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On January 27 2015 15:05 rsoultin wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 15:00 DarthPunk wrote:On January 27 2015 14:57 rsoultin wrote:
Is that really your only reason that you think I'm scum? You've been the king of weak reasons lately. No. Take all the countless other weird things about you stated by myself and others. I am just adding to the general case against you in the thread. I do not need to list every scummy thing you have ever done over and over again. If you want to know, read the filter that you have claimed to have been wanting to read for the last two cycles. Regardless you're probably going to want to consolidate it just a little at least if you genuinely want to lynch me. Though I guess your vote is still on Breshke. Why not me?
Cause there is no scum team without breshke in it. I still think Breshke - Shining is a possibility. I just seem to argue with you more because you are around and keep pushing my buttons.
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On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote:I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care. Can you explain this point? You said it earlier but I'm not sure how it's more likely to come from mafia than town?
2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts. Is this meta based on one game?
3. GB had a few decent points on him here: Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 07:23 GlowingBear wrote:On January 19 2015 07:17 Damdred wrote:
Good find GB.
Shinings cote was horrible he said he was in between me and lm voting tried to hammer gb. And caught jarjar slip about the setup This makes no sense at all, because he was between you and LM and you were scumreading LM right? But then, he voted me, who was scumreading you. This guy really believe in busses or he is mafia. Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 10:46 GlowingBear wrote:On January 18 2015 13:01 The Shining wrote:
Continuing my previous post:
Trfel - I don't know what to think of you from post to post. The early vote on Geript had me uneasy for the same reason I suspected ExO in my last game. Maybe it is a personal preference but early votes on Day 1 just dont feel right to me. You had nothing to go off of except a statement made pre-game. Had you just left it up until this point, I'd be even more skeptical but you unvoted. Because you finally started discussion or to try and get out of the spotlight? Regardless, I like the dialogue it has generated, as a lot of people commented on it, and as I read on, I feel I answered my own question, as you seem to have no problem staying in the spotlight, even after backing off Geript. I'm not convinced you're Town but you're talking and not shying away from questions. Not a good D1 lynch but null because nothing in particular about you is jumping out at me as town. You have all the reasons to town read Trfel but ends calling him null and I can't understand why. Oh so that's why you were scumreading me. Here is the thing: I like to throw unexplained stuff in the thread to get reactions, so I can gather information on people. I can use it to see who is actively reading and trying to solve the game, and it is a way of keep the thread discussion going on. It is a thing I've learned playing with Rayn (he does this a lot) and something town foolishness also does. I've said to Trfel that a way to generate discussion is doing controversial things and/or giving reads. Openings are very important because of that. The main proof of this is that this game already has 36 pages and the latest newbie game barely had 20 pages at night1. The one liners thing is dull. If you town read LS for posting things that comes from the top of his head, you can't scum read me for one liners, because that's just me not holding my thoughts. This is specially if you really believe this: On January 19 2015 05:48 The Shining wrote:
Catching up from my last post. In response to your question of whether town or scum would think their posts through more.
DP - I find that Townies, especially paranoid townies, will second guess and double check and triple check everything someone is saying and doing. Our goal is to actively find scum and you don't do that without really thinking out your questions and responses. Scum does have to think out their posts, too, but I have also seen scum hastily post up a few thoughts just to increase their presence in the thread before fading back into the shadows. Which is exactly what happened EoD. On January 19 2015 06:18 The Shining wrote:
Damdred - I don't really like your last few posts either. GB brought a weak case against you and tried to push you and although you defended yourself, you went the extra step to say he is probably Town for this? You yourself said scum likes to paint townies as townies for free cred. You're also not sure who you want to lynch and haven't voted. I haven't, either, but I've already said I wanted to vote GB or LM. Are you just going to try to jump on the safest wagon?
I wanna give you benefit of the doubt but I'm not sure I can. I'll be even more suspicious of you if GB gets flipped Town today after you town him, with more than a few players scumreading him or questioning his play. This post is completely wrong. Yes, scum call townies town all the time, but NOT in the situation Damdred was. He was shot to get lynched and I was the second wagon. Damdred is much more likely to lynch me than to die. This is exactly why I decided damdred was town. Always remember that mafias objective is to survive. He wasn't willing to survive. Of course he can still be scum but the probability is WAY less than him being townie. On January 19 2015 06:04 The Shining wrote:
GB - You said you were coming at lurkers. Since then, I've posted a read on you leaning scum and asked you why the LS BS meter comment was something worth mentioning when it is LS, a player who in my short experience experiences with him seems throw whatever is on his mind out there.
