EPTIn-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 57
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Firebolt145
Lalalaland34501 Posts
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Firebolt145
Lalalaland34501 Posts
Also BKB should be on there as situational, so you can actually channel your ult. | ||
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idonthinksobro
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Firebolt145
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logawa
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adding it now thank you so much! | ||
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Axe (Jungle) Guide Elder Titan (Lane) Guide Tusk (Middle) Guide | ||
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Coil1
128 Posts
A-Z Abaddon Get rid of drums. It doesn't give that much for a support compared to a carry. Alchemist You're trying to do too much here. Pick a role and the guy reading(assuming he's new to the hero) won't be overwhelmed by options Ancient Apparition(Mid) AA won't be doing squat with this skill build mid. His whole laning presence is using chilling touch and this one takes stats over it. As for items see critique below Ancient Apparition(Lane) Remove Rod of Atos. His stun isn't good enough to justify spending 3100 gold on it. Add Agh's to Core. It's just too good of an upgrade to not rush. Put a blurb on force staff in case there's an ursa or otherwise dangerous hero one needs to get away from. I recommend skilling chilling touch as a priority rather than cold feet. Anti-Mage Don't start with a quelling blade. A few branches beefs him up a bit when he needs it most. AM also has a nice attack animation and base damage so he shouldn't need a quelling blade at the very start. Axe If you're going arc boots(which I think is sad that axe needs them) then mek becomes a higher priority. Replace hood with mek. Bane Thank god that soul ring is gone but there is no reason for bane to prioritize necro over blink or mek. Rest is fine Batrider There's a reason why bat usually doesn't upgrade boots until he can get travels after blink/force and that's cause other than travels, since tranquils were changed there aren't a lot of useful boots for him. Phase is pretty bad since bat will usually be layering napalm on the lasso target. Beastmaster(Lane) Don't bother with drums. He has expensive core items that give far better benefits. See Mid Beastmaster(Mid) It's far more useful to go mek-->blink--THEN Aghs, especially in pubs where hero kills matter a lot. Bloodseeker Definitely no reason here for a quelling blade. BS has massive base damage. Other than that, it's fine. Bounty Hunter I would add some small mana item for early game(Urn or Medallion) but that's fairly minor Brewmaster Again, he has a large list of expensive core items and he can't use money on less impactful stuff like drums. Move blink to core Bristleback Why is hood so far up here? He can just get a casual cloak for a much more cost-effective buffer for magic damage. Also vanguard works well with his passive so I actually recommend here. Broodmother Fine Centaur Warrunner Again, hood is prioritized far too much. Casual cloak for a later pipe. Blink or vanguard should be rushed. Chaos Knight Get soul ring way off here. Put stout into starting items and remove a branch Chen Add a stick, no reason to not get a stick on chen. Otherwise fine. Clinkz Fine, I would add soul ring as a situational item in the case of a 1v1 matchup. Clockwerk Probably one of the least friendly guide heroes. Once again, hood. Casual cloak. Add force staff as a situational Crystal Maiden Force staff is nowhere to be found on here. It's more important than mek since cm often has a crippling small mana pool considering her ult. Force gives an escape and widens it a bit. Mek only serves to worsen the situation without some kind of int item. Dark Seer No real reason to ever get drums on DS. Everything else is fine Dazzle No soul ring pls. Otherwise mostly fine Death Prophet Fine, thank god no bloodstone Disruptor Get eul's off. A well-played disruptor doesn't need help trapping with field. I would put mek into core. Doom(Jungle) Put quelling in for early game. It's effectively mitigation since creeps die faster and hit you less. Doom(Lane) Don't put radiance anywhere here or on the jungle guide. This isn't 2012. He has better things to do like sblade or blink doom. Armlet sounds good for doom but he's not really the kind of scrappy hit-stuff-fight-early hero that enjoys it. He gets far more cost-wise by going AC. Dragon Knight(Lane) Take soul ring off completely, add hotd in somewhere. Otherwise fine. Drow Ranger Double wraith band wat. Get one max for an aquila. Earthshaker Fine Earth Spirit Force staff