|
On January 16 2012 10:13 kingjames01 wrote:
Town: I propose to you, that at least one of BC/BM is mafia.
Why do I think this?
There was a lot of chaos during Day 1. It started out with some decent speculation and debate as to who should be elected and why. Although there were a large number of candidates, certain candidates were becoming clear leaders in the race.
After BC's mason plan and claim, the environment of the thread quickly spiralled out of control. From a focussed discussion of who to elect, we observed multiple mason claims, several nonsensical posts and a drop in the useful posts-to-noise ratio.
Either the level of Town play is low (which I don't believe, based on the experience of the player list involved) or the mafia arrived in earnest.
At the end of the day, there was a surge in votes cementing BC as Mayor over BM, who was elected as sheriff. It is WIFOM to discuss which role is more desirable for the current mafia family so I will stop here.
Instead of constantly looking for scumslips in every vote. Step back and think about the day's events.
What did the players ATTEMPT to do?
What did the players ACCOMPLISH?
For Day 2, we ABSOLUTELY need to get back on track. There's going to be a lot of discussion I'm sure due to the night actions but don't lose sight of what we learned in Day 1.
Finally, the degree to which we hold BC and BM accountable should increase!
BC claimed Mason.
BC proposed a mass Mason claim.
BC claimed to Mason sandroba.
BC and sandroba reached 'a compromise'.
BC used his Mayoral right to choose the Day 1 lynch and chose Palmar.
We can no longer check BC's role and/or alignment.
If BC's mass Mason claim was so pro-town, what did it actually accomplish? It wasn't very well thought out. Even if he is Town-aligned, it injected so much chaos into this game, that players are struggling to keep up. Weaker mafia can slip in a few posts here and there and we'll never even notice if they mess up.
BC: tell us what you think your plan accomplished? Why did you suggest a plan that inherently would cause the Town to go in circles?
Also, BM previously supported my idea to reveal the Bodyguards. Do you support this proposal? Will you give up their names after the night is over?
hi kingjames
It is so glad to know the mafia are reallllllllly angry with me right now as it makes it really obvious when you guys leap out at me. I say this because people who should have been far more active during this game cycle and risked modkills are suddenly "spurred" into playing a game and instantly doing exactly what I would expect you to. Jump at me instantly. Why do you ask that I expect this? Because I did the most town move throughout the entirety of day 1.
From what I remember day 1 about the elections was very much what you would see in a game with no real movement. Everyone was discussing the candidates but most of it came down to experience in the players to narrow down the running. Before my claim and even after my claim up until the last 4-6 hour mark I had been solidly in the lead via votes. The "swinging" of votes towards me to give me mayor over bm was not a surge. I gained 3 votes near end of deadline. In the last 4 hours bm lost 3-4 votes then gained like 6-7. Protact who had near no solid voter base till the last 4 hours went from a very low amount of votes to just missing an elected spot. Those two had voter surges, I did not.
All the reasoning for those 3 people voting me near the end of the day were all posted within the thread as well.
You are right that we cannot forget what we learned day 1 and into night 1. Mafia is pissed at the mason situation. Town is moderately so, however you can immediately tell a player like wiggles is town based on how he is aiming to fix the situation. Not only that he is attempting to turn it into a group of scumhunters that the mafia has to risk infiltrating to fuck with (thus potentially losing one or more of their own members) or give up the idea of infilitrating it and letting town have an exclusive spot to talk.
Are their issues with wiggles plan? Yes, however it is clearly more pro town than players saying "lets trust people with near no experience with pms to use them properly"
Forcing people who can do damage or make massive gains for the town accountable for their actions and able to be analyzed properly is far more pro town than letting people work around in the dark with no guidance or real "negative" to fucking up in pm's. By forcing people to operate in the public eye with a far more insidious role than most hinders mafia, benefits town, and also created a topic of discussion day 1 that is not rehashing old games. This is a polarizing discussion. Through it, regardless of what some people may try to convince you, a ton of information was placed upon a large majority of the active player base. Did some players skirt by without posting? Why yes they did, you are one of them who did dick all day 1.
However, every game possess; players who will skirt by doing the bare minimum who will never join in on a discussion unless near forced to by mods, or by being actively called out / put up for lynch or vig shot. That is the nature of the game. However, the "active" players who comment badly on major topics but do near nothing else in the thread are typically scum being told to join in on a discussion. Is this always true? no, but it is a good starting ground.
Everyone can look back at day 1 and realize that the mason discussion did in fact take up most of the day, however near everyone should also see how many people actively sharing opinions that gave a huge amount of information that we would otherwise not have had.
You can argue that had I not done what I had that the same amount or more information would be garnered, but till my claim how much solid information had been produced on any player aside from "x is good, but if hes elected and mafia it could be bad, etc..."
Day 1 mafia games need elections to kickstart discussion, however it is near down to a formula that catching reds is far harder unless one slips up hard. By forcing people to participate in a discussion that opinions will clearly show a mafia or town bias, the chances of slipping up are far higher.
people can argue till the town comes home if I made the right move or not and that is fine however what is done is done and their is now a ton of information people can use as a starting ground to work with.
Now onto current shite.
BG names were encrypted and given out into seperate pieces. In the case both bgs are red and Myself / bm or myself on my own or bm on his own die, you will now have people able to give the bg names out to get them killed.
If people are afraid that it was possible I was linked to two reds, if the bgs both die instantly you will have 4 people who will have known the information. either myself or bm as red, or both people I gave the encrypted info to.
However in the case both bgs die, it is far more likely that the reds are the two people I gave information to than myself or bm. Why? Because if either of us is red, or if both of us are red, town bgs protect us and we would have no reason to off them fast. This is obviously wifom, but you get the idea.
Veteran well known players need to shape up, now. Palmar was lynched because of his play. If you join a game this size and intend on trolling or contributing very little useful information chances are you are going to be pegged as scum and dealt with as such. Vets should know better than to create an atmosphere that mafia can hide in, palmar was doing just that. Kurumi is also guilty of this, regardless of if he does it frequently or not.
