voting on. I have known this for quite some time. I have to agree this is a serious issue. Reading of the bills should be mandatory.
MoltkeWarding
Profile Joined November 2003
5195 Posts
July 08 2009 21:44 GMT
#20
On July 09 2009 06:41 Mastermind wrote:
I got something completely different out of the OP then everyone else it seems. Th issue I see being brought up in the OP is that the elected officials dont read what they are voting on. I have known this for quite some time. I have to agree this is a serious issue. Reading of the bills should be mandatory.


Yes, and this is inevitable in our time, to quote one of my favourite historians:

In the democratic age, more and more people speak. In the bureaucratic age, fewer and fewer people listen.

Substitute speaking for writing, and listening for reading, and you have a fairly good generalization of what is happening, not only in government, but in universities, businesses, and everywhere else in society.
tec27
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
United States3696 Posts
July 08 2009 22:17 GMT
#21
On July 09 2009 04:57 Caller wrote:
this is why i support a libertarian monarchy

Fact: a monarch has one ruler. Democracy has "the people," meaning everyone rules or there are lots of "rulers."
Fact: a minority of people are not stupid.

Therefore: under monarchy, you have at least have a small chance of being ruled by intelligent people. Under democracy, you have no chance of being ruled by intelligent people.

There are certainly good arguments as to why monarchies are better protectors of liberties than democracies, but this is not really one of them. Also, wtf is a 'libertarian monarchy'? Libertarians are against the use of coercion, and any form of government requires coercion to exist. Therefore I find it sort of weird to call a monarchy libertarian. I guess you mean that the ruler has libertarian leanings? In which case why do they maintain the monarchy?
Can you jam with the console cowboys in cyberspace?
Caller
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Poland8075 Posts
July 08 2009 22:19 GMT
#22
On July 09 2009 07:17 tec27 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2009 04:57 Caller wrote:
this is why i support a libertarian monarchy

Fact: a monarch has one ruler. Democracy has "the people," meaning everyone rules or there are lots of "rulers."
Fact: a minority of people are not stupid.

Therefore: under monarchy, you have at least have a small chance of being ruled by intelligent people. Under democracy, you have no chance of being ruled by intelligent people.

There are certainly good arguments as to why monarchies are better protectors of liberties than democracies, but this is not really one of them. Also, wtf is a 'libertarian monarchy'? Libertarians are against the use of coercion, and any form of government requires coercion to exist. Therefore I find it sort of weird to call a monarchy libertarian. I guess you mean that the ruler has libertarian leanings? In which case why do they maintain the monarchy?


first of all not seriousness at all is serious

second of all, a monarchical libertarianism would be essentially that all government powers are under one ruler, but the ruler is restricted by law to do pretty much everything. so picture america, minus congress and the supreme court, and minus anything that begins with the words "department of."
Watch me fail at Paradox: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=397564
MoltkeWarding
Profile Joined November 2003
5195 Posts
July 08 2009 22:26 GMT
#23
Truth is stranger than theory;

what Americans call Libertarian is more or less the intellectual inheritance of the Austrian economics.

Mises was a friend to Otto Habsburg, who in turn is wont to depict the late Austrian Empire as a more or less libertarian society.
Aegraen
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1225 Posts
July 08 2009 22:49 GMT
#24
On July 09 2009 07:26 MoltkeWarding wrote:
Truth is stranger than theory;

what Americans call Libertarian is more or less the intellectual inheritance of the Austrian economics.

Mises was a friend to Otto Habsburg, who in turn is wont to depict the late Austrian Empire as a more or less libertarian society.


I find that Libertarianism finds its roots embedded within Objectivism. It's hard to underscore the importance Ayn Rand played on modern day libertarianism. Laissez-Faire and the workings of Mises plays both an integral role in the LP and Conservative constituencies. So, to say that LP is the only philosophy that cherishes the importance of free-market capitalism is a falsehood. Secondly, while economics plays a key role in any philosophy, Libertarianism also has a specific philosophy in regards to the role of government.

In fact, the two founders of the LP were Goldwater/Taft conservatives. If only conservatives and libertarians would either, re-take the GOP, or defect to the libertarian party that would be a great day. I'm quite sick of all the RINO's the likes of Collins, Snowe, Powell, Graham, McCain, Martinez, etc.