You haven't so much as acknowledged me since except to say if you can't lynch Damdred, you want to push the lurkers in Breshke or myself. Why am I not seeing any pressure to do so? You voted Breshke but didnt respond to who addressed you directly. Instead, you made a weak case IMO against Damdred who has repeatedly said he is meh and burnt out. I'm not sure how much credit I want to give Damdred for those excuses but he did mention to me when he coached me last game that he was burning out. He also mentioned it when he convinced me to sign up for this game. I'm not fully buying it yet but in a scenario where you are scum and he is town, it seems like easy pickings to pick on a Town you've played with before, use meta as reasoning for him flip flopping on lynching you and take advantage of him not being as invested in the game as he could be. Damdreds scum meta is to not be involved. If he is getting tired of playing mafia and isn't involved because if that, well, I can't know. The only thing I know is his meta. Period. Sorry, I've skipped some posts while skimming through the thread, it seems I missed one of yours. And regarding not acknowledging you: ![[image loading]](http://41.media.tumblr.com/8276e2b065652480a2edbd0522aac367/tumblr_mjtiex5KeP1r0qyqbo1_500.png) I'm gonna stop here to tell you this: I've misread a lot of your posts. I thought you were saying that I didn't pressure damdred enough, but you were talking about lurkers. I also believed damdred when he said about the scumread on him and LM because I remembered the post your said you wouldn't be surprised if he was scum if I flipped town. After actually reading your filter win enough attention, you're clearly town to me. I rescind everything I said about you being scum. Although you have a very, very small filter. The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him. Eh, I don't know. Most of these points were on something GB misunderstood...
4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly. Nh. Could be alignment indicative but I don't know how strong it is.
5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. This I think is a very good point, actually. Probably the best one here and the main reason I'm reconsidering my read. I think it's odd that he hasn't been pushed much this game.##vote The ShiningI'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta.
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+ Show Spoiler +On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote:I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care.
2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts.
3. GB had a few decent points on him here: Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 07:23 GlowingBear wrote:On January 19 2015 07:17 Damdred wrote:
Good find GB.
Shinings cote was horrible he said he was in between me and lm voting tried to hammer gb. And caught jarjar slip about the setup This makes no sense at all, because he was between you and LM and you were scumreading LM right? But then, he voted me, who was scumreading you. This guy really believe in busses or he is mafia. Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 10:46 GlowingBear wrote:On January 18 2015 13:01 The Shining wrote:
Continuing my previous post:
Trfel - I don't know what to think of you from post to post. The early vote on Geript had me uneasy for the same reason I suspected ExO in my last game. Maybe it is a personal preference but early votes on Day 1 just dont feel right to me. You had nothing to go off of except a statement made pre-game. Had you just left it up until this point, I'd be even more skeptical but you unvoted. Because you finally started discussion or to try and get out of the spotlight? Regardless, I like the dialogue it has generated, as a lot of people commented on it, and as I read on, I feel I answered my own question, as you seem to have no problem staying in the spotlight, even after backing off Geript. I'm not convinced you're Town but you're talking and not shying away from questions. Not a good D1 lynch but null because nothing in particular about you is jumping out at me as town. You have all the reasons to town read Trfel but ends calling him null and I can't understand why. Oh so that's why you were scumreading me. Here is the thing: I like to throw unexplained stuff in the thread to get reactions, so I can gather information on people. I can use it to see who is actively reading and trying to solve the game, and it is a way of keep the thread discussion going on. It is a thing I've learned playing with Rayn (he does this a lot) and something town foolishness also does. I've said to Trfel that a way to generate discussion is doing controversial things and/or giving reads. Openings are very important because of that. The main proof of this is that this game already has 36 pages and the latest newbie game barely had 20 pages at night1. The one liners thing is dull. If you town read LS for posting things that comes from the top of his head, you can't scum read me for one liners, because that's just me not holding my thoughts. This is specially if you really believe this: On January 19 2015 05:48 The Shining wrote:
Catching up from my last post. In response to your question of whether town or scum would think their posts through more.
DP - I find that Townies, especially paranoid townies, will second guess and double check and triple check everything someone is saying and doing. Our goal is to actively find scum and you don't do that without really thinking out your questions and responses. Scum does have to think out their posts, too, but I have also seen scum hastily post up a few thoughts just to increase their presence in the thread before fading back into the shadows. Which is exactly what happened EoD. On January 19 2015 06:18 The Shining wrote:
Damdred - I don't really like your last few posts either. GB brought a weak case against you and tried to push you and although you defended yourself, you went the extra step to say he is probably Town for this? You yourself said scum likes to paint townies as townies for free cred. You're also not sure who you want to lynch and haven't voted. I haven't, either, but I've already said I wanted to vote GB or LM. Are you just going to try to jump on the safest wagon?
I wanna give you benefit of the doubt but I'm not sure I can. I'll be even more suspicious of you if GB gets flipped Town today after you town him, with more than a few players scumreading him or questioning his play. This post is completely wrong. Yes, scum call townies town all the time, but NOT in the situation Damdred was. He was shot to get lynched and I was the second wagon. Damdred is much more likely to lynch me than to die. This is exactly why I decided damdred was town. Always remember that mafias objective is to survive. He wasn't willing to survive. Of course he can still be scum but the probability is WAY less than him being townie. On January 19 2015 06:04 The Shining wrote:
GB - You said you were coming at lurkers. Since then, I've posted a read on you leaning scum and asked you why the LS BS meter comment was something worth mentioning when it is LS, a player who in my short experience experiences with him seems throw whatever is on his mind out there.
