Agnostic basically means you haven't made up your mind / indifferent.
I don't see much grey areas in this, and they're fairly simple concepts.
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Euronyme
Sweden3804 Posts
Agnostic basically means you haven't made up your mind / indifferent. I don't see much grey areas in this, and they're fairly simple concepts. | ||
KING CHARLIE :D
United States447 Posts
On July 19 2012 00:37 TheKwas wrote: Show nested quote + On July 19 2012 00:20 KING CHARLIE :D wrote: I still don't understand, maybe you can clear up a couple things for me. I was stupid and looked up the definition of atheist...and apparently, or at least I gathered, the "theist" part of it had something to do with "God" and his existence. How is it possible to be an invisible unicorn atheist? Atheist isn't a word that just means you don't believe in it. Help me out here. I'm not sure if you're trolling at this part or not. The invisible unicorn analogy bit is just to remove the idea away from loaded religious terms that may muddle understanding. Replace "Invisible Unicorn" with "theist being" or "god": I lack a belief in gods: I am an atheist I also believe that it's impossible to know for 100% certain that gods don't exist: I am an agnostic. You are 'atheistic' in regards to Thor, Odin, Zeus, Ra, Bhaal, and so on. An 'atheist' is someone who is atheistic in regards to all gods. There's no 'redundant' or 'grey' area between them, nor do they mean the same thing: they are labels for different things. There's no 'grey' area between being a socialist and being a SC fan: they are just labels for different things. I understand what you're saying now. You should read up on atheism and agnosticism though. There's definitely a ton of area in agnosticism that is exactly the same as a ton of area in atheism. | ||
Iyerbeth
England2410 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [You wrote] + This is a hallmark of a stupid person. Stupid people take extreme positions. ... Devoutly religious people are morons. It is part of God's plan, for some reason, that I need to blindly concede to a doctrine that has an equal amount of objective proof backing it than all the others, (none), and that 10% of my income will spare me the eternal flame broiler of hell. If I choose not to, I need to have such reverence for some pathetic fantasy that you've bought into to make you feel better about the fact that you will die and decay in a pine box until an asteroid extinguishes our planet again in another couple thousand years. Staunch liberals/Communists, extreme conservatives/Anarchists, sexual prudes and deviants...all of them are the exact same person poised at opposite ends of the spectrum, arguing against each other. It's never really about whatever it is they are arguing about. Your first day at a new job could be the day after election day, and you could go three years eleven months and two weeks without having ever heard the fat dyke that wears the pointy shoes and ruffled shirt say a single word about her positions on sociopolitical issues. Magically, as soon as it becomes a topical conversation around the Sweet-N-Low, she is a goosestepper and patriot for whatever arbitrary cause aligns with her ugly friends. A lot of it stems from stupid people trying to maintain a veneer of intelligence; they use it as a mental crutch. It's like a roadmap for them. The idea of looking at each situation that presents itself through the lens of your own wisdom and experience is such an insurmountable task in the mind of the stupid person that they need to deal in absolutes. In their simple grasp of the world, one political party has to be a benevolent crusader of all that is good, with the will of the people driving them, and the other party has to be an evil machine hell bent on the destruction of mankind and world domination. + Show Spoiler [I wrote] + This is a hallmark of a stupid person. Stupid people take their positions because they heard someone else take the position and it sorta made sense to them at first glance. ... Devoutly religious people who believe what they do only because they believe what they do are morons. It is part of God's plan, for some reason, that I need to blindly concede to a doctrine that has an equal amount of objective proof backing it than all the others, (none), and that 10% of my income will spare me the eternal flame broiler of hell. If I choose not to, I need to have such reverence for some pathetic fantasy that you've bought into to make you feel better about the fact that you will die and decay in a pine box until an asteroid extinguishes our planet again in another couple thousand years. Staunch liberals/Communists, extreme conservatives/Anarchists, sexual prudes and deviants...all of them are the exact same person poised at opposite ends of the spectrum, arguing against each other. With many throughout the spectrum on pretty much any issue, it's almost never usually about whatever it is they are arguing about. Your first day at a new job could be the day after election day, and you could go three years eleven months and two weeks without having ever heard the fat dyke that wears the pointy shoes and ruffled shirt say a single word about her positions on sociopolitical issues. Magically, as soon as it becomes a topical conversation around the Sweet-N-Low, she is a goosestepper and patriot for whatever arbitrary cause aligns with her ugly friends. A lot of it stems from stupid people trying to maintain a veneer of intelligence; they use it as a mental crutch. It's like a roadmap for them. The idea of looking at each situation that presents itself through the lens of your own wisdom and experience is such an insurmountable task in the mind of the stupid person that they need to deal in absolutes. In their simple grasp of the world, one political party has to be a benevolent crusader of all that is good, with the will of the people driving them, and the other party has to be an evil machine hell bent on the destruction of mankind and world domination. | ||