All people that fw chose to not replace who are not modkilled, post. Kingjames is posting now and has yet to inform us as to where he was for 48 hours without posting, why he didnt vote, and why he is solely centered on continuing the mason debate while ignoring almost every other event that happened in the thread?
I will quote a few posts of kingjames to give everyone an idea of why he would make an excellent lynch target for this coming day
On January 14 2012 00:53 kingjames01 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 00:38 kitaman27 wrote:
KJ's bodyguards should claim plan is incredibly poor. So is Jackal's. Even if the scum team did subsititute all three bodyguards, they still have to worry about a electoral official being a vet, which would cost them 3 scum or that one of the bodyguards wasn't jailed, which would also cost them 3 scum. First, there are only 2 Bodyguards. Second, I agree with you about Jackal's comment about lynching a Bodyguard. Third, you're actually agreeing with me in essence. I'm saying that if they sneak in a Bodyguard, it will be risky to take out the elected officials. However, to make it harder for them, they should be revealed from the beginning. What if both elected officials are killed and we have 0 clue as to who the Bodyguards were? Are you okay with that risk? Finally, are you stating for the record that if you were elected, you would not reveal your Bodyguards?
See this post everyone? He is advocating the divulging of "blue roles" I put that in quotations as they could be red. He also makes a point on saying that hes fine with lynching a bodyguard to prevent mafia from taking the role.(note that jackal just wanted the threat there, not actually doing it unless there was reason to) Why would you do this? Outing their names in thread or saying you will lynch one only gets bgs offed and makes the mayor/sheriff more vulnerable. Thankfully I figured out an alternative and acted on it that didn't require giving mafia the ability to snipe the bgs at no cost or suspicion as we were nice enough to hand them out.
On January 14 2012 09:08 kingjames01 wrote:
Alright, I've been at work all day and it's taken me quite a while to catch up in the reading.
I'm going to reiterate, that I support the Bodyguards being made public. There was a point raised earlier which suggested that if this plan were carried through, the elected officials would be more vulnerable. I don't think that is the case. I have already stated my reasoning but here is the idea again.
If at least one of the Bodyguards is Town, then they player has to die before our Mayor and/or Sheriff are vulnerable.
If both Bodyguards die, everyone will be on guard and can then start to protect the elected officials.
If at most one dies, then the Mayor and/or Sheriff are still safe. Why? Because the mafia will have to trade at least one of their own to kill the Mayor and/or Sheriff.
Next, I think the Mass Mason Roleclaim is a terrible plan. The mafia know the roles of 10 players out of 50, namely, their own players. If all of the Masons claim, then they know the roles of more players in the game. If they can, they will target our powerful Blue roles, like Town Jack, Medic, Detective.
Why are you guys okay with helping them to narrow down their targets?
Contradiction in this post insanely. He is fine with outing the bgs that could be either mafia or town (and they protect the sheriff/mayor who could be town/town, mafia/town, or mafia and mafia)
But is against another role that could be either alignment that could do an insane amount of damage to the town in mafia hands hidden away. His argument is mafia would know more players in the game and narrow their shots down, guess what, so does handing out the bgs. Note he also calls the mass mason roleclaim a terrible plan.
Yet when he returns from his 48 hour absence all he can talk about is how he thinks either i or bm is mafia, and the terrible mason plan that he had already said his piece on.
He doesn't analyze any player. He concentrates solely on me. Read his last post before he vanished for 48 hours
On January 14 2012 09:14 kingjames01 wrote:
Also, consider for the moment, that BC may be mafia Jack.
If he uses his Mason power on Day 1 to establish his credibility and then is subsequently elected to office, we will not be able to find the mafia Jack.
It is a risk, but I know that BC will take that risk. He is very much a medium-risk, high-reward player.
EVERYONE! WHAT HAPPENS IF BLOODYC0BBLER IS MAFIA JACK?
I consider this scenario involving BC to be within his bag of tricks, and I will not vote to elect him into office.
Given his extreme distrust of me here and his refusal to vote for me (didnt vote for anyone at all) you would think given the entire days worth of posting he would opt to push specifically at me when he returned, or analyzed me extensively.
Instead he opted to suggest 1 of 2 people could be red, attempt to shut down a pro town idea, request the names of the bgs.
A player of his ability knows he has to provide far more than he has given this game and I am taking notice.
|
As for people asking for my pm logs between opz and sandroba, I will post them after we transition to day 2
|
I've gone back over the thread a bit (not completely, I was more busy todayIRL than I had anticipated to be) and here are my thoughts on tomorrow's lynch.
Lanaia
- - as observed by others and I found to be very true upon looking myself, Lanaia has no scum reads. She mentioned liking the idea of lynching Palmar, but she never outright said she thought he was scum and she never said she thought anyone was scum. That's scummy, as we're trying to find scum here. She's also got a lot of excuses for not posting, and she dislikes all the 'fuckery' going on in-thread.
Sandroba
- - His claim to fame D1 was his very vocal support of the mass mason claim. I think it would have been a good idea, but I also wasn't about to try and force anyone to do anything. Sandroba was though. He also apparently made the Palmar lynch happen with BC out-of-thread (if I'm to understand correctly). Why not put a case forward like WBG? Maybe because WBG was catching flak for 'basing it all on meta?' Because he didn't want to look "scummy" like WBG perhaps? I don't know...because it was decided in private.
Foolishness
- - playing up his null contributions to this game, claiming he's in danger tonight for fingering mafia D1 (which might be true if he's town, but I'm guessing he's not.) Supported BM vocally and switches support to Mattchew. Remember why?
That's about it. Do with that what you will guys.
