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Big Game Hunters - The phenomenon

Forum Index > SC2 General
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shadymmj
Profile Joined June 2010
1906 Posts
November 24 2012 13:54 GMT
#1
Take a moment to familiarise yourself with BGH, if you haven't already:
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Map_(BGH)

Big Game Hunters was THE most popular Starcraft map. Everyone has played it, most have played it multiple times, and a few play it at a very competitive level. Of course it wasn't a "serious" map by any rate, but I think it was a blast to play - and apparently many people thought so too.

As much as BGH was a phenomenon, it has also become a remarkable fact that the map is dead in SC2. I believe that if we can pinpoint why people don't play BGH in sc2, we can essentially also manage to solve why people don't like to play sc2.

Why do you think people don't play BGH? Is it because:

- Custom games don't allow the ally/unally feature unless it is user-created through triggers?
- The custom game UI is terrible for user created maps?
- An infinite resources battle royale wouldn't be fun in sc2 (explain why)?
- Some people take BGH's very seriously
- Lack of initiative; we need Blizzard to implement BGH as an official unranked game mode
- Other reasons...?

Feel free to share.
There is no such thing is "e-sports". There is Brood War, and then there is crap for nerds.
JKM
Profile Joined November 2011
Denmark419 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-24 14:06:00
November 24 2012 14:04 GMT
#2
On November 24 2012 22:54 shadymmj wrote:

Why do you think people don't play BGH? Is it because:
- An infinite resources battle royale wouldn't be fun in sc2 (explain why)?


This. I think you'd see huge infestor, blord, spine/spore armies devour the map. Also all those chokes force late game compositions because no army can go through (P: colossus/storm, T: tanks, Z: fungal/spines).
edit: so I think it would just develop into camping, probably favoring zerg.
1338, one upping 1337
Kakaru2
Profile Joined March 2011
198 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-24 14:11:07
November 24 2012 14:09 GMT
#3
I played BGH daily for many years. Miss those ***2v2 BGH TOP ONLY*** games.
The amount of strategies and play on the map was amazing. First time I played it I thought this was a NR match. Got destroyed before 10 min mark.
Then you had to adapt to those 2 tanks drop play which caused me a lot of grief first. There were sites for BGH players to meet/share.

And contrary to people that didn't played BGH there were not many games longer on it so you can get to T3. Much shorter timing attacks were the norm.

I think that in SC2 the entire custom UI/popularity system is not appropriate. What will make BGH type really thrive is if Blizzard would implement it like you mentioned in an game mode. But ranked, so you can play with people of your level.
marconi
Profile Joined March 2010
Croatia220 Posts
November 24 2012 14:12 GMT
#4
The thing is, BGH allowed players to have huge armies even if their macro sucked, while sc2 allows this for basically everyone so there's no need to play a money map to have huge armies. Secondly, early game micro is crap when comparing sc2 to sc, as zergs would just own everything with 5 hatch/queen ling armies, zealots are much more suckier, and marines without medivacs and stim also suck, and they don't have firebats. Early game mass tier1 fights were awesome in sc1 bgh, and you could spend like half an hour or even more just microing the shit out of your t1 units. I simply think it would not be as fun as sc1, hell I even tried some BGH variant in sc2 and guess what, they sucked. XD
MHT
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden1026 Posts
November 24 2012 14:14 GMT
#5
We still play Sc2:BW on that map though.
Madkipz
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Norway1643 Posts
November 24 2012 14:15 GMT
#6
That won`t happen. What we need is custom ladder. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=382383