You haven't so much as acknowledged me since except to say if you can't lynch Damdred, you want to push the lurkers in Breshke or myself. Why am I not seeing any pressure to do so? You voted Breshke but didnt respond to who addressed you directly. Instead, you made a weak case IMO against Damdred who has repeatedly said he is meh and burnt out. I'm not sure how much credit I want to give Damdred for those excuses but he did mention to me when he coached me last game that he was burning out. He also mentioned it when he convinced me to sign up for this game. I'm not fully buying it yet but in a scenario where you are scum and he is town, it seems like easy pickings to pick on a Town you've played with before, use meta as reasoning for him flip flopping on lynching you and take advantage of him not being as invested in the game as he could be. Damdreds scum meta is to not be involved. If he is getting tired of playing mafia and isn't involved because if that, well, I can't know. The only thing I know is his meta. Period. Sorry, I've skipped some posts while skimming through the thread, it seems I missed one of yours. And regarding not acknowledging you: I'm gonna stop here to tell you this: I've misread a lot of your posts. I thought you were saying that I didn't pressure damdred enough, but you were talking about lurkers. I also believed damdred when he said about the scumread on him and LM because I remembered the post your said you wouldn't be surprised if he was scum if I flipped town. After actually reading your filter win enough attention, you're clearly town to me. I rescind everything I said about you being scum. Although you have a very, very small filter. The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him.
4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly.
5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. ##vote The ShiningI'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta.
Point one is meh to me as i think it honestly is different for every player and how much they think about the setup and rely on roles coming out etc.
I like point two and three and dislike point 4.
Five is what really sold it for me though because i think it says a lot. I don't get damdreds townread on the shining and damdred decided to vote me when DP was trying to get another wagon to get traction and the shining was considered as an option.
Without specifically looking in his filter can you explain damdreds town read on the shining for me RSo because i don't know if it is just me or not.
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On January 27 2015 15:02 rsoultin wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 14:58 DarthPunk wrote:
Anyway by now you should have figured out by now that if you are town and you think breshke is town that the rest of the townies are not gonna no lynch so you need to make sure you are all on the same wagon so scum can't influence the lynch.
YET!
You are sticking with some shitty and inconsistent reasoning for wanting to no lynch you aren't really pushing the wagon you want (damdred) to the rest of the townies that you 100% need to vote with you your scum team is not really defined.
All you are certain of is that your buddy bresh is town and that you want to no lynch for a reason that is not genuine or consistent. Shush, child. I'm reading geript xP I may have to leave my conclusions in the morning and hope the rest of town doesn't shit the bed, but I'm going to try to do this right. Geeeeeeript. More a point of curiosity than anything: why do you do these psychological question thingies? You did it with both me and JJB, but the one you did with him seemed more on point. Kinda.
JJB I did it because of how I read Slam. I think that read transfers over 100% or at least close enough to matter. I did chezinu things with you because I really don't fucking care that much right now. I feel like I have a townread on everyone but Shining and no one is super big on lynch him except maybe DP. Maybe I'm just wrong on him. But the no vote switch makes it really weird. Like if I'm wrong on DP/Damdred then fuck it. My bad. But the most logical lynch there is Breshke because he makes the most sense between the three of you logically.
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On January 27 2015 15:09 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 15:05 rsoultin wrote:On January 27 2015 15:00 DarthPunk wrote:On January 27 2015 14:57 rsoultin wrote:
Is that really your only reason that you think I'm scum? You've been the king of weak reasons lately. No. Take all the countless other weird things about you stated by myself and others. I am just adding to the general case against you in the thread. I do not need to list every scummy thing you have ever done over and over again. If you want to know, read the filter that you have claimed to have been wanting to read for the last two cycles. Regardless you're probably going to want to consolidate it just a little at least if you genuinely want to lynch me. Though I guess your vote is still on Breshke. Why not me? Cause there is no scum team without breshke in it. I still think Breshke - Shining is a possibility. I just seem to argue with you more because you are around and keep pushing my buttons.
Mrt. Why is there no scum team without Breshke in it? I kind of think it would be weird for town to be pushing a Breshke lynch and the scum team of Breshke and Shining to just sit by and go whatever.
It seems like the only way you can think Breshke is scum based solely on the vote is if you think I'm scum, too. What is your case against Breshke other than how close the vote was?
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On January 27 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 12:16 DarthPunk wrote:On January 27 2015 12:11 Breshke wrote:
DP why do you not see a scum team with me not in it? Cause: Geript is town and Damdred looks townie whenever he tries. Day one and Last lynch. I think the Vote yesterday was scum/town due to weird lynch inertia and the vote being so closely contested. You conveniently afk'd from two lynches and were there just before the lynch of LM before disappearing again as noted by geript. Rso - Shining whilst possible doesn't make as much sense due to the way Rso refused to swap her vote to you yesterday which, if she is scum and you are town is a completely arbitary decision. ALSO Your play changed weirdly at mylo. I wasn't around for like over 12 hours before the LM lynch i don't know if you are flat out lieing or are just mistaken you might want to go look. Explain the weird inertia? How would that lynch have been different if it was town/town? Also how is my play different? Stop calling me scum for things and not explaining them
Can you respond to this please DP you can call me bad or whatever but please don't ignore me when you are trying to lynch me.