I'm gonna miss you. All of you. 
|
On January 16 2012 09:26 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 09:05 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 08:42 wherebugsgo wrote:
I don't agree that Protact has been giving town direction at all. Notice how absent they have been for the vast majority of the last 24 hours?
well yeah but he I consider him being right with some points about BC. I think the talk about masons was not good for town. We could have discussed something else as well, we had enough stuff (like who's acting scummy) and who we want to lynch. BC kind of produced a mass claim. I still don't know if it's that bad but it certainly was not was he intended, at least not without discussing it but discussing it took way too much time when we needed to get a defined picture of our mayors. So yes, protac posted very little, I am scared of him as well and I'd love him to be in no office at all. Still what he posted gave me town vibes. What are your thoughts about sandroba, bum, bc and protac? I think I answered them good enough from my point of view. sandro is probable scum unless he does something tomorrow. He's so far been useless and his idea about the mass mason claim was stupid. Protac I think is scum based on how he switched lynch targets. He/they switched as it was convenient, to macpo. Bum, I'm unsure of so far (haven't read through his posts thoroughly tbh). From the initial read I was getting, townish. However, I don't think I've given him as much attention as I should have. I will reread the thread again a couple more times with the flip in mind. BC, I'm leaning pretty town. The only thing that's unsettling is how little he said about Palmar before lynching him, but I'm fine with the lynch and I wasn't really set off about anything else BC has done. The thing about the Palmar flip is that it makes people like zeks, opz, and several others look bad. Lanaia looks bad as well; she has not commented on anything concrete and so far has had no scum reads. It looks rather similar to her play from XLVII. At any rate, I still want thoughts from people on Protac and opz. Sandro/zeks/Lanaia thoughts would be nice too.
Strong scumread on protac at the moment based on his behaviour in thread. My opinion of him will obviously be skewed given that he has analyzed me and I have (IMO) have basically proven him false but due to the nature of how he chose to attack me leads me to believe he is red. Opz is currently a neutral read for me, will require more information as overall he has been quiet both here and in pms.
zeks and lanaia need to step up as both are experienced players who know better than to lurk, and sandro needs to heavily step into this game and try. So far his behaviour here has screamed bored townie, but without any contributions I will change that to mafia.
|
|
|
On January 16 2012 11:41 VisceraEyes wrote:I've gone back over the thread a bit (not completely, I was more busy todayIRL than I had anticipated to be) and here are my thoughts on tomorrow's lynch. Lanaia - - as observed by others and I found to be very true upon looking myself, Lanaia has no scum reads. She mentioned liking the idea of lynching Palmar, but she never outright said she thought he was scum and she never said she thought anyone was scum. That's scummy, as we're trying to find scum here. She's also got a lot of excuses for not posting, and she dislikes all the 'fuckery' going on in-thread. Sandroba - - His claim to fame D1 was his very vocal support of the mass mason claim. I think it would have been a good idea, but I also wasn't about to try and force anyone to do anything. Sandroba was though. He also apparently made the Palmar lynch happen with BC out-of-thread (if I'm to understand correctly). Why not put a case forward like WBG? Maybe because WBG was catching flak for 'basing it all on meta?' Because he didn't want to look "scummy" like WBG perhaps? I don't know...because it was decided in private. Foolishness - - playing up his null contributions to this game, claiming he's in danger tonight for fingering mafia D1 (which might be true if he's town, but I'm guessing he's not.) Supported BM vocally and switches support to Mattchew. Remember why? That's about it. Do with that what you will guys. I'm gonna miss you. All of you.
First off, if you are a jack you could theoretically save yourself, but realistically you should have been jailed.
As for pushing palmar? The only experienced player of my scumreads he would fully endorse was palmar. I had a reason foolishness which I now believe was likely false, however I had a strong read on protrac on red and he really did not want me offing foolishness or protac. Keep in mind in thread people were also having issues with protrac offing me and due to the overwhelming majority I chose the player who was contributing far less than they should have while still being active. Palmar flipped miller which is good for our dts, is terrible on a whole.
As another note to the lynch, I am still accountable however let me explain that I came back and had very little time to catch up on the thread before the deadline. Had I been able to take in more of the thread I most likely still would have offed protrac for his late swap who to lynch if elected, and for orchestrating such a late into the day vote swing. As I did not have a full grasp of the situation I had to choose based off the information I had before i left for work.
Lets make sure today nets us a better result.
|
On January 16 2012 11:42 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 09:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 16 2012 09:05 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 08:42 wherebugsgo wrote:
I don't agree that Protact has been giving town direction at all. Notice how absent they have been for the vast majority of the last 24 hours?
well yeah but he I consider him being right with some points about BC. I think the talk about masons was not good for town. We could have discussed something else as well, we had enough stuff (like who's acting scummy) and who we want to lynch. BC kind of produced a mass claim. I still don't know if it's that bad but it certainly was not was he intended, at least not without discussing it but discussing it took way too much time when we needed to get a defined picture of our mayors. So yes, protac posted very little, I am scared of him as well and I'd love him to be in no office at all. Still what he posted gave me town vibes. What are your thoughts about sandroba, bum, bc and protac? I think I answered them good enough from my point of view. sandro is probable scum unless he does something tomorrow. He's so far been useless and his idea about the mass mason claim was stupid. Protac I think is scum based on how he switched lynch targets. He/they switched as it was convenient, to macpo. Bum, I'm unsure of so far (haven't read through his posts thoroughly tbh). From the initial read I was getting, townish. However, I don't think I've given him as much attention as I should have. I will reread the thread again a couple more times with the flip in mind. BC, I'm leaning pretty town. The only thing that's unsettling is how little he said about Palmar before lynching him, but I'm fine with the lynch and I wasn't really set off about anything else BC has done. The thing about the Palmar flip is that it makes people like zeks, opz, and several others look bad. Lanaia looks bad as well; she has not commented on anything concrete and so far has had no scum reads. It looks rather similar to her play from XLVII. At any rate, I still want thoughts from people on Protac and opz. Sandro/zeks/Lanaia thoughts would be nice too. Strong scumread on protac at the moment based on his behaviour in thread. My opinion of him will obviously be skewed given that he has analyzed me and I have (IMO) have basically proven him false but due to the nature of how he chose to attack me leads me to believe he is red. Opz is currently a neutral read for me, will require more information as overall he has been quiet both here and in pms. zeks and lanaia need to step up as both are experienced players who know better than to lurk, and sandro needs to heavily step into this game and try. So far his behaviour here has screamed bored townie, but without any contributions I will change that to mafia.
