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On June 16 2019 04:07 Freeborn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 03:24 General_Winter wrote:Interesting development. Toss feels that late late game is super Z favored so Toss develops a ton of mid game timings to never need to play the late game, or to only go into late game in a serious advantage having done damage. After years in the lab, Toss gets the mid game timings so strong that Zerg decides midgame is super Toss favored and so then Dark develops a ton of early game all ins so he doesn’t have to play the mid game, or at minimum only goes to the midgame after having done damage. I’m going to assume the next step is that Toss decides the early game is Z favored and so develops a bunch of probe rushes to avoid having to play the early game  :D
so the meta is either go dank or go dumb...
suddenly every zerg and protoss players can become a chad
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Canada8990 Posts
On June 16 2019 06:56 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 04:07 Freeborn wrote:On June 16 2019 03:24 General_Winter wrote:Interesting development. Toss feels that late late game is super Z favored so Toss develops a ton of mid game timings to never need to play the late game, or to only go into late game in a serious advantage having done damage. After years in the lab, Toss gets the mid game timings so strong that Zerg decides midgame is super Toss favored and so then Dark develops a ton of early game all ins so he doesn’t have to play the mid game, or at minimum only goes to the midgame after having done damage. I’m going to assume the next step is that Toss decides the early game is Z favored and so develops a bunch of probe rushes to avoid having to play the early game :D so the meta is either go dank or go dumb... suddenly every zerg and protoss players can become a chad
What is a chad?
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On June 16 2019 07:15 Nakajin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 06:56 seemsgood wrote:On June 16 2019 04:07 Freeborn wrote:On June 16 2019 03:24 General_Winter wrote:Interesting development. Toss feels that late late game is super Z favored so Toss develops a ton of mid game timings to never need to play the late game, or to only go into late game in a serious advantage having done damage. After years in the lab, Toss gets the mid game timings so strong that Zerg decides midgame is super Toss favored and so then Dark develops a ton of early game all ins so he doesn’t have to play the mid game, or at minimum only goes to the midgame after having done damage. I’m going to assume the next step is that Toss decides the early game is Z favored and so develops a bunch of probe rushes to avoid having to play the early game :D so the meta is either go dank or go dumb... suddenly every zerg and protoss players can become a chad What is a chad?
Wut? U ask me again man...
Ok besides the real life common meaning.
on Reddit,it means a player who can cheese the hell out of you.not a one trick pony player
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Canada8990 Posts
On June 16 2019 07:30 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 07:15 Nakajin wrote:On June 16 2019 06:56 seemsgood wrote:On June 16 2019 04:07 Freeborn wrote:On June 16 2019 03:24 General_Winter wrote:Interesting development. Toss feels that late late game is super Z favored so Toss develops a ton of mid game timings to never need to play the late game, or to only go into late game in a serious advantage having done damage. After years in the lab, Toss gets the mid game timings so strong that Zerg decides midgame is super Toss favored and so then Dark develops a ton of early game all ins so he doesn’t have to play the mid game, or at minimum only goes to the midgame after having done damage. I’m going to assume the next step is that Toss decides the early game is Z favored and so develops a bunch of probe rushes to avoid having to play the early game :D so the meta is either go dank or go dumb... suddenly every zerg and protoss players can become a chad What is a chad? Wut? U ask me again man... Ok besides the real life common meaning. on Reddit,it means a player who can cheese the hell out of you.not a one trick pony player
Oh yes sorry, now that went to google it I remember asking about it, can't say it's part of my real life vocabulary tho haha.
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JYP "unable to bring his Protoss expertise to the finals broadcast."
There are 3 Korean announcers. What are the races of the other two? Do they have 1 for each race? Is that why there are 3?
(Or are they all protosses, like GSL has been lately? Hah!)
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Really happy to see Dark advancing to the finals! Sad about JYP though 
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On June 16 2019 03:24 General_Winter wrote:Interesting development. Toss feels that late late game is super Z favored so Toss develops a ton of mid game timings to never need to play the late game, or to only go into late game in a serious advantage having done damage. After years in the lab, Toss gets the mid game timings so strong that Zerg decides midgame is super Toss favored and so then Dark develops a ton of early game all ins so he doesn’t have to play the mid game, or at minimum only goes to the midgame after having done damage. I’m going to assume the next step is that Toss decides the early game is Z favored and so develops a bunch of probe rushes to avoid having to play the early game
i'm not sure that's the case really.
hurricane looked aweful and dark control over the pace of the game was absolute.
i believe we won't see the same strategies in the finals, or from other zerg players for that regard.
the reason being zerg need a substantial economic advantage to support this playstyle.
should the protoss properly defend against the early aggression, than the hordes of low tier zerg units will get destroyed by normal early-mid protoss compositions waiting in defensive stances.
if the protoss harass to successfuly deal economic dmg, zerg simply won't be able to support huge armies early on.
