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This thread is for discussing recent bans. Don't discuss other topics here. Take it to website feedback if you disagree with a ban or want to raise an issue. Keep it civil.NOTE: For those of you who want to find the actual ABL thread where the bans are posted. Please look in here: https://tl.net/forum/closed-threads/ |
On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. 
TBH I would have liked to see it extended for his twitter comments, but that might not be objectively fair.
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:18 KhAmun wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. TBH I would have liked to see it extended for his twitter comments, but that might not be objectively fair.
No way. I think a ban on TL would never be extended for criticisms of TL off-site, unless the comments were meant to be malicious, like if Destiny told people to harass Intrigue or something.
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Didn't Chill ban a guy once for being a jerk to him on sc2 games?
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On May 02 2012 14:29 Shana wrote:
Didn't Chill ban a guy once for being a jerk to him on sc2 games?
I thought it was a bit more than being a jerk. I am sure someone will find the ban though.
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On May 02 2012 14:29 Shana wrote:
Didn't Chill ban a guy once for being a jerk to him on sc2 games?
I know mani banned a guy once for 3 gating him on iccup rofl.
Ban reason was don't play PvT like a dick or something like that.
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On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban.
The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment.
I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course.
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On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course.
It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands.
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On May 02 2012 14:25 motbob wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:18 KhAmun wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. TBH I would have liked to see it extended for his twitter comments, but that might not be objectively fair. No way. I think a ban on TL would never be extended for criticisms of TL off-site, unless the comments were meant to be malicious, like if Destiny told people to harass Intrigue or something.
Yeah that's why i added in the objectively fair bit. It was just my knee-jerk reaction to his comments.
I guess it was just his way of re-stating his position on the original issue.
To entertain the thought, is there a line somewhere in that regard? I mean, if he went off on twitter insulting and being as offensive as possible to numerous TL staff and TL in general, is there a point at which you would say good riddance, we don't want you in our community any longer?
Isn't it similar to to not listing his stream during a ban, as this action is contradictory to Victor's statements during the IdrA ban, and I'd be curious to know why there is a discrepancy between the two.
EDIT: And this isn't me criticizing or anything, TL always makes really respectable decisions and I'm curious about the thought process regarding this stuff.
EDIT2: I just read your post in the ask TL Staff Anything thread, so I guess that's is sufficient.
For anyone wondering what that post was, I'll quote it:
I did not make the decision regarding Destiny's defeaturing. I do not know the reasons behind the decision. But I can imagine that the reasoning went something like this:
Destiny is not really a member of the TL community. He barely posts on TL and does not know what a "red name" means. If his account is banned, but his stream is still up, the ban was not a real punishment, and there is no incentive to keep him from mucking up the forums. Therefore, defeaturing the stream is necessary for the ban to have any meaning.
Keep in mind this isn't representative of any official stance of TL, and Motbob says 'I can imagine' for a reason.
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On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands.
So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response?
I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong.
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On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course.
On May 02 2012 14:42 motbob wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:27 Namenlos wrote:What is the resoning behind this? Afaik Idra wanted to not be on the list and had no choice. I do not see the difference here. Idra's stream will still be listed in the stream section. Our stream list is an informational resource much like the TLPD, Calendar, or Liquipedia. We believe for these resources to function properly, they must be comprehensive and complete and thus we do not remove banned pro players from them. Do you take him out of TLPD, Calendar and Liquipedia too? It feels like you want the kick people to the max when they are on the ground and feature or unfeature the streams against their will. I think that is very immature - one of the points tl criticized about steven. I did not make the decision regarding Destiny's defeaturing. I do not know the reasons behind the decision. But I can imagine that the reasoning went something like this: Destiny is not really a member of the TL community. He barely posts on TL and does not know what a "red name" means. If his account is banned, but his stream is still up, the ban was not a real punishment, and there is no incentive to keep him from mucking up the forums. Therefore, defeaturing the stream is necessary for the ban to have any meaning.
There you go
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Vancouver14381 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong.