Something came up IRL that requires my attention this week. I have been unable to stay active and keep up to date on everything so for the better good of the game I've requested for a substitute..
|
The end of the night phase will be postponed. I'm not sure how long. Sorry for the inconvenience, I will keep you guys updated.
|
BC do you intend to only mason people who know what you're capable of in PMs? This is important to me for obvious reasons.
What are your thoughts on Foolishness supporting Mattchew for mayor D1? Can you see town Foolishness doing this? There are a plethora of reasons why scum Foolishness could want to do this, but can you think of a reason town Foolishness would?
|
On January 16 2012 11:04 blahz0r wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 22:58 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 11:51 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm willing to vote bum for the fact that I like him right now. I think he's
Bum are you willing to lynch Palmar?
I'd be willing to lynch BC too if I continue feeling the way I'm feeling about him. But we'll see. Need more time on that, since BC is much harder to read than Palmar. Palmar's just like lolscum woke up and I'm at this post. Yeah I liked bum a lot too but I don't really like the people he likes So you went from liking him to not liking him because of the people he likes. [1]Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 01:52 Toadesstern wrote:
btw I'm not convinced risk.nuke is mafia at all :p
I'd gladly lynch scumdroba or bum. I think sandroba is more scummy however I am a little afraid that we might end up lynching a townie because BC might be a mafia too. If BC's a mafia I don' think sandroba is mafia.
Conclusion: I want to lynch sandroba. I'd rather not risk lynching BC so early and lynching sandroba is way better information for us while giving pretty decent chance to hit a red mine Now you want to lynch him? [2]Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 06:22 wherebugsgo wrote:
@ Toadesstern:
Please explain why you find bumatlarge to be scummy.
Also, summarize your thoughts on Protactinium and sandroba while you're at it. I want to know things from you.
as promised (sry took longer because I completly forgot it ) about sandroba:I don't like the fact that BC lynched Palmar at all. Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first. I asked BC and Sandroba to show me their pm logs, neither one did it and I don't like the coincidence of bc masoning sandroba although I have to agree that that one point probably is circular reasoning because I think it's something that makes bc scummy Sandroba's budding with Palmar (without a reason) and with BC (without giving an explanation). Also he voted BC. If you now look at what I posted about bum and BC you realize that there's a lot of mentioning each other within this circle of BC-Bum-Sandroba. I've got the feeling sandroba is trying to trick me/ us his picks and his style obviously is not helping at all.My highest priority to lynch right now would be sandroba, followed by bum. I won't support a bc lynch although I think he's leaning scum for me right now because I'm not sure about my judgement of bc yet. I'd say he's got a 30-50% of flipping red instead of true 10 out of 50. Yes you did say a little about it but all you have now is a feeling. Why did it go from people he trusted to just a feeling? [3]Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 09:36 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 09:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 16 2012 09:05 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 08:42 wherebugsgo wrote:
I don't agree that Protact has been giving town direction at all. Notice how absent they have been for the vast majority of the last 24 hours?
well yeah but he I consider him being right with some points about BC. I think the talk about masons was not good for town. We could have discussed something else as well, we had enough stuff (like who's acting scummy) and who we want to lynch. BC kind of produced a mass claim. I still don't know if it's that bad but it certainly was not was he intended, at least not without discussing it but discussing it took way too much time when we needed to get a defined picture of our mayors. So yes, protac posted very little, I am scared of him as well and I'd love him to be in no office at all. Still what he posted gave me town vibes. What are your thoughts about sandroba, bum, bc and protac? I think I answered them good enough from my point of view. [...] Bum, I'm unsure of so far (haven't read through his posts thoroughly tbh). From the initial read I was getting, townish. However, I don't think I've given him as much attention as I should have. I will reread the thread again a couple more times with the flip in mind. [...] The thing about the Palmar flip is that it makes people like zeks, opz, and several others look bad. Lanaia looks bad as well; she has not commented on anything concrete and so far has had no scum reads. It looks rather similar to her play from XLVII. At any rate, I still want thoughts from people on Protac and opz. Sandro/zeks/Lanaia thoughts would be nice too. Yeah I had a town read on bum early on too. The scary thing about protac for me btw (because I did not explain why I called it scary) is that he looks townish to me but I can't realy put it down with words. I'm not trusting myself there at all because I don't even know why I got that townread, it just feels townish because I really liked the big post he did. Sure that' something but that' should not be enough to give me a townread when he's lurking so hardcorde. Why does palmars flip make people like zeks or opz look bad? I'm going to be honest here: They're both a big blank note for me. Go back to bum. Is he MAFIA or not? Can you explain more besides this "I got this bad feeling because so and so are together". I'd like to believe you but there is uncertainty for now. Is there also a possibility that one of them could be town led astray? [4]Still reading a day or two worth of text =\
1) kind of yeah. At least that's what made me look into him and I now longer had a town feeling. I've got the feeling I was tricked by something. This whole thing looks weird but I can't put my finger on it where I'm wrong beause surly I am wrong somewhere
2) Again: Kind of. I'd much rather see sandroba dead, more explanation at [4]
3) It's a feeling because it's a day1-read. So as my palmar is town, mattchew is town, VE is town were. I'm saying were because palmar and mattchew are both dead and I still call VE a fakeclaimer and I want to know why, I won't call anything based on d1 analysis without a flip something different than a feeling.
4) Most certainly scum and yes I am most certainly wrong somewhere. My point is and always was that I think something is wrong within BC - Bum - Sandroba. I think either one or 2 (maybe all 3 but I doubt they're that stupid) are scum. I think all 3 are scummy to some degree but yeah I'm going to be wrong on one of them at least I guess. I think my scumread on BC is wrong. I'm pretty sure I am right on sandroba and I think I am right on bum, won't call it anything like a 100% call however and neither will I call sandroba a 100% call.
The big issue I have is that I think at least one of them is screwing with us by giving fake reads. You know, they're asked to give us 3 townreads and end up listing 2 people I think to be town and 1 I am think to be mafia to screw with us and make it hard to judge them based on their reads because being wrong is hardly something bad as long as it's for a reason.