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Super happy for Dark, he's my all--time favorite so definitely cheering for him. At the same time though, I just don't see him winning it this season...
I really hope he will, but current PvZ meta looks P-favoured and Trap is going to enter the finals with an excellent mental condition after beating Classic. Not sure how much worth is Rogue going to be as his practice partner since he has been slacking hugely lately, but the Jin Air teamhouse will surely make him prepared anyway.
Dark showed what is (was) hidden up in his sleeve in this latest series as well, which is another factor benefiting Trap.
Definitely don't want to count Dark out, this will be very close series IMO, but personally I believe Trap will take it. But if Dark manages to do it during this Protoss madness era, that'd be truly f***ing legendary.
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On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf
it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/
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On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/
Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did.
Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me.
Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted 
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wow Dark 15-2 so far. If he sweeps Trap this will be a really dominant run.
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On June 16 2019 11:53 waiting2Bbanned wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/ Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did. Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me. Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted
Rommel was a Wermacht General and not a Nazi (although the case can be made that some of his ideals might have been similar considering the time and place he lived in, he never joined the party), be careful with that you say and how you label people, even dead ones.
Other than that, not only this series but the whole GSL and other tournaments clearly show that PvZ is in a very bad spot right now, where both races have to resort to unhealthy gimmicks in order to win. The games have not felt fair nor enjoyable to me, whether it is with Protoss relying on boring but strong 2 base all-ins and Zerg being clearly favoured in the later stages of the game to the point that no Toss player even dares to have a straight-up macro game vs Zerg. I hope Blizzard acknowledges both ugly sides of the coin on this one soon and fix the matchup.
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Man, I'm not a Dark fan, but I'm glad he advanced so we didn't get a PvP. Now, may Dark be destroyed utterly.
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Another curse broken!
Would have liked a Dark VS Classic more, but still hyped for the finals
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Very impressed by Trap, especially if he wins the whole thing
Innovation, Classic, now Dark is next. He's really running the gauntlet here.
Rooting for him since an underdog taking down the titans of all three races would be epic
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On June 16 2019 11:53 waiting2Bbanned wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/ Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did. Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me. Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted
I swear the people who write these comments live in a bubble where matchfixers only harmed themselves and not anyone else. Blizzard giving any credit to Life would be an insult to all the players and coaches who lost their jobs because of matchfixers (of which Life was by far the most damaging in sc2). Not to mention any potential up and coming or future players that never happened after the scandal.
You can't help kill a scene then expect that same scene to honour all your achievements.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On June 17 2019 02:37 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 11:53 waiting2Bbanned wrote:On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/ Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did. Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me. Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted I swear the people who write these comments live in a bubble where matchfixers only harmed themselves and not anyone else. Blizzard giving any credit to Life would be an insult to all the players and coaches who lost their jobs because of matchfixers (of which Life was by far the most damaging in sc2). Not to mention any potential up and coming or future players that never happened after the scandal. You can't help kill a scene then expect that same scene to honour all your achievements.
Yeah, it's not like other sports don't give second chance while we're here on the threshold of a ceremonial crucifiction... >< Holy Batman on a nuclear powered pogo stick
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On June 17 2019 02:53 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2019 02:37 Fango wrote:On June 16 2019 11:53 waiting2Bbanned wrote:On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/ Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did. Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me. Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted I swear the people who write these comments live in a bubble where matchfixers only harmed themselves and not anyone else. Blizzard giving any credit to Life would be an insult to all the players and coaches who lost their jobs because of matchfixers (of which Life was by far the most damaging in sc2). Not to mention any potential up and coming or future players that never happened after the scandal. You can't help kill a scene then expect that same scene to honour all your achievements. Yeah, it's not like other sports don't give second chance while we're here on the threshold of a ceremonial crucifiction... >< Holy Batman on a nuclear powered pogo stick
Other sports wouldn't give a second chance to players that killed a good portion of their scene. Usually they just get done for doping or something and the blame is on them. With matchfixers their actions harmed every other player, not just themselves.
