Restreaming GSL

On September 07 2010 21:31 DreamScaR wrote:
Although they are demanding it, and they did say that it was illegal. Sometimes there aren't other options with their servers getting so flooded with people trying to watch. Thankfully my stream on the Gom player was able to stay alive the whole time. I think before even going on the thought of banning the re-streamers as a community we should go towards Gom to say that their servers are unable to handle the mass amounts. Yes, they don't get the viewer hit count from their site, but all the sponsor relay and messages do get heard.

On September 07 2010 21:35 Doko wrote:
What is stopping people from making a new livestream / ustream account? I can understand teamliquid not wanting to get involved but don't think for a second that it will stop people from doing it.

On September 07 2010 21:51 Kaolla wrote:
i think it would be rather strange to stop restreaming gom while practically anything else can be restreamed... when msl/osl were complaining at other channels (such as youtube) no action was taken either... If gom would make it's stream more accessible and working well, then i could see the point in this, but at rignt now i don't see why you would make an exception for gom...

Also it's not as if they are totally unaware of the number of ppl watching it through streams here. Since it's 100% sure that they do know this, I think it should be very clear to them that their own stream obviously sucks compared to other free streaming services -_- Their arguments seem rather weak to me.

On September 07 2010 22:36 sleepingdog wrote:
the only real problem is - why the hell would GOMTV think that anybody would watch the re-stream if their stream worked just fine? I mean, seriously, this doesn't make any sense at all, people are not "that" dumb in general

if maybe 10% are too layz to register, but the rest I guess is just - like me - unable to watch the stream due to crashing gom-player or lag-issues

On September 07 2010 21:56 Cider wrote:


But the point is, action was taken this time. They requested that restreamers stop and the people not watch restreams and pointed out that it was illegal. A Gom official also posted in the GSL thread asking people to not restream. Anyone restreaming GSL or watching a restream is thus ignoring their wishes and being disrespectful to GomTV.

I wish someone would justify their "well the free stream sucks so therefore i'm justified in watching a restream" argument. This argument is popping up all over the forums with absolutely no backing or reasoning behind it whatsoever. The fact that it is streamed on the internet does not mean you are entitled to watch it.

On September 07 2010 22:44 ithree wrote:


Furthermore TL complied when MLG and IEM requested it, whats with this double standard ?

Isn't free English casting of Korean games what TL always wanted ? isn't this the holy grail ?

Instead the mods are supporting copyright infringement through illegal streams. You have zero right to watch the GSL, if they reach capacity you can't watch, tough shit. They are the copyright holders and have the right to decide how the content is dealt with.

Technically TL pro-league streams have always been illegal, the WTO has already ruled that even where language support or intent to sell to a region doesn't exist it remains illegal, just look to Japanese Anime. Its generally turned a blind eye to, but this, they are providing directly for and to the world, facilitating access and providing support. It is not perfect, people are having problems but it is far from the whole and again irrelevant.


Why do they care?
Well doesn't really matter tbh, whine about 'fairness' all you like it means nothing, there is not an atom of it in universe and no law on the planet will help you in such an abstract thing.

But if you must know advertising on the internet is different than offline; they expect all kinds of information about the people they're reaching, in this case geographic and pure view count seems to be their primary concern.
So be bypassing the offical stream you are denying the advertiser and GOM the real information about their success or failure and can only serve to attract litigation or cut backs in service. Is that what you want ?



If you have paid for HQ on the other hand, then you do and feel free to bitch and warn others, but do so primarily on the Gom site/email where something can be done about it.

tl;dr take your self righteous entitlement and shove it.

Everyone can get access (sheer number of streams)
More people can see SC2
Support ProLeauge, kill Gretch (Gom is using foreigners as evidence and funds to fight Kespa, so give HQ away for free etc)

They're illegal (no ifs not buts, pure and simple)
Impossible to let everyone see it (someone will always have problems getting access)
Hurts the GSL
TL becomes enemy of Blizz/Gom (though we're too big to kill/fight atm, didn't kespa say that ?)
|- - -> TL supports pirates

On September 07 2010 23:56 Zona wrote:
What about the Korean stream - is it freely available too?