I don't see a reason however especially in what sandroba posts.
|
Why I wasn't able to post in the game is between myself and the mods. The details do nothing to enhance the game and can be revealed by the mods during or after the game.
It is entirely within my right to scrutinze you. You put yourself out there when you decided to run for an elected position. In fact, that was one of your pillars on which you ran your candidacy.
I have never suggested or supported the lynching of your Bodyguards. As long there are precautions taken to give us the names of the Bodyguards in the event of your or BM's early demise, I am fine with it. However, since I respect your abilities to succeed as scum, I don't trust your intentions. I don't trust your actions. I don't trust your plans.
Mafia is a game of information. The control of information is crucial to both sides. In a game with so many posts, information can be lost or buried so easily. Instead, look at our actions and discuss what they accomplished.
I am very vocal about the Bodyguards being made public. What was the purpose? To ensure that we at least come out even if the Mayor and/or Sheriff were killed prematurely.
I am very vocal against the idea that Masons should mass claim. Why? To allow experienced Masons to work unhampered and be able to disseminate any information in the future without fear of being lynched upon surfacing.
I summarize a big-picture look at the major events of Day 1 in an effort to help re-focus the Town. I can't do it by myself but that is the best, pro-Town move that we can all do, other than to find a scum.
What have you done?
You ran a candidacy based on accountability. You re-iterated that all elected officials be watched carefully.
You pushed a calm Town into a frenzy with your Mason claim, (which can no longer be verified).
You initiated a mass Mason plan which effectively hamstrings any Masons who want to work in private.
You lynched a Town player with input based on some compromise that we can't see.
All I'm asking is that you be accountable to your election platform and to your actions. Stop trying to start a fight. Give us your PM logs.
|
i think you're mafia blahz0r
|
On January 16 2012 11:56 jcarlsoniv wrote:
The end of the night phase will be postponed. I'm not sure how long. Sorry for the inconvenience, I will keep you guys updated.
Problem solved  Night phase ending on time, post inc soon.
|
oh shit i posted this without refreshing l0l. but yeah i was referring to this post
+ Show Spoiler +On January 16 2012 11:04 blahz0r wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 22:58 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 11:51 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm willing to vote bum for the fact that I like him right now. I think he's
Bum are you willing to lynch Palmar?
I'd be willing to lynch BC too if I continue feeling the way I'm feeling about him. But we'll see. Need more time on that, since BC is much harder to read than Palmar. Palmar's just like lolscum woke up and I'm at this post. Yeah I liked bum a lot too but I don't really like the people he likes So you went from liking him to not liking him because of the people he likes. Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 01:52 Toadesstern wrote:
btw I'm not convinced risk.nuke is mafia at all :p
I'd gladly lynch scumdroba or bum. I think sandroba is more scummy however I am a little afraid that we might end up lynching a townie because BC might be a mafia too. If BC's a mafia I don' think sandroba is mafia.
Conclusion: I want to lynch sandroba. I'd rather not risk lynching BC so early and lynching sandroba is way better information for us while giving pretty decent chance to hit a red mine Now you want to lynch him? Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 06:22 wherebugsgo wrote:
@ Toadesstern:
Please explain why you find bumatlarge to be scummy.
Also, summarize your thoughts on Protactinium and sandroba while you're at it. I want to know things from you.
as promised (sry took longer because I completly forgot it ) about sandroba:I don't like the fact that BC lynched Palmar at all. Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first. I asked BC and Sandroba to show me their pm logs, neither one did it and I don't like the coincidence of bc masoning sandroba although I have to agree that that one point probably is circular reasoning because I think it's something that makes bc scummy Sandroba's budding with Palmar (without a reason) and with BC (without giving an explanation). Also he voted BC. If you now look at what I posted about bum and BC you realize that there's a lot of mentioning each other within this circle of BC-Bum-Sandroba. I've got the feeling sandroba is trying to trick me/ us his picks and his style obviously is not helping at all.My highest priority to lynch right now would be sandroba, followed by bum. I won't support a bc lynch although I think he's leaning scum for me right now because I'm not sure about my judgement of bc yet. I'd say he's got a 30-50% of flipping red instead of true 10 out of 50. Yes you did say a little about it but all you have now is a feeling. Why did it go from people he trusted to just a feeling? Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 09:36 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 09:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 16 2012 09:05 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 08:42 wherebugsgo wrote:
I don't agree that Protact has been giving town direction at all. Notice how absent they have been for the vast majority of the last 24 hours?
well yeah but he I consider him being right with some points about BC. I think the talk about masons was not good for town. We could have discussed something else as well, we had enough stuff (like who's acting scummy) and who we want to lynch. BC kind of produced a mass claim. I still don't know if it's that bad but it certainly was not was he intended, at least not without discussing it but discussing it took way too much time when we needed to get a defined picture of our mayors. So yes, protac posted very little, I am scared of him as well and I'd love him to be in no office at all. Still what he posted gave me town vibes. What are your thoughts about sandroba, bum, bc and protac? I think I answered them good enough from my point of view. [...] Bum, I'm unsure of so far (haven't read through his posts thoroughly tbh). From the initial read I was getting, townish. However, I don't think I've given him as much attention as I should have. I will reread the thread again a couple more times with the flip in mind. [...] The thing about the Palmar flip is that it makes people like zeks, opz, and several others look bad. Lanaia looks bad as well; she has not commented on anything concrete and so far has had no scum reads. It looks rather similar to her play from XLVII. At any rate, I still want thoughts from people on Protac and opz. Sandro/zeks/Lanaia thoughts would be nice too. Yeah I had a town read on bum early on too. The scary thing about protac for me btw (because I did not explain why I called it scary) is that he looks townish to me but I can't realy put it down with words. I'm not trusting myself there at all because I don't even know why I got that townread, it just feels townish because I really liked the big post he did. Sure that' something but that' should not be enough to give me a townread when he's lurking so hardcorde. Why does palmars flip make people like zeks or opz look bad? I'm going to be honest here: They're both a big blank note for me. Go back to bum. Is he MAFIA or not? Can you explain more besides this "I got this bad feeling because so and so are together". I'd like to believe you but there is uncertainty for now. Is there also a possibility that one of them could be town led astray? Still reading a day or two worth of text =\
|
I do have scumreads, they're just not as strong as the townreads I have :/ (which really doesn't help me any).
