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US Politics Feedback Thread - Page 119

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Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France8216 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-12 13:04:58
April 12 2018 13:04 GMT
#2361
Danglar wasn’t banned because he was right wing or even wrong, but because he turned the thread into his personal batleground shitshow by flooding it with endless bickering where he would refuse the notion that 2+2=4 if it didn’t suit his hard right ideological stance.

The whole thing had become seriously unreadable.

If you post compulsively every 15 minutes for days at a time as he did, chances are you are not helping the quality of the thread, are here for the wrong reasons and are gonna get banned.

(I’m not big on commenting on banned people but he never missed an opportunity to talk about how hopefully P6 would « reform » and so on while he was himself singlehandedly turning the thread into a noxious flame war, so screw it.)
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
bo1b
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
Australia12814 Posts
April 12 2018 13:29 GMT
#2362
I have a fairly large disagreement with anyone at all who genuinely has a "one side of politics is evil" thought process. It's obviously extremely easy to point out the ridiculous flaws in the Trump administration, yet politics has become more of a team sport in the last few years (at least it seems so), so whenever I see a post with an absolute and total lack of nuance in support of one particular party, side of politics, person etc I have to raise eyebrows.

It is particularly egregious given the moral righteousness the left has devlopped in recent years, perhaps as a reflection to the self declared "patriotism" that the right side of politics around the anglosphere seems unable to stray away from, and I'm left with a feeling that people are going out of there way to hate each other based on minor differences in political beliefs. The arguments of "whataboutism" are somewhat hillarios given just a year and a bit ago any criticism at all towards the left could and would be countered with "but what about Trump...", and I received the impression that neither representitive was all that popular overall, and that a lesser of two evils situation had arrived.

Having major news outlets continually peddle bullshit doesn't help either, and it's not just Faux news who does so, a quick look back in time at the James Damore firing showed left leaning publications lining up to lie about what he had wrote, the circumstances it was written in, and the target audience. The inevitable argument against that is that isn't politics, which is true, yet identity politics right or wrong has become a great way to divide people into camps, and people in those camps seem to toe the party line on various things.

I guess I just genuinely believe that most people tend to sit around the center of their nations political spectrum, and having a "news panel" invite two opposing extremes on to debate helps absolutely no one, and has led to the situation we're in now, with one side of politics trying to impeach a president for a variety of reasons related to Russia, while criticising him for not taking enough action against Russia, while criticising him for taking potentially too much at the same time (the Syrian gas attacks), and on the other hand there is a group of people doing there absolute best to see what sand tastes like.

What a joke.
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-12 14:12:29
April 12 2018 14:10 GMT
#2363
On April 12 2018 22:29 bo1b wrote:
I have a fairly large disagreement with anyone at all who genuinely has a "one side of politics is evil" thought process. It's obviously extremely easy to point out the ridiculous flaws in the Trump administration, yet politics has become more of a team sport in the last few years (at least it seems so), so whenever I see a post with an absolute and total lack of nuance in support of one particular party, side of politics, person etc I have to raise eyebrows.

It is particularly egregious given the moral righteousness the left has devlopped in recent years, perhaps as a reflection to the self declared "patriotism" that the right side of politics around the anglosphere seems unable to stray away from, and I'm left with a feeling that people are going out of there way to hate each other based on minor differences in political beliefs. The arguments of "whataboutism" are somewhat hillarios given just a year and a bit ago any criticism at all towards the left could and would be countered with "but what about Trump...", and I received the impression that neither representitive was all that popular overall, and that a lesser of two evils situation had arrived.

Having major news outlets continually peddle bullshit doesn't help either, and it's not just Faux news who does so, a quick look back in time at the James Damore firing showed left leaning publications lining up to lie about what he had wrote, the circumstances it was written in, and the target audience. The inevitable argument against that is that isn't politics, which is true, yet identity politics right or wrong has become a great way to divide people into camps, and people in those camps seem to toe the party line on various things.

