EPTI'm out until some sanity come back.
4.8.2 Patch - Balance changes & new ladder season - Page 3
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xongnox
540 Posts
I'm out until some sanity come back. | ||
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JackONeill
861 Posts
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insitelol
845 Posts
But could you please revert the chronoboost buff that was done at the start of LotV. Thanks! Also, since the intoduction of deployable observers and templar autoattack macro became too easy for protoss. Reverting this as well could solve PvT issues. | ||
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DieuCure
France3713 Posts
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insitelol
845 Posts
On January 23 2019 21:46 DieuCure wrote: The actual chronoboost isn't the same as the start of lotv, stop trying to troll when you don't know the changes . No idea what are you talking about. There is an agreement between top pros that Lotv broke TvP. That happened because of chronoboost buff (compared to Hots version). I'm trying to help you out asking blizzard to solve the problem, why do you call me a troll? | ||
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12134 Posts
On January 23 2019 21:53 insitelol wrote: No idea what are you talking about. There is an agreement between top pros that Lotv broke TvP. That happened because of chronoboost buff (compared to Hots version). I'm trying to help you out asking blizzard to solve the problem, why do you call me a troll? First of all 2016 Code S LotV - 1P 1T 2017 Code S - 1P 2T 2018 Code S - 3T Looks defintively broken beyond repair. But let's say Terrans are just better. BTW either we're at 0T titles or 4T titles this year  1) Can you provide any source of your "There is an agreement between top pros that Lotv broke TvP"? Anything? edit> Link to a TL post of Neeb would be awesome, but generally speaking any link to anything supporting your claim woudl be sufficient  2) Can you provide the numbers of how the chronoboost is changed and what values were before? Currently you're telling us you're not troll yet you won't support your arguments with the numbers. Provide the numbers, it's easy. Obviously people here don't remember the old Chronoboost so they need a reminder. Provide us this stuff so we can finally see how chronoboost needs the change! This isn't really that hard, but currently you're operating with very vague arguments which are fishy. | ||
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Doink
75 Posts
On January 23 2019 19:19 xongnox wrote: Happy PvPvZvZ (vMech?) everyone. I'm out until some sanity come back. I could live with a bit less games vs. terran. 50% of my games are vs. terran and my winrate is by far the worst against them. Still the strongest race after patch IMO. | ||
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Tyrhanius
France947 Posts
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DieuCure
France3713 Posts
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PinoKotsBeer
Netherlands1387 Posts
On January 24 2019 02:45 Tyrhanius wrote: The thor buff is too much. It will make mech invincible vs zerg. Think about it :thors outrange broodlords and vipers... While it auto-focus air units.... How is it possible to counters mass tanks +thors as zerg now ? Let the meta settle. The thor buff isnt too much, its only 1 range, the unit itself has still one of the derpiest ai, slow, and plenty of counters. If you struggle vs tank thor in your league, consider asking for help in the The LotV Zerg Help Me Thread https://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/499586-the-lotv-zerg-help-me-thread | ||
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Snakestyle11
191 Posts
On January 24 2019 04:14 PinoKotsBeer wrote: Let the meta settle. The thor buff isnt too much, its only 1 range, the unit itself has still one of the derpiest ai, slow, and plenty of counters. If you struggle vs tank thor in your league, consider asking for help in the The LotV Zerg Help Me Thread https://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/499586-the-lotv-zerg-help-me-thread Thats actually huge... 1 more range than broods and vipers...is a BIG BIG DEAL. Imagine an army of thors, ghosts, few tanks, some hellbats. If the tanks are well spread, and if you add upgraded turrets and planetaries in the mix, it is, on paper, literally unbreakable in the current state of things. We are gonna have to work those swarm hosts like crazy, because tier 3 zerg might not be viable against super late game mech terran currently. Will need to test things, but when broodlords lost 1 range and became equal to thors in range, it changed a LOT. Having 1 less range than thors might be too much. Have they even tested it in a unit tester? This patch is like...everything no1 ever asked for... Blink/wg buff, nydus buffs, thors +1 range buff against massive... What are they even thinking -.-. Maybe we should consider giving broodlords an escape mechanism similar to protoss recall or BC tactical jump? Because right now they are the slowest clunkiest most vulnerable massive air unit, while being the most vulnerable one with the biggest weakness ( only one that cant attack air and needs support even against ground). I feel like broodlords need an escape mechanism or small mobility buff to be less *all-in*. Theres no retreating currently with broodlords in most scenarios. They are also incredibly weak in base races, and cant really catch any unit in the game unless the other player lets it happen. In theory, you never have to fight against broodlords, you can always take your army run and fight somewhere else or base trade. | ||
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Deleuze
United Kingdom2102 Posts
Eggs will no longer block the optimal placement of a Hatchery after being destroyed. Huge! This is SUCH a pain in that arse! Thank you Blizz | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
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Rollora
2450 Posts