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On June 17 2019 02:37 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2019 11:53 waiting2Bbanned wrote:On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/ Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did. Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me. Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted I swear the people who write these comments live in a bubble where matchfixers only harmed themselves and not anyone else. Blizzard giving any credit to Life would be an insult to all the players and coaches who lost their jobs because of matchfixers (of which Life was by far the most damaging in sc2). Not to mention any potential up and coming or future players that never happened after the scandal. You can't help kill a scene then expect that same scene to honour all your achievements.
Yet there are sports like baseball where cheaters get short suspensions and are inducted into the Hall Of Fame, after being caught multiple times. I'm talking about grown men, not some kid playing a video game. Also those players cheated to win, ask anyone if Life didn't win his matches and trophies on skill and talent.
"help kill a scene"?? I was glued to the screen watching him play, he brought thousands of eyeballs to the scene.
You want to blame Life for the years-long decline in SC2 viewership & player base, while giving Blizzard's decade-long mismanagement a pass?
I could also mention the institutionalized corruption in KESPA, but I don't think any reasonable argument would work with you, so I'll just stop here.
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On June 17 2019 03:28 waiting2Bbanned wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2019 02:37 Fango wrote:On June 16 2019 11:53 waiting2Bbanned wrote:On June 16 2019 11:23 Die4Ever wrote:On June 16 2019 02:33 Fango wrote:Sad for JYP, right before the finals as well On June 16 2019 01:45 Elentos wrote:On June 16 2019 01:44 stilt wrote:On June 16 2019 01:34 Veluvian wrote:
I remember back in WoL when JYP had a huge PvZ while streaming as a progamer. Although that did not worked well in that terrain domination era in offline tournaments. Great guy really.
And of course I'm happy for Dark. He was right on the interview, he did some tiny mistakes but in general he was enormously good and Hurricane did everything wrong. Still this is very good tournament for the protoss guy, he deserves more respect rather it was clear he is not ready for a final yet.
What a paradox is the memory itself I'm thinking. Tastosis still can't remember that Life was the last Code S Z champion, but probably the reasons are clear why he is so easily forgotten today. This oversight is really cringy imo, I love Tasteless but not telling his nick is prudish. They're probably just straight up not supposed to talk about Life. I don't think it's an official rule for them not to talk about Life, but I remember Artosis saying on stream that the casters had decided amongst themselves not to bring him up. The only one I saw talk about him after the scandel was Wolf it seems it is a rule https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/b413s8/we_are_explicitly_instructed_to_never_mention/ Whatever Life did that got him banned, the way he played the game was genius. To this day I've never seen anyone impress me like he did. Blizzard's pathetic attempt at rewriting history won't change that for me. Rommel was a nazi, but that doesn't negate his strategic brilliance, or make anyone try to erase him from the history books. Good thing they're doing it to a video game player though, keep our feeble minds pure and untainted I swear the people who write these comments live in a bubble where matchfixers only harmed themselves and not anyone else. Blizzard giving any credit to Life would be an insult to all the players and coaches who lost their jobs because of matchfixers (of which Life was by far the most damaging in sc2). Not to mention any potential up and coming or future players that never happened after the scandal. You can't help kill a scene then expect that same scene to honour all your achievements. Yet there are sports like baseball where cheaters get short suspensions and are inducted into the Hall Of Fame. I'm talking about grown men, not some kid playing a video game. Also those players cheated to win, ask anyone if Life didn't win his matches and trophies on skill and talent. I could also mention the institutionalized corruption in KESPA, but I don't think any reasonable argument would work with you.
I wonder if baseball lost most of it's pro players, as well as it's most important league/source of income partly (not entirely, but still) because of those cheaters?
Life didn't cheat and receive a standardised ban, he matchfixed. There's a massive difference there. Whether you like it or not the actions of matchfixers assisted in killing korean sc2. Proleague was still fairly popular until the scandal at the start of 2016, post scandal it was pretty clear it lost a good portion of it's audience. How would you feel as a player or coach who lost their job seeing Life honoured by blizzard as one of the greats?
Edit: Especially given what happened in BW. Any pro korean player knew the potential consequences of matchfixing and the impact it can have on a scene. No excuses.
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EPT
