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I am currently in a game development program in university, and I happened to take a course appropriately named "Business of Gaming". My professor in this course owns his own gaming company so he is quite knowledgeable in this field. Last week was our last lecture with him, and since he did not have anything left to teach us, he decided to do a Q&A session with us. Some of the questions asked and answers given were irrelevant to the majority of you, but there was one question that I asked which gave me really thought provoking answer which I would like to share.
The question I asked him was "How do you think society views gamers?". This is a question that was asked many times on TL but this was the first time I got such a response. His response goes as follows (paraphrasing):
Society is much more accepting of gamers today definitely. We aren't viewed so much as just lazy dropouts that live in our mother's basements. That being said, there is a kind of backlash effect going on right now. For example, a gamer, when asked if he is a gamer, might say "Yes, I am a gamer, BUT I am not like THOSE type of gamers".
The idea that he was trying to show us was basically that gamers, although more accepted, now have this kind of double standard. People are now more willing to tell others that they play games, but they do not want to associate themselves with their hardcore counterparts, and the hardcore gamers do not want to associate themselves with the casual gamers, causing a divide in the gaming community.
The reality is that every single person today is a gamer. Whether you are playing angry birds on your iPhone, or playing Starcraft on your PC. It doesn't matter what game you play, you are still a gamer. We all play games because we love to play games.
Going a bit more in depth into the gaming industry, there are games that actually appeal to both the casual and the hardcore. The most popular games in the world, like Sonic or even Mario. These games did something right, in the sense that the hardcore gamers would want to get every single coin and be the perfectionist that they are, while the casual gamers just wanted to go through the level without losing. These type of games prove that we are all just gamers, and we shouldn't disassociate ourselves from our own community.
I think that the day of which when gamers can truly be accepted by society would come only when we accept ourselves for who we are. It does not matter what game you play, or how well you play it, as long as you share the same love for games. There will be a day when gamers can talk to one another and say "Oh yeah I am a(n) FPS/RTS/RPG gamer".
As Day[9] once said, "I play Starcraft, and I am proud that I am a Starcraft player". There will come a day when all gamers can stand together and say, We play games, and we are proud that we are gamers.
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Calgary25977 Posts
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into?
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To me the self title gamer states that the person spends the majority of their free time playing video games as opposed to other things like sports.
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On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into?
Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer".
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Calgary25977 Posts
On December 15 2010 05:01 PaPaLung wrote:
To me the self title gamer states that the person spends the majority of their free time playing video games as opposed to other things like sports.
That's my point. Everyone does something with the majority of their free time. You don't see groups of people discussing the ins and outsof being cast by society as "readers", "sewers", "TV watchers", "shoppers", "talkers", "cooks", etc. These are just normal people. Oh and they have a hobby.
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I agree Chill. I am a gamer, but that is not the only thing I identify myself as being. And to OP, I think that maybe we just not want to be embarrassed to claim to be gamers, and maybe not so much proud of it.
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Calgary25977 Posts
On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer".
I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange.
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On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into?
Very good point, I really don't understand it personally. I mean if someone asks if I play Starcraft, I'm not gonna deny it. But this doesn't mean my life revolves around gaming.
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On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange.
Well, I would guess that gamers value their hobby more than the normal hobby as well - playing games often bring forth very strong feelings of accomplishment, interaction, absorption, etc, and considering the amount of time gamers put into it, they want to feel as though there is something more to it then just playing a video game. This is compounded by the development of competitive gaming, though this becomes another discussion entirely.
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By definition, a gamer is a person who plays games. As such, I am going by that definition that anyone who plays games is a gamer.
Also, why is it embarrassing to admit you play games? Literally everyone today plays games to some extent.
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On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange.
there are many people that call themselves a football player or whatever. "Fanatic" book readers call themselves "book worms" i guess (at least they do in germany). So yeah, everyone does that.
What i think is true on your statement however, chill, is, that the share of people giving themselves a name for what they are doing still depends on how "abnormal" their thing is. Like, reading books is considered the most normal thing in the world, thus not that many people fell the "need" to call themselves a special name for that. But gaming was just until recently still considered a very weird thing, so "gamers" still quite often call themselves just that.
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Calgary25977 Posts
On December 15 2010 05:09 dignity wrote:
By definition, a gamer is a person who plays games.
