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A dota support - Page 5

Blogs > Bumblebee
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Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:22:57
October 31 2011 15:08 GMT
#81
I wouldn't call ES an easy hero, maybe easy to play and incredibly hard to master as he is that versatile, personally I like playing Lich,VS and ES the most, not a fan of dazzle or tide or antything like that

I also like Windrunner

cause shes hot

atleast in Dota 1.
WriterXiao8~~
DucK-
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Singapore11447 Posts
October 31 2011 15:09 GMT
#82
Generally, OP has correct view on the level of difficulty of heroes. This blog was for the newbies I presume, and ES/CM are rather friendly. This is as all you need is to land your Nova Bite Fissure etc and you are done. You don't need the perfect fissure at low level games. You just need A fissure. However, at a higher level, these heroes are actually quite hard to play.

On topic though, there's one thing I don't get - Why would enchantress be considered "hard" to play? Her heal gives her a way to make up for any heavy harassment, and none of her skills are all that pivotal on exact positioning (like Black Hole) or intricate timing/judgement (Holy Persuasion / Ice Blast). A player simply needs to know how to draw the line between lane harassment and risky overextension to stay safe, and get one or two proper wards to make sure jungling isn't dangerous.


This is because Enchantress has very low HP. Furthermore, you would need greater micro to handle the creeps during ganks or pushes, while ensuring that your Enchant is using Impetus, and not out of position getting nuked/towered etc.
brian2sk8t
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States192 Posts
October 31 2011 15:09 GMT
#83
I briefly played the first defense of the ancients game, but i have played games such as League of Legends and Heroes of Newerth, and i have to say i really appreciate the role of support and how it gives DoTa an incredible dynamic that is different from many other games. The coordination required among team mates, and the correct use of a support requires great amounts of time (synergy developement, playing with the same people frequently), skill, and challenges a different skillset than a game such as starcraft. I, for one, play a support quite frequently and when playing with good friends who you have coordination with,it makes the difference.

PS: A beta key would be incredible.
Wasting time is such a waste of time
Profila
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden6 Posts
October 31 2011 15:10 GMT
#84
The support, this is where I feel at home!

Thanks for a great writeup, it has actually been hard finding decent guides for DotA2 as of yet (I suppose everyone with access to beta is playing non stop). This will be a good reference when choosing character.

I suppose I have decent knowledge on the LoL and HoN support heroes, but the DotA metagame for supporters has been hard to keep up with for the last couple of years.
Ognam
Profile Joined October 2011
United States798 Posts
October 31 2011 15:13 GMT
#85
On October 31 2011 23:06 tyCe wrote:
Thanks for the miniguide. I never played DotA other than casually but I've been watching some streams and commentaries lately. I've noticed that junging is not a given in every team comp. Why is it worth having five laners (including roamers and babysitters) rather than having at least one designated jungler every game as in LoL?

Jungling is almost always slower than staying in a lane. Although some heroes farm nearly as effectively in the forest as they do in a lane, jungling is generally reserved for heroes that have a spell that deal particularly well with neutral creeps (Chen/Enchant/Enigma). By having a jungler, you're weakening your team's lane presence unless they have the ability to be very active in ganking from the forest(again, Chen/Enchant/Enigma).
Darkren
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Canada1841 Posts
October 31 2011 15:14 GMT
#86
Thanks for these blogs alot, ive been a big dota player, but quit about 1 year ago, im really looking forward to dota2 im preaty sure im gonna get back to it.

These blogs are awsome they help me get back into the mood of the game and to relearn everything much faster.
"Yeah, I send (hopefully) helpful PM's quite frequently. You don't have to warn/ban everything" - KadaverBB
Ognam
Profile Joined October 2011
United States798 Posts
October 31 2011 15:19 GMT
#87
On November 01 2011 00:07 brachester wrote:
why are there so many intelligence heroes?