JDub
United States976 Posts
Stupid people take extreme positions. Atheists are morons. Isn't this a little bit ironic? I'd consider a blanket statement about all atheists, especially when you apparently don't understand the full meaning of the word "atheist", an extreme position. Edit: The blanket statement about devoutly religious folks, is (as much as I dislike organized religion), also an extreme position. | ||
TheKwas
Iceland372 Posts
How would you define the type of person I am referencing? They have to be some facet of atheism...Explicit strong atheist? Explicit strong atheist would work, but honestly, it's more of a label for a hypothetical person than anyone in the real world. These sort of "strong atheists" that insist that they know god doesn't exist are basically just fictitious straw-men that religious figures create. No one of note in any atheist community i know of actually believes that. 1. Difference in Knowledge A gnostic atheist not only believes there are no gods, he also claims to know there are no gods. An agnostic atheist doesn’t believe in gods, but doesn’t claim to know there are no gods. For the most part, atheists don't bother with this distinction, because the first one is just downright stupid. 99.99999...% of atheists are agnostic atheists. The word 'atheist' itself simply means "a lack of belief in theism". A gnostic atheist is largely just a hypothetical creation. Thinking that that's the mainstream atheist belief is misunderstanding atheism. | ||
KING CHARLIE :D
United States447 Posts
On July 19 2012 00:43 JDub wrote: Isn't this a little bit ironic? I'd consider a blanket statement about all atheists, especially when you apparently don't understand the full meaning of the word "atheist", an extreme position. Edit: The blanket statement about devoutly religious folks, is (as much as I dislike organized religion), also an extreme position. Hmm. I need to find a different way to word the "stupid people take extreme positions." I guess what I mean is being "closed-minded" because I take issue with the arrogance associated with thinking that your beliefs are the be all end all and that there is no other credible way to think about it. | ||
KING CHARLIE :D
United States447 Posts
On July 19 2012 00:49 TheKwas wrote: I edited my post but already the thread moved on so I'll just repost with comment: Show nested quote + How would you define the type of person I am referencing? They have to be some facet of atheism...Explicit strong atheist? Explicit strong atheist would work, but honestly, it's more of a label for a hypothetical person than anyone in the real world. These sort of "strong atheists" that insist that they know god doesn't exist are basically just fictitious straw-men that religious figures create. No one of note in any atheist community i know of actually believes that. Show nested quote + 1. Difference in Knowledge A gnostic atheist not only believes there are no gods, he also claims to know there are no gods. An agnostic atheist doesn’t believe in gods, but doesn’t claim to know there are no gods. For the most part, atheists don't bother with this distinction, because the first one is just downright stupid. 99.99999...% of atheists are agnostic atheists. The word 'atheist' itself simply means "a lack of belief in theism". A gnostic atheist is largely just a hypothetical creation. Thinking that that's the mainstream atheist belief is misunderstanding atheism. I know I have probably co-mingled with a lot more stupid people than you, and I can accept your point that the majority of atheists do not feel that way, but this person does exist. I've come across several of them, and maybe using a term like "atheist" is unfair to the people that have actually put a significant amount of thought in their beliefs, but how else do I label this guy? Militant Atheist? | ||
Euronyme
Sweden3804 Posts
