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Hello, all! It's become quite apparent that many of you are not reading the first post carefully. Failure to do so in the future will be met with swift punishment. And as always, remember to be civil. Thanks, Empyrean. Time stamp: 03:59 KST. | ||
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setzer
United States3284 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:33 stevarius wrote: When you consider how many posts he has and how long he's been on these forums, 25 is not really anything. It's like parking tickets over 30 years. If anyone else posted like Idra does they would never get to that many posts or 25 bans. People claim 90 days is too harsh but when is enough enough? | ||
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Stropheum
United States1124 Posts
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Az0r_au
Australia385 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:23 mahnini wrote: what people are forgetting is that TL has high standards for the conduct of their users. due to the explosion of new users and lack of sufficient manpower to moderate a lot of people think TL is just some forum where you can post whatever you feel like with no repercussions. that couldn't be anywhere further from the truth. this is going to sound super elitist but i don't care because it's the truth. TL is one of the foundations for why sc2 is the way it is today. TL is one of the reasons western esports even stands a chance. for 10 years through thick and thin our little community kept cranking out coverage of a video game from across the world that many have heard of but few truly understood. all the mods and staff you see aren't here doing it for the money or power, they do it because they love the game and the community. hot_bid, chill, kennigit? they all started as regular users who browsed the forum and loved the game. through contributions to the site and dedication they were selected to be among the proud few who could call themselves TL staff. think about how easy it is today for you to get a stream to watch sc2 and remember that back in 2005 TL members would stay up till 2am on irc hoping that one of our members MAYBE could get their hands on a korean stream. remember that when WCG had no idea what TL was or how to get a proper caster TL's support and encouragement helped propel tasteless to caster fame. TLPD? possibly the most comprehensive starcraft database in existence? made from the ground up by TL staff and volunteers. our strategy forums are probably the most informative english resources in the world, they have to be moderated and still we don't consider them to be perfect. articles, fpvods, commentaries? our users put their heart and soul into churning these out because they knew somewhere out there in our community there was someone who would appreciate it. people need to stop considering TL a separate entity or some conglomerate of egotistic admins. TL is YOU. every single poster, viewer, or reader is part of TL. everything on this site is user generated by people who care and it's a damn shame when one of only sites that will literally take a stand for the community and uphold it's integrity is seen as some overzealous, overmoderated, egotistic, site for elitists. if that's elitist then i'm an elitist and that's just how it is. While I agree that previous TL members have made TL what it is today and you all deserve full credit for bringing your small community to the mainstream, main stream e-sports (atleast in NA) contains BM and smack talk. Try watching Halo or CoD, every frag is accompanied by an insult to the dead players mother or his sexuality. I feel that because of TL's beginnings as a tight nit community, the "old guard" has a very sheltered view and thin skinned view on manners in general. Sooner or later TL will have to deal with the fact that BM is a part of e-sports and a very entertaining part at that. Most casual viewers dont watch e-sports because they can appreciate the finer points of a 45 minute macro game. They watch it for their favourite players and their rivalries or to see people "get owned" etc. | ||
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Indrium
United States2236 Posts
But this was really just dumb. He threw a hissy fit about the ban and took his stream down and that annoyed me. Then he got people to harass Chill. I'm one of the regulars in the fan club but this was just stupid. I don't get it, man. IdrA's great. He's got that devil may care attitude that's really appealing a lot of the time, but then he just crossed the line here. I'm actually just really disappointed. And I know he wouldn't give a fuck, and that makes me laugh a little bit. | ||
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Werk
United States294 Posts
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umsplay
29 Posts
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9934 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:33 stevarius wrote: When you consider how many posts he has and how long he's been on these forums, 25 is not really anything. It's like parking tickets over 30 years. to fix your analogy: it's like he parks 4.46 times per day over a period of 6 years, 9 months, and 7 days (213,494,400 seconds) and still hits other cars edited for accuracy | ||
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TALegion
United States1187 Posts
Why wasn't this a perma ban? I understand that as a pro, he gets a little leeway. Maybe even a lot of leeway. But he is WAY past that. If all of his bans (or even really half of them) were taken seriously, he would have been perma banned a while. TL, being a place were conduct and proper behavior are so well enforced, doesn't seem like a place where there would be THAT MUCH of a double standard ("Oh, you're a pro, so you can do whatever the fuck you want. We'll just flick your ear around as punishment," vs. "What? Fucking 10 posts? Banned.") I'm not saying that TL is unfair/flawed, because I refuse to believe that, what I'm saying is that they don't take IdrA's bans seriously. Why? My idea is that none of this is, "real." IdrA just does all of this shit for publicity. Why else would he get such lenient penalties? The TL staff knows this, and bans him accordingly, while still making is realistic. They couldn't just completely ignore it, because then people would think lowly of TL/disregard IdrA as a fake (it'd be too obvious). If they actually treated him regularly, he'd have been gone LONG ago. Maybe this is me being stupid (though, makes sense to me...), but I think this entire scenario is a giant-ass piece of evidence that all of IdrA's BM is just some bullshit attention-whoring publicity stunt to get people to notice him (and I believe it's working, seeing as he has a 50 page thread on his ban, and a +400 page fan thread). | ||
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Reaper9
United States1724 Posts
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madrod
Australia66 Posts