On September 07 2010 22:43 st3roids wrote:
Lets ban free speech as well

Hello people at GOMTV.net. Please read through this post, and give us some sort of reply. It is also important to note that this is only in regards to SD restreams.

On Day 2, the English commentators were instructed to tell us not to watch restreams. On Day 3, they restated this, saying that it was illegal, stopped sponsors from getting correct data on the amount of exposure, and stopped GOMTV.net from knowing how successful the streams are, and whether any technical changes needed to be made.

Now, let me tell you how I ended up watching restreams:

On Day 1, right off the bat, the GOM Player would not load the stream. Then, when it did, the stream usually did not last more than 15 minutes; it would just close, retuning me to the orange screen. Trying to start up the stream again took several tries, where sometimes the GOM Player didn't respond at all, sometimes GOM Player froze, and sometimes it told me that I was missing something,error 0x00000071. It took up to ten minutes to fix the stream each time, and it seems as if it was time, and not anything I was doing that actually fixed the stream. Consider how this happened at least twelve times during Day 1. How could you expect anyone to stay on GOM Player after that? I went to watch a restream.

On Day 2, someone had posted a direct url that, when put into the GOM Player, would (allegedly) play better than if the stream were actually launched from the website. Whether this was true, or you fixed up some of the technical problems, I do not know. What I do know is that the stream for Day 2 worked a lot better for me. I am sure that you do not want me copy the url, as it may do bad for the servers, but it works. I had perhaps four times, significantly less, where the GOM Player just stopped. Keep in mind that you can't just restart the GOM Player. It gives you all sorts of errors, and by the time it is actually fixed, you have no idea what actually fixed it. Typically, it takes 15 minutes for it to fix itself, when not immediately. What did I do during the times that it was down? I watched a restream of course.

On Day 3, I used to same link. It worked out fine in the beginning, then started to die again, by the time cellawerra took the stage. I wanted to see this match, and I knew how difficult it would be for me to restart the stream. Tell me, what option do I have at this point but to watch a restream? I think the stream started working again 20 minutes towards the end, but do you expect me to constantly check to see if my stream will start working again? I respect your concerns, so I will try to watch my own stream if possible, but if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. I have a restream on and muted in the background every day, for when my stream crashes.

Now, let's take a look at some other people's concerns. Some complain that the stream doesn't support Chrome. This is not a valid argument. Other browsers are free, so one should download the free browser and watch under GOMTV.net's rules. That said, you can see why people don't want to do that, right? Other's say that there is no mac support. Do you expect them to buy a new computer in order to watch the streams?

Restreams are also a part of the community. This is not something that legitimizes them, but I did want to point it out. When I watched my own stream, I had a restream open because I wanted to chat with the people also watching that stream. There were about 4500 people in there. How many were actually there for the chatting only, like me, I do not know.

Also, it is to my understanding that, when streams did not work for some people, you sent them over to the TeamLiquid restreams. Now, you are calling it illegal (and I'm not saying it's not), but telling people to go there at the same time? Could you please explain this, and I apologize if I have my information incorrect.


My final point is this. No one wants to watch restreams. Personal streams have higher quality and flexibility. The only reason we are watching restreams is because we are forced to, some way or another. You have stated that you need people to watch your streams in order for you to know of any lag, server overloads, and other technical issues. Well guess what? You already have them. That's why the restreams are there! You don't expect people to sit with a broken GOM Player in front of them, its orange screen shining, and not doing anything, do you? Do you think anyone will just sit there and be content that you may or may not be getting the information that their stream is not working, when they can easily go watch a restream? Some people's streams lag so bad that they have to watch restreams. Others don't have the right "equipment" to watch their own streams.

The point is this: you are not losing any viewers because of restreams. People who are watching restreams would not be watching through the GOM Player if the restreams were stopped, because it simply doesn't work. If you want more viewers, you need to fix your technical problems. When I press that "launch stream" button, a stream has to actually show.

I sincerely appreciate the fact that you are providing free streams for everybody. However, if it doesn't work, it might as well not be there.

On September 08 2010 15:41 Schnake wrote:
I think one problem is that TL cannot take down re-streamers, it can only prevent exposure. Gom has to notify livestream, ustream etc. to enforce their rights.

