EPTPurelegacy DQ'd From WCS - Page 5
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
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UtherTruthBringer
43 Posts
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Adnapsc2
47 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
On June 08 2019 10:15 MrFreeman wrote: I'm shocked at the amount of people that would give him a slip, just because he didn't hack in the qualifier. This person is a toxic member of the community who cheats on the ladder and proceeds by sh1t talking his opponent and trying to enrage them, since they are already tilted from playing a map hacker. He should have been perma banned 4 years ago. I guess people are defending him because all we know for a fact is that he hacked 4 years ago. ProTech and others say he continued hacking but we have no proof for it except their word. The question is if Blizzard meant with "recent" hacking the hacking from 4 years ago or if he was caught hacking again. Being BM on ladder isn't an offence that deserves to get you banned. | ||
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
On June 08 2019 16:52 Charoisaur wrote: I guess people are defending him because all we know for a fact is that he hacked 4 years ago. ProTech and others say he continued hacking but we have no proof for it except their word. The question is if Blizzard meant with "recent" hacking the hacking from 4 years ago or if he was caught hacking again. Being BM on ladder isn't an offence that deserves to get you banned. Actually it is, you can get banned for that, it rarely happens, true, but it can get you banned. We know for a fact he has hacked recently, because the official announcement is that. How recent, that we dont know, but 4 years ago is not recently by any means, there have been ban-waves since then. Hell, LotV isnt more than 4 years old, it was released in November 2015 Unless you're saying that the Blizzard officials are flat out lying, and why the hell would they do that here? | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On June 08 2019 19:01 Geo.Rion wrote: Actually it is, you can get banned for that, it rarely happens, true, but it can get you banned. We know for a fact he has hacked recently, because the official announcement is that. How recent, that we dont know, but 4 years ago is not recently by any means, there have been ban-waves since then. Hell, LotV isnt more than 4 years old, it was released in November 2015 Unless you're saying that the Blizzard officials are flat out lying, and why the hell would they do that here? Blizzard could be more forthcoming with specifics perhaps, what else can ‘...due to a hacks review of recent play’ possibly mean other than he was hacking recently and got caught? As far as I’m aware ban waves are not reliable at scrubbing all the hackers, but they don’t generate false positives either. Absolute best case scenario the guy hacked for a short period years ago, a short period recently and not at all in between those periods. I’m browsing reddit on the topic and the amount of ‘you can’t just ban a player for being BM’ style comments are blowing my brain. Maybe our community would be better off if we spent less energy giving the benefit of the doubt to toxic figures, especially if they don’t even read why the person was bloody banned first. | ||
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raff100
498 Posts
He was basically a kid when he hacked and we all made dumb mistakes at that age, that we shouldn't be marked forever for. I've never liked Purelegacy, but watching him almost crying at the end of Rotti's video, left me a bad gut feeling. Sometimes we forget that behind a nickname on battlenet there's a person, with all of his struggles that we may never know. Maybe Starcraft is his escape, who knows.. | ||
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DSh1
292 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
On June 08 2019 19:01 Geo.Rion wrote: Actually it is, you can get banned for that, it rarely happens, true, but it can get you banned. True but it depends on the kind of BM. A simple "get out scrub" certainly isn't enough to get banned | ||
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-Kyo-
Japan1927 Posts
biggest fucking joke ever. i'll never forget the time in 2015 or something where this kid(literally at the time) was hacking and reaper proxied me, killed my main and natural, i expoed to 3rd on Catallena with a colo and a few gates and ended up winning on 1 base all while he was shit talking me and telling me to leave cuz i was awful and was losing to reapers. Look, people need to take a more aggressive approach to shit heads like this than vs avilo. Avilo had problems as we can all see retrospectively, and we shouldn't encourage that. That's okay to understand. But, as other people have been posting, PL has literally been ruining 2v2 queue with his friends for YEARS while hacking. Anyone who seriously plays or understands how 2v2 works just knows that statistically his scores are nonsensical, as are his friends. As I've always said ProTech and I aren't best friends or anything, but he certainly gets some things right. And these guys cheat in ever sense of it, from stream cheating as even other streamers like upatree have stated, to just hacking. It's hilariously stupid anyone would even give this guy the time of day. So, in short, i have no idea why rotti decided to interview this guy. i have no idea why it took so long for blizzard to do anything (prob cuz the latest hacks that have been around for a while now have just been undetected forever). and i have nothing but happiness that i was able to retweet the WCS post a few days ago and reply to that reddit post. srsly, F people who ruin other legit players experiences in events. | ||
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lechatnoir
392 Posts
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ProTech
United States510 Posts
On June 08 2019 11:22 Wombat_NI wrote: I think Rotti is wrong on that, perhaps he wasn’t aware prior to the interview, but otherwise he asked pretty decent questions. Think he’s definitely right on his closing thoughts, streamers throwing around hacking accusations far too loosely vs random players who have no real platform to reply or defend themselves is obnoxious. I dont disagree witb his closing statement eithet but no matter how you look at it has contradiction written all over it. I cant help but think that hes trying to get the community and blizzard a second chance to someone who just blew his second chance | ||
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argonautdice
Canada2722 Posts