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On January 27 2015 15:12 Breshke wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote:I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care.
2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts.
3. GB had a few decent points on him here: Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 07:23 GlowingBear wrote:On January 19 2015 07:17 Damdred wrote:
Good find GB.
Shinings cote was horrible he said he was in between me and lm voting tried to hammer gb. And caught jarjar slip about the setup This makes no sense at all, because he was between you and LM and you were scumreading LM right? But then, he voted me, who was scumreading you. This guy really believe in busses or he is mafia. Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 10:46 GlowingBear wrote:On January 18 2015 13:01 The Shining wrote:
Continuing my previous post:
Trfel - I don't know what to think of you from post to post. The early vote on Geript had me uneasy for the same reason I suspected ExO in my last game. Maybe it is a personal preference but early votes on Day 1 just dont feel right to me. You had nothing to go off of except a statement made pre-game. Had you just left it up until this point, I'd be even more skeptical but you unvoted. Because you finally started discussion or to try and get out of the spotlight? Regardless, I like the dialogue it has generated, as a lot of people commented on it, and as I read on, I feel I answered my own question, as you seem to have no problem staying in the spotlight, even after backing off Geript. I'm not convinced you're Town but you're talking and not shying away from questions. Not a good D1 lynch but null because nothing in particular about you is jumping out at me as town. You have all the reasons to town read Trfel but ends calling him null and I can't understand why. Oh so that's why you were scumreading me. Here is the thing: I like to throw unexplained stuff in the thread to get reactions, so I can gather information on people. I can use it to see who is actively reading and trying to solve the game, and it is a way of keep the thread discussion going on. It is a thing I've learned playing with Rayn (he does this a lot) and something town foolishness also does. I've said to Trfel that a way to generate discussion is doing controversial things and/or giving reads. Openings are very important because of that. The main proof of this is that this game already has 36 pages and the latest newbie game barely had 20 pages at night1. The one liners thing is dull. If you town read LS for posting things that comes from the top of his head, you can't scum read me for one liners, because that's just me not holding my thoughts. This is specially if you really believe this: On January 19 2015 05:48 The Shining wrote:
Catching up from my last post. In response to your question of whether town or scum would think their posts through more.
DP - I find that Townies, especially paranoid townies, will second guess and double check and triple check everything someone is saying and doing. Our goal is to actively find scum and you don't do that without really thinking out your questions and responses. Scum does have to think out their posts, too, but I have also seen scum hastily post up a few thoughts just to increase their presence in the thread before fading back into the shadows. Which is exactly what happened EoD. On January 19 2015 06:18 The Shining wrote:
Damdred - I don't really like your last few posts either. GB brought a weak case against you and tried to push you and although you defended yourself, you went the extra step to say he is probably Town for this? You yourself said scum likes to paint townies as townies for free cred. You're also not sure who you want to lynch and haven't voted. I haven't, either, but I've already said I wanted to vote GB or LM. Are you just going to try to jump on the safest wagon?
I wanna give you benefit of the doubt but I'm not sure I can. I'll be even more suspicious of you if GB gets flipped Town today after you town him, with more than a few players scumreading him or questioning his play. This post is completely wrong. Yes, scum call townies town all the time, but NOT in the situation Damdred was. He was shot to get lynched and I was the second wagon. Damdred is much more likely to lynch me than to die. This is exactly why I decided damdred was town. Always remember that mafias objective is to survive. He wasn't willing to survive. Of course he can still be scum but the probability is WAY less than him being townie. On January 19 2015 06:04 The Shining wrote:
GB - You said you were coming at lurkers. Since then, I've posted a read on you leaning scum and asked you why the LS BS meter comment was something worth mentioning when it is LS, a player who in my short experience experiences with him seems throw whatever is on his mind out there.
You haven't so much as acknowledged me since except to say if you can't lynch Damdred, you want to push the lurkers in Breshke or myself. Why am I not seeing any pressure to do so? You voted Breshke but didnt respond to who addressed you directly. Instead, you made a weak case IMO against Damdred who has repeatedly said he is meh and burnt out. I'm not sure how much credit I want to give Damdred for those excuses but he did mention to me when he coached me last game that he was burning out. He also mentioned it when he convinced me to sign up for this game. I'm not fully buying it yet but in a scenario where you are scum and he is town, it seems like easy pickings to pick on a Town you've played with before, use meta as reasoning for him flip flopping on lynching you and take advantage of him not being as invested in the game as he could be. Damdreds scum meta is to not be involved. If he is getting tired of playing mafia and isn't involved because if that, well, I can't know. The only thing I know is his meta. Period. Sorry, I've skipped some posts while skimming through the thread, it seems I missed one of yours. And regarding not acknowledging you: I'm gonna stop here to tell you this: I've misread a lot of your posts. I thought you were saying that I didn't pressure damdred enough, but you were talking about lurkers. I also believed damdred when he said about the scumread on him and LM because I remembered the post your said you wouldn't be surprised if he was scum if I flipped town. After actually reading your filter win enough attention, you're clearly town to me. I rescind everything I said about you being scum. Although you have a very, very small filter. The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him.