Unfortunately, there are a bunch of neutrals as well.
I'm currently writing up a post detailing such. However, it clearly won't be posted til after the night ends as I'm late here.
|
I took no action tonight. Just so there are no surprises.
|
On January 16 2012 11:59 Kenpachi wrote:
i think you're mafia blahz0r
On January 16 2012 12:00 Kenpachi wrote:oh shit i posted this without refreshing l0l. but yeah i was referring to this post + Show Spoiler +On January 16 2012 11:04 blahz0r wrote:Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 22:58 Toadesstern wrote:On January 14 2012 11:51 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm willing to vote bum for the fact that I like him right now. I think he's
Bum are you willing to lynch Palmar?
I'd be willing to lynch BC too if I continue feeling the way I'm feeling about him. But we'll see. Need more time on that, since BC is much harder to read than Palmar. Palmar's just like lolscum woke up and I'm at this post. Yeah I liked bum a lot too but I don't really like the people he likes So you went from liking him to not liking him because of the people he likes. Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 01:52 Toadesstern wrote:
btw I'm not convinced risk.nuke is mafia at all :p
I'd gladly lynch scumdroba or bum. I think sandroba is more scummy however I am a little afraid that we might end up lynching a townie because BC might be a mafia too. If BC's a mafia I don' think sandroba is mafia.
Conclusion: I want to lynch sandroba. I'd rather not risk lynching BC so early and lynching sandroba is way better information for us while giving pretty decent chance to hit a red mine Now you want to lynch him? Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 06:22 wherebugsgo wrote:
@ Toadesstern:
Please explain why you find bumatlarge to be scummy.
Also, summarize your thoughts on Protactinium and sandroba while you're at it. I want to know things from you.
as promised (sry took longer because I completly forgot it ) about sandroba:I don't like the fact that BC lynched Palmar at all. Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first. I asked BC and Sandroba to show me their pm logs, neither one did it and I don't like the coincidence of bc masoning sandroba although I have to agree that that one point probably is circular reasoning because I think it's something that makes bc scummy Sandroba's budding with Palmar (without a reason) and with BC (without giving an explanation). Also he voted BC. If you now look at what I posted about bum and BC you realize that there's a lot of mentioning each other within this circle of BC-Bum-Sandroba. I've got the feeling sandroba is trying to trick me/ us his picks and his style obviously is not helping at all.My highest priority to lynch right now would be sandroba, followed by bum. I won't support a bc lynch although I think he's leaning scum for me right now because I'm not sure about my judgement of bc yet. I'd say he's got a 30-50% of flipping red instead of true 10 out of 50. Yes you did say a little about it but all you have now is a feeling. Why did it go from people he trusted to just a feeling? Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 09:36 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 09:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On January 16 2012 09:05 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 08:42 wherebugsgo wrote:
I don't agree that Protact has been giving town direction at all. Notice how absent they have been for the vast majority of the last 24 hours?
well yeah but he I consider him being right with some points about BC. I think the talk about masons was not good for town. We could have discussed something else as well, we had enough stuff (like who's acting scummy) and who we want to lynch. BC kind of produced a mass claim. I still don't know if it's that bad but it certainly was not was he intended, at least not without discussing it but discussing it took way too much time when we needed to get a defined picture of our mayors. So yes, protac posted very little, I am scared of him as well and I'd love him to be in no office at all. Still what he posted gave me town vibes. What are your thoughts about sandroba, bum, bc and protac? I think I answered them good enough from my point of view. [...] Bum, I'm unsure of so far (haven't read through his posts thoroughly tbh). From the initial read I was getting, townish. However, I don't think I've given him as much attention as I should have. I will reread the thread again a couple more times with the flip in mind. [...] The thing about the Palmar flip is that it makes people like zeks, opz, and several others look bad. Lanaia looks bad as well; she has not commented on anything concrete and so far has had no scum reads. It looks rather similar to her play from XLVII. At any rate, I still want thoughts from people on Protac and opz. Sandro/zeks/Lanaia thoughts would be nice too. Yeah I had a town read on bum early on too. The scary thing about protac for me btw (because I did not explain why I called it scary) is that he looks townish to me but I can't realy put it down with words. I'm not trusting myself there at all because I don't even know why I got that townread, it just feels townish because I really liked the big post he did. Sure that' something but that' should not be enough to give me a townread when he's lurking so hardcorde. Why does palmars flip make people like zeks or opz look bad? I'm going to be honest here: They're both a big blank note for me. Go back to bum. Is he MAFIA or not? Can you explain more besides this "I got this bad feeling because so and so are together". I'd like to believe you but there is uncertainty for now. Is there also a possibility that one of them could be town led astray? Still reading a day or two worth of text =\
I reached similar conclusions based on that post as well.
blahz0r
|
Crap, pressed Enter accidentally.
blahz0r, you are attempting to justify your choice for tomorrow's lynch.
Since, you as mafia, NEED AN EXCUSE to vote, you just dug around looking for someone, anyone, to cast suspicion on. You're also not doing it very convincingly.
mafia: blahz0r
|
There's some bad news and some good news. The bad news is that day 1 had a horribly mafia-favored atmosphere. The good news is that the mafia didn't take advantage of it. That is to say, the mafia became complacent because they didn't need to do much to encourage chaos, and thus became lazy and slacked off. The theme of this post is apathy. The mafia are apathetic because the atmosphere is so chaotic that they don't need to do much to stay under the radar. After all, why work hard when you can be lazy?
L
On January 15 2012 00:41 L wrote:
So I decided to take a good read of the thread from the start in one burst because hey, I'm a day late. A few things stood out as odd:
1) There are a LOT of mayoral candidates. Many of them seem to have prepared their candidacy prior to the game. Candidacies prepared prior to the game don't give us any information (insofar as submitting candidature goes) because they are done in the absence of role or alignment information. The surplus of candidates as well as the pre-prepared quality of many indicates that candidacy itself is devalued in this game.