https://tl.net/forum/starcraft-2/520630-2017-wcs-challenger-north-america-ruling "In the course of our investigation, we discovered that Vindicta was one of several players logging into accounts that had been actioned for hacking in the past, and also had known hackers logging onto accounts under his name. In light of this, Vindicta has received a ban from play through WCS Austin and WCS Jönköping Challengers and main event, and his position in the WCS Challenger North America Playoffs has been revoked." ????? so they somehow was able to determine Vindicta was account sharing with hackers under his own account(s) and he himself wasn't hacking? Vindicta is currently playing in WCS, so I wonder if Blizz will give Purelegacy a second chance if "recent" hacking meant before LotV. | ||
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naughtDE
158 Posts
If Blizz just believed hearsay of popular community figures and this is a witch hunt, then Rotti did well in warning us of what we are becoming. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20345 Posts
It's only a few pretty clear sentences. Should they write an essay about why they're permabanning hackers each time that they make a new account and hack again? Third chances, maybe, after consistently being one of the worst community members possible over a 5 year period? More information would be good but in this case i don't hold it against them at all. They've said all that was reasonably necessary. --- ????? so they somehow was able to determine Vindicta was account sharing with hackers under his own account(s) and he himself wasn't hacking? They have a disgusting amount of technical data which all players must agree to being harvested when they install and play the game; yes, they're technically capable of making that kind of judgement accurately. We have no reason to believe that they lied about it or were not thorough in their investigation.. nor do we have any reason to believe that any other investigation (e.g. PureLegacy's) was held to lower standards. I trust the SC2 team. They actually seem quite lenient on bans, allowing hackers and some real sociopaths abusing mechanics to ruin the game for dozens of people for years rather than banning somebody that doesn't 1000% deserve it, let alone permanently banning them twice. As you say, Vindicta wasn't permabanned for his shady activity. He was only removed from a couple of events and then life goes on. Blizzard does give people second chances and there are shades of grey between no action and permaban, it's just that PureLegacy ended up in permaban territory because of the extreme scale and duration of his rule breaking. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On June 08 2019 23:06 naughtDE wrote: Blizz just needs to clarify if he got swooped with the recent Ban wave because of his hacking 4 years ago or more recently, especially since he swore he hasn't during that time. And even if he got swooped because of what he did 4 years ago and he has to sit this one out, then so be it. If Blizz just believed hearsay of popular community figures and this is a witch hunt, then Rotti did well in warning us of what we are becoming. Maybe, Rotti’s position seemed to be informed by an understanding that a combination of 2015 hacking and other poor conduct made up the rationale for his ban. I and many others here interpret the wording of the statement and other things to mean he was banned for hacking a pretty short time ago, and possibly was part of the most recent ban wave for it. I don’t think Rotti had that information because he didn’t bring it up at all, I don’t think he takes the stance he did if he was privy to it. Nobody really, outside of historians, scientists dealing with long-term phenomena, people analysing cultural trends etc uses the word ‘recent’ to mean 4 years ago. What we have become, and have been for some time is way too tolerant of shitty behaviour because ‘the scene needs characters’ or ‘it’s entertaining’ other such justifications. People were defending Avilo on Reddit even after Twitch banned him and the police were involved. Why is the onus on people to just tolerate bullshit and not on people to just grow up and be functional adults? If the 2v2 guys in this thread, a scene I don’t know or care for particularly are saying that between cheating and other obnoxious behaviour he actually ruined the competitive end of the scene in NA, and multiple 1v1 players have said the same subsequently on the obnoxious behaviour end, and have said so for quite some time that’s really not a witch hunt that’s a consistent pattern of behaviour. None of his answers really pass muster against that IMO. If he’s in need of good practice, I don’t know maybe do the rather common practice partner thing? I just don’t think he’s being honest at all in the interview with Rotti. If we were even a quarter as tolerant of casters who aren’t Tastosis or other favourites that would be a marked improvement. | ||
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EnderSword
Canada669 Posts
It's very clear from Rotti's interview he still takes zero responsibility for what he did, he's still blaming others, he's still claiming he doesn't actually open his opponent's streams, that these players are all just lying and he's "just laddering" He's banned from all these chats and he 'can't remember' why. Nothing he said had any ring of truth whatsoever and all the blame is on other people, he's the victim, there's nothing he can do and the other people hate him for no good reason blah blah blah. I don't understand why people feel the need to give people like this '2nd chances' when they're not the least bit sorry. It's always these people who are complete assholes for years that then turn to the community and want goodwill or something when they finally get caught. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20345 Posts
It's always these people who are complete assholes for years that then turn to the community and want goodwill or something when they finally get caught. Caught 5 years ago, said he would reform, didn't reform, caught again. | ||
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TaKeTV
Germany1201 Posts
Personally I feel the 'flagged once - banned forever' is fine but I don't want people to have 2nd chances in a competetive world where they cheated. | ||
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EnderSword
Canada669 Posts
On June 09 2019 05:15 TaKeTV wrote: My only issue with the ban is that he was allowed to participate. I think this is a super good point, Blizzard seems to often take the stance of 'We'll decide once it matters' Then you've got these ineligible players knocking out other people and Blizzard just ignores it until someone qualifying forces them to make a decision. | ||
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