• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 22:50
CEST 04:50
KST 11:50
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror4[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10
Community News
Rollback Netcode in Brood War395.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 202621Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup10StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026)78
StarCraft 2
General
5.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 2026 [Old] StarCraft 3 Reportedly in Development StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026) How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)
Tourneys
ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event RSL 2026 Offline Finals LCQ Sign-Ups Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 546 Catch the Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble
Brood War
General
Rollback Netcode in Brood War Bot on ladder Repalyzer - replay analysis app for StarCraft: Rem Making an Online Broodwar Manager Game BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Semifinal A [ASL22] Semifinal B [ASL22] Ro8 Day 4
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Escaping Into Video Games: G…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 9091 users

In-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 284

Forum Index > The Tavern
Post a Reply
Prev 1 282 283 284 285 286 371 Next
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 25 2016 18:52 GMT
#5661
[image loading]

neat
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
February 25 2016 19:44 GMT
#5662
Nice! Can't wait to see what you do with the raw data.
Logo
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 25 2016 20:52 GMT
#5663
On February 26 2016 04:44 Logo wrote:
Nice! Can't wait to see what you do with the raw data.


Same as before: stat updates every 15 days.

Before, it was a python script my friend wrote, but now he made it an .exe so I can just run it.

The data it collects is the same as what is publicly available:

Subs
Ratings
# of comments
# of views
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
February 25 2016 21:39 GMT
#5664
Cool! I was sort of hoping it could parse out the guide data into something we could feed into other systems (I'd love a script/system to keep Liquipedia's in page guides up to date with your guides or something like that).
Logo
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 25 2016 22:25 GMT
#5665
On February 26 2016 06:39 Logo wrote:
Cool! I was sort of hoping it could parse out the guide data into something we could feed into other systems (I'd love a script/system to keep Liquipedia's in page guides up to date with your guides or something like that).


Do you mind in terms of names/URLs?
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 09:25:53
February 25 2016 22:43 GMT
#5666
Legion Commander (Lane)
Added Healing Salve to Starting Items
Added Iron Talon to Early Game
Added Magic Wand to Core Items
Added Drums of Endurance to Situational Items
Moved Power Treads to Early Game
Moved Bottle to Situational Items
Moved Sange and Yasha to Extension Items
Removed Iron Branch x2
Removed Abyssal Blade
Removed Quelling Blade

Legion Commander (Middle)
Removed Iron Branch x3
Added Iron Talon to Early Game
Added Magic Wand to Core Items
Added Drums of Endurance to Situational Items
Moved Power Treads to Early Game
Moved Sange and Yasha to Extension Items
Removed Iron Branch x2
Removed Abyssal Blade
Removed Quelling Blade

Drow Ranger
Added Shadow Blade to Situational Items
Moved Black King Bar to Extension Items
Removed Silver Edge
Removed Mask of Madness

Enchantress
New Skill Build: W E Q Q Q R Q E E E R W W W R (1. Untouchable 2. Nature's Attendants 3. Enchant)
Added Moon Shard to Extension Items
Moved Drums of Endurance to Situational Items
Removed Hand of Midas
Removed Shiva's Guard

Magnus
New Skill Build: Q E Q E Q R Q W W W R W E E R (1. Shockwave 2. Empower 3. Skewer)
Added Linken's Sphere to Situational Items
Moved Guardian Greaves to Extension Items

Crystal Maiden
Added Aghanim's Scepter to Extension Items
Removed Scythe of Vyse

Alchemist (Middle)
New Skill Build: E Q Q E Q R W Q E E R W W W R (1. Acid Spray 2. Greevil's Greed 3. Unstable Concoction)
Added Mjolnnir to Extension Items
Moved Heart of Tarrasque to Extension Items
Moved Monkey King Bar to Luxury Items
Removed Boots of Travel - Level 2

Alchemist (Lane)
New Skill Build: E Q W Q W R Q Q W W R E E E R (1. Acid Spray 2. Unstable Concoction 3. Greevil's Greed)
Added Hand of Midas to Situational Items
Added Silver Edge to Situational Items
Moved Blink Dagger to Core Items
Moved Solar Crest to Extension Items
Moved Heart of Tarrasque to Extension Items
Moved Monkey King Bar to Luxury Items
Removed Magic Wand
Removed Boots of Travel - Level 2

Juggernaut
New Skill Build: Q E Q W Q R Q W W W R E E E (1. Blade Fury 2. Healing Ward 3. Blade Dance)

Keeper of the Light
New Skill Build: W E E Q E Q Q Q R W WW E R R (1. Illuminate 2. Mana Leak 3. Chakra Magic)

Venomancer
Added Tranquil Boots to Core Items
Moved Force Staff to Extension Items
Moved Blink Dagger to Extension Items
Removed Arcane Boots

Bounty Hunter
Removed Pipe of Insight
Removed Solar Crest

Ember Spirit (Lane)
Ember Spirit (Middle)
Moved Manta Style to Situational Items
Moved Eye of Skadi to Extension Items