2) Of those 'immediate' candidacies, Foolishness's is the most peculiar on its face, I honestly don't understand why someone would prepare a post to push for someone in the absence of role information, but my best guess is that he wanted to run himself, then got masoned or masoned someone else.
3) Mattchew releases a pm between him and Foolishness that states straight up that Bill Murray will be easy to control. No one comments on this.
4) On page 39 its stated that roles who get elected cannot be roleblocked; All of the current candidates for mayor are crumbing or have claimed roles that don't benefit from this. This issue is brought up a grand total of ONCE in the 12 pages since then and not discussed any further.
5) There are a LOT of chaff posts in this thread. A lot of larger posts are similarly filled with repetitive content.
6) The most interesting of the semi-chaff posts are the cloaked kingmakers. Posts like "Oh, the race is already over, X or Z is going to win". Why are they interesting? Because the leading candidate currently has 10% of the popular vote and mafia's potential to swing votes is grossly disproportionate to the amount of votes cast thusfar.
7) No one seems particularly 'pressed' with respect to the vote totals, which indicates that everyone's roughly happy with the way things are or at least not hurried enough to make a play yet. Given how strong the election roles are, this means mafia has likely captured at least one of the frontrunner spots at this point in time. This also means that mafia is doubly happy to throw out cloaked kingmakers as they clutter the thread, remove an incentive for people to participate AND lead them to an election result that they're comfortable with.
8) A grand total of one post stands out in my memory regarding the timing of votes and stated that people should be throwing down their votes asap to prevent the election from getting hijacked by a mafia swing. No one picked up on it and there was a burst of posting to bury it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
So, what does this tell me? Tells me two things:
1) People need to vote. Now.
2) I'm voting for me. L for Mayor.
3) The best defensive votes statistically are on players who currently aren't winning but posted pre-canned candidacies. The best offensive votes are on players who have crumbed a role that isn't mason.
P.S. Rainbow text is fucking hard.
In his campaign post, he gives a laundry list of 8 things that he finds "odd", but these points cast doubt and provide more questions than answers.
L makes up the term "cloaked kingmakers", although there really is no reason to believe that the people saying that "X is going to win" are mafia. L is just making up a catchy phrase to avoid having to explain anything.
In point 7 L suggests that mafia have one of the front running spots, but doesn't put any effort into figuring out who it is, and just casts doubt to make the voters fearful.
How does he conclude his laundry list of 8 points? He tells people to vote for him. Now. Besides providing no content except doubt, the tone of this post is quite interesting. L's first post is large and basically says and screams "I am full of energy, care about the town, and am providing valuable insight", when in fact, he quickly falls off the radar, shows his apathy, and gives no such insight.
The rest of his posts are incoherent and don't provide direction. His posts don't command attention, and even when he prods people, he doesn't do it in a way that draws attention. Even though he appears perky and full of energy, as a whole they are apathetic. L says that he would choose to lynch Mattchew based on a flimsy sentence (and by calling him a "cloaked kingmaker"). He also tosses his vote on VisceraEyes without much thought.
L is apathetic and has done nothing for the town while attempting to hide that he is doing so.
Jackal
I have no idea why Foolishness thinks he's town. Jackal is not playing his usual gung ho strongly opinionated town style. His play is quite similar to his play in TL Mafia XLVIII as mafia. Jackal isn't actively involved in the game. He never pushes a strong opinion (highly uncharacteristic), and just sits back while making irrelevant comments on random posts. Clearly, he is reading the thread. Clearly, he doesn't care to contribute. And why should he? The thread is in chaos, so its easy to just get lazy as mafia.
kingjames
In this game, kingjames proposes that bodyguards be made public, posts a consideration that BC may be the mafia jack, and then disappears.
On January 14 2012 09:14 kingjames01 wrote:
Also, consider for the moment, that BC may be mafia Jack.
If he uses his Mason power on Day 1 to establish his credibility and then is subsequently elected to office, we will not be able to find the mafia Jack.
It is a risk, but I know that BC will take that risk. He is very much a medium-risk, high-reward player.
EVERYONE! WHAT HAPPENS IF BLOODYC0BBLER IS MAFIA JACK?
I consider this scenario involving BC to be within his bag of tricks, and I will not vote to elect him into office.
A fear mongering post that asks what happens if BC is red, with no opinion or followup. Another case of apathy. Contrast this with TL Mafia XXXVIII where instantly gives strong opinions on some of the proposed policy plans (random lynching, zodiac lists), immediately jumps into trying to find mafia, posts some detailed analyses, and does a lot of poking and prodding. In this game, kingjames does not attempt to find mafia. He instead discusses outing bodyguards, and casts doubt on BC without providing any opinion. The key thing to note is that in contrast to his town play where he is outgoing and analytical, his posts in this game are very subdued, seem artificial and feel overly planned.
Macpo
Here we revisit Macpo. I won't restate my previous analysis. However, I think people are not seeing the subtle differences in how Macpo is different from some of the other newbies or lurkers. The key is overemphasis on inexperience to the point that he is begging to be ignored. This is a textbook case of mafia. But for all of you doubters, here is a new piece of information. Look at Macpo's 4th post here:
On January 14 2012 20:02 Macpo wrote:
It's getting clear that Bill Murray is the way to go.
Mr Wiggles, a good town, but he just doesn't want to be on the stage too much, so I guess the mayor role doesn't suit him very well.
BC: way too unclear and risky for me; he is trying too much stuff, going for a thousand contradictory stuff, taking back what he said and so on.
Bill has shown a lot of presence, and has made reasonable analyses, plus he is not afraid. That's enough for me up to now, I think we won't have better than that.
To those complaining about me being rational, it's getting obvious that they prefer random one line crap to argumentation. I'll answer back when they'll meet my standards.
Also, I changed my mind on Cybercheese, as he opened my eyes on the the BC case.