Intelligence heroes don't scale well with items. Agility heroes get more damage, more attack speed, and more armor, whereas int heroes only gain damage and mana. The damage/stun/effects of spells have a hard cap once they are maxed out with 4 levels, so getting more items/levels doesn't change their power. Agility/Strength heroes generally have "steroid" spells, which increase attack speed/damage/cleave, and thus increase in power as your items increase.

In effect, intelligence heroes hit a hard cap on their damage output once their skills are maxed, whereas agility heroes hit the hard cap once their items are maxed, and it takes much much longer to max out on items than it does to max out on skill levels.
N1k0
Profile Joined June 2011
Uruguay1075 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:27:02
October 31 2011 15:19 GMT
#88
I'm loving your blogs about dota , and you are really cool for giving out beta keys, even if i never win one i think that is really awesome what you are doing (:
On the topic of the blog: i personally love playing support and have fallen in love with both AA and Enigma since watching NaVi play them soo well (the Puppy black hole in ESWC was fucking amazing).
Edit: You forgot Rhasta =]
Willeren
Profile Joined June 2011
Denmark15 Posts
October 31 2011 15:22 GMT
#89
Nice write-up. I generally think that support is an overlooked role in the MOBA genre. It's like in football when the guy who passes the ball to his teammate, who then goes ahead and scores, get no recognition. In my opinion support is the hardest role to fullfill right below the mid hero
Pocketsocks
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States192 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:23:48
October 31 2011 15:22 GMT
#90
Very good guide for "newer" players or players coming from League of Legends, I like how you also added in information on good starting items, core items and especially luxury items. I would however, like to note that I do disagree with some of your difficulty ratings for some of the heroes for example ES should be "Hard" in my opinion because some players would have difficulty from just picking him up to landing the correct Fissures to "zone" specific areas. Take the youtuber talesoflumin for example; now don't get me wrong I love the guy, he is funny and likes to enjoy the game regardless of the situation,(Example game
but in this example game when he plays ES he uses Fissure for only the stun effect and not for the "zoning" effect. Venomancer as well I would disagree, instead of being a medium difficulty I'd rather see him as an easier hero such like CM. I find Vengeful Spirit sort of controversial because of her ult, it does take decision making and sometimes quick reactions to get the "best" swaps such as; getting the carry separated from group, saving your own carry etc. I would believe that it's better to see Vengeful Spirit in "medium" but then again these are my own opinions. But overall I find this a very good guide!

Edit: Holy check I didn't expect the video to pop up into the text. Sorry!
When you want to succeed as bad as you want to breathe, you will be successful.
tirentu
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada1257 Posts
October 31 2011 15:23 GMT
#91
Man, I can't wait to play this game. I spent so many hours playing DotA and HoN, and LoL just doesn't feel the same, though all my friends play it >.<.
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:26:33
October 31 2011 15:25 GMT
#92
Certain heroes are definitely easy like CM and Lich, but the rest I just can't see how you can file under easy to play because they have such high potentials of execution. I also thought vengeful spirit was one of the harder supports to use when you started out because of the short auto attack range, and ganking is kind of demanding on newer players.
Benjef
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United Kingdom6921 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:30:43
October 31 2011 15:26 GMT
#93
Mind naming the items . I don't recognise some of the new dota 2 pictures. Mainly the ones under boots, on the first set of pictures is that a salve? and on the 2nd set is that an Eul's?

I would class Enigma as an easy hero, all you really need to do late game is good get ultamites off and have enough farm for a BkB. Somewhat in the same boat as Tide tbh, they have the same job come late game...

Best support in the game tho is Windrunner hands down. So versatile, got a nice disable, finishing move and escape mechanism. Goes great with a Force staff and Mek :D.

I love supports its pretty much all I play (WR, CM, VS, Seer and Shadow Demon) :D, I like enabling a good team fight or setting up our carry to own.

Cannot wait for the damn Beta to go public .