into core Elder Titan Hood. Take drums off. He doesn't really need the mana expansion when he has arc boots. Ember Spirit Fine Enchantress Drums no-go, aghs too good not to rush after or even before mek. It's hard to justify arc boots on enchantress when she needs the hp and as from treads. She can run mek fine without arc boots. Enigma Treads are recommended due to the hp increase. Otherwise fine Faceless Void Mask of madness is good, I'm not going to say remove it cause it actually is really good but the average pub probably has to backfire a bit too much. Gyrocopter Replace MKB with HotD and move MKB to extension. Move bkb to core. Huskar Get rid of drums completely. Huskar doesn't care about the mana-expansion and other items are more useful. Invoker If these weren't pubs we were talking about, I would say no bottle, but they probably need the regen. Io The new tranquils are really good for Io, and he can do mek without arc boots. Get rid of soul ring and drums. I don't even know what the soul ring is for when you have a bottle. The drums aren't as useful as other items like a vlads or mek. Add vlads to situational Jakiro Fine Juggernaut Fine Keeper of the Light Fine Kunkka Fine Legion Commander(Jungle) Legion jungle is god awful now that her passive got changed but I'm sure the pubs will want a guide for this. Looks fine other than the flawed base. Legion Commander(Lane) Fine Leshrac I really prefer treads instead of phase if going carry for the extra hp but that's more preference than the rest of this. Lich No drums pls Lifestealer(Lane) Looks fine. Idk why there's a hyperstone under core. That might as well be lumped into AC. Lifestealer(Jungle) See above Lina All drums do is give a bit more hp and max mana(which lina gets plenty of normally). She gets more effective survivability out of a blink or force. Lion Normally I would condemn arc boots on lion but with going mek he really needs the max mana. Lone Druid(Jungle) Oh boy. Another flawed build from the start because LD jungle from lv1 is awful. Lone Druid(Lane) Halberd isn't really an option on LD ever. His bear doesn't have mana to activate it and if your bear is 6 slotted and you're getting a halberd for your main hero you got a problem already. Luna Fine Lycan Fine Magnus Remove drums entirely. He doesn't need the max mana since the blink dagger change. Usually it's better to just go blink before arc boots nowadays because of the aforementioned change but it's probably more newbie-friendly to have a bigger mana pool for easier management. Medusa Add Satanic, MKB, and Daedulus as optional items. Jesus christ don't encourage a random noob to get a rapier. Meepo I really want to say get rid of drums and mek entirely but I know there's going to be some poor guy that randomed it and he's 0-9 and needs easy tank. More noob-friendly to go aghs first, agreed. Mirana Add maelstrom to core items Morphling Fine Naga Siren A semi-carry build probably is best. Prophet No pub will listen to a guide for this guy anyway. They'll just make midas treads sblade deso. Doesn't matter Necrophos Fine Nightstalker Move armlet to core IMO Nyx Assassin What's with this copy/paste shit from the valve guide? Not a hint of force staff or blink dagger what a sight Ogre Magi About as good as it can get. No amount of arguing with make people stop making agh's on ogre. Omniknight No soul ring. He's far better off rushing mana boots. I don't get the random medallion here. Outworld Devourer AC makes no sense even as a situational item. Phantom Assassin Why the halberd? No sense made. The reasons you provided basically apply to every hero. Phantom Assassin You can't convince a pub to stop making soul ring on pl so I'm not even going to both. Looks fine otherwise. Phoenix(Lane) Looks fine Phoenix(Mid) This is identical to lane? Puck ....arc boots? She doesn't need that much mana. She's going back to base after every teamfight anyway. She needs the hp from treads. Pugna Arc boots really isn't necessary. He has gigantic int gain that means his mana pool gets very large very quick. He needs the hp from treads. Pudge Tranquils are much better for pudge. 