I guess I just genuinely believe that most people tend to sit around the center of their nations political spectrum, and having a "news panel" invite two opposing extremes on to debate helps absolutely no one, and has led to the situation we're in now, with one side of politics trying to impeach a president for a variety of reasons related to Russia, while criticising him for not taking enough action against Russia, while criticising him for taking potentially too much at the same time (the Syrian gas attacks), and on the other hand there is a group of people doing there absolute best to see what sand tastes like.

What a joke.

I think with the UK and US (those are the countries I know the most about) the answer isn't as simple as most people sitting in the middle of the political spectrum. I think FPTP distorts that enormously because politicians are fighting for the votes of a very small amount of people. In the UK there is a lot of talk about a new centrist party that brings together a large number of people made politically homeless by the move to the left by Labour and right by the Conservatives, but even disregarding all the evidence surrounding political tribalism, loyalty etc it is an insane idea. This is because the evidence shows that a plurality of voters are economically left wing (and I mean nationalisation level left wing) and socially conservative (hanging would still be brought back if it were decided via referendum). FPTP is not that conducive to producing parties that are representative of voters' views, and I don't think you can assume that's because there is an empty centre ground that parties are alienating.

EDIT: also you can be opposed to trump, want more action taken against Russia and not want to bomb Syria without being a mess of contradictions. I understand that a lot of people DO end up contradicting themselves on these points, but all three positions aren't mutually exclusive.
bo1b
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
Australia12814 Posts
April 12 2018 14:18 GMT
#2364
I tend to agree with everything you wrote except the degree of which you wrote it, if that makes any sense. Obviously people have there preferences politically, economically, socially etc, but I honestly believe they tend to the centre more then the extremes, whereas if you just drew conclusions from media it would be the opposite.

At least that's how I think of it.
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
April 12 2018 15:11 GMT
#2365
On April 12 2018 23:18 bo1b wrote:
I tend to agree with everything you wrote except the degree of which you wrote it, if that makes any sense. Obviously people have there preferences politically, economically, socially etc, but I honestly believe they tend to the centre more then the extremes, whereas if you just drew conclusions from media it would be the opposite.

At least that's how I think of it.

Do you mean people generally tend to be scared off by extremes? If so I definitely agree but I think that's down to perception, the media, the Overton window and so on rather than any objective centre ground that might exist.
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
April 12 2018 15:17 GMT
#2366
Wait I thought this was the actual thread whoops
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
April 12 2018 15:54 GMT
#2367
On April 12 2018 22:04 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Danglar wasn’t banned because he was right wing or even wrong, but because he turned the thread into his personal batleground shitshow by flooding it with endless bickering where he would refuse the notion that 2+2=4 if it didn’t suit his hard right ideological stance.

The whole thing had become seriously unreadable.

If you post compulsively every 15 minutes for days at a time as he did, chances are you are not helping the quality of the thread, are here for the wrong reasons and are gonna get banned.

(I’m not big on commenting on banned people but he never missed an opportunity to talk about how hopefully P6 would « reform » and so on while he was himself singlehandedly turning the thread into a noxious flame war, so screw it.)

Posting things like “I hope people can see past their partisan blinders and view things honestly” is so passive aggressive and counter productive to discussion. Phrases like that, dripping with faux geniality, became way to common in the thread.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7684 Posts
April 12 2018 16:11 GMT
#2368
how long are danglars and stealthblue banned for
It is terrible to die of thirst at sea. Must you so salt your truth that it will no longer even slake thirst?
bo1b
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
Australia12814 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-12 17:33:18
April 12 2018 17:31 GMT
#2369
On April 13 2018 00:54 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2018 22:04 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Danglar wasn’t banned because he was right wing or even wrong, but because he turned the thread into his personal batleground shitshow by flooding it with endless bickering where he would refuse the notion that 2+2=4 if it didn’t suit his hard right ideological stance.

The whole thing had become seriously unreadable.

If you post compulsively every 15 minutes for days at a time as he did, chances are you are not helping the quality of the thread, are here for the wrong reasons and are gonna get banned.