Oracle (Lane)
Oracle (Middle)
Created New Tab: "Utility Items"
Added Flying Courier to "Utility Items"
Added Observer Ward to "Utility Items"
Added Sentry Ward to "Utility Items"
Added Gem of True Sight to "Utility Items"
Added Smoke of Deceit to "Utility Items"
Moved Aether Lens to Core Items
Moved Guardian Greaves to Extension Items
Removed Mekansm

Warlock (Middle)
Added Glimmer Cape to Extension Items
Removed Scythe of Vyse

Warlock (Lane)
New Skill Build: E W W E E R E W W Q R Q Q Q R (1. Upheaval 2. Shadow Word 3. Fatal Bonds)
Added Glimmer Cape to Extension Items
Removed Scythe of Vyse

Outworld Devourer
Added Tango to Starting Items
Added Drums of Endurance to Core Items
Removed Faerie Fire x2

Lich
Added Aether Lens to Extension Items
Removed Scythe of Vyse

Viper
Added Healing Salve to Early Game



To-Do
1. Update Contributor's List
2. Revise Build Categories (tentative thoughts: Middle, Jungle, Safe[lane], Off[lane], Support)
3. done
4. done
5. done
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
February 25 2016 22:55 GMT
#5667
On February 26 2016 07:25 Torte de Lini wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 26 2016 06:39 Logo wrote:
Cool! I was sort of hoping it could parse out the guide data into something we could feed into other systems (I'd love a script/system to keep Liquipedia's in page guides up to date with your guides or something like that).


Do you mind in terms of names/URLs?


Nah, Liquidpedia has a recommended items and build sections for each hero on the page itself, but they're static and out of date. It always bugs me to see them out of date, but the work to actually keep them relevant would be immense unless it was an automated process.
Logo
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 25 2016 23:21 GMT
#5668
On February 26 2016 07:55 Logo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 26 2016 07:25 Torte de Lini wrote:
On February 26 2016 06:39 Logo wrote:
Cool! I was sort of hoping it could parse out the guide data into something we could feed into other systems (I'd love a script/system to keep Liquipedia's in page guides up to date with your guides or something like that).


Do you mind in terms of names/URLs?


Nah, Liquidpedia has a recommended items and build sections for each hero on the page itself, but they're static and out of date. It always bugs me to see them out of date, but the work to actually keep them relevant would be immense unless it was an automated process.


It would probably be possible to have the script scrape the item codes off the page (e.g: "travel_boots_1g.png"). I am not sure how that is done though.
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
BluemoonSC
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
SoCal8933 Posts
February 25 2016 23:42 GMT
#5669
I bet if he were coaxed into it, I'd bet that R1ch could probably pull something together. Maybe speak to emu about it?
LiquidDota Staff@BluemoonGG_
Belisarius
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia6233 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 00:34:57
February 26 2016 00:34 GMT
#5670
I'm sure that's not difficult. I'm too much of an amateur to do it off the top of my head, but if you PM'd me a copy of your friend's script I could at least look at ripping the items.

I'm pretty sure LD has at least a half dozen regulars who are code monkeys of some flavour or other who could do it in about 10 minutes, though.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 26 2016 00:59 GMT
#5671
On February 26 2016 09:34 Belisarius wrote:
I'm sure that's not difficult. I'm too much of an amateur to do it off the top of my head, but if you PM'd me a copy of your friend's script I could at least look at ripping the items.

I'm pretty sure LD has at least a half dozen regulars who are code monkeys of some flavour or other who could do it in about 10 minutes, though.


I can ask for the GitHub link.




I'm going to revise Sven to the new Blink -> HOTD build before stats tomorrow.
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
SpiritoftheTunA
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States20903 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 02:45:35
February 26 2016 02:35 GMT
#5672
i would make bottle core (instead of situational) on LC middle, getting mana to spam out the lane before rune spawns -> spamming out the lane -> securing runes is game winning in the mid lane if your hero is capable of it. even if your hero doesnt really need the bottle refill every 2 minutes, preventing your opponent from getting an invis dd or haste can be pretty game changing

of course you can control runes without the bottle but making a bottle required purchasing will definitely increase rune consciousness overall i think
posting on liquid sites in current year
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 02:39:35
February 26 2016 02:39 GMT
#5673
Just a thought on the mid/core divide - if all that is different is starting items, could you not just put in like a null talisman as a situational item, then put "Start with this and x regen if mid" in the description? That way you only sacrifice an item slot rather than an entire guide
Belisarius
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia6233 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 03:24:39
February 26 2016 03:23 GMT
#5674
Yeah as long as we're maintaining seperate mid guides, there's a pretty small list of mid heroes who will skip bottle and that list doesn't include LC.

On February 26 2016 11:39 Nevuk wrote:
Just a thought on the mid/core divide - if all that is different is starting items, could you not just put in like a null talisman as a situational item, then put "Start with this and x regen if mid" in the description? That way you only sacrifice an item slot rather than an entire guide

This is one way to do it. The downside is that it depends on people reading the descriptions, which I'm not sure we can rely on.