Give the players that have cash at hand and a good concept to go with it the ability to form a ladder. Because blizzard quality was never up to the standard of community quality.
.
"Mudkip"
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-24 14:18:16
November 24 2012 14:17 GMT
#7
inb4 surfer4life comes to the thread. oh, also, there are multiple versions of bgh on sc2 right now, and they are pretty fun. you know playing videogames should be fun.
edit: yeah 2v2 bgh was kickass tvb.
Sbrubbles
Profile Joined October 2010
Brazil5776 Posts
November 24 2012 14:22 GMT
#8
BGH was fun. I'd go medic marine always, except when I'd rush for cattlebruisers.
Bora Pain minha porra!
hitpoint
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1511 Posts
November 24 2012 14:24 GMT
#9
Well I didn't even know BGH was in SC2. So maybe the shitty custom game interface is to blame?
It's spelled LOSE not LOOSE.
Gyro_SC2
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada540 Posts
November 24 2012 14:25 GMT
#10
Because the popularity system suck and don't allow new map to be played
Inex
Profile Joined October 2010
Bulgaria443 Posts
November 24 2012 14:26 GMT
#11
Isn't that "fastest map possible" custom game similar to BGH in concept? BGH was fun back in the day when we had ancient computers, no internet, just LAN and a lot of time on our hands. The only reason I would play BGH is because of nostalgia.
Disposition1989
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Canada270 Posts
November 24 2012 14:26 GMT
#12
I think it's most of those things but before I read them the first thing that came to mind was the diversity of the compositions you could have. I played 3v3 zc myself but it's just a more wide open money map... except mandatory no rush. For Terran, you could do tanks, wraiths, goliaths, bcs, ghosts (and nukes), science vessels. No bio though and valkyries were bugged out. Zerg? Anything. Even queens had their uses. Toss? Everything except scouts hehe. You'd have a pack of corsairs flying around knocking out detection, etc. So I think BGH would be pretty similar to this but with a lot more diversity in strategy than zc which was a.) Break the middle with seige units, b.) Mass air on one side, c.) Mass recall/nydus worm,

Now in sc2 I don't think you could do this. Zerg would inevitably end with bw infestor corruptor and you'd never see most of the other stuff but the main death balls of the respective races. So that's why I wouldn't play a money map in sc2
Chemist
Profile Joined November 2011
Austria127 Posts
November 24 2012 14:27 GMT
#13
I don't get it, it's a map not a mod, so

we need Blizzard to implement BGH as an official unranked game mode

makes no sense at all.

The reason why some maps are not played is imho BN2.0, if people don't see the map featured they don't play it, and if you want to play ityou can find it, but no one will join...
xsnac
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Barbados1365 Posts
November 24 2012 14:33 GMT
#14
is hard to find . i played a lot of games on bgh with friends however i dont see it at all on custom games sc2 .
1/4 \pi \epsilon_0
KingAce
Profile Joined September 2010
United States471 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-24 14:37:05
November 24 2012 14:36 GMT
#15
It probably has to do with the way we collect minerals and gas in SC2.

Resource gatherings is a lot faster in SC2 than it ever was in legit BW maps. So it was very fun to casually play maps like BGH or fastest to speed up the macro and get to the late game faster.


In a sense every map in SC2 is kinda like BGH IMO, with mules, larva inject and chrono boost....two gasses and all.
"You're defined by the WORST of your group..." Bill Burr
[F_]aths
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany3947 Posts
November 24 2012 14:41 GMT
#16
On November 24 2012 22:54 shadymmj wrote:
Take a moment to familiarise yourself with BGH, if you haven't already:
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Map_(BGH)

Big Game Hunters was THE most popular Starcraft map. Everyone has played it, most have played it multiple times, and a few play it at a very competitive level. Of course it wasn't a "serious" map by any rate, but I think it was a blast to play - and apparently many people thought so too.

As much as BGH was a phenomenon, it has also become a remarkable fact that the map is dead in SC2. I believe that if we can pinpoint why people don't play BGH in sc2, we can essentially also manage to solve why people don't like to play sc2.

Why do you think people don't play BGH? Is it because:

- Custom games don't allow the ally/unally feature unless it is user-created through triggers?
- The custom game UI is terrible for user created maps?
- An infinite resources battle royale wouldn't be fun in sc2 (explain why)?
- Some people take BGH's very seriously
- Lack of initiative; we need Blizzard to implement BGH as an official unranked game mode
- Other reasons...?

Feel free to share.

Because times are a-changing.