To bill: some people here have NOT posted yet at all!! I feel fine about lynching sandroba, as he acts quite scummy, but I suggest that if you are elected, you lynch someone who has not talked yet. statistics we'll be that it is mafia.
and compare to his first post, where he overly emphasizes his newbiness. See the difference? Macpo doesn't apologize at all in this post, and spews a bunch of opinions. Previously, he stated that "I just feel that being confident in my claims on day 1 is kind of stupid, as there is almost no rational basis for being so." Huge contrast. Its as if its a different person posting. Its pretty obvious that Macpo is getting coaching from his mafia friends. Then his next post:
On January 15 2012 09:13 Macpo wrote:
I haven't been able to post my scum tells last post, here they are.
Basically, I think we kind of neglect all these players, who are basically hiding. I am not saying this 100% scums; some of them are probably really not here. but I also think it's more than 20% scum in there, we should keep this in mind:
- Refallen 2 empty posts.
- Munk-E 1 empty post.
- Brownbear 4 posts, 4lines.
- d3_crescentia 3 posts 3 lines.
- igabod 4 posts 4 lines.
- rtgICEMAN 4 posts, and no clear position.
- Maxella 2 posts.
Please guys, really get into it and help town; as now you are just very embarrassingly hiding. Until you convincingly do, you are all my favorite scums tells.
Also, while going through the filters, I saw the remarkable case of Jayjay, one poster, 10%of the whole thread. and to be honest, only crap in it; far from any rational standard . This annoys me, so I put him on my scummy list. We really need to have more rational stuff to clarify things. like REALLY.
Besides the fact that Macpo doesn't follow his own advice and really doesn't "get into it and help town", notice the pleading tone. I bet its a different coach this time! LOLOLOLOL
GGQ
On January 15 2012 12:02 GGQ wrote:
havent caught up, I'm at page 57, but I skipped ahead. don't vote in Protractinium. Seriously, don't. Macpo is pretty clearly a newb town imo
For not having caught up yet, GGQ has a shockingly strong opinion that Macpo is newb town. What's even more interesting is that this read is his basis for urging people not to vote me in. Why does GGQ have such a strong attachment to Macpo? He never once discusses lynch targets or inquires about who the other mayoral candidates is going to lynch. But for some reason he really wants to save Macpo. Without even considering whether or not I am otherwise a good candidate for mayor. He doesn't attempt to persuade me not to lynch Macpo, he just flat out says that I shouldn't be voted in. In short, GGQ is apathetic both about who becomes mayor and who gets lynched. But for some reason he really cares that Macpo doesn't get lynched.
GGQ is also lurking hard while providing no content. Contrast to Responsibility Mafia where he is active, expresses interest in finding a good target for the lynch and gives a few detalied analyses on GMarshal and Mr. Wiggles.
Ciryandor
In sharp contrast to his previous posts (and future posts, I might add), where he has a defiant tone, "LOL that's a good reason to get you voted in.", and "LOL says the guy whose first post is to criticize bad posts.", Ciryandor switches to a submissive tone in an attempt to gain sympathy as one who has been wrongly accused. His argument is that there are other players who fit the same criterion, and posts a list of half-hearted "reads" to attempt to appease. But it is all a ploy. Note how he never mentions who he wants lynched. He is way too apathetic and seems more concerned about saving himself (less antagonistic tone) rather than actually believing in any his reads, or any of anyone elses, for that matter.
But here's the kicker:
Right now I'm torn between Proact and Sandroba in voting, because at least they're concrete in promising ONE NAME to lynch instead of being wishy-washy in getting a list of targets up, and that I think they have plans for town after Day 1 that don't need to be publicized yet.
He is torn between voting for me/sandroba, but then in his next post, states:
Same thing here; I only read the blue post saying 9 minutes to deadline with 4 minutes to go, so I just chucked in a vote at Bill seeing that Proact is in the lead (as of the last votecount update I saw), and that I don't like BC to get sheriff because he and Proact are at odds with each other.
Two things wrong here. First, he doesn't vote for me/sandroba. He also non-chalantly "chucks" a vote at Bill. Not a verb you'd associate with someone who "is torn between" two other candidates, huh? While he may say that he didn't want BC and me to both be in office, his vote is way too casual. Second, notice the sudden difference in tone between this post and the previous one. No more puppy eyes "I'm being unfairly fingered out despite there being many other people acting like me" talk. Ciryandor changes from calm to careless and aloof, and basically just throws his vote down without much forethought. Of course, when I end up losing the election, Ciryandor says nothing about the result. Only that On January 15 2012 12:37 Ciryandor wrote:
Yes, Miller is townie that checks as scum.
If thats not apathy, I don't know what is.
evantrees
I agree with Foolishness that evantrees is mafia. His first post is so incoherent it begs to be skipped, but this post in particular is bad:
On January 15 2012 09:44 evantrees wrote:to quote VE out of context at the modkill + attempted day vig bit late but anyways. Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 07:26 supersoft wrote:
and one question, is it correct that Jitsu, BC, sandroba and matthew claimed mason already? ~OpZ~ not sandroba otherwise correct, bc masoned sandroba OpZ masoned bc jitsu masoned VE mattchew masoned foolishness according to whats been said at least. Doubt I typed anything useful going through this mess but I will check.
Posting a useless list without any opinion? Check. Even worse is that he doesn't even verify that the information is correct, and states that what he wrote is probably useless. This is apathy at its finest. Furthermore, evantrees is lurking hard core. We know he's reading the thread, as he posts a null comment on Palmar's flip before randomly requesting that repalcements are relfected in the OP. The argument that evantrees is just a bored townie doesn't hold here. Bored townies don't ask the mods to indicate replacements in the OP. evantrees is completely apathetic and pretends to contribute to the town when he in fact is not.
Well those are my thoughts in the event that I am shot in the face. Start by lynching Macpo (he's too obviously mafia, and his flipping red will strengthen the cases on GGQ and Ciryandor). 6 reds should be enough given that its only day 1 and we can't kill them all right away anyway. Just make sure these don't get spammed away by some of the aggressive posters. Also please don't do something dumb like lynching someone who is really putting in the effort to figure stuff out.
|
On January 16 2012 12:03 VisceraEyes wrote:
I took no action tonight. Just so there are no surprises.
of course you did not, you don't have any night actions
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://s1.hubimg.com/u/5308476_f520.jpg)
