PTP IV - Demon's Run - Page 179
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Acrofales
Spain17704 Posts
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17704 Posts
On July 03 2013 12:10 gonzaw wrote: Also, it's even easier than that. You could do this if you want: "austin is scum AND (gonzaw is town OR (NOT gonzaw is town))" You get the same equivalent formula "austin is scum", no need to say "Acro was alive in D1" or stuff like that. That's why the same method has to apply to sub-formulas as well Oh, if you could nest propositions deeper then you could probably set it up so complex that the number could confirm 5 DT checks... but don't ask me how to set it up right now | ||
gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On July 03 2013 12:15 Acrofales wrote: Eh, then it isn't as useful: it would cause way too many headaches to set something up so the NUMBER of true propositions you get back gives you useful information. Although you can probably set it up so that 5 formulas are enough to be a 100% dt check on 3 players, it'd give me massive headaches and isn't worth it if you can just dayvig someone in the face Well, that's the point, if you know how to use it and work a little bit to figure out the correct formulas, you could get very potent shit. You can get up to 6 different answers (0-5 correct propositions), so if you create the correct set of formulas you could reverse engineer that shit to get more shit and shit I can't really think of any at the moment. I was hoping BC would post the "riddle" in the thread and everybody would think shit together to make the perfect listcheck! | ||
austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
Big big big big thanks to the hosts, there was a lot of crap to keep track of PLUS i know I asked a boatload of questions, but felt like I got answers when I should have and was told I couldn't get answers when it would have sort of ruined the game. Was super pissed at myself for accidentally claiming scum, and I hope it's the last time I do so as mafia, but glad it worked out in the end. Sorry kita that we couldn't get you the victory, really wanted you to win with us if we could, but then that just wasn't an option the last day. Sorry to gonzaw/crossfire/kita for the last day. I felt kind of shitty as I was arguing, thinking the whole time that my re-targeting ability would probably give me a 100% chance to win. But I also felt bad about claiming and ruining MZ/geript's chances at a win for us. I'm kind of glad kita turned out anti-town because it makes me feel a little less shitty. | ||
Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On July 03 2013 12:42 Crossfire99 wrote: I targeted you with it and shot gonzaw. I figured you'd medic or vet, and if you were vet he'd die, if you were medic I would have you medic me and he'd die. Since you used vet (i think that's what obs said), I didn't get to retarget anything, it just fizzled.Don't worry about it austin. What did you actually do with your re-targeting ability? I was, again, paranoid that you'd use NRA member. I could have died if you went that route over protection, which is one reason I made sure to say that KP wasn't targeted. If it was just KP, NRA member wouldn't have mattered. But oddly enough, I could have died from the non-KP action I took. | ||
Meapak_Ziphh
United States6782 Posts
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Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
On July 03 2013 12:48 austinmcc wrote: I targeted you with it and shot gonzaw. I figured you'd medic or vet, and if you were vet he'd die, if you were medic I would have you medic me and he'd die. Since you used vet (i think that's what obs said), I didn't get to retarget anything, it just fizzled. I was, again, paranoid that you'd use NRA member. I could have died if you went that route over protection, which is one reason I made sure to say that KP wasn't targeted. If it was just KP, NRA member wouldn't have mattered. But oddly enough, I could have died from the non-KP action I took. I was debating about that but I did the safer option which was to ensure that I survived to the next day so I could use my 1 way redirection ability which diverted all actions used onto me onto someone else I choose. Too bad you were too cautious after all the craziness gonzaw revealed about my role and delayed your shot 27 days...I'm pretty sure we could have worked out our differences peacefully in that time. | ||
austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On July 03 2013 12:48 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I had a lot of help in getting there, but glad we could win it.austin thank you for logging me my first, yes my first in almost 3 years of play, victory as scum. You can consider my effort payback for this little incident: On April 10 2013 11:26 Keirathi wrote: Anyways: I don't expect to live through the night tonight, and assassin is already dead. I am a cop. I checked austin last night, and he is town. I was also given the Lie Detector invention. I will use it when it's appropriate and let everyone know the results. On April 10 2013 11:27 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Guys I'm gonna make this real easy for everyone. Please listen to this while reading the following post: ##Nuke: austinmc To everyone who has called me scum: On April 10 2013 11:29 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: cough coughFUCK | ||
Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:00 austinmcc wrote: I had a lot of help in getting there, but glad we could win it. You can consider my effort payback for this little incident:cough cough hahahahaha | ||
austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On July 03 2013 12:54 Crossfire99 wrote: I was debating about that but I did the safer option which was to ensure that I survived to the next day so I could use my 1 way redirection ability which diverted all actions used onto me onto someone else I choose. Too bad you were too cautious after all the craziness gonzaw revealed about my role and delayed your shot 27 days...I'm pretty sure we could have worked out our differences peacefully in that time. For once, paranoia finally pays off. I honestly thought you were bluffing with the big win percentage chance, but now I absolutely see it. I think that if I wasn't still super paranoid about NRA Member (which seriously doesn't do anything against factional KP), I might have gone for it. But as long as we were one on one and couldn't lynch each other, I didn't see a reason not to choose random nights to fire at you. Gonzaw telling me items were one-use was a big help, although...I assume that would have come out at some point during the day, when we started talking percentages. | ||
Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
On July 01 2013 06:27 Crossfire99 wrote: Kita, this is what I'm doing to you right now. ##Vote: kitaman27 Kitaman27: ## Vote: kitaman27 | ||
Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:04 austinmcc wrote: For once, paranoia finally pays off. I honestly thought you were bluffing with the big win percentage chance, but now I absolutely see it. I think that if I wasn't still super paranoid about NRA Member (which seriously doesn't do anything against factional KP), I might have gone for it. But as long as we were one on one and couldn't lynch each other, I didn't see a reason not to choose random nights to fire at you. Gonzaw telling me items were one-use was a big help, although...I assume that would have come out at some point during the day, when we started talking percentages. I was really hoping gonzaw wouldn't say anything, but I think he just felt relieved to finally know 100% that you were scum and figured that what he said wouldn't hurt. Obviously it came back to bite us but that is the least of the issues that town had with this game. Honestly, if I was stuck with like 3 people and I thought all of them were anti-town I'd probably go stir crazy too. | ||
gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:04 austinmcc wrote: I honestly thought you were bluffing with the big win percentage chance, but now I absolutely see it. I think that if I wasn't still super paranoid about NRA Member (which seriously doesn't do anything against factional KP), I might have gone for it. But as long as we were one on one and couldn't lynch each other, I didn't see a reason not to choose random nights to fire at you. Gonzaw telling me items were one-use was a big help, although...I assume that would have come out at some point during the day, when we started talking percentages. Before D4 ended I asked deconduo if he allowed scum to just no-NK ad nauseaum in a 1v1 situation like this. I felt it was kind of....unfair I guess. He said he'd think about it but never answered ;_; Gonzaw telling me items were one-use was a big help Oh yeah I forgot I told scum how to win against us and lost because of it, thanks for the reminder | ||
austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
Even then, it might have worked. I had planned to force you to target your ability onto crossfire the NRA member, making you kill yourself. That was the only way around it I could think of. Seriously. It didn't actually kill anyone this game, but screw that role. "Oh, you targeted me, you're dead now, and you can also be bussed onto me" is some bullshit once the person looks townie. | ||
Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:10 gonzaw wrote: Before D4 ended I asked deconduo if he allowed scum to just no-NK ad nauseaum in a 1v1 situation like this. I felt it was kind of....unfair I guess. He said he'd think about it but never answered ;_; Oh yeah I forgot I told scum how to win against us and lost because of it, thanks for the reminder Gonzaw, if I made an ordered list of the reasons for town losing you would be at the bottom of the list. I'd be way above you on the blame chart with most of the townies (excluding BC, Dandel, and Acro and maybe 1 or 2 others idk). Don't feel bad about this game. We tried to lynch scum day 1 (after solstice), but failed. Day 2 blame on sk8r (lol). Day 3 we lynched geript. Day 4 we lynched kita. It's just too bad that everything went crazy. Don't feel depressed. | ||
gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:10 gonzaw wrote: Before D4 ended I asked deconduo if he allowed scum to just no-NK ad nauseaum in a 1v1 situation like this. I felt it was kind of....unfair I guess. He said he'd think about it but never answered ;_; Also, couldn't Xfire technically just NOT use his item on those 27 nights? So you choose not to shoot on N5, Xfire chooses not to use his item that same night You choose not to shoot on N6, Xfire chooses not to use his item that same night ... You choose to shoot on N889, Xfire chooses to use his item on N889, you lose. I mean...it's technically possible. But you'd say something like "oh, but then I could just wait another day more!" yeah but games of mafia dont' work like that, at some point the host FORCES you to shoot. I mean, technically there is nothing that says scum must 100% shoot at night and town must 100% lynch at day. In ANY game of mafia town can NL at day and scum no-NK at night, yet that doesn't happen because someone's gotta give, and the host will make sure of that one way or the other In those cases it's difficult since there are 2 actors with 2 different actions: town -> lynch, and scum -> NK. But here it's easy, host just forces YOU to shoot, since you are the sole actor (scum -> NK). ...I guess the most fair situation would be this: Host asks Xfire at which cycle he would activate his item, then host asks austin at which cycle he will NK. If both are the same, it's assumed the game went on and both acted the same night, thus Xfire wins If both are different, then it's assumed austin shot Xfire when he was not protected, so austin wins. ...if austin can just give a number like N9898120932937109847612039781320918273 then I guess it doesn't matter, but again, host can take it down to a "reasonable" number......I guess I dunno this shit is confusing lol | ||
Crossfire99
United States1529 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:16 gonzaw wrote: Also, couldn't Xfire technically just NOT use his item on those 27 nights? So you choose not to shoot on N5, Xfire chooses not to use his item that same night You choose not to shoot on N6, Xfire chooses not to use his item that same night ... You choose to shoot on N889, Xfire chooses to use his item on N889, you lose. I mean...it's technically possible. But you'd say something like "oh, but then I could just wait another day more!" yeah but games of mafia dont' work like that, at some point the host FORCES you to shoot. I mean, technically there is nothing that says scum must 100% shoot at night and town must 100% lynch at day. In ANY game of mafia town can NL at day and scum no-NK at night, yet that doesn't happen because someone's gotta give, and the host will make sure of that one way or the other In those cases it's difficult since there are 2 actors with 2 different actions: town -> lynch, and scum -> NK. But here it's easy, host just forces YOU to shoot, since you are the sole actor (scum -> NK). ...I guess the most fair situation would be this: Host asks Xfire at which cycle he would activate his item, then host asks austin at which cycle he will NK. If both are the same, it's assumed the game went on and both acted the same night, thus Xfire wins If both are different, then it's assumed austin shot Xfire when he was not protected, so austin wins. ...if austin can just give a number like N9898120932937109847612039781320918273 then I guess it doesn't matter, but again, host can take it down to a "reasonable" number......I guess I dunno this shit is confusing lol Well it fits with the craziness of this game. | ||
gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
On July 03 2013 13:14 austinmcc wrote: Even then, it might have worked. I had planned to force you to target your ability onto crossfire the NRA member, making you kill yourself. That was the only way around it I could think of. You could force someone to use his ability? wtf lol Seriously. It didn't actually kill anyone this game, but screw that role. "Oh, you targeted me, you're dead now, and you can also be bussed onto me" is some bullshit once the person looks townie. You talking about NRA member or your own role? If you are talking about NRA member then maybe yes it's OP (in this type of game at least). Like I said I threw random abilities in like 10 minutes, I didn't have time to think about balance | ||
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