As such, I am going by that definition that anyone who plays games is a gamer.
I think this is a pretty vanilla response to my comments. I expected a little more. If you want to dig deep enough, your definition applies to 95% of modern people.
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I have a high disrespect for gamers, not because they spend most their time playing video games, but because they don't. Most self-proclaimed gamers aren't actual gamers. They are a regular person who happens to play COD for a few hours a week and believes that it's a real skill set. Playing video games isn't an occupation to them, it isn't even a hobby most of the time. It's just something they do to pass the time, and then they get back to their normal lives. 'Gamers' are an insult to real gamers. There are people who dedicate their existence to playing video games even non-professionally. These people do not usually call themselves gamers and I can see why. Personally, I am not a real gamer, and I am not a 'gamer' either. I am someone who plays video games for 8+ hours a day, and I will try to be a 'gamer' until the standard for being a gamer requires you to actually play video games.
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On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange.
Dancers, musicians, and many other people definitely do define themselves as such. I think people want to define themselves as what they are passionate about. So what if you work whatever job, collect baseball cards, etc... You consider yourself a gamer because it is your passion just as the dancer, musician, etc would.
On December 15 2010 05:17 Chairman Ray wrote:
I have a high disrespect for gamers, not because they spend most their time playing video games, but because they don't. Most self-proclaimed gamers aren't actual gamers. They are a regular person who happens to play COD for a few hours a week and believes that it's a real skill set. Playing video games isn't an occupation to them, it isn't even a hobby most of the time. It's just something they do to pass the time, and then they get back to their normal lives. 'Gamers' are an insult to real gamers. There are people who dedicate their existence to playing video games even non-professionally. These people do not usually call themselves gamers and I can see why. Personally, I am not a real gamer, and I am not a 'gamer' either. I am someone who plays video games for 8+ hours a day, and I will try to be a 'gamer' until the standard for being a gamer requires you to actually play video games.
I have no idea wtf you just said...
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On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into?
I think a big part of it is because for someone identifying themselves as a gamer it is cultural just as much as it is a hobby.
To make an example look at Punk rock (more so back when it was new and not now). Listening to music is just a hobby/past time/entertainment, but people who were punk would identify themselves as such because it was also a cultural experience to them. You can easily say the same about skaters, potheads, and a bunch of other 'groups'. Sometimes a hobby is used as the central identifier for a type of culture. I don't see a gamer as an identifier for anyone who plays games, I see it as an identifier for someone who is involved with a particular culture that has a common ground of video games.
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Calgary25977 Posts
On December 15 2010 05:19 Scorcher2k wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange. Dancers, musicians, and many other people definitely do define themselves as such. I think people want to define themselves as what they are passionate about. So what if you work whatever job, collect baseball cards, etc... You consider yourself a gamer because it is your passion just as the dancer, musician, etc would.
Good examples.
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On December 15 2010 05:19 Scorcher2k wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange. Dancers, musicians, and many other people definitely do define themselves as such. I think people want to define themselves as what they are passionate about. So what if you work whatever job, collect baseball cards, etc... You consider yourself a gamer because it is your passion just as the dancer, musician, etc would. Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:17 Chairman Ray wrote:
I have a high disrespect for gamers, not because they spend most their time playing video games, but because they don't. Most self-proclaimed gamers aren't actual gamers. They are a regular person who happens to play COD for a few hours a week and believes that it's a real skill set. Playing video games isn't an occupation to them, it isn't even a hobby most of the time. It's just something they do to pass the time, and then they get back to their normal lives. 'Gamers' are an insult to real gamers. There are people who dedicate their existence to playing video games even non-professionally. These people do not usually call themselves gamers and I can see why. Personally, I am not a real gamer, and I am not a 'gamer' either. I am someone who plays video games for 8+ hours a day, and I will try to be a 'gamer' until the standard for being a gamer requires you to actually play video games. I have no idea wtf you just said...
Sorry, my paragraph was a bit confusing. I'll try to summarize it.
Basically, people who call themselves gamers don't play a lot of video games, which discourages the very small population of real gamers from calling themselves gamers. Therefore the subculture of being a gamer does not exist.
