EPTA well known player (Life) match-fixes, perma ban.
I understand that they are different region, and different kind of players, but they did the same crime,in same game, should've same punishments imo.
7 Chinese Players Banned: Match-fixing & Smurfing - Page 3
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valas991
Hungary181 Posts
A well known player (Life) match-fixes, perma ban. I understand that they are different region, and different kind of players, but they did the same crime,in same game, should've same punishments imo. | ||
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CxWiLL
China830 Posts
On June 10 2017 15:41 valas991 wrote: So, upcoming chinese player match-fix, 1,5-2 year ban A well known player (Life) match-fixes, perma ban. I understand that they are different region, and different kind of players, but they did the same crime,in same game, should've same punishments imo. Unlike life, not that many money is involved. it is more like the old Byun/Coca story. | ||
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lechatnoir
386 Posts
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CynicalDeath
Italy3453 Posts
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Elentos
55555 Posts
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digmouse
China6330 Posts
On June 10 2017 15:55 CxWiLL wrote: Unlike life, not that many money is involved. it is more like the old Byun/Coca story. It's a tad more severe than that as tournament spots/WCS points and some money were involved. | ||
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EESCLuna
Spain53 Posts
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Elentos
55555 Posts
On June 10 2017 16:50 digmouse wrote: It's a tad more severe than that as tournament spots/WCS points and some money were involved. How are the reactions from Chinese fans? | ||
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Circumstance
United States11403 Posts
On June 10 2017 14:31 -Kyo- wrote: The difference between value of those two are not really equatable. The CH and KR scene are also quite different, and moreover, Life's position as a player is amplified by his previous placements. Personally, I've always thought, as it is in sports (generallllyy.. speaking) an appropriate punishment for what was done is fair enough. Once the players have served their time, if they show no repeat offense behavior, then give them that chance. It's quite tragic when hard stances are taken, as seen in the CS:GO scene where some of the best NA players were perm banned by valve, but have stated years later (while still being well respected in the community) they would donate all tournament earnings/do PR/PSAs/etc, just to have another chance to compete. That is their drive to play. The top players all respect them and this approach, but they are still shut out by valve. 2 years is a long, long time in esports. Just go check out the reddit thread on teams of the past to really put in perspective how much has changed in each iteration of SC2 in those time gaps. Just as a PS, if you really think hard stances should always be taken, then many players such as Major, and a few WCS EU players would also currently be perm banned for similar things, or smurfing in tournaments. People make mistakes, and in this case, it really sucks for these rising players but lets take a logical approach. To agree on some aspects: pathological/repeat offenders should always be quickly identified and never be given the next opportunity. The question of the appropriate punishment for misrepresentation is hairier, though I absolutely consider it necessary for said punishment ro be punitive, so as to disincentivize repeat attempts. However, when it comes to the named three, there must be no second chances. Fixed matches and tournament stream cheating are not to be taken lighrly, or even moderately. They entirely delegitimize what the viewer sees on their screen. Time for the next few players in the Chinese ranks to get their shot in WCS qualifiers, and for some other high-caliber players to make arrangements in the Korean House. Silky, Coffee, and Punk can find some other game, preferably by another company, if they want a second chance. Like Hosty and AZK did. | ||
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jy_9876543210
265 Posts
"That escalated quickly", I suppose?  | ||
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jy_9876543210
265 Posts
On June 10 2017 12:56 digmouse wrote: They smurfed on other's accounts to play in tournaments on their behalf. What this should be called in English? I still think "smurfing" doesn't sound right. Maybe "impersonation" is more appropriate? I think “代考” is called impersonation in exam, and this is something similar. Another word is substitute exam-taker. So, maybe something like "substitute game-player"?  | ||
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-Kyo-
Japan1926 Posts