then you take the waste of life comment, in the correct context he said it, hes not saying someone would be better off dead, all he meant was, he is a waste of time, or, a waste of YOUR life if you complain about him. i dont at all see why this deserved a ban, but TL can ban whoever they want, its their site. all i ask is that the same scrutiny is given to all users in order to be fair. only this rises a problem in that idra was deemed guilty so quickly (using the "waste of life" quote, when not reading what he actually meant), yet everyone is so keen to point out cruncher should be innoxent until proven guilty, theres no solid evidence blah blah blah. i guess it comes down to the fact that idra never relly posted all that much anyway, not much will be missed. hopefully he streams again soon, and hopefully TL start moderating fairly and without bias. | ||
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kerpal
United Kingdom2695 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:23 mahnini wrote: what people are forgetting is that TL has high standards for the conduct of their users. due to the explosion of new users and lack of sufficient manpower to moderate a lot of people think TL is just some forum where you can post whatever you feel like with no repercussions. that couldn't be anywhere further from the truth. this is going to sound super elitist but i don't care because it's the truth. TL is one of the foundations for why sc2 is the way it is today. TL is one of the reasons western esports even stands a chance. for 10 years through thick and thin our little community kept cranking out coverage of a video game from across the world that many have heard of but few truly understood. all the mods and staff you see aren't here doing it for the money or power, they do it because they love the game and the community. hot_bid, chill, kennigit? they all started as regular users who browsed the forum and loved the game. through contributions to the site and dedication they were selected to be among the proud few who could call themselves TL staff. think about how easy it is today for you to get a stream to watch sc2 and remember that back in 2005 TL members would stay up till 2am on irc hoping that one of our members MAYBE could get their hands on a korean stream. remember that when WCG had no idea what TL was or how to get a proper caster TL's support and encouragement helped propel tasteless to caster fame. TLPD? possibly the most comprehensive starcraft database in existence? made from the ground up by TL staff and volunteers. our strategy forums are probably the most informative english resources in the world, they have to be moderated and still we don't consider them to be perfect. articles, fpvods, commentaries? our users put their heart and soul into churning these out because they knew somewhere out there in our community there was someone who would appreciate it. people need to stop considering TL a separate entity or some conglomerate of egotistic admins. TL is YOU. every single poster, viewer, or reader is part of TL. everything on this site is user generated by people who care and it's a damn shame when one of only sites that will literally take a stand for the community and uphold it's integrity is seen as some overzealous, overmoderated, egotistic, site for elitists. if that's elitist then i'm an elitist and that's just how it is. well said. TL is elitist in that it believes all it's users should be the best they can. that's why i love this site. cheers. | ||
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turdburgler
England6749 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:36 intrigue wrote: to fix your analogy: it's like he parks 4.46 times per day over a period of 7 years and still hits other cars but is the car he hits a waste of metal? | ||
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julianto
2292 Posts
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
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the-darkest-templar
United States32 Posts
It isn't. He had a lit of leeway. And he abused the hell out of it. Idra needs to grow up. Anyone else would have just taken the ban and gone back to streaming. He had to complicate issues because he felt persecuted, as he often does, because he's Idra, and everyone's out to get him. | ||
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Natt
France253 Posts
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zeru
8156 Posts
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stevarius
United States1394 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:36 intrigue wrote: to fix your analogy: it's like he parks 4.46 times per day over a period of 7 years and still hits other cars Parking your car is not the same every time and humans don't learn perfection from experience. In the case of posting, more posts will not make you more likely to care about the rules. | ||
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VIB
Brazil3567 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:38 julianto wrote: Idra called cruncher a waste of life and accused him of cheating with no evidence.What did Idra post that got him originally banned? | ||
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Wiseman
United States41 Posts
On May 08 2011 10:23 mahnini wrote: people need to stop considering TL a separate entity or some conglomerate of egotistic admins. TL is YOU. every single poster, viewer, or reader is part of TL. everything on this site is user generated by people who care and it's a damn shame when one of only sites that will literally take a stand for the community and uphold it's integrity is seen as some overzealous, overmoderated, egotistic, site for elitists. if that's elitist then i'm an elitist and that's just how it is. I would like to say that this very reason is why some on this thread have been trying to discuss this ban in a reasonable fashion and to discuss what it means for the community. Which includes me, and which includes you. If you've read my posts, you'll see I'm not trying to compare TL as overzealous, overmoderated, egotistical, or a site for elitists. TL is a site that laid a lot of the foundation that is leading to the explosion of SC2's popularity. It will always have its place in SC2 history, but its future in SC2 is NOT guaranteed. I'm not saying that its critically out of whack, that next month TL wont be around anymore, I'm saying looking out 5 years from now will TL still be the large community that it is today, with the same passion not from the old BW hold outs, but from hundreds of thousands of CASUAL fans who come to TL for SC2 scene news, watch streams, and catch tournaments, VODs, recaps, etc (all the great content we love from TL!) That is what is great about TL and I love it. I think this ban of Idra has just provided a place where we can discuss the conflicts that have been occurring amongst eSports organizations recently. Please understand that there are new members of TL who love TL just as much as you guys who have been here for years. | ||
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