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On July 14 2016 03:07 [PkF] Wire wrote:
wow I actually struggled like a noob to get master 3. It's strange since I've been easily master for seasons, so I should have been in m3 without question since master league is bigger. I admit I even expected to be master 2.
didn't master actually get smaller now? wasn't it like 7-8%?
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On July 14 2016 17:47 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2016 17:46 Alchemik wrote:On July 14 2016 03:07 [PkF] Wire wrote:
wow I actually struggled like a noob to get master 3. It's strange since I've been easily master for seasons, so I should have been in m3 without question since master league is bigger. I admit I even expected to be master 2. didn't master actually get smaller now? wasn't it like 7-8%? apparently it was 2% last season (according to http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/511586-comparison-of-league-distributions)
wasn't that only how Blizz wanted it to be, but the real distribution was different? uhh, I'm not sure anymore
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On July 14 2016 18:09 Alchemik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2016 17:47 [PkF] Wire wrote:On July 14 2016 17:46 Alchemik wrote:On July 14 2016 03:07 [PkF] Wire wrote:
wow I actually struggled like a noob to get master 3. It's strange since I've been easily master for seasons, so I should have been in m3 without question since master league is bigger. I admit I even expected to be master 2. didn't master actually get smaller now? wasn't it like 7-8%? apparently it was 2% last season (according to http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/511586-comparison-of-league-distributions) wasn't that only how Blizz wanted it to be, but the real distribution was different? uhh, I'm not sure anymore
I explored the thing a bit and apparently it was more around 6.5%. So yeah I guess I was just in the lower tiers and had to struggle to get master 3.
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So it is possible to be promoted under provisional MMR.
I had been on Silver 3 with a full bar for a while and got promoted to Silver 2, while still under provisional MMR. The promotion is not immediate upon reaching full bar.
But you don't get promoted to where you should be, which according to my non-provisional MMR is Gold 1.
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United States12257 Posts
Seems like it wants to be extra extra cautious when you have a provisional rating. That's good info, thanks. What was your provisional MMR when you finally did get promoted? What was the buffer?
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On July 15 2016 17:10 Excalibur_Z wrote:
Seems like it wants to be extra extra cautious when you have a provisional rating. That's good info, thanks. What was your provisional MMR when you finally did get promoted? What was the buffer?
Before promotion:
MMR: 3361
Provisional MMR: 2778
After promotion:
MMR: 3425
Provisional MMR: 2841
Silver Tier 2 to Tier 3 boundary: 2786
Note that passing the boundary with provisional MMR doesn't ensure promotion, as I've had a full bar 2 or 3 times before.
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My MMR stop being provisional after 24 games, then I got promoted to Gold 1.
Provisional MMR does not converge to true MMR. But it should.
The game before promotion I was Silver 2, with provisional MMR 2768 and true MMR 3352, a big gap. After the promotion game, my true MMR was 3396. In fact, from the start, my provisional MMR was 2705, and it never really changed much despite the gap.
Provisional MMR doesn't make much sense.
One would expect that the correct way to do provisional MMR is MMR-k*sigma, where k starts off at 2 and decreases to 0 over 25 games, allowing for promotion along the way depending on provisional MMR.
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United States12257 Posts
So before promotion the MMR gap between actual and provisional was 583, and after it was 584. There's probably some rounding there which means it actually stayed the same. On SEA, my actual-provisional gap was 513 (3740-3227). Maybe the gap stays at 2 standard deviations? It would make more sense to me if it gradually converged toward your actual MMR, but expressing confidence in stdev terms also seems reasonable (if a bit more jarring for the player).
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On July 14 2016 18:09 Alchemik wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2016 17:47 [PkF] Wire wrote:On July 14 2016 17:46 Alchemik wrote:On July 14 2016 03:07 [PkF] Wire wrote:
wow I actually struggled like a noob to get master 3. It's strange since I've been easily master for seasons, so I should have been in m3 without question since master league is bigger. I admit I even expected to be master 2. didn't master actually get smaller now? wasn't it like 7-8%? apparently it was 2% last season (according to http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/511586-comparison-of-league-distributions) wasn't that only how Blizz wanted it to be, but the real distribution was different? uhh, I'm not sure anymore
Rankedftw had it at 8%, since basically the release of LotV. If it's actually 4% currently like they said it should be, then it makes sense that it's harder now.