Destiny is still able to stream off site on his own3d channel independent of TL. He shouldn't be too worried unless he relies on TL to give him new viewers, which I doubt is the case since most SC2 players have already heard of him. On the other hand, he is still listed on other sites where SC2 is not the focus and that's where he can gain new fans. In the end, the diehard fans can still find him easily enough if they want to watch his stream, unless he's protesting the ban by not streaming.
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
I mean, directly comparing the Destiny ban to the Idra ban is not really fair. Two totally different situations.
And demanding consistency for a situation that's happened twice in TL's history does not seem reasonable to me, either. To me, this situation seems to demand review on a case-by-case basis. Any blanket policy would be inadequate.
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United States8477 Posts
On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong.
One line?
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If you're a Destiny fan and want to catch his stream whether he's featured or not, you can just add him to your favorites and it comes up anyway. It'll obviously hurt his revenue, but if he's gonna rely on TL featuring him for revenue, he should follow their rules.
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On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong.
No, but what I am saying is that if something like this were to "end his career," it would be no one's fault but his own. I don't think that there is any reason to end his career, but that choice is up to him entirely, not us or this site. That is my point. That is the entire risk of working for yourself.
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On May 02 2012 15:10 TheAmazombie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong. No, but what I am saying is that if something like this were to "end his career," it would be no one's fault but his own. I don't think that there is any reason to end his career, but that choice is up to him entirely, not us or this site. That is my point. That is the entire risk of working for yourself.
If his career lives and dies based on whether TL features him or not, he should recognize that he needs to accept their rules. It's his own fault; if he hadn't posted anything in the shitshow witch-hunt thread, I guarantee he wouldn't have been banned/punished.
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On May 02 2012 15:09 corpuscle wrote:
If you're a Destiny fan and want to catch his stream whether he's featured or not, you can just add him to your favorites and it comes up anyway. […]
Nope does not work for me, I just favoured him. Guess I'll have to make twitch and own3d accounts now.
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On May 02 2012 15:10 TheAmazombie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong. No, but what I am saying is that if something like this were to "end his career," it would be no one's fault but his own. I don't think that there is any reason to end his career, but that choice is up to him entirely, not us or this site. That is my point. That is the entire risk of working for yourself.
I'm not arguing that this actually will end his career. I'm saying that calling for his head is wrong. That doesn't absolve him of responsibility. That entire shitstorm started as a "lynch Destiny" party. Then he threw gas on it, but that's not the point. I was criticizing the fact that it was started as such; his response is irrelevant to my point, as is his ban.
Really these are two separate issues that I have, and I think people missed that.
I don't have a problem with the ban. I was bothered by the different responses re:defeaturing, but I feel like that's been answered. That ended my concern with TL staff actions.
The "end his career" stuff was entirely separate and unrelated to any of the mod actions. I was commenting on the lynch-mob tendencies of the community, not the mods. It was originally in response to someone complaining about the Destiny followers. I wasn't saying it was wrong to ban him, etc. I was saying it was wrong for people call for the ruining of his career, as well as noting the blood-lust that seems to come out at times like this.
EDIT re:motbob
I meant the posting of the original shitstorm thread was in response to one line, not that the mod actions were only responding to that.
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
On May 02 2012 15:27 Boiler Bandsman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 15:10 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong. No, but what I am saying is that if something like this were to "end his career," it would be no one's fault but his own. I don't think that there is any reason to end his career, but that choice is up to him entirely, not us or this site. That is my point. That is the entire risk of working for yourself. I'm not arguing that this actually will end his career. I'm saying that calling for his head is wrong. That doesn't absolve him of responsibility. That entire shitstorm started as a "lynch Destiny" party. Then he threw gas on it, but that's not the point. I was criticizing the fact that it was started as such; his response is irrelevant to my point, as is his ban. Really these are two separate issues that I have, and I think people missed that. I don't have a problem with the ban. I was bothered by the different responses re:defeaturing, but I feel like that's been answered. That ended my concern with TL staff actions. The "end his career" stuff was entirely separate and unrelated to any of the mod actions. I was commenting on the lynch-mob tendencies of the community, not the mods. It was originally in response to someone complaining about the Destiny followers. I wasn't saying it was wrong to ban him, etc. I was saying it was wrong for people call for the ruining of his career, as well as noting the blood-lust that seems to come out at times like this. EDIT re:motbob I meant the posting of the original shitstorm thread was in response to one line, not that the mod actions were only responding to that.
