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On June 13 2013 11:35 Cyro wrote:
Haswell is hot. I'm going to replace my exhaust fan (i broke it, so this is open case with about 20c ambients) and buy a 2500rpm ty-143 fan to throw as a third onto my silver arrow, and also add another intake i think at bottom; because of how nicely it lines up with my blower GPU intake (and i guess any other blower GPU) which should significantly reduce max noise levels of my system, or at least make it harder for a game to trigger noise ramp-ups. I'm not too bothered about them; but i can probably lower them a lot, so why not?
I'm not sure about the TY-143. Does that work together with the slow fans? If the fan control decides to run stuff at 70 %, both fans will get the same signal, but the slow fan will be slower than you'll want it, and the TY-143 will already start to blow your ears off.
The standard brown version of the Silver Arrow has the TY-150 in the middle position. Perhaps you should buy that one. It should work fine with your 140mm slow fans, and it also will be a little more powerful as it's 150mm. You could set them up as TY-147 ---> TY-150 ---> TY-147 on the Silver Arrow. Or you could move one of the TY-147 to a different position in your case if it fits. You might want to see if you can skip the exhaust fan if you go for a lot of positive pressure in your case. Positive pressure means you can also remove all the slot panels around your graphics card and be sure that air will be pushed out through there (instead of dusty air being sucked in).
If you buy the TY-143, you could experiment with the TY-143 alone running in the middle position of the cooler without any other fan. This could be interesting if your TY-147 fit in the mounting positions for fans of your case. I fear the TY-143 will be loud as fuck when it ramps up so that won't work.
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United Kingdom20343 Posts
Thanks for the advice. My case actually has a built in fan-controller thing to the front panel; i could attach the 2500rpm fan to that, and manual it NP (two channel fan controller; but i really dont mind my other fans being maxed out all the time anyway, they are quiet)
I've got some data to post when i can add sc2 performance info to it, but temperatures are basically a nonfactor in regular gaming. I'd only need the 143 for certain cases, or to look cool, or just to have lower temps when i dont care about noise ;p
Why would i go for positive pressure? I'm a newbie here. The back and top exhausts are very close to the CPU cooler, and i lost at least 2-4c from my CPU temps when i messed up my back exhaust fan, but i only had a single intake.
Stats on the 143 read ~130cfm at 45dba, while the 150 reads as 84cfm at 34dba, i thought i might be able to have decent gains from a third fan because of the two i have now maxing at their 1200rpm
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/6uFHaSJ.png)
LOL seems about right
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I have just one last question for my rig since I seem to be getting different answers. Should I just carry over my Vista to the new SSD, keep it on the current HDD, or just keygen Windows 7 or 8 onto the SSD?
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United Kingdom20343 Posts
I'd keygen windows 7 or windows 8.1 onto it.
Vista, while being a big no anyway, doesn't support AVX instructions which are quite important for performance, particularly on haswell cpu's (which support avx2)
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This is about positive pressure and sounds good: http://www.silverstonetek.com/techtalk_cont.php?tid=wh_positive&area=en
I don't know how the top exhaust being used as intake for fresh cold air would turn out for the CPU cooler. It could be good.
If you want a lot of fresh air for your CPU, if you have a 5.25 inch drive cage with a lot of space and mesh slot covers, you can ghetto rig a large fan inside that drive cage. That got me up to 10 C in my previously badly ventilated case. The top exhausts should probably be covered so that you'll create some kind of wind tunnel from the front to the rear of the case.
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On June 13 2013 18:52 Johnnycashew wrote:
I have just one last question for my rig since I seem to be getting different answers. Should I just carry over my Vista to the new SSD, keep it on the current HDD, or just keygen Windows 7 or 8 onto the SSD?
There's a Windows Upgrade license. It's a good bit cheaper than the normal license but it's still the same kind of product key. You might want to look that up.
EDIT: That's from the prices I see at amazon.de. It's about 85 € for Windows 7 or 8 OEM, but it's about 50 € for Windows 8 Upgrade. I can only find the Win 8 upgrade with that price.
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United Kingdom20343 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/uQPVCTy.png)
Was just benchmarking and accidentally got this wonderful illustration of GPU usage throughout an sc2 game, starting out with it being at 100% load and capping my FPS, dropping further and further as supplies rise, and then rising again as they drop (turns into a low econ low supply game later)
This is medium shaders on a gtx260, 1920x1080, with an FPS ceiling around 150-300 due to GPU, depending on where the camera is looking etc
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It's kind of not a good idea to be running different size or different speed fans together on a cooler, with respect to noise. You can get some modulation artifacts.
Despite the high temperatures of the CPU itself, not all that much heat is being transferred to the heatsink (see the power consumption), so the temps of the heatsink itself shouldn't be really high. Adding a third fan to such a setup really shouldn't do too much, but if a few degrees is that important to you, then sure. The key should be to fix the exhaust and intake so the cooler fans aren't essentially working hard and operating on the inside of a little straw (if it's a very restricted case; if it's not, then it shouldn't make all too much difference).