4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly.
5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. ##vote The ShiningI'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta. Point one is meh to me as i think it honestly is different for every player and how much they think about the setup and rely on roles coming out etc. I like point two and three and dislike point 4. Five is what really sold it for me though because i think it says a lot. I don't get damdreds townread on the shining and damdred decided to vote me when DP was trying to get another wagon to get traction and the shining was considered as an option. Without specifically looking in his filter can you explain damdreds town read on the shining for me RSo because i don't know if it is just me or not.
Not really. He's basing it on meta.
I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as scummy per se when I went through his filter for Day 3. The reasoning I didn't always agree with but I could follow his train of thought? I don't know if Damdred's meta read should apply so strongly between a forum with 10 page games and a forum like this, though. The strength of his surety is a bit weird.
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On January 27 2015 15:08 geript wrote:
DP, where are you at? Which of Breshke/Shining/rsoultin is town do you think?
Clearly breshke-Rso
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On January 27 2015 15:18 rsoultin wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 15:12 Breshke wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote:I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care.
2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts.
3. GB had a few decent points on him here: Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 07:23 GlowingBear wrote:On January 19 2015 07:17 Damdred wrote:
Good find GB.
Shinings cote was horrible he said he was in between me and lm voting tried to hammer gb. And caught jarjar slip about the setup This makes no sense at all, because he was between you and LM and you were scumreading LM right? But then, he voted me, who was scumreading you. This guy really believe in busses or he is mafia. Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 10:46 GlowingBear wrote:On January 18 2015 13:01 The Shining wrote:
Continuing my previous post:
Trfel - I don't know what to think of you from post to post. The early vote on Geript had me uneasy for the same reason I suspected ExO in my last game. Maybe it is a personal preference but early votes on Day 1 just dont feel right to me. You had nothing to go off of except a statement made pre-game. Had you just left it up until this point, I'd be even more skeptical but you unvoted. Because you finally started discussion or to try and get out of the spotlight? Regardless, I like the dialogue it has generated, as a lot of people commented on it, and as I read on, I feel I answered my own question, as you seem to have no problem staying in the spotlight, even after backing off Geript. I'm not convinced you're Town but you're talking and not shying away from questions. Not a good D1 lynch but null because nothing in particular about you is jumping out at me as town. You have all the reasons to town read Trfel but ends calling him null and I can't understand why. Oh so that's why you were scumreading me. Here is the thing: I like to throw unexplained stuff in the thread to get reactions, so I can gather information on people. I can use it to see who is actively reading and trying to solve the game, and it is a way of keep the thread discussion going on. It is a thing I've learned playing with Rayn (he does this a lot) and something town foolishness also does. I've said to Trfel that a way to generate discussion is doing controversial things and/or giving reads. Openings are very important because of that. The main proof of this is that this game already has 36 pages and the latest newbie game barely had 20 pages at night1. The one liners thing is dull. If you town read LS for posting things that comes from the top of his head, you can't scum read me for one liners, because that's just me not holding my thoughts. This is specially if you really believe this: On January 19 2015 05:48 The Shining wrote:
Catching up from my last post. In response to your question of whether town or scum would think their posts through more.
DP - I find that Townies, especially paranoid townies, will second guess and double check and triple check everything someone is saying and doing. Our goal is to actively find scum and you don't do that without really thinking out your questions and responses. Scum does have to think out their posts, too, but I have also seen scum hastily post up a few thoughts just to increase their presence in the thread before fading back into the shadows. Which is exactly what happened EoD. On January 19 2015 06:18 The Shining wrote:
Damdred - I don't really like your last few posts either. GB brought a weak case against you and tried to push you and although you defended yourself, you went the extra step to say he is probably Town for this? You yourself said scum likes to paint townies as townies for free cred. You're also not sure who you want to lynch and haven't voted. I haven't, either, but I've already said I wanted to vote GB or LM. Are you just going to try to jump on the safest wagon?
I wanna give you benefit of the doubt but I'm not sure I can. I'll be even more suspicious of you if GB gets flipped Town today after you town him, with more than a few players scumreading him or questioning his play. This post is completely wrong. Yes, scum call townies town all the time, but NOT in the situation Damdred was. He was shot to get lynched and I was the second wagon. Damdred is much more likely to lynch me than to die. This is exactly why I decided damdred was town. Always remember that mafias objective is to survive. He wasn't willing to survive. Of course he can still be scum but the probability is WAY less than him being townie. On January 19 2015 06:04 The Shining wrote:
GB - You said you were coming at lurkers. Since then, I've posted a read on you leaning scum and asked you why the LS BS meter comment was something worth mentioning when it is LS, a player who in my short experience experiences with him seems throw whatever is on his mind out there.