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On December 15 2010 05:25 Chairman Ray wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:19 Scorcher2k wrote:On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange. Dancers, musicians, and many other people definitely do define themselves as such. I think people want to define themselves as what they are passionate about. So what if you work whatever job, collect baseball cards, etc... You consider yourself a gamer because it is your passion just as the dancer, musician, etc would. On December 15 2010 05:17 Chairman Ray wrote:
I have a high disrespect for gamers, not because they spend most their time playing video games, but because they don't. Most self-proclaimed gamers aren't actual gamers. They are a regular person who happens to play COD for a few hours a week and believes that it's a real skill set. Playing video games isn't an occupation to them, it isn't even a hobby most of the time. It's just something they do to pass the time, and then they get back to their normal lives. 'Gamers' are an insult to real gamers. There are people who dedicate their existence to playing video games even non-professionally. These people do not usually call themselves gamers and I can see why. Personally, I am not a real gamer, and I am not a 'gamer' either. I am someone who plays video games for 8+ hours a day, and I will try to be a 'gamer' until the standard for being a gamer requires you to actually play video games. I have no idea wtf you just said... Sorry, my paragraph was a bit confusing. I'll try to summarize it. Basically, people who call themselves gamers don't play a lot of video games, which discourages the very small population of real gamers from calling themselves gamers. Therefore the subculture of being a gamer does not exist.
I don't really follow your logic or thought process through all of that. I probably don't agree with your conclusions, but I have noticed that some of the most... um imposing I guess is the right word... people who identify themselves as gamers seem to have very little gaming skills and/or play very little video games and instead tend to just enjoy more of the humor, stories, and culture of the games they do play. I noticed this a ton when I was at Pax East.
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On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into?
I agree. I have never understood the fascination with forging an identity around a hobby.
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On December 15 2010 05:25 Chairman Ray wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2010 05:19 Scorcher2k wrote:On December 15 2010 05:06 Chill wrote:On December 15 2010 05:03 Comeh wrote:On December 15 2010 04:59 Chill wrote:
Regarding your final paragraph: I find it strange that so many game-players define themselves personally as "gamers". I don't see triple-A hockey players going around calling themselves "hockey players" and defining their self-worth as it relates to being a hockey player.
Why can't you just be a guy? Oh and you also like games. But you like other stuff too. What's with this "gamer" box I see a lot of people trying to fit themselves into? Well, I think its sort of the same reason that someone that is a really big football player might consider himself a football player. The same can be said of many hobbies - people often define themselves on said hobbies. Because gaming is a hobby that usually takes up a lot of peoples' free time that they enjoy, it seems natural to describe themselves as "one who games", or easier "a gamer". I think being an athlete goes above and beyond a hobby. But you still see gamers define themselves by their hobby. I can't think of anyone else who does this besides gamers. It's a little strange. Dancers, musicians, and many other people definitely do define themselves as such. I think people want to define themselves as what they are passionate about. So what if you work whatever job, collect baseball cards, etc... You consider yourself a gamer because it is your passion just as the dancer, musician, etc would. On December 15 2010 05:17 Chairman Ray wrote:
I have a high disrespect for gamers, not because they spend most their time playing video games, but because they don't. Most self-proclaimed gamers aren't actual gamers. They are a regular person who happens to play COD for a few hours a week and believes that it's a real skill set. Playing video games isn't an occupation to them, it isn't even a hobby most of the time. It's just something they do to pass the time, and then they get back to their normal lives. 'Gamers' are an insult to real gamers. There are people who dedicate their existence to playing video games even non-professionally. These people do not usually call themselves gamers and I can see why. Personally, I am not a real gamer, and I am not a 'gamer' either. I am someone who plays video games for 8+ hours a day, and I will try to be a 'gamer' until the standard for being a gamer requires you to actually play video games. I have no idea wtf you just said... Sorry, my paragraph was a bit confusing. I'll try to summarize it. Basically, people who call themselves gamers don't play a lot of video games, which discourages the very small population of real gamers from calling themselves gamers. Therefore the subculture of being a gamer does not exist.
You are far too wrapped up in what it means to be a "real gamer." Who cares if someone says they are a gamer and only plays farmville for an hour a day? Is that really a huge problem that we need to address? Do hardcore gamers really get furious when they hear a casual gamer talk about playing games?
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