(I’m not big on commenting on banned people but he never missed an opportunity to talk about how hopefully P6 would « reform » and so on while he was himself singlehandedly turning the thread into a noxious flame war, so screw it.)

Posting things like “I hope people can see past their partisan blinders and view things honestly” is so passive aggressive and counter productive to discussion. Phrases like that, dripping with faux geniality, became way to common in the thread.

I agree, and you eloquently wrote what I was struggling to formulate in my mind for a little bit, so thanks.
On April 13 2018 00:11 kollin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2018 23:18 bo1b wrote:
I tend to agree with everything you wrote except the degree of which you wrote it, if that makes any sense. Obviously people have there preferences politically, economically, socially etc, but I honestly believe they tend to the centre more then the extremes, whereas if you just drew conclusions from media it would be the opposite.

At least that's how I think of it.

Do you mean people generally tend to be scared off by extremes? If so I definitely agree but I think that's down to perception, the media, the Overton window and so on rather than any objective centre ground that might exist.

Certainly, I personally tend to think that the nebulous nature of politics and all that comes with it a centre is all but impossible to define.
mustaju
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Estonia4505 Posts
April 12 2018 17:44 GMT
#2370
I'd also like info on the GreenHorizons ban and duration.
WriterBrows somewhat high. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndFysO2JunE
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22675 Posts
April 12 2018 17:49 GMT
#2371
On April 13 2018 02:44 mustaju wrote:
I'd also like info on the GreenHorizons ban and duration.

what GH ban? Not listed in the Us pol OP.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-12 17:51:34
April 12 2018 17:49 GMT
#2372
weird that the GH ban doesn't show up in the banthread.
gors -> looking back a couple pages GH's name shows the lock next to it denoting a ban; but there's nothing in the thread notes, nor the ban thread (and that last part is rare, as most bans show up in the automated banlist.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18870 Posts
April 12 2018 17:55 GMT
#2373
Might have been self-requested or something.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22675 Posts
April 12 2018 17:55 GMT
#2374
On April 13 2018 02:55 farvacola wrote:
Might have been self-requested or something.

They should show up in the ban list aswell.

Oo now I wonder what happened aswell.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
April 12 2018 17:56 GMT
#2375
No luck finding the “offending post” either.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19265 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-12 18:18:07
April 12 2018 18:08 GMT
#2376
There's a checkbox to add a ban to the public ban list that wasn't checked.

The gist of it is a really terrible posting history with 3 pages of mod notes.

edit: was thinking about a different ban
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
April 12 2018 18:12 GMT
#2377
Three pages seems like the magic number.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Nixer
Profile Joined July 2011
2774 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-04-12 18:14:42
April 12 2018 18:13 GMT
#2378
Yeah I'm garbage and screwed up. Can't even press the right buttons

Anyway,
On April 13 2018 00:42 TL.net Bot wrote:
GreenHorizons was just temp banned for 2 weeks by Nixer.

That account was created on 2011-04-16 10:56:04 and had 12755 posts.

Reason: Consistent derailment and general whataboutism not only in the US Politics Mega-thread but also in other threads. This is not an acceptable way to post as it worsens the discussion quality considerably.

You've done it before and you've been shown lenience, that's stopping now. Improve your posting.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/general/532255-us-politics-mega-thread?page=103#2056
Graphics
Aveng3r
Profile Joined February 2012
United States2411 Posts
April 12 2018 18:14 GMT
#2379
That ban on doodsmack seems pretty heavy handed, especially since it seems like some of the regular "information posters" are having a tough time grasping the new guidelines
I carve marble busts of assassinated world leaders - PM for a quote
Seeker *
Profile Blog Joined April 2005
Where dat snitch at?37121 Posts
April 12 2018 18:18 GMT
#2380
I'm working on a public statement for the US Politics Mega-thread. I just haven't had the chance to finalize it because I've been busy with work.
ModeratorPeople ask me, "Seeker, what are you seeking?" My answer? "Sleep, damn it! Always sleep!"
TL+ Member
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