You haven't so much as acknowledged me since except to say if you can't lynch Damdred, you want to push the lurkers in Breshke or myself. Why am I not seeing any pressure to do so? You voted Breshke but didnt respond to who addressed you directly. Instead, you made a weak case IMO against Damdred who has repeatedly said he is meh and burnt out. I'm not sure how much credit I want to give Damdred for those excuses but he did mention to me when he coached me last game that he was burning out. He also mentioned it when he convinced me to sign up for this game. I'm not fully buying it yet but in a scenario where you are scum and he is town, it seems like easy pickings to pick on a Town you've played with before, use meta as reasoning for him flip flopping on lynching you and take advantage of him not being as invested in the game as he could be. Damdreds scum meta is to not be involved. If he is getting tired of playing mafia and isn't involved because if that, well, I can't know. The only thing I know is his meta. Period. Sorry, I've skipped some posts while skimming through the thread, it seems I missed one of yours. And regarding not acknowledging you: I'm gonna stop here to tell you this: I've misread a lot of your posts. I thought you were saying that I didn't pressure damdred enough, but you were talking about lurkers. I also believed damdred when he said about the scumread on him and LM because I remembered the post your said you wouldn't be surprised if he was scum if I flipped town. After actually reading your filter win enough attention, you're clearly town to me. I rescind everything I said about you being scum. Although you have a very, very small filter. The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him.
4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly.
5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. ##vote The ShiningI'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta. Point one is meh to me as i think it honestly is different for every player and how much they think about the setup and rely on roles coming out etc. I like point two and three and dislike point 4. Five is what really sold it for me though because i think it says a lot. I don't get damdreds townread on the shining and damdred decided to vote me when DP was trying to get another wagon to get traction and the shining was considered as an option. Without specifically looking in his filter can you explain damdreds town read on the shining for me RSo because i don't know if it is just me or not. Not really. He's basing it on meta. I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as scummy per se when I went through his filter for Day 3. The reasoning I didn't always agree with but I could follow his train of thought? I don't know if Damdred's meta read should apply so strongly between a forum with 10 page games and a forum like this, though. The strength of his surety is a bit weird.
Do you think damdred/DP is a likely team?
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On January 27 2015 15:27 Breshke wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 15:18 rsoultin wrote:On January 27 2015 15:12 Breshke wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote:I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care.
2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts.
3. GB had a few decent points on him here: Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 07:23 GlowingBear wrote:On January 19 2015 07:17 Damdred wrote:
Good find GB.
Shinings cote was horrible he said he was in between me and lm voting tried to hammer gb. And caught jarjar slip about the setup This makes no sense at all, because he was between you and LM and you were scumreading LM right? But then, he voted me, who was scumreading you. This guy really believe in busses or he is mafia. Show nested quote +On January 19 2015 10:46 GlowingBear wrote:On January 18 2015 13:01 The Shining wrote:
Continuing my previous post:
Trfel - I don't know what to think of you from post to post. The early vote on Geript had me uneasy for the same reason I suspected ExO in my last game. Maybe it is a personal preference but early votes on Day 1 just dont feel right to me. You had nothing to go off of except a statement made pre-game. Had you just left it up until this point, I'd be even more skeptical but you unvoted. Because you finally started discussion or to try and get out of the spotlight? Regardless, I like the dialogue it has generated, as a lot of people commented on it, and as I read on, I feel I answered my own question, as you seem to have no problem staying in the spotlight, even after backing off Geript. I'm not convinced you're Town but you're talking and not shying away from questions. Not a good D1 lynch but null because nothing in particular about you is jumping out at me as town. You have all the reasons to town read Trfel but ends calling him null and I can't understand why. Oh so that's why you were scumreading me. Here is the thing: I like to throw unexplained stuff in the thread to get reactions, so I can gather information on people. I can use it to see who is actively reading and trying to solve the game, and it is a way of keep the thread discussion going on. It is a thing I've learned playing with Rayn (he does this a lot) and something town foolishness also does. I've said to Trfel that a way to generate discussion is doing controversial things and/or giving reads. Openings are very important because of that. The main proof of this is that this game already has 36 pages and the latest newbie game barely had 20 pages at night1. The one liners thing is dull. If you town read LS for posting things that comes from the top of his head, you can't scum read me for one liners, because that's just me not holding my thoughts. This is specially if you really believe this: On January 19 2015 05:48 The Shining wrote:
Catching up from my last post. In response to your question of whether town or scum would think their posts through more.