On January 23 2019 04:55 Creager wrote: Quite disappointed to see they just went through with every single change they proposed despite the criticism they got throughout different forums/social media. Wasnt it almost always like this and "wait and let the meta evolve"? | ||
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seemsgood
5527 Posts
it is not hard it's just too hard | ||
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Loccstana
United States833 Posts
On January 24 2019 06:30 Snakestyle11 wrote: Thats actually huge... 1 more range than broods and vipers...is a BIG BIG DEAL. Imagine an army of thors, ghosts, few tanks, some hellbats. If the tanks are well spread, and if you add upgraded turrets and planetaries in the mix, it is, on paper, literally unbreakable in the current state of things. We are gonna have to work those swarm hosts like crazy, because tier 3 zerg might not be viable against super late game mech terran currently. Will need to test things, but when broodlords lost 1 range and became equal to thors in range, it changed a LOT. Having 1 less range than thors might be too much. Have they even tested it in a unit tester? This patch is like...everything no1 ever asked for... Blink/wg buff, nydus buffs, thors +1 range buff against massive... What are they even thinking -.-. Maybe we should consider giving broodlords an escape mechanism similar to protoss recall or BC tactical jump? Because right now they are the slowest clunkiest most vulnerable massive air unit, while being the most vulnerable one with the biggest weakness ( only one that cant attack air and needs support even against ground). I feel like broodlords need an escape mechanism or small mobility buff to be less *all-in*. Theres no retreating currently with broodlords in most scenarios. They are also incredibly weak in base races, and cant really catch any unit in the game unless the other player lets it happen. In theory, you never have to fight against broodlords, you can always take your army run and fight somewhere else or base trade. You should stop treating broodlords as a "GG, I win the game" unit. They are not, and no unit should be like that. | ||
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StarscreamG1
Portugal1653 Posts
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egrimm
Poland1202 Posts
On January 24 2019 09:08 StarscreamG1 wrote: I actually like the patch. Am I crazy? No, You're just a Protoss player  Jokes aside I feel like both T and Z find some changes to hard to swallow that's where the whining comes from. I mean Zergs are terrified of BL and vipers being owned by Thor-based mech armies while Terrans are having PTSD flashbacks of blink-era. Me myself I'm not sure. These are not the changes I was asking for but I can see merit and reason behind them. Will see I guess. | ||
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RampancyTW
United States577 Posts
On January 24 2019 08:55 Loccstana wrote: You should stop treating broodlords as a "GG, I win the game" unit. They are not, and no unit should be like that. Brood Lords are the slowest end-game air unit, cost 300/250 total (more than Tempest, slightly less than Carriers), have the lowest health, ONLY ATTACK GROUND, have the lowest DPS out of all of them, and need to be present in large numbers (6+) to be effective. In exchange, they can be produced in bulk more readily and only cost 4 supply, which balances out the extra supply Z has tied up in Drones and Queens. They're not supposed to be an automatic "GG I win" unit but they're extremely vulnerable and cannot retreat or defend themselves if their support is eliminated. If they DON'T end the game, they cease to have much function outside of a 45-minute-plus turtle fest. They're simply too immobile and inflexible to be used outside of a hardcore turtle or a finishing blow. | ||
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batatm
Israel116 Posts
On January 24 2019 09:08 StarscreamG1 wrote: I actually like the patch. Am I crazy? i actually feel the same! and i really think ppl look on this changes the wrong way: the robotics and blink cost reduction, along with WG shorter time are to allow protoss NOT go for stargate openers, and still defend against pheonix and banshees. cloaked banshees is more popular than ever, across all match ups. oracle and pheonix allow protoss to easily defend against it, making oracle harass opening too flexible to pass. by reducing robotics facility cost and buffing observer speed, protoss can safely seek other tech path. so yah, protoss might switch to blink openers, but now a days terran has much more tools too deal with it. sure, they might harass a bit (instead of using oracles), but i don't think it would turn into game ending strategy. after the early game, the protoss now face price increase to immortals and slower tempest. terran has been complaining about mid-late protoss army and now it got nerfed, so give it a chance before bickering. the thor buff is a bit alarming, as it is now outranges both tempest and BL. it will also make it harder to use vipers, which are the primary tool for zerg vs mech in the late game. moreover, it can affect the air superiority battles in TvT, and even rander liberators obsolete. still, no matter the changes the thor has never been able to become a staple unit, so it's anyone's guess as to how significant this will turn out to be. as for the rest, it looks solid (imo). ultralisk speed was the only noticeable buff zerg got last patch, along with a sh1tpile of nerfs, and it turned out to be a lackluster upgrade, so it stands to reason to make it more reliable. it's still unclear how the nydus change would turn out, partly because they barely see any use, so hopefully this will push them forward without making them un-counterable (as they were pre-nerf). the cyclone and BC changes are in order to increase the time before they unlock their full power. i'm actually a bit surprised to see them treated so mildly, probably to still allow cyclones to be utilized vs blink. | ||
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