It's probably safer to use a "Starting items - mid" tab because the tab name gets shown directly to the player in-game, unlike the description. You sacrifice a tab instead of an entire guide, which is more than an item slot, but still a big step up.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 04:44:06
February 26 2016 04:41 GMT
#5675
On February 26 2016 12:23 Belisarius wrote:
Yeah as long as we're maintaining seperate mid guides, there's a pretty small list of mid heroes who will skip bottle and that list doesn't include LC.

Show nested quote +
On February 26 2016 11:39 Nevuk wrote:
Just a thought on the mid/core divide - if all that is different is starting items, could you not just put in like a null talisman as a situational item, then put "Start with this and x regen if mid" in the description? That way you only sacrifice an item slot rather than an entire guide

This is one way to do it. The downside is that it depends on people reading the descriptions, which I'm not sure we can rely on.

It's probably safer to use a "Starting items - mid" tab because the tab name gets shown directly to the player in-game, unlike the description. You sacrifice a tab instead of an entire guide, which is more than an item slot, but still a big step up.


It's already in the early game: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=203428541

Yes, Starting Items - Mid would be ideal.

https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Belisarius
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia6233 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 07:08:59
February 26 2016 07:08 GMT
#5676
Legion Commander (Middle)
Removed Iron Branch x3
Added Iron Talon to Early Game
Added Magic Wand to Core Items
Added Drums of Endurance to Situational Items
Moved Power Treads to Early Game
Moved Bottle to Situational Items
Moved Sange and Yasha to Extension Items
Removed Iron Branch x2
Removed Abyssal Blade
Removed Quelling Blade

is what I was responding to.

I'm happy if it stays in earlygame for now.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 26 2016 07:35 GMT
#5677
It's a copy and paste, i'll repair it.
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 18:48:08
February 26 2016 18:41 GMT
#5678
I'm looking at revising the Sven build; but I don't understand why Q is not maxed whatsoever. Because the duration is a static 2.0 or something else?

e.g: http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2178853523

side-note, but I also see max Sun Ray for Phoenix which is new to me. I think I will still keep it max Spirits
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 18:55:36
February 26 2016 18:53 GMT
#5679
On February 27 2016 03:41 Torte de Lini wrote:
I'm looking at revising the Sven build; but I don't understand why Q is not maxed whatsoever.

e.g: http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2178853523

side-note, but I also see max Sun Ray for Phoenix which is new to me. I think I will still keep it max Spirits


It's just not useful based on your other choices?

You take max cleave first for maximum farming (which is an important trait of Sven). When you're level 8 you have to choose between warcry and bolt. At that point you're looking at trading 225 magical damage once, maybe twice, per fight for +15 armor plus a cooldown reduction giving warcry a >50% uptime.

Once you choose warcry > bolt then there's no reason to go back and get the extra levels in stormbolt that late.


The sunray first is interesting, it seems like a support build (for now?). It makes sense if you have a team you trust to provide disables and you're lower level/lower farm so you can't be as aggressively positioned to chase with spirits. Plus with a slower leveling Phoenix you can't rely as much on aggressivelyt placed eggs anyways so the attack speed slow synergy isn't as practical. Ray is a lot better for playing off your team, but spirits are still probably the better choice for setting up plays yourself.
Logo
Velzi
Profile Joined June 2012
Finland659 Posts
February 26 2016 19:02 GMT
#5680
For Sven, u can clear ancient Stacks with max w and max e but if u are 4-4-1 or 4-1-4, taking stacks aint so easy. Also if u are not planning to fight with Sven until SnY Blink HotD, u might aswell max ur farming speed over maxing ur killing potential.

Some lanes where u struggle to get farm u might aswell go 2-0-2 or something and then max cleave. But if lane is easy, u usually keep ur points and take cleave when u start farming both jungle and lane.

Sun Ray is Phoenix's best skill, thats why u max it. Spirit max is really only better when u are solo offlane vs dual melee lane or something u can really bully with. Especially support Phoenix should max e almost always. For the build, 1-4-4 over 4-4-1 should be standard, whether u want to max w or e should be situational. (again for the build maxing r>w>e>q is fine if u feel like maxing e is still not standard enough)
Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you to their level and then beat you with experience. http://www.dotabuff.com/players/115305822 https://yasp.co/players/115305822
Prev 1 282 283 284 285 286 371 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
08:00
OSC Elite Rising Star #21
CranKy Ducklings66
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 148
PiLiPiLi 31
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 2734
ViBE154
Bale 28
Dota 2
monkeys_forever440
NeuroSwarm217
Counter-Strike
summit1g7239
taco 595
Other Games
JimRising 582
WinterStarcraft306
C9.Mang0281
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick998
BasetradeTV154
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 105
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP101
• poizon28 30
• davetesta28
• practicex 18
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• Scarra1118
• Shiphtur312
Upcoming Events
Big Brain Bouts
7h 10m
Rex vs INexorable
GgMaChine vs HeRoMaRinE
Reynor vs herO
Online Event
9h 10m
AI Arena Tournament
14h 10m
BSL: Ladder Tournament
16h 10m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 7h
Patches Events
1d 12h
BSL Open Qualifier
1d 16h
BSL Open Qualifier
1d 16h
OSC
2 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
The PondCast
5 days
Online Event
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Copium Cup

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Acropolis #5
HCC Season 3
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.