If you're just discussion the community reaction to Destiny's comments, then I'm not sure this thread is the right place for that...
I was about to refer you to a thread in Website Feedback that was discussing that very topic, but it looks like you tried posting there and were referred here. Heh.
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On May 02 2012 15:33 motbob wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 15:27 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 15:10 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:43 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 14:39 TheAmazombie wrote:On May 02 2012 14:37 Boiler Bandsman wrote:On May 02 2012 13:58 bkrow wrote:Thank god - i have more of a problem with the army of ignorant morons that latch onto everything that Destiny says and then see it as a way to 'protest' or fight for some 'greater good' I really respect TL for the action they took, especially with the stance on defeaturing his stream during his ban. The fanboy hordes are a problem, yes. But I would argue the mob mentality among some posters is even worse. Destiny's stream is a huge part of his career, and a HUGE number of people want to trash that because of something he said in the heat of anger at a loss. It's exactly the same as the self-righteous mob that lynched Orb for months-old rage and seriously damaged his career over something he did/said as a private player, not as a caster. I'm sure many of us have raged at some point, either in Starcraft or even at the office, and we didn't have a torch-bearing mob trying to end our careers. Ban him for forum behavior, call him out for saying something stupid, but don't try to end his career for one stupid comment. I also disagree with the defeaturing, unless there's been a change in policy since IdrA's high-profile episode with streaming. I actually don't feel strongly either way defeaturing either of them, but the inconsistency is what bothers me. Unless I'm missing some nuance of the policy, of course. It is up to him to take care of his career. TL and other users have nothing to do with that. If he fails, then he needs to either adapt or look into another profession. His career does not rest with TL and the TL community. It rests in his own hands. So you're saying that ending or seriously damaging someone's career for a one-line rage chat is a proportionate response? I never said Destiny isn't responsible for his own actions; he is. But we as a community are each responsible for our actions in response, too, and I would argue that advocating the end of someone's career over this is disproportionate and wrong. No, but what I am saying is that if something like this were to "end his career," it would be no one's fault but his own. I don't think that there is any reason to end his career, but that choice is up to him entirely, not us or this site. That is my point. That is the entire risk of working for yourself. I'm not arguing that this actually will end his career. I'm saying that calling for his head is wrong. That doesn't absolve him of responsibility. That entire shitstorm started as a "lynch Destiny" party. Then he threw gas on it, but that's not the point. I was criticizing the fact that it was started as such; his response is irrelevant to my point, as is his ban. Really these are two separate issues that I have, and I think people missed that. I don't have a problem with the ban. I was bothered by the different responses re:defeaturing, but I feel like that's been answered. That ended my concern with TL staff actions. The "end his career" stuff was entirely separate and unrelated to any of the mod actions. I was commenting on the lynch-mob tendencies of the community, not the mods. It was originally in response to someone complaining about the Destiny followers. I wasn't saying it was wrong to ban him, etc. I was saying it was wrong for people call for the ruining of his career, as well as noting the blood-lust that seems to come out at times like this. EDIT re:motbob I meant the posting of the original shitstorm thread was in response to one line, not that the mod actions were only responding to that. If you're just discussion the community reaction to Destiny's comments, then I'm not sure this thread is the right place for that... I was about to refer you to a thread in Website Feedback that was discussing that very topic, but it looks like you tried posting there and were referred here. Heh.
Well, I was mostly referred b/c of my question about the defeaturing, which actually was answered. The system worked!
I more responded as a clarification that I wasn't criticizing the mod actions, I was just adding a commentary on the community's reaction as a whole and they kind of ran together. I wasn't intending for it to blow up like this, and it's really not something I was trying to bring up an extensive derailing discussion of.
+ Show Spoiler +Besides, isn't this thread semi-officially subtitled "shitstorm grandstanding" anyway?
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