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One small rant I'd like to make is that I actually tried for the first time to get back into 1v1. But the truth as far as I can see is that the new system sucks.
Basically what happened is that I got stuck in gold 1 with 4k mmr. I had easily 60%+ win loss ratio vs my diamond opponents and after 20+ games of that I was still stuck in gold 1 with that mmr. It's super weird because appearantly gold 1 stops at 3200'ish but i was at 4k blank and no promotion to plat 3 at all.
I also don't like the fact that if i lose 1 single game then my promotion bar goes all the way down and I need like 5-6 wins in a row to get anything done.
Hopeless system :/
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United States12257 Posts
It says in the ? button popup that you have a provisional MMR, which can delay your promotions. The provisional state lasts for about 25 games. After that, your real MMR takes over.
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Yeah, Jan1997, it just would have taken playing a little more in your case I think. If you were winning even 50% versus Diamond, or even being placed against them, it's probably just needing some more games to "validate" statistically its sense of your ranking. So probably not that much different than before except actually showing numbers in this system.
Is it possible to get demoted to a lower tier within a league during a season? Like from Gold 1 to Gold 2?
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United States12257 Posts
On July 18 2016 02:44 LordYama wrote:
Yeah, Jan1997, it just would have taken playing a little more in your case I think. If you were winning even 50% versus Diamond, or even being placed against them, it's probably just needing some more games to "validate" statistically its sense of your ranking. So probably not that much different than before except actually showing numbers in this system.
Is it possible to get demoted to a lower tier within a league during a season? Like from Gold 1 to Gold 2?
No, demotions are still disabled.
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On July 18 2016 00:38 Jan1997 wrote:
Hopeless system :/
I don't think the system has changed from before. Only now you see what's going on behind the scenes.
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Update: I played some more games and got into Diamond 3. Yay! No more 4k mmr gold lol.
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fix Dasan Station mules land outside the gold. FIX IT NOW. I though Testbug was just a name.
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On July 18 2016 02:48 Excalibur_Z wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2016 02:44 LordYama wrote:
Yeah, Jan1997, it just would have taken playing a little more in your case I think. If you were winning even 50% versus Diamond, or even being placed against them, it's probably just needing some more games to "validate" statistically its sense of your ranking. So probably not that much different than before except actually showing numbers in this system.
Is it possible to get demoted to a lower tier within a league during a season? Like from Gold 1 to Gold 2? No, demotions are still disabled.
I wish they brought it back... Having MMR shown means nothing if you can't get demoted.
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United States12257 Posts
On July 18 2016 13:41 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2016 02:48 Excalibur_Z wrote:On July 18 2016 02:44 LordYama wrote:
Yeah, Jan1997, it just would have taken playing a little more in your case I think. If you were winning even 50% versus Diamond, or even being placed against them, it's probably just needing some more games to "validate" statistically its sense of your ranking. So probably not that much different than before except actually showing numbers in this system.
Is it possible to get demoted to a lower tier within a league during a season? Like from Gold 1 to Gold 2? No, demotions are still disabled. I wish they brought it back... Having MMR shown means nothing if you can't get demoted.
It's probably fine honestly. People will memorize the MMR min and max for their tier and you'll instantly recognize whether your opponent was a "real" same/next-leaguer or whether they're below the MMR floor. If it's the latter then they get demoted next season anyway.
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Czech Republic12134 Posts
On July 18 2016 03:34 pundurs wrote:I don't think the system has changed from before. Only now you see what's going on behind the scenes.
Which means that if you think you are playing players who you are supposed to not play and it is exactly like that you CAN report a BUG!
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EPT