DP - I find that Townies, especially paranoid townies, will second guess and double check and triple check everything someone is saying and doing. Our goal is to actively find scum and you don't do that without really thinking out your questions and responses. Scum does have to think out their posts, too, but I have also seen scum hastily post up a few thoughts just to increase their presence in the thread before fading back into the shadows. Which is exactly what happened EoD. On January 19 2015 06:18 The Shining wrote:
Damdred - I don't really like your last few posts either. GB brought a weak case against you and tried to push you and although you defended yourself, you went the extra step to say he is probably Town for this? You yourself said scum likes to paint townies as townies for free cred. You're also not sure who you want to lynch and haven't voted. I haven't, either, but I've already said I wanted to vote GB or LM. Are you just going to try to jump on the safest wagon?
I wanna give you benefit of the doubt but I'm not sure I can. I'll be even more suspicious of you if GB gets flipped Town today after you town him, with more than a few players scumreading him or questioning his play. This post is completely wrong. Yes, scum call townies town all the time, but NOT in the situation Damdred was. He was shot to get lynched and I was the second wagon. Damdred is much more likely to lynch me than to die. This is exactly why I decided damdred was town. Always remember that mafias objective is to survive. He wasn't willing to survive. Of course he can still be scum but the probability is WAY less than him being townie. On January 19 2015 06:04 The Shining wrote:
GB - You said you were coming at lurkers. Since then, I've posted a read on you leaning scum and asked you why the LS BS meter comment was something worth mentioning when it is LS, a player who in my short experience experiences with him seems throw whatever is on his mind out there.
You haven't so much as acknowledged me since except to say if you can't lynch Damdred, you want to push the lurkers in Breshke or myself. Why am I not seeing any pressure to do so? You voted Breshke but didnt respond to who addressed you directly. Instead, you made a weak case IMO against Damdred who has repeatedly said he is meh and burnt out. I'm not sure how much credit I want to give Damdred for those excuses but he did mention to me when he coached me last game that he was burning out. He also mentioned it when he convinced me to sign up for this game. I'm not fully buying it yet but in a scenario where you are scum and he is town, it seems like easy pickings to pick on a Town you've played with before, use meta as reasoning for him flip flopping on lynching you and take advantage of him not being as invested in the game as he could be. Damdreds scum meta is to not be involved. If he is getting tired of playing mafia and isn't involved because if that, well, I can't know. The only thing I know is his meta. Period. Sorry, I've skipped some posts while skimming through the thread, it seems I missed one of yours. And regarding not acknowledging you: I'm gonna stop here to tell you this: I've misread a lot of your posts. I thought you were saying that I didn't pressure damdred enough, but you were talking about lurkers. I also believed damdred when he said about the scumread on him and LM because I remembered the post your said you wouldn't be surprised if he was scum if I flipped town. After actually reading your filter win enough attention, you're clearly town to me. I rescind everything I said about you being scum. Although you have a very, very small filter. The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him.
4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly.
5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. ##vote The ShiningI'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta. Point one is meh to me as i think it honestly is different for every player and how much they think about the setup and rely on roles coming out etc. I like point two and three and dislike point 4. Five is what really sold it for me though because i think it says a lot. I don't get damdreds townread on the shining and damdred decided to vote me when DP was trying to get another wagon to get traction and the shining was considered as an option. Without specifically looking in his filter can you explain damdreds town read on the shining for me RSo because i don't know if it is just me or not. Not really. He's basing it on meta. I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as scummy per se when I went through his filter for Day 3. The reasoning I didn't always agree with but I could follow his train of thought? I don't know if Damdred's meta read should apply so strongly between a forum with 10 page games and a forum like this, though. The strength of his surety is a bit weird. Do you think damdred/DP is a likely team?
Some of the interaction between Damdred and DP around page 7ish (I think) of Damdred's filter makes me question that. Like the back and forth about Damdred not reading DPs filter, though I don't think that was pursued very far, and Damdred saying DP's townread on LM was weak.
I don't really see anywhere else that they've engaged with each other much, though. And DP kinda just rides as town without much explanation on Damdred's part.
I'll have a more solid opinion on them when I get to DP's filter. I'm reading geript right now, working my way up the list. Obviously they've been aligning their reads today.
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...hey geript...you chose to lynch breshke on the phone thing too after saying you were reading shining and breshke both as town?
am I missing something? the phone thing seems like a very strange tipping point, but both you and damdred chose to jump on that.
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also, you can't seem to decide whether you want to be scumread or townread, geript. you think people are scum for scumreading you and then get uncomfortable when they think you're town. I know that doesn't mean anything necessarily but it's just a point of oddity
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If Damdred/DP are town, it makes 0 sense for Breshke to not be in a mafia team. Like if he's town in that situation too, you as mafia don't give a fuck to vote for LM or Breshke. Breshke is even heavily preferential because LM is still exceptionally wifomable.
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On January 27 2015 15:39 geript wrote:
If Damdred/DP are town, it makes 0 sense for Breshke to not be in a mafia team. Like if he's town in that situation too, you as mafia don't give a fuck to vote for LM or Breshke. Breshke is even heavily preferential because LM is still exceptionally wifomable.