On September 09 2010 18:08 Immersion_ wrote:
What I don't understand is the 1k + watching restreams right now? Surely GOM is working for everyone this early in the day?

On September 09 2010 18:46 RobRoy2501 wrote:
Listen, gom needs to fix their stuff before they say anything. I have paid for the *NOT* HQ vods and the HQ stream and tonight was the first time I watched the HQ stream. It worked halfway through one game and now its choppy to the point of unwatchable. Right now I have it open and muted(so they still get their numbers) and Im watching a restream. Kind of a sad solution but Im willing to pay 20, I consider it more of a donation, but for the love of god I just want a stream/vod with enough quality to read the resources and worker count.

Im willing to pay 20, I consider it more of a donation

On September 10 2010 07:24 Hikari wrote:
Not as many people have trouble with octoshape,
TheGunRun and MLG run very good streams for free.
GOM's stream is plagued with technical difficulties, from gom player to lag.

On September 09 2010 18:46 RobRoy2501 wrote:

should be the attitude of everyone who cares about e-sports, I realize this is not reasonable at all but I wish people would at least have a little more respect for what the GSL is doing for sc2..

I'm pretty sure if the viewer numbers are high throughout this season and they can show the sponsors that this is something worthwhile then the quality will improve a lot and it'll all have been worth it, I wish people would be more supportive of this great event that's all ;/

On September 08 2010 15:26 Nilaus wrote:
This discussion has nothing to do with the stream quality, capacity or price.

GomTV asked everyone (probably mostly directed at TL) to stop restreaming.
TL should comply without hesitation. TL complied with MLG and ESL, so why are they not respecting the wishes of GSL.

On September 10 2010 17:06 Plexa wrote:
MLG and ESL contacted us directly and requested the streams removed, we obliged. I haven't watched any of the GOM casts, so I don't know what has been said or what has not been said on stream, but I do know that GOM have not made any effort to contact us about the restreams despite the fact the have ample means to do so. We are happy to cooperate with them, but they need to open the dialogue first.

On September 07 2010 11:19 JunkkaGom wrote:
Hello,

It has been quite a while since I posted here.

It is understandable that many people are looking for an alternative source to watch the games,
as our service is still facing many technical difficulties and thus not able to meet your demands.
We are putting lot of effort to fix the problems, and although this will take lot of time and resource, we are determined to meet the demands of oversea fans.

However, I sincerely advise you to restrain from providing or viewing unathorized restreams.
Such act violates our copyright and it will make our job more difficult.
The more people watch GSL at http://www.gomtv.net/2010gslopens1/ the easier it is for us to gain and provide the support we need.

On September 10 2010 18:15 cyprin wrote:




Is that not direct enough?

On September 10 2010 18:55 Grond wrote:


I think you missed a part.

On September 11 2010 00:20 Brenbenn wrote:
It's funny how you have to do your best to word your argument in a convoluted way to try to make it sound reasonable when all I had to do to explain why it's wrong to to type out the situation plainly. Trying to combine together the situations and experiences of those that paid vs those that didn't in your response is where it starts to become weak.

Arguing about their infrastructure not being up to the task is a perfectly acceptable argument for those that have paid, it is not so acceptable when it is being used to encapsulate the arguement regarding the experience of those that have not.

If you did not pay for a service that was provided out of good will and then ended up recieving the service at a level below your own expectations you are still not entitled to anything.

No paying user has been turned away from goms door, the quality certainly has not matched what has been promised but as a paying user I have yet to be unable to log onto either the HQ or the LQ stream at any time. If you have not paid for the service then you can hardly argue about turning up to a free open to all screening at a movie theatre but found all the seating filled, you just have to wait till the next day/screening to watch the show.

See if you had just written plainly 'I did not pay to watch the stream but think I should be able to watch it at all times whenever I want using whatever means I need to anyway' I would not have had to ramble like that :/ Just be honest, it's cool, personal choice and all that.

All above arguements do not apply to those that have actually paid for the stream, all the people that fall into that catagory are certainly currently being ripped off with the service Gom has provided.

No paying user has been turned away from goms door

On September 11 2010 01:01 Brenbenn wrote:

I have more arguments in me but it's hitting 2am here and i'm all out of caffiene (pity me :/) so I shall just leave this as you and I disagree'ing, which is cool.