On July 19 2012 00:49 TheKwas wrote: I edited my post but already the thread moved on so I'll just repost with comment: Show nested quote + How would you define the type of person I am referencing? They have to be some facet of atheism...Explicit strong atheist? Explicit strong atheist would work, but honestly, it's more of a label for a hypothetical person than anyone in the real world. These sort of "strong atheists" that insist that they know god doesn't exist are basically just fictitious straw-men that religious figures create. No one of note in any atheist community i know of actually believes that. Show nested quote + 1. Difference in Knowledge A gnostic atheist not only believes there are no gods, he also claims to know there are no gods. An agnostic atheist doesn’t believe in gods, but doesn’t claim to know there are no gods. For the most part, atheists don't bother with this distinction, because the first one is just downright stupid. 99.99999...% of atheists are agnostic atheists. The word 'atheist' itself simply means "a lack of belief in theism". A gnostic atheist is largely just a hypothetical creation. Thinking that that's the mainstream atheist belief is misunderstanding atheism. I think I'd say I'm a 'strong atheist'. I consider the bible and contemporary religions as trustworthy as old norse mythology and lord of the rings. Does that make me a moron? I think that the person claiming there being a super sentient being floating about should be the one brining proof, rather than the one claiming that it doesn't exist. For instance, we don't all believe in big foot. Why? Because there's not enough evidence to suggest he exists. On the other end of the spectrum - we can't prove that big foot doesn't exist, and in all honesty we don't really have an incentive to do so, as we're convinced he doesn't exist. If you do believe in big foot, take the loch ness monster or harry potter as examples instead. Am I a moron? :/ Furthermore, are we all morons for being strong anti big foot believers? He might be the man behind the curtain, the man controlling this very universe. We'll never know. | ||
TheKwas
Iceland372 Posts
I would just say something like "people who are gunshot certain in their beliefs are morons", or "close-minded people are morons". then just specify people that insist that religion is absolutely essential to human society/morality or people that insist that religion is nothing but a blight on society/morality. Those are the two most obviously "extreme" and stupid positions in the realm of religion. | ||
jpak
United States5045 Posts
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ggrrg
Bulgaria2715 Posts
Feta So when I arrived in the US to do an year abroad, I was absolutely devasteted to find out that it wasn't sold anywhere in a 50 miles radius. I was certain that it would be an year of suffering without my most important food source, but then I found the next best thing in the world: Cheddar By the way, do you mean that Rita literally snorted the hot sauce!? I've seen and heard of people trying to snort a variety of stuff, but never hot sauce! Also, I'm very happy to see your blog entries coming in shorter intervals recently! Thanks and keep them coming! + Show Spoiler [disagreement] + So far no religion has been able to convince me that it holds more merit than any of the thousands upon thousands of other religions and deities recorded in the history of mankind. Which results in me being a nonbeliever. If there is any supernatural being that just sits there and watches its own creation or a giant, whose high school chemistry project resulted in the creation of our universe is irrelevant, since there is no reason for me (or anybody for that matter) to believe in such a thing. Ergo I'm a nonbeliever, thus, per definition, atheist. Also, you're completely right: I do have "an axe to grind with religion". Pointing out injustice and wars in history, which have been provoked by religion is pointless, since it's all past and gone. However, there is still too many problems created or reinforced by religion. I hate that religious opposition is a/the driving factor behind hindering stem cells research, disabling a reasonable consensus on abortion, stopping gay rights and adoptions by same sex parents, and much more. Furthermore, I hate that religion almost always creates social tensions - between people of different religions, between sexes (ultra Islamic societies), between social classes (Hinduism). Furthermore, I hate that religion is abused for political agendas all over the world. I do agree however that normally (maybe even always) things are not black and white and having an absolute stance is contraproductive or plain stupid. However, I'd say on rare occasions there are some issues, which have such small grey areas that examining them causes nothing but a philosophical debate without any practical significance, and thus an absolute stance becomes acceptable. | ||
TheKwas
Iceland372 Posts
I think I'd say I'm a 'strong atheist'. I consider the bible and contemporary religions as trustworthy as old norse mythology and lord of the rings. Does that make me a moron? I think that the person claiming there being a super sentient being floating about should be the one brining proof, rather than the one claiming that it doesn't exist. For instance, we don't all believe in big foot. Why? Because there's not enough evidence to suggest he exists. On the other end of the spectrum - we can't prove that big foot doesn't exist, and in all honesty we don't really have an incentive to do so, as we're convinced he doesn't exist. If you do believe in big foot, take the loch ness monster or harry potter as examples instead. Am I a moron? :/ Furthermore, are we all morons for being strong anti big foot believers? He might be the man behind the curtain, the man controlling this very universe. We'll never know. You are not a 'strong atheist' in the sense of being a "gnostic atheist". You just perceive the probability of god to be very, very low, but not impossible. You are still, technically, an agnostic. A gnostic christian, on the other hand, wouldn't just consider god to be probable, but they would claim to know that god exists (example: "I witnessed miracles, I KNOW god exists!!". | ||