If Damdred/DP are town, I'd have to agree with you. That makes me and Bresh scum or both scum AFK. Unless you're scum, but I'm not really hating your filter right now, other than a few odd points here and there. Haven't finished it though. What was so compelling about the phone?
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On January 27 2015 15:39 geript wrote:
If Damdred/DP are town, it makes 0 sense for Breshke to not be in a mafia team. Like if he's town in that situation too, you as mafia don't give a fuck to vote for LM or Breshke. Breshke is even heavily preferential because LM is still exceptionally wifomable.
This.
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Compelling about the phone?
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What changed your read on Damdred, geript? You seemed to be scumming him all the way up to shennanies.
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On January 25 2015 06:50 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On January 25 2015 06:39 DarthPunk wrote:On January 25 2015 06:36 geript wrote:On January 25 2015 06:29 rsoultin wrote:On January 25 2015 06:22 geript wrote:On January 19 2015 06:41 Breshke wrote:
So trfel why do you think LM will flip scum? Havnt people said he is always like thi aswell? This is a question that bugs me because I don't see it ever come back up again. It's just kinda full speed ahead on LM. I also don't remember anyone commenting on how active LM tends to be as either alignment. Maybe I made a passing comment that I usually think of LM as a low activity guy. Overall, I'd agree with you that the early townreads were perhaps quite wrong, but I'm not really seeing clear scum motivation or a lot of scummy things. One thing that does kinda bug me is that the's big on the LM-Trfel +1 theory, but if that's the case, then he should basically have it down to rsoultin/DP/Shining/me. But he doesn't really get how Trfel+LM implicates DP. There's no question as to whether or not LM is mafia. Yet he had a conversation with mafia bout LM. Seriously, geript? He had JJB as his prime scum read. Can you quote me where he was scumreading trfel Day 1, because I certainly don't remember it. Just read my fucking post. Did I say that Breshke has Trfel as mafia? No. I'm saying that Breshke had a conversation with Trfel about LM. That's something I'd remember as town. Plus he doesn't get how Trfel+LM=DP but even by his own reasoning he has it limited town to Rso/DP/Shining/me. He seems essentially town on everyone that Trfel+LM could be mafia with under normal circumstances. Ya this is a good point. Also I just realized something. You know how bresh said his phone died at work day one? Well we are both Australian so I don't see how his phone could die at 8:30 am. Fuck it. I really don't want to care about this but it is weird. I'm going to feel really extra stupid and lazy if Breshke flips town though. ##unvote
##vote Breshke
You made your points about Breshke before this...but this tipped the scales?
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On January 27 2015 15:48 rsoultin wrote:
What changed your read on Damdred, geript? You seemed to be scumming him all the way up to shennanies.
Reading his filter and past games filters and doing an 8 game meta on him at least half of which were games I've played in.
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On January 27 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 12:16 DarthPunk wrote:On January 27 2015 12:11 Breshke wrote:
DP why do you not see a scum team with me not in it? Cause: Geript is town and Damdred looks townie whenever he tries. Day one and Last lynch. I think the Vote yesterday was scum/town due to weird lynch inertia and the vote being so closely contested. You conveniently afk'd from two lynches and were there just before the lynch of LM before disappearing again as noted by geript. Rso - Shining whilst possible doesn't make as much sense due to the way Rso refused to swap her vote to you yesterday which, if she is scum and you are town is a completely arbitary decision. ALSO Your play changed weirdly at mylo. Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote:
I wasn't around for like over 12 hours before the LM lynch i don't know if you are flat out lieing or are just mistaken you might want to go look. Geript pointed out that it was weird you were not around when you were around before that is when the lynch was happening. Regardless that phone thing is some bullshit. You said your phone died. That looked really unlikely, then you made up some story about your phone overheating and suddenly draining all the battery, something I have never ever in my life heard of. So yeah you not being around at lynches and mysteriously disappearing is scummy. Show nested quote +On January 27 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote:
Explain the weird inertia? How would that lynch have been different if it was town/town?
Doesn't make sense for mafia to try and switch the lynch off an easy mislynch like LM, there seemed to be ALOT of resistance to lynching you instead of LM even if some of it was passive resistance indicating scum had a vested interest in ensuring the lynch of someone which is reflected in the votes. If town/town scum are 1000% more likely to just afk their vote on LM because it doesn't give any info to the town. There was no reason for damdred or geript to move lynches as scum. If the vote was town/town I would expect there to have been a more one sided vote count or many votes spread around.
On January 27 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote:
Also how is my play different?
Different tone, hard buddying Rso, more invested than previously, Soft pushing me without ever calling me out. Not really pushing a scum read at all, rather pushing a no lynch despite really thinking through what is happening in the game.
On January 27 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote:
Stop calling me scum for things and not explaining them
I explained my read on you in my case on you. Also due to POE it is unlikely you are not in one of my two scum teams
which are:
Breshke - Rso
Breske - Shining.
Also you and Rso keep trying to chainsaw defend one another which makes things pretty obvious. Like you are outing yourselves this mylo badly.
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EPT