On September 11 2010 04:32 tofucake wrote:

Off-topic, but that's what Blizzard is doing to me. I can't buy an EU copy and customer support basically said "tough shit".

Seems like a lot of SC2 business is doing this.

On September 11 2010 05:46 Sad Hermit wrote:
i would be for taking down the streams if the price to watch it on gom player wasnt what it is.
you can argue that paying the money will be supporting e-sports but the cost for letting someone watch your stream online would never be over a dollar, and having to pay even more for VODs? ridiculous.

i would be more than willing to pay for this stream if it was a reasonable price and so should everyone else, making taking down the streams reasonable as well.
i however will not support gretech for trying to get rich off e-sports. and neither should anyone else, unless they enjoy giving their money away or if their intentions are to share the stream with the world.

On September 11 2010 07:09 danson wrote:



Stream quality could be better, but you are paying for access to a sporting/entertainment event.

this event, is a month long and you will get approximately 75hours of content.

with their current pricing, you are paying about a $0.26 for every hour of casting they do. It is very reasonable... much more bang for your buck than any of the other premium tournies.

On September 11 2010 07:42 Sad Hermit wrote:


i agree but thats not my point, it costs nearly nothing to broadcast the stream to people, knowing this they charge 20 dollars and 30 dollars. WTF

On September 11 2010 11:53 Hikari wrote:
The only thing holding me back from paying that $20, tbh, is all the negative comments I have hear from people about the VoD, and that I have had so much trouble using the free stream that I do not trust the "HQ" stream. There are certain players I would like to cheer for (cella/tlo/tester) but at the same time the quality of the games suck in comparison to the last IEM, the quality of the stream is horrible compared to MLG, and quality of the cast is no where close to the famous Chill vs CombatEX....

On September 11 2010 14:27 Hot_Bid wrote:
I have purchased the season ticket and the HQ stream is perfectly smooth for me, it has never lagged even once throughout all the broadcast days.

On September 11 2010 07:09 danson wrote:
this event, is a month long and you will get approximately 75hours of content.

with their current pricing, you are paying about a $0.26 for every hour of casting they do. It is very reasonable... much more bang for your buck than any of the other premium tournies.

On September 10 2010 20:40 R1CH wrote:
...

On September 13 2010 22:56 tofucake wrote:

Don't post until after the cast is over.


It's obviously far better than Friday, but it's still a pretty big issue.

On September 14 2010 21:13 cyprin wrote:
100% uptime for the gom stream today
Do people really still need restreams?
It's kind of disgraceful.

On November 30 2010 20:54 ZeusWTFrudoin wrote:
Well thank you guys for not responding to my question and Disabling my stream, would of loved to have a answer before hand.

On November 30 2010 21:36 Hot_Bid wrote:
You can have your ustream / livestream or other accounts disabled if you continue restreaming. As a courtesy to GOM we're disabling restreams.


The answer is no you can't restream either HQ or LQ streams. Your stream has been re-enabled, do not do it again.

On December 01 2010 08:14 AcrossFiveJulys wrote:


This is really bad news for linux users (including me when I don't have my laptop on me). There is no GOM player for linux afaik.

On December 01 2010 10:56 jalstar wrote:
Why disable LQ restreams? I can never seem to connect to the official one, I always get the "connection limit has been reached" message or something like that.

On December 02 2010 00:49 tofucake wrote:
I still think TL should figure out a way to get an official LQ restream permission from GOM for when those kinds of errors happen.

On December 04 2010 07:50 Chill wrote:
Why are you posting this here?

On December 04 2010 10:16 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:

ok i help you.

restreaming means about gsl, beeing accessible. sadly it is not.

i and thousands of people around never ever get to watch a gsl event live from gomtv site. because it sucks. always get "too much we cannot handle, we work wrong and you cannot watch".

hint get ?

On December 04 2010 10:16 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:

ok i help you.

restreaming means about gsl, beeing accessible. sadly it is not.

i and thousands of people around never ever get to watch a gsl event live from gomtv site. because it sucks. always get "too much we cannot handle, we work wrong and you cannot watch".

hint get ?