KING CHARLIE :D
United States447 Posts
On July 19 2012 01:03 TheKwas wrote: Fair enough. I'm probably a bit defensive on the wording because already atheism has a really bad rep because of widespread misunderstanding around what "atheist" means. Don't use militant atheist either, that's both cliched and very misleading because the 2 most common interpretations would just be: a) very outspoken atheist or b) actually someone who is violent, not c) someone who is certain god doesn't exist. I would just say something like "people who are gunshot certain in their beliefs are morons", or "close-minded people are morons". then just specify people that insist that religion is absolutely essential to human society/morality or people that insist that religion is nothing but a blight on society/morality. Those are the two most obviously "extreme" and stupid positions in the realm of religion. You're 100% right. This will take some revisions. Thank you for being part of the creative process and for sharing your wisdom with me. | ||
TheKwas
Iceland372 Posts
I must have dalkgalbi: and perogies: Unfortunately, most places with an abundance of the one will typically be lacking in the other. The world is a cruel place sometimes. | ||
Euronyme
Sweden3804 Posts
On July 19 2012 01:07 TheKwas wrote: Show nested quote + I think I'd say I'm a 'strong atheist'. I consider the bible and contemporary religions as trustworthy as old norse mythology and lord of the rings. Does that make me a moron? I think that the person claiming there being a super sentient being floating about should be the one brining proof, rather than the one claiming that it doesn't exist. For instance, we don't all believe in big foot. Why? Because there's not enough evidence to suggest he exists. On the other end of the spectrum - we can't prove that big foot doesn't exist, and in all honesty we don't really have an incentive to do so, as we're convinced he doesn't exist. If you do believe in big foot, take the loch ness monster or harry potter as examples instead. Am I a moron? :/ Furthermore, are we all morons for being strong anti big foot believers? He might be the man behind the curtain, the man controlling this very universe. We'll never know. You are not a 'strong atheist' in the sense of being a "gnostic atheist". You just perceive the probability of god to be very, very low, but not impossible. You are still, technically, an agnostic. A gnostic christian, on the other hand, wouldn't just consider god to be probable, but they would claim to know that god exists (example: "I witnessed miracles, I KNOW god exists!!". Oh OK. I misunderstood. I thought it had to do with the probabilities. I guess I'm not a moron then after all! Well then, about the food. My mum makes a dish for me that I'm not 100% certain of the ingredients, but it's something like this. The basic ingredients are quinoa boiled in turmeric, and mung beans. That's like the bulk. In addition I like to have geen olives, a truck load of feta cheese, some garlic, some butter/olive oil and whatever else you feel like having. Basically it's been the main reason of me returning for visits relatively often. There's something more to the beans though, but I'm not quite sure what it is. Either way eating that is a mouth orgasm x100. I can't actually make the dish myself as I'm a disgrace to the human race when it comes to cooking skills, and making it the right way requires a lot of steps and a lot of time. | ||
jpak
United States5045 Posts
On July 19 2012 01:18 TheKwas wrote: With religion out of the way, on to the food porn. I must have dalkgalbi: and perogies: Unfortunately, most places with an abundance of the one will typically be lacking in the other. The world is a cruel place sometimes. My mother makes killer dakgalbi, but i have never had perogies before. That actually looks pretty good :D | ||
KING CHARLIE :D
United States447 Posts
On July 19 2012 01:32 jpak wrote: Show nested quote + On July 19 2012 01:18 TheKwas wrote: With religion out of the way, on to the food porn. I must have dalkgalbi: and perogies: Unfortunately, most places with an abundance of the one will typically be lacking in the other. The world is a cruel place sometimes. My mother makes killer dakgalbi, but i have never had perogies before. That actually looks pretty good :D It honestly looks delicious. Why is it so easy to get a hamburger in the states and amazing food like this I have never even heard of. I gotta find a hole in the wall and try that "dalkgalbi". | ||
TheKwas
Iceland372 Posts
Dalkgalbi is a Korean dish. If you can find it in a legit restaurant, they will typically cook it in front of you at your table (as you can somewhat see in the picture). | ||
Jaaaaasper
United States10225 Posts
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KING CHARLIE :D
United States447 Posts
On July 19 2012 01:53 Jaaaaasper wrote: Well the only thing that would set me in withdrawal would be the lack of water. The thing i would miss the most? Probably coffee the life blood of the sleep challenged. Yeah, I live in Seattle. It's everywhere, and I feel completely at it's mercy. | ||
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