To be more precise: We now have better maps to play on.
You don't choose to play zerg. The zerg choose you.
Seldentar
Profile Joined May 2011
United States888 Posts
November 24 2012 14:52 GMT
#17
On November 24 2012 23:41 [F_]aths wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2012 22:54 shadymmj wrote:
Take a moment to familiarise yourself with BGH, if you haven't already:
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Map_(BGH)

Big Game Hunters was THE most popular Starcraft map. Everyone has played it, most have played it multiple times, and a few play it at a very competitive level. Of course it wasn't a "serious" map by any rate, but I think it was a blast to play - and apparently many people thought so too.

As much as BGH was a phenomenon, it has also become a remarkable fact that the map is dead in SC2. I believe that if we can pinpoint why people don't play BGH in sc2, we can essentially also manage to solve why people don't like to play sc2.

Why do you think people don't play BGH? Is it because:

- Custom games don't allow the ally/unally feature unless it is user-created through triggers?
- The custom game UI is terrible for user created maps?
- An infinite resources battle royale wouldn't be fun in sc2 (explain why)?
- Some people take BGH's very seriously
- Lack of initiative; we need Blizzard to implement BGH as an official unranked game mode
- Other reasons...?

Feel free to share.

Because times are a-changing.

To be more precise: We now have better maps to play on.


Nice Freudian slip. There certainly is quite a bit more a-moving going on! ;P
Kakaru2
Profile Joined March 2011
198 Posts
November 24 2012 14:54 GMT
#18
On November 24 2012 23:52 Seldentar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2012 23:41 [F_]aths wrote:
On November 24 2012 22:54 shadymmj wrote:
Take a moment to familiarise yourself with BGH, if you haven't already:
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Map_(BGH)

Big Game Hunters was THE most popular Starcraft map. Everyone has played it, most have played it multiple times, and a few play it at a very competitive level. Of course it wasn't a "serious" map by any rate, but I think it was a blast to play - and apparently many people thought so too.

As much as BGH was a phenomenon, it has also become a remarkable fact that the map is dead in SC2. I believe that if we can pinpoint why people don't play BGH in sc2, we can essentially also manage to solve why people don't like to play sc2.

Why do you think people don't play BGH? Is it because:

- Custom games don't allow the ally/unally feature unless it is user-created through triggers?
- The custom game UI is terrible for user created maps?
- An infinite resources battle royale wouldn't be fun in sc2 (explain why)?
- Some people take BGH's very seriously
- Lack of initiative; we need Blizzard to implement BGH as an official unranked game mode
- Other reasons...?

Feel free to share.

Because times are a-changing.

To be more precise: We now have better maps to play on.


Nice Freudian slip. There certainly is quite a bit more a-moving going on! ;P


A bit more than a bit! and a poor map pool as well (due to design/balance constraints)
leveller
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden1840 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-24 14:55:23
November 24 2012 14:55 GMT
#19
On November 24 2012 22:54 shadymmj wrote:
Take a moment to familiarise yourself with BGH, if you haven't already:
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Map_(BGH)

Big Game Hunters was THE most popular Starcraft map. Everyone has played it, most have played it multiple times, and a few play it at a very competitive level. Of course it wasn't a "serious" map by any rate, but I think it was a blast to play - and apparently many people thought so too.

As much as BGH was a phenomenon, it has also become a remarkable fact that the map is dead in SC2. I believe that if we can pinpoint why people don't play BGH in sc2, we can essentially also manage to solve why people don't like to play sc2.

Why do you think people don't play BGH? Is it because:

- Custom games don't allow the ally/unally feature unless it is user-created through triggers?
- The custom game UI is terrible for user created maps?
- An infinite resources battle royale wouldn't be fun in sc2 (explain why)?
- Some people take BGH's very seriously
- Lack of initiative; we need Blizzard to implement BGH as an official unranked game mode
- Other reasons...?

Feel free to share.


Because teams are locked! Right now u can only play 4v4 or free for all. The whole point was 2v2v2v2 in my opinion.

EDIT: AND THE BACKSTABBING
HolydaKing
Profile Joined February 2010
21254 Posts
November 24 2012 14:58 GMT
#20
The custom map system is just shit, that's pretty much why so few maps are being played.

I don't think there are other explanations needed. Many people don't know the map and don't search for it. It's not easy to find when you don't look for it.
1 2 3 4 Next All
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