Edit - Also no furion? He can be a support? But I guess its how you build him.
<3 | Dota 2 | DayZ | <3
SpaceToaster
Profile Joined October 2010
United States289 Posts
October 31 2011 15:28 GMT
#94
On November 01 2011 00:25 Itsmedudeman wrote:
Certain heroes are definitely easy like CM and Lich, but the rest I just can't see how you can file under easy to play because they have such high potentials of execution. I also thought vengeful spirit was one of the harder supports to use when you started out because of the short auto attack range, and ganking is kind of demanding on newer players.


I don't think he means easy to play at a high level, just easy to get the hang of. I know VS was one of the easiest heroes for me to figure out, even if I wasn't good yet.

I definitely feel the most at home with supports though, I can't carry worth a crap, but I love enabling my carry and ganking.
Ognam
Profile Joined October 2011
United States798 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:32:05
October 31 2011 15:31 GMT
#95
On November 01 2011 00:26 Benjef wrote:
Mind naming the items . I don't recognise some of the new dota 2 pictures. Mainly the ones under boots, on the first set of pictures is that a salve? and on the 2nd set is that an Eul's?

I would class Enigma as an easy hero, all you really need to do late game is good get ultamites off and have enough farm for a BkB. Somewhat in the same boat as Tide tbh, they have the same job come late game...

Best support in the game tho is Windrunner hands down. So versatile, got a nice disable, finishing move and escape mechanism. Goes great with a Force staff and Mek :D.

Cannot wait for the damn Beta to go public .

Edit - Also no furion? He can be a support? But I guess its how you build him.

Under boots is: Sentry/Observer wards, Dust of appearance, Smoke of Deceit, TP Scroll.

Under luxury items: Phase/Treads/Arcane boots, Magic wand, Basilus, Urn, Force Staff, Euls(I think? who buys this item LOL), Mek, Blink Dagger.

Edit: Just noticed, shouldn't BKB be in luxury items too?
Bumblebee
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
3237 Posts
October 31 2011 15:31 GMT
#96
If you're curious as to what the items are, right click them and copy the picture link. Then you can see it in the .png filename. I can't edit because I don't have html rights, so I'd need someone else to edit it for me.
There is no difference between a knight and any other man aside from what he wears. @robinnymann
TheDeVlin
Profile Joined October 2011
Sweden6 Posts
October 31 2011 15:33 GMT
#97
Enjoyed the guide, I've been playing HoN on and off for a while now and found it very helpful. Would appreciate it if you would name the items in future posts, I don't actually recognise which ones they are.. Anyway, support I think is the hardest role for me to play so really appreciate it!
Thanks for the posts and hopefully the key!
Altsa
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Finland990 Posts
October 31 2011 15:35 GMT
#98
Im not yet used to those dota2 item icons..Support heroes have always been my favourite. Mainly in the form of str teambattle heroes(Crix, TC) or Int ganker/teambattle heroes(WR, WD, Enigma).
AoD
Clearout
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Norway1060 Posts
October 31 2011 15:42 GMT
#99
I love your blogs, makes me really excited for Dota 2. Even though I only play HoN and barely know which hero does what in Dota comparatively, I learn a lot of good abstract concepts from this.
really?
Numy
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
South Africa35471 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-31 15:46:30
October 31 2011 15:46 GMT
#100
On October 31 2011 22:24 Bumblebee wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 31 2011 22:22 drmaul wrote:
I don't see how you can give any heroes an 'easy' difficulty. They aren't easy at all to play correctly. Sure, while you aren't farming and shit on them, there are a TON of other things you need to do or pay attention to.

There always is many things to do and no hero is easy to master. However the concepts of some heroes and what you have to do is definitely easier than others.


I dunno if you can really class things as easy to hard. Just seems a too simplistic way of doing it. Since all support heroes require similar map presence and understanding they will always be hard to master in a fundamental aspect.

Also maybe put something under salving your teammates. That's generally quite important if lanes are under fire.
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