4 armor and regen for roaming and rotting. Usual thing with hood. Queen of Pain Fine Razor I take some issue with the drums but not enough for me to say take it off. Riki Get the gem off there. Any good team will buy a gem for riki instead of sentries after a while and this'll just make it more likely for them to get a free gem. Rubick Drums are a no-go. He has much more useful stuff such as force staff and blink. As a poor support he can't really afford something that mostly luxury(in terms of farming priority) Getting drums on rubick will likely means he won't get force/blink before the end of the game. Sand King I don't understand the eth blade. Situational doesn't mean 1 out of every 1000 games. Shadow Demon No drums pls. See Rubick. Move force staff to core Shadowfiend Some small mostly perferential things on my part here. Nothing too major. Shadow Shaman(Lane&Mid) Looks fine Silencer Drums are less egregious here due to silencer's potential as a semi-carry. Nothing other than that. Skywrath Mage Fine Slardar Either rush vanguard or blink. I recommend blink for pubs. Slark(Lane&Mid) I really don't see any reason to differentiate. There are very few differences to be found between the builds. On another note, finally a hero that makes use of drums fully. Sniper Fine Spectre Fine, early fighting build is probably best. Spirit Breaker Fine Storm Spirit Orchid goes with BKB like popcorn and butter. Go with it. Sven No armlet. He farms too fast for a slot-inefficient item. Replace MoM with drums in the core items. Templar Assassin Fine Terrorblade Looks fine except I would add an OoV to early game. That can lead to a ton of kills along with the slow and later build into skadi. Tidehunter No need for drums here again. See Rubick Timbersaw No drums pls. The movespeed is wasted and he's better off rushing bloodstone(sadly, even if he's way behind, bloodstone is still the best answer) Tinker No real way to feasibly do a tinker guide. Tiny(Lane) Lump yasha into manta. Otherwise fine Tiny(Mid) Oh god, just delete this one Treant Protector No drums pls. See Rubick I don't get the necrobook. There's no reason that necro is any better for treant than any other hero. Troll Warlord Fine Tusk Fine Undying Hood again. Otherwise Fine Ursa Jungle ursa is shit now that tranquils were changed. He really has to lane. In which case, swap quelling for branches. Vengeful Spirit Venge gets the same soft-pass on the drums as silencer but I still don't like it. Add blink somewhere. Personally I think it's core. Venomancer Add mek to core if you're going to have him make mana boots. Otherwise tranquils are good for him with extra armor and roamability. Viper He really doesn't need drums when he's already going mek. Visage I dislike manaboots on visage but it helps deal with mek cost. Warlock Fine, he needs the mana boots for refresher Weaver Fine Windranger Eth blade....? See previous comment on situational items. Wraith King See comment on medusa for rapier. Fine otherwise Witch Doctor See Rubick for drums, Add mek to core. Zeus Hard to fuck up a zeus build. | ||
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For some of these, you want to cut corners and make Core Items pretty much the only Core rather than building into it; for some I agree; others I'll get second opinions. For some, it's been discussed like with Ancient Apparition mid others will need to have their Drums removed haha! | ||
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Some things will not be changed because either the build is fine as is and/or I want to create a separate guide and just haven't gotten around to it (Ursa/Nyx). I've provided URLs for anyone who wants to inspect these guides themselves. Changes will be made this afternoon as I get set up! Thanks for the feedback! + Show Spoiler [Revision fedback] + Changed See Patch below To Consider See Patch Below Unchanged Alchemist You're trying to do too much here. Pick a role and the guy reading(assuming he's new to the hero) won't be overwhelmed by options Bloodseeker Definitely no reason here for a quelling blade. BS has massive base damage. Other than that, it's fine. Ancient Apparition(Lane) Remove Rod of Atos. His stun isn't good enough to justify spending 3100 gold on it. Add Agh's to Core. It's just too good of an upgrade to not rush. Put a blurb on force staff in case there's an ursa or otherwise dangerous hero one needs to get away from. I recommend skilling chilling touch as a priority rather than cold feet. Ancient Apparition(Mid) AA won't be doing squat with this skill build mid. His whole laning presence is using chilling touch and this one takes stats over it. As for items see critique below Lifestealer(Lane) Looks fine. Idk why there's a hyperstone under core. That might as well be lumped into AC. Leshrac I really prefer treads instead of phase if going carry for the extra hp but that's more preference than the rest of this. Bounty Hunter I would add some small mana item for early game(Urn or Medallion) but that's fairly minor Bristleback Why is hood so far up here? He can just get a casual cloak for a much more cost-effective buffer for magic damage. Also vanguard works well with his passive so I actually recommend here. Brewmaster Again, he has a large list of expensive core items and he can't use money on less impactful stuff like drums. Move blink to core Clinkz Fine, I would add soul ring as a situational item in the case of a 1v1 matchup. Gyrocopter Replace MKB with HotD and move MKB to extension. Move bkb to core Meepo I really want to say get rid of drums and mek entirely but I know there's going to be some poor guy that randomed it and he's 0-9 and needs easy tank. More noob-friendly to go aghs first, agreed. Nyx Assassin What's with this copy/paste shit from the valve guide? Not a hint of force staff or blink dagger what a sight Omniknight No soul ring. He's far better off rushing mana boots. I don't get the random medallion here. Pudge Tranquils are much better for pudge. 