On June 10 2017 17:05 Circumstance wrote: if they want a second chance. Like Hosty and AZK did. This part I don't really understand. If you are worried about the legitimization of one company in esports, shouldn't you be worried about the whole enterprise seeing as how they are all intertwined in a significant manner, especially in regards to the tournaments that are hosting events? In which case, it really wouldn't make sense to allow them to play a different game as the fundamental thing you are at odds with here is the fact that they have cheated in the first place. If you are worried about them undermining one game, what is to stop them from doing it in a different game? If you are not worried about them undermining the system, and admit that they'd probably learn from such an experience (i.e; they are not repeat offenders/genuinely vouch that they will not allow this sort of thing to happen again), why is it hard to allow them, just as in football or any other traditional sport (or esport for that matter) to be given another chance YEARS from now if the community still believes them to deserve a chance? What you've basically stated is they can get another chance, effective immediately, just not with this company. Unfortunately, this approach does not really deal with the terms of punishment they've already been given because you're essentially acting as if they are a completely different entity due to the fact that they've changed the game they're playing. This approach to me makes even less sense under the pretense that they do something like forward their tournament earnings to some charity and can only make income from some form of sponsorship. Regardless, I don't think we really need to worry to much about it now... because who knows where sc2 will be in 2 more years... it's a really, really long time given how long the game has already been out o: ah edit: I'll also add in terms of "punishment", it's quite well documented that harsher punishments don't generally serve as a deterrent to breaking rules. A key objective of the players in this case is probably at the fundamental issue of sc2 right now... which is that it is hard to make a real living outside of korea. If you can clearly see that even if you get a ban, and you make a few $KK more than you can make legitimately playing in tournaments during that time then these people are probably going to take the chance. You'll take it, the money you have received, and try to move on. Obviously, under the hope that they don't actually think they'll get caught. | ||
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Creager
Germany1910 Posts
On June 10 2017 12:58 digmouse wrote: Worse than that, they knowingly competed in tournaments on behalf of other players. I'd call that fraud  | ||
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Argonauta
Spain4954 Posts
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Poopi
France12904 Posts
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AlexGPunkt
Germany258 Posts
Still very bad for the chinese scene. | ||
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Raptorteam
12 Posts
On June 10 2017 13:42 SidianTheBard wrote: glad these dumb shits can't play again. Only banned for a year or two | ||
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Dav1oN
Ukraine3164 Posts
On June 10 2017 15:41 valas991 wrote: So, upcoming chinese player match-fix, 1,5-2 year ban A well known player (Life) match-fixes, perma ban. I understand that they are different region, and different kind of players, but they did the same crime,in same game, should've same punishments imo. why is that? rules and laws are different in different countries considering they've got own server to play - it should be decided locally and I doubt that's a big loss to global scene by any means, losing Life was way worse and still meaningless overall | ||
Mizenhauer
United States1892 Posts
ah edit: I'll also add in terms of "punishment", it's quite well documented that harsher punishments don't generally serve as a deterrent to breaking rules. A key objective of the players in this case is probably at the fundamental issue of sc2 right now... which is that it is hard to make a real living outside of korea. If you can clearly see that even if you get a ban, and you make a few $KK more than you can make legitimately playing in tournaments during that time then these people are probably going to take the chance. You'll take it, the money you have received, and try to move on. Obviously, under the hope that they don't actually think they'll get caught. It's pretty much impossible to make a real living in Korea without KeSPA teams paying 60k a year to top players. Right now, there are teams paying top top Korean Pros 500-1000 a month (it might be higher than 1000 and I hope it is, but it's documented that it's as low as 500), but that's not enough to make a "real living". Of course every little bit counts. That can't be ignored. I'm sure the players love the support and it's good for the scene to have teams, but it's not what it was before when players were being adequately (adequately might even be a generous way to describe it) compensated for skipping university to play a game. Side note: streaming in now way compares to the lost 60k a year. Watch streams of top Koreans and add up how much they make in donations. It's like trying to dam a river with a pebble. | ||
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DieuCure
France3713 Posts
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