I find myself one of the traditional conservatives like a Taft while also sharing many ideals with Ayn Rand and Libertarianism.
"It is easy to be conspicuously 'compassionate' if others are being forced to pay the cost." -- Murray N. Rothbard -- Rand Paul 2010 -- Ron Paul 2012
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
July 08 2009 23:35 GMT
#25
On July 09 2009 06:19 IntoTheWow wrote:
successful troll

Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
G0dly
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States450 Posts
July 08 2009 23:40 GMT
#26
On July 09 2009 04:16 Aegraen wrote:
Wake up people! If you don't act now, and soon the situation will become so much more dire (Which is hard to imagine). For a budget trillions in deficit (They have all ready doubled the deficit they inherited in 6 months! Can only imagine how much higher it will go if the Healthcare fiasco ever gets passed), how do you expect to keep spending like this and not ending up like the Weimar Republic or Zimbabwe?


I'm curious as to this point; last I checked the external debt now is about a trillion lower than it was in 2007. Not that the nation's debt isn't high, but what source are you using?
The Emperor - The Genius - The Cheater - The Maestro
triangle
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3803 Posts
July 09 2009 00:17 GMT
#27
Deficit =/= debt.

Deficit is how fast your debt is increasing. Debt is how much you owe.
Also known as waterfall / w4terfall
Aegraen
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1225 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-09 00:33:31
July 09 2009 00:29 GMT
#28
On July 09 2009 08:40 G0dly wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2009 04:16 Aegraen wrote:
Wake up people! If you don't act now, and soon the situation will become so much more dire (Which is hard to imagine). For a budget trillions in deficit (They have all ready doubled the deficit they inherited in 6 months! Can only imagine how much higher it will go if the Healthcare fiasco ever gets passed), how do you expect to keep spending like this and not ending up like the Weimar Republic or Zimbabwe?


I'm curious as to this point; last I checked the external debt now is about a trillion lower than it was in 2007. Not that the nation's debt isn't high, but what source are you using?


Read the latest CBO projections and reports. By 2018 we are expected to have a 13.5 trillion deficit (The budget approved by the 111th Congress). Obama, coming into office had a 5.5 trillion deficit.

It took the US over 220 years to reach 5.5 Trillion, in 10 years he is going to derail this nation. Just this year we have a 1.8-2.0 Trillion deficit nearly half of what the nation accumulated in its entire existence. We aren't even done with FY09 and the democrats are talking about a second stimulus and socialized healthcare which is reported to be another 2$ trillion a YEAR. Good lord, can you be any more reckless?

Here is an easy to see CBO budget graph.

[image loading]


I was against the reckless spending the previous administration and all prior. On top of this we have monetized our debt (I urge you to do a little research about this topic), which was the death stroke for this country. No country on the face of this planet has ever overcame doing this. It has meant certain destruction every single time. In lamens terms we are essentially printing our own bonds to pay our own debt. In the end this makes our currency worth zero. The whole destabilization of the economy is all but guaranteed.

We need to end the FED and the IRS.
"It is easy to be conspicuously 'compassionate' if others are being forced to pay the cost." -- Murray N. Rothbard -- Rand Paul 2010 -- Ron Paul 2012
Cube
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Canada777 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-09 05:34:51
July 09 2009 05:34 GMT
#29
sorry what exactly is so bad about these regulations, the mandatory inspections by qualified professionals can hardly hurt can they?. it isnt like the F.B.I. is going to interrogate you about your heating system....
fanatacist
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
10319 Posts
July 09 2009 16:05 GMT
#30
I love the over-dramatic bleeding hearts that rise in any political climate.
Peace~
Normal
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL: GosuLeague
19:15
Quarter Finals
Hejek vs Herbmon
Semih vs Kyrie
cavapoo vs TousaN
ZZZero.O107
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 171
JuggernautJason79
EnDerr 42
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 15844
Sea 1257
Artosis 260
ZZZero.O 107
Aegong 59
Dota 2
PGG 224
League of Legends
tarik_tv11694
Counter-Strike
fl0m7334
olofmeister3413
rGuardiaN113
Super Smash Bros
PPMD93
Heroes of the Storm
Grubby3410
Khaldor118
Other Games
summit1g6624
FrodaN1006
shahzam115
ViBE8
Maynarde1
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream4283
Other Games
BasetradeTV149
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta45
• RyuSc2 41
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• FirePhoenix9
• Diggity2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22079
League of Legends
• TFBlade1438
• Shiphtur629
Other Games
• imaqtpie1276
• Scarra863
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Monday
1h 47m
GSL Code S
11h 17m
Rogue vs GuMiho
Maru vs Solar
Online Event
1d 1h
Replay Cast
1d 3h
GSL Code S
1d 11h
herO vs Zoun
Classic vs Bunny
The PondCast
1d 11h
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
OSC
2 days
Korean StarCraft League
3 days
[ Show More ]
SOOP
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
Cheesadelphia
3 days
CSO Cup
3 days
GSL Code S
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Cure vs Percival
ByuN vs Spirit
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
2025 GSL S2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.