4 armor and regen for roaming and rotting. Usual thing with hood. Riki Get the gem off there. Any good team will buy a gem for riki instead of sentries after a while and this'll just make it more likely for them to get a free gem. Tiny(Lane) Lump yasha into manta. Otherwise fine Tiny(Mid) Oh god, just delete this one Vengeful Spirit Venge gets the same soft-pass on the drums as silencer but I still don't like it. Add blink somewhere. Personally I think it's core. Venomancer Add mek to core if you're going to have him make mana boots. Otherwise tranquils are good for him with extra armor and roamability. Viper He really doesn't need drums when he's already going mek. Visage I dislike manaboots on visage but it helps deal with mek cost. Enigma Treads are recommended due to the hp increase. Otherwise fine Lone Druid (Jungle) Lone Druid (Lane) Halberd isn't really an option on LD ever. His bear doesn't have mana to activate it and if your bear is 6 slotted and you're getting a halberd for your main hero you got a problem already. Outworld Devourer AC makes no sense even as a situational item. Sand King I don't understand the eth blade. Situational doesn't mean 1 out of every 1000 games Doom (Jungle) Put quelling in for early game. It's effectively mitigation since creeps die faster and hit you less. Bane Thank god that soul ring is gone but there is no reason for bane to prioritize necro over blink or mek. Rest is fine Beastmaster (Lane) Don't bother with drums. He has expensive core items that give far better benefits. Undying Hood again. Otherwise Fine Puck ....arc boots? She doesn't need that much mana. She's going back to base after every teamfight anyway. She needs the hp from treads. Anti-Mage Don't start with a quelling blade. A few branches beefs him up a bit when he needs it most. AM also has a nice attack animation and base damage so he shouldn't need a quelling blade at the very start. | ||
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Removed Drums of Endurance Moved Force Staff to Situational Items Moved Necromonicon to Core Items Added Black King Bar to Situational Items Moved Aghanim's to Extension Items Moved Veil of Discord to Situational Items Medusa Added Monkey King Bar to Employee Discount Batrider Removed Phase Boots Added Description for Boots of Speed Chen Added Magic Wand to Early Game Dark Seer Removed Drums of Endurance Moved Pipe of Insight to Situational Items Dazzle Removed Soul Ring Doom (Lane) Removed Armlet of Mordiggan Drow Ranger Removed 1x Wratih Band Added Ring of Protection to Starting Items Earth Spirit Moved Force Staff to Core Items Elder Titan Moved Drums of Endurance to Situational Items IO Removed Soul Ring Added Vladmir's Offering to Situational Items Added Tranquil Boots to Situational Items Lich Removed Drums of Endurance Magnus Removed Drums of Endurance Added Assault Cuirass as Situational Items Added Shiva's Guard as Extension Items Night Stalker Added Armlet of Mordiggan Rubick Removed Drums of Endurance Shadow Demon Removed Drums of Endurance Moved Force Staff to Core Items Storm Spirit Moved Black King Bar to Core Items Moved Linken's Sphere to Situational Items Terrorblade Added Orb of Venom to Early Game (before boots of speed) Tidehunter Removed Drums of Endurance Timbersaw Removed Drums of Endurance Witch Doctor Moved Mekansm to Core Items Moved Drums of Endurance to Situational Items Axe Moved Mekansm to Core Items Moved Blade Mail to Extension Items Added Shiva's Guard to Extension Items Windranger Removed Eth. Blade Mirana Added Maelstrom to Core Items Chaos Knight Removed Soul Ring Crystal Maiden Moved Force Staff to Core Items Removed Drums of Endurance Huskar Removed Drums of Endurance To Consider Ursa Do Ursa Lane Guide Beastmaster (Middle) "It's far more useful to go mek-->blink--THEN Aghs, especially in pubs where hero kills matter a lot." Sven "No armlet. He farms too fast for a slot-inefficient item. Replace MoM with drums in the core items." Pugna "Arc boots really isn't necessary. He has gigantic int gain that means his mana pool gets very large very quick. He needs the hp from treads." Treant Protector "No drums pls. I don't get the necrobook. There's no reason