If there's a blower video card, you probably want more intake, as otherwise the graphics card would be taking a lot of the intake air and making sure the CPU area doesn't get much of it.
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On June 13 2013 21:20 Cyro wrote:Was just benchmarking and accidentally got this wonderful illustration of GPU usage throughout an sc2 game, starting out with it being at 100% load and capping my FPS, dropping further and further as supplies rise, and then rising again as they drop (turns into a low econ low supply game later) This is medium shaders on a gtx260, 1920x1080, with an FPS ceiling around 150-300 due to GPU, depending on where the camera is looking etc
Cool graphic.
150 FPS is enough for 144 Hz. ;P
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United Kingdom20343 Posts
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United Kingdom20343 Posts
On June 13 2013 22:08 Myrmidon wrote:
It's kind of not a good idea to be running different size or different speed fans together on a cooler, with respect to noise. You can get some modulation artifacts.
Despite the high temperatures of the CPU itself, not all that much heat is being transferred to the heatsink (see the power consumption), so the temps of the heatsink itself shouldn't be really high. Adding a third fan to such a setup really shouldn't do too much, but if a few degrees is that important to you, then sure. The key should be to fix the exhaust and intake so the cooler fans aren't essentially working hard and operating on the inside of a little straw (if it's a very restricted case; if it's not, then it shouldn't make all too much difference).
If there's a blower video card, you probably want more intake, as otherwise the graphics card would be taking a lot of the intake air and making sure the CPU area doesn't get much of it.
I figured adding a third, good fan to the middle would push temps some towards silver arrow extreme which is 2x ty-143 for example, the lack of airflow on my 1200rpm fans would leave more room for improvement i think. I'd be happy if i got a consistent -3c from it under max load, or even like 2c.
There's a bottom intake spot on my case that points right into the GPU intake. Match made in heaven. My GPU is by far the loudest component so if it's significantly cooler (and i think an intake at the right plcae can do that) then it would lower noise levels and help temps quite a bit, i don't really care too much about noise, but like i said, if you can remove some of it for free, why not?
I like blowers, feels like they interfere with CPU OC a lot less. I was hoping for a 760ti model with the titan reference cooler, any info on 760 release? I thought it got talked about before. Looks actually like titan reference cooler is stuck being sold with titan, 780 and 770, so i might get a 770.
It seems hard to get ahold of a 770 with titan reference cooler in UK. Anyone know one to buy?
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Well, if it's some kind of holey gamer box like Xigmatek Utgard, then it shouldn't matter as much what the fans and layout are, so what I said earlier probably doesn't as much apply.
Yes, blower graphics card is better for CPU temps. It's just in a restrictive case where maybe you could say the GPU and CPU coolers are fighting hard for whatever intake is available, but that's still better than blowing a bunch of hot air around and into the CPU area.
edit: I think GTX 770 was launched with no official reference model expected to be available. It happens for some releases and not for others.
Since it's pretty much an overclocked GTX 680, all the AIB partners know what to do with it already. Looks like EVGA and PNY are offering blower models, at least.
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United Kingdom20343 Posts
Do you know where i can get one? Preferably EVGA or another good company, i don't know many UK sites because i'm not really a window shopper. OCUK, scan, that's pretty much it  dont know anywhere else to look
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Well, I've done enough builds for UK here in the past. Other places include Amazon, Aria, Dabs, Ebuyer.
Problem is, I'm not seeing any blowers anywhere. I guess none for UK market.
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German sites offer the best value, but shipping might push the cost over what you might get in the UK. Mindfactory in particular have excellent prices, but 30 euro shipping. Hardwareversand are great too, but 19 euro shipping, so mostly worth it only for a big order.
Mindfactory are selling PALIT 770s as low as 343 euro!!!
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The price difference is strange. There's a meta site http://geizhals.de to compare prices, and it seems http://skinflint.co.uk is its UK version. Looking at the Gigabyte GTX770, the .de shops are up to 50 € cheaper.
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German sites offer the most competitive pricing in Europe.
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what is everyone's opinion on these two motherboards
1) Gigabyte GA-Z87X-D3H -- 3x PCIe 3.0 x16, 6x USB 3.0, DisplayPort
2) ASRock Z87 Extreme 4 -- 3 PCIe 3.0 x16, 2x Gb LAN, 4x USB 3.0
i am thinking of going with the gigabyte, but just want people's feedbacks
thanks ^^
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Same price or what? I can't really decide. If that EM shield for audio noise on the ASRock works, it might be a neat feature. If I don't use some kind of external volume control on my current motherboard, I can hear some noise from the graphics card working with headphones. The audio chip itself might also be an argument for the ASRock. From what I've seen in forum posts, you can supposedly hear a difference between a soundcard and that Realtek 892 chip on the Gigabyte board, which might not be the case with what's used on the Extreme4.
If the Gigabyte is cheaper, I'd rather take that as I trust them quality wise.
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The EM shield works for sure. I haven't even listened to my old board obviously in forever, and I thought the difference was definitely noticeable. Its not 100$ sound card quality but if you like having nice sound it definitely, definitely helps.
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EPT
