EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 1349
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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:04 On_Slaught wrote: The entire obstruction volume is fucking horrible for Trump (and his lawyers for that matter). Its actually overwhelming to read the level of blatant corruption and subterfuge. Further, Mueller not indicting for obstruction means little since they make clear from that they went in with the idea that they would not make a prosecutorial judgement on the charge for a variety of reasons. Yeah apparently they explicitly leave the obstruction question to Congress. Which makes a lot of sense. Wondering if Pelosi will initiate impeachment proceedings. | ||
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Nouar
France3270 Posts
On April 19 2019 00:54 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: Important summary on the obstruction: (page 370). Annoying that they made it un-copy pastable.... The presidents efforts to influence the investigation were unsuccessful only because people declined to carry out his orders... I know what I am going to read tonight. However that part is already pretty damning... | ||
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30545 Posts
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/Le5h7dy.jpg) | ||
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PoulsenB
Poland7707 Posts
On April 19 2019 00:55 Danglars wrote: Hence when it comes to questions like domestic surveillance, abuse of FISA warrants, illegal leaks, you're really not thinking about that stuff and the facts. You're going through how much you hated the Putin summit, or when he called the media "Enemies of the People." It's almost a karmic calculation. Are we back to the FISA stuff now? As far I am aware, the claims of abuse are unwarranted. Meanwhile, we have this lovely official report that has just been released, and it kinda reinforces my views on what sorts of a person Trump is. On April 19 2019 01:17 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: Example of the mob boss speak when coercing Sessions to un-recuse. (page 320) "I'm not telling you to do anything, but if you did it, you'd totally be a hero!" lmao | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
Like xDaunt predicted, there certainly are bombs dropping today. Edit: looks like this part was posted last page. Oops. Will keep it up anyways for those that missed it. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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Zambrah
United States6943 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:30 On_Slaught wrote: An important part of the report: Trump did actively try and obstruct (that is obvious to all but the most koolaid filled cultists after reading this) but was not as successful as he would have liked. So the BEST case scenario is he tried to obstruct but failed. Nixon-lite. Like xDaunt predicted, there certainly are bombs dropping today. https://twitter.com/CNNPolitics/status/1118909820797620226 Edit: looks like this part was posted last page. Oops. Will keep it up anyways for those that missed it. I get the feeling this is going to be used as the main win for people who just can't peel themselves off of Trump's wet and sticky leg, "see! he didnt even succeed, so that basically means hes innocent, after all if he didnt succeed in obstructing the investigation then there was no obstruction!" | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:33 IgnE wrote: Didn’t we already know all this? What’s new here? Presumably xdaunt doesn’t disagree with any of the factual claims in the report. I’m not sure that in the dozens of pages of discussion on this issue that two people, one from each side, have directly disputed a coherent factual narrative. There just seems to be a lot of arguing about which events are actually important I didn't know that the president said he was fucked and the investigation was the end of his presidency in the oval office upon receiving news the special counsel was appointed. Or the number of times he asked McGahn to fire Mueller. Or that Corey Lewandowski delivered a message to Sessions to curtail the investigation. But the report is public, you can just read it like the rest of us. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland22770 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:36 Plansix wrote: I indefinably didn't know that the president said he was fucked and the investigation was the end of his presidency in the oval office upon receiving news the special counsel was appointed. Or the number of times he asked McGahn to fire Mueller. Or that Corey Lewandowski delivered a message to Sessions to curtail the investigation. But the report is public, you can just read it like the rest of us. It’s pretty bloody damning in places, probably worse than I’d thought it would end up being, as you say some of the stuff I’d thought were hearsay or hyperbole apparently actually occurred. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:33 IgnE wrote: Didn’t we already know all this? What’s new here? Presumably xdaunt doesn’t disagree with any of the factual claims in the report. I’m not sure that in the dozens of pages of discussion on this issue that two people, one from each side, have directly disputed a coherent factual narrative. There just seems to be a lot of arguing about which events are actually important There are absolutely new facts, some of which have already been mentioned. Further, it shows how basically every statement Trump has made about his actions regarding the investigation have been a lie. Every position he takes should be presumed false until proven otherwise. Still, I fully expect xDaunt/Danglars/Introvert etc to play down how absolutely damning this is, or more importantly, how damning it SHOULD be that the President would act like this. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:36 Plansix wrote: I didn't know that the president said he was fucked and the investigation was the end of his presidency in the oval office upon receiving news the special counsel was appointed. Or the number of times he asked McGahn to fire Mueller. Or that Corey Lewandowski delivered a message to Sessions to curtail the investigation. But the report is public, you can just read it like the rest of us. honestly none of that surprises me. maybe I didnt “know it” in all of the particulars, but again, simply grafting some details onto an irrelevant tree doesn’t make it relevant without argument. didnt everyone already suspect that trump would/did act like that? we already know trump is a liar. even xdaunt and danglars probably thought so | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:41 Wombat_NI wrote: It’s pretty bloody damning in places, probably worse than I’d thought it would end up being, as you say some of the stuff I’d thought were hearsay or hyperbole apparently actually occurred. The sheer volume is also pretty shocking. It was a non-stop effort to gain control of the investigation through whatever means he could. And he attempted to fire Sessions and others to reach that goal. The only reason those failed due to Trump's inability to fire someone in person. On April 19 2019 01:45 IgnE wrote: honestly none of that surprises me. maybe I didnt “know it” in all of the particulars, but again, simply grafting some details onto an irrelevant tree doesn’t make it relevant without argument. didnt everyone already suspect that trump wiuld act like that? we already know trump is a liar. even xdaunt and danglars probably thought so It is sort of unclear what you are asking. Did I suspect Trump did this stuff? Yes. Did I know that there would be this amount of provable evidence backed up my suspicions and countless witness accounts of the president's attempts to obstruct? No, not in my wildest dreams. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
theres been two years of, at times hyperbolic, reporting on this. and you claim to be shocked? | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland22770 Posts
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semantics
10040 Posts
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
On April 19 2019 01:45 IgnE wrote: honestly none of that surprises me. maybe I didnt “know it” in all of the particulars, but again, simply grafting some details onto an irrelevant tree doesn’t make it relevant without argument. didnt everyone already suspect that trump wiuld act like that? even xdaunt and danglars probably thought so By "act like that" do you mean a multi year operation, which he tried to cover up, to try and kill an investigation into himself? That some people might argue that doesnt rise to an indictable offense doesnt change what is clear for everyone to see. And thankfully, for the first time it really is clear for all to see. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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hunts
United States2113 Posts
On April 19 2019 00:55 Danglars wrote: Hence when it comes to questions like domestic surveillance, abuse of FISA warrants, illegal leaks, you're really not thinking about that stuff and the facts. You're going through how much you hated the Putin summit, or when he called the media "Enemies of the People." It's almost a karmic calculation. You've already barked up the "abuse of FISA warrants" tree and failed, you know as well as everyone else the FISA warrant was quite warranted and there was no abuse. Furthermore the "illegal leaks" all came from trump and his own people and you know it, or at least should. But hey, don't let pesky things like facts get in the way of your conjecture. | ||
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