On December 07 2010 11:40 Toxiferous wrote:
No more restreams? No VODS allowed on youtube? Guess I'm stuck reading text over gsl results ._.

On January 13 2011 22:59 quickshot10101 wrote:
its sad, there are SOO MANY PEOPLE unable to use/watch the official gsl stream free or paid. I think restreams atm help keep gsl alive. I really hope the gsl either adds native vlc support (though u can get it to work on vlc allrdy if u know the tricks) or just improve there system they allrdy have. cause atm its flawed

On January 18 2011 21:21 LittLeD wrote:
ON AIR:
→ [GSL] Code A Ro8
Stream: Sverige614

So I guess TL has now allowed restreams? Im confused

On January 18 2011 21:21 LittLeD wrote:
ON AIR:
→ [GSL] Code A Ro8
Stream: Sverige614

So I guess TL has now allowed restreams? Im confused

On January 18 2011 20:57 Scrimpton wrote:

Sorry but that's just so off base it actually made me slightly embarrassed for you.
Gotta say, I've been subscribed to GOM since season 1, but occasionaly i'm watching the free stream at work and I've never had a problem.

Pretty disappointing that every time GSL is on, there are 5-10 re-streams on TL.

If it's that hard for the busy TL staff to monitor their stream content when GSL goes live, then go ahead and ask for someone to volunteer to do it. Hell 3 streams right now specifically state "restreaming gsl" in their description.

Very bad situation.. people need to learn that they don't have a "right" to other peoples content.
The free stream works, and if it doesn't work for you, then the option to go premium is there for less than a burger and a coke.

On January 18 2011 20:57 Scrimpton wrote:




Sorry but that's just so off base it actually made me slightly embarrassed for you.
Gotta say, I've been subscribed to GOM since season 1, but occasionaly i'm watching the free stream at work and I've never had a problem.

Pretty disappointing that every time GSL is on, there are 5-10 re-streams on TL.

If it's that hard for the busy TL staff to monitor their stream content when GSL goes live, then go ahead and ask for someone to volunteer to do it. Hell 3 streams right now specifically state "restreaming gsl" in their description.

Very bad situation.. people need to learn that they don't have a "right" to other peoples content.
The free stream works, and if it doesn't work for you, then the option to go premium is there for less than a burger and a coke.

On January 29 2011 05:47 Ic3d wrote:
Yeah makes sense. Just keep it off TL. Check Ustream/Justin/Own3d directly as Xapti suggested.

On March 02 2011 18:44 Roflhaxx wrote:

I actually disagree with this, you got threads about much worse crimes than re-streaming gsl that are allowed to stay open. Example: the high thread.The thing that sucks about no restreaming is that I cannot watch GSL at school because the port the gomplayer uses is blocked. Finding a restream on ustream etc is like finding a needle in a haystack.

On March 02 2011 18:44 Roflhaxx wrote:

I actually disagree with this, you got threads about much worse crimes than re-streaming gsl that are allowed to stay open. Example: the high thread.The thing that sucks about no restreaming is that I cannot watch GSL at school because the port the gomplayer uses is blocked. Finding a restream on ustream etc is like finding a needle in a haystack.

On August 11 2011 22:27 Abrafred wrote:
I'm begging to watch gstl right now. its live and i can't see any of it because the GomPlayer is screwed up. Probably full capacity.. i don't knoow but it's giving me wierd error every time i press play. Managed to watch some earlier butit froze and gave me the same error. So it would be great to catch a live restream. Restreaming does nothing bad for Gom. If it's the free version that is. If Gom can't give me the stream i don't see why someone else shouldn't. Maybe we can have restreams supported by Gom so that their views can be accounted for when being presented to the sponsors.

On August 11 2011 22:27 Abrafred wrote:
I'm begging to watch gstl right now. its live and i can't see any of it because the GomPlayer is screwed up. Probably full capacity.. i don't knoow but it's giving me wierd error every time i press play. Managed to watch some earlier butit froze and gave me the same error. So it would be great to catch a live restream. Restreaming does nothing bad for Gom. If it's the free version that is. If Gom can't give me the stream i don't see why someone else shouldn't. Maybe we can have restreams supported by Gom so that their views can be accounted for when being presented to the sponsors.