that necro is any better for treant than any other hero." Dragon Knight "Take soul ring off completely, add hotd in somewhere. Otherwise fine." Enchantress "Drums no-go, aghs too good not to rush after or even before mek. It's hard to justify arc boots on enchantress when she needs the hp and as from treads. She can run mek fine without arc boots." Abaddon "Get rid of drums. It doesn't give that much for a support compared to a carry." Centaur Warruner Again, hood is prioritized far too much. Casual cloak for a later pipe. Blink or vanguard should be rushed. Clockwerk Probably one of the least friendly guide heroes. Once again, hood. Casual cloak. Add force staff as a situational Disruptor Get eul's off. A well-played disruptor doesn't need help trapping with field. I would put mek into core. | ||
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dcttr66
United States555 Posts
I'm not sure why my post wasn't deleted by the moderator but since I was warned and given red text in my post I decided to remove my content out of respect for the authority of the website. User was warned for this post (hijacking someone else's thread, and spreading low quality/bad guides) | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
All the things you've said "we discussed" are basically times where we have told you you are wrong and your response was "well it feels necessary to me" and left it on  (aka hyperstone as "core" on naix). | ||
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On March 22 2014 00:00 Sn0_Man wrote: Specifically with wisp, you need a ton of hp/mana regen items to keep your buddy topped up but which in particular you need vary depending on the carry you are following around. For some, a bottle will keep them topped up on mana, for others you need a soul ring or arcanes. Note that wisp actually can't really run a mek on just a bottle for mana items assuming he's using spirits decently often. All the things you've said "we discussed" are basically times where we have told you you are wrong and your response was "well it feels necessary to me" and left it on (aka hyperstone as "core" on naix). Oof, you got me. A lot of them I recall it going back and forth; specifically Anti-Mage Branches or Quelling Blade, AA build order and rushing Aghs, etc. For others; I'd like to revisit them, specially the hoods where Coil seems to note that I do put Hood on a lot of heroes where it doesn't seem necessary. The main ones I am really unsure about are: Sven, Pugna, Dragon Knight, Enchantress, Centaur and Clockwerk. I'm still convinced about Hyperstone on Naix. It is basically the first item you want when building either Mjonllir or Assault Cuirass. If you check situational/extension items for him, they are both there; so this is meant to say: "get this and decide which you want to build" similar to how I did it for Doom and Timbersaw. | ||
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Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
AA rushes aghs always excepting the rare cases when he needs mek. Immediately after which he rushes aghs. Everything else sucks on him in comparison. Skill build is fluid but max E is the most common/popular in side lanes. AA mid sucks dick even though Yango likes it cuz he remembers dendi AA from TI1 or something. It doesn't happen ever and shouldn't be a guide since it's simply so unpopular. Mobility items on him fall squarely under the "JESUS URSA HAS A BLINK" category. Centaur's the only hero that can justify a hood very often since the regen and magic resist are godly for farming with double edge. Please don't get vanguard on cent its actually the worst thing on earth. Armlet sven sucks. Soul ring DK is a safe-lane farming carry build but its reasonable. Clock isn't a "guide-able" hero so while i'm unsure what the current build is, you can argue for literally any build on clock. I don't have comments on enchantress that hero's unuseably bad. Hyperstone isn't "core" idgaf wat u say. Perfectly legit build: Phase/Drums/SnY/Basher->Abyssal hell that even skips armlet which you could inject in there too | ||
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Firebolt145
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On March 22 2014 00:37 Firebolt145 wrote: Just because it's a common part of two items you're likely to build one of doesn't mean it should be placed separately on its own in 'core'. I mean how is it not core though? I'm nearly always going to go Assault Cuirass and in nearly every case; the extra attack speed is of the most priority and usually I buy it even after if I have to suddenly deviate for XYZ reason. The extra attack speed is really desired, no? That's my understanding of it :x | ||
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