Becoming God - Page 5
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nimdil
Poland3747 Posts
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PhoenixVoid
Canada32737 Posts
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NDPH_Prodigy
Australia35 Posts
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Titusmaster6
United States5936 Posts
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Makro
France16890 Posts
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JonnySC2
Germany119 Posts
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Silvana
3713 Posts
On March 23 2016 10:42 Orr wrote: Watching the live stream of him finally winning that elusive individual title at IEM Toronto was so satisfying. But my favorite SC2 memory of him by far (staying up till an ungodly hour as I always do to watch PL GF) was crushing a heavily favored, and on fire Parting (w/ the greatest PvT of all-time) in the pivotal and ultra-hyped G2 of the 2014 Proleague Grand Finals. He truly channeled his BW form for that one game. Kicking the soccer ball far into the crowd in celebration, and later holding the trophy high aloft with his teammates behind paying respect to their great leader, while the legions in attendance chanted his name, and his mother and father were crying on camera. Watching that was absolutely magical. The feels!!! (And I'm not even a BW fan!) Hopefully Flash decides to return to KT as a coach. Hopefully we can witness another magical moment like this, and get another chapter from Waxangel on Flash's career ![]() | ||
FaCE_1
Canada6158 Posts
I whish SC2 would be delay 1 or 2 more years ![]() | ||
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19152 Posts
On March 24 2016 03:28 FaCE_1 wrote: nice read. I whish SC2 would be delay 1 or 2 more years ![]() As a resident BW enthusiast, I was actually extremely excited for SC2. I thought it came at the right time and had great potential in the earliest previews. Lots of crazy cool ideas at alpha level too. It just didn't capture the core of BW enough to make a player like Flash and what he excelled at possible in SC2. Both are great separately, I just wish the games had more in common then lore. Flash, imo, should have never left BW after seeing the massive difference in games. | ||
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TrueRedemption
United States313 Posts
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Ej_
47656 Posts
On March 24 2016 03:36 BisuDagger wrote: As a resident BW enthusiast, I was actually extremely excited for SC2. I thought it came at the right time and had great potential in the earliest previews. Lots of crazy cool ideas at alpha level too. It just didn't capture the core of BW enough to make a player like Flash and what he excelled at possible in SC2. Both are great separately, I just wish the games had more in common then lore. Flash, imo, should have never left BW after seeing the massive difference in games. the forced switch should have never happened either, but the moneys took over | ||
konadora
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Singapore66071 Posts
missing the good ol' days. | ||
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Poopi
France12758 Posts
On March 24 2016 03:36 BisuDagger wrote: As a resident BW enthusiast, I was actually extremely excited for SC2. I thought it came at the right time and had great potential in the earliest previews. Lots of crazy cool ideas at alpha level too. It just didn't capture the core of BW enough to make a player like Flash and what he excelled at possible in SC2. Both are great separately, I just wish the games had more in common then lore. Flash, imo, should have never left BW after seeing the massive difference in games. Wouldn't. have SC2.protoss fit him tho? | ||
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19152 Posts
That's a reasonable thought if you take how Classic changing to protoss impacted him. I think for someone who achieved a mastery of brood war though, that there were a ton of mechanical differences that worked against his habits. Bisu suffered this too. His micro control may be the best of any RTS player ever, but the faster battle pace of SC2 and micro capabilities in those battles worked against him. | ||
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stuchiu
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
On March 24 2016 04:49 BisuDagger wrote: That's a reasonable thought if you take how Classic changing to protoss impacted him. I think for someone who achieved a mastery of brood war though, that there were a ton of mechanical differences that worked against his habits. Bisu suffered this too. His micro control may be the best of any RTS player ever, but the faster battle pace of SC2 and micro capabilities in those battles worked against him. He chose the wrong race. He should have played Terran. Same thing with Flash, he should have played Protoss. Just my own observations based on the games I've seen from both BW and SC2 of them both. Though I haven't watched enough of Flash's old BW games and a strong enough sense of the meta to understand why he was so much more successful with his greedy style, but that certainly wouldn't work in SC2. That said, those race changes wouldn't have guaranteed success for either of them, especially Bisu who had no interest for the game or the scene. Flash's biggest weaknesses in SC2 wouldn't have been covered by playing Protoss. | ||
[F_]aths
Germany3947 Posts
It is JulyZerg. | ||
Zess
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
Flash's proleague performances with KT exposed some unreal boosted fraud animals | ||
TheAnarchy
Chile1105 Posts
Nada and savior are the true and only gods after them bw died. That time is coincident with the golden era of non koreans (draco, testie, mondi, assem, pj, etc). I believe that after those players retired a third level player like szisky became the best player in the world. | ||
Orr
United States168 Posts
On March 24 2016 04:53 stuchiu wrote: Just my own observations based on the games I've seen from both BW and SC2 of them both. Though I haven't watched enough of Flash's old BW games and a strong enough sense of the meta to understand why he was so much more successful with his greedy style, but that certainly wouldn't work in SC2. I watched Flash throughout his prime when he transcended to God tier. Yes, his micro was incredible, but I never thought that was what separated him from the other greats (like others here are saying). His 'star-sense' as it was frequently termed back then was what made him the GOAT. The meta during his reign was very mature, and since BW didn't have balance updates/patches, you were stuck with what you had (maps did their best to fix obvious unit design issues, but there were still clear flaws). As BW became increasingly figured out during the golden years where Flash, Jaedong, and the other greats pushed the basic game design (of something conceived in the late 90's) to the absolute max of human ability, there were relatively few viable strategies and the meta was understood almost down to a science at the highest level. Flash had incredible micro (notably in his constant mech ball control and positioning of tank lines) coupled w/ amazing nonstop macro. But neither was flawless. And wasn't good enough from pure mechanics alone to accomplish anywhere near what he did. He did perfect the fast two-base, into turtling till you secure a third, while getting quick double armory and researching dual vehicle weapon upgrades, and then moving out w/ the deadly mech ball that hits right when 2/2 upgrades come online (lots of tanks supported by vultures laying mine fields, w/ typically limited goliaths for anti-air). But the key to his immortality lay in possessing that singular extra sense, where he seemed to always know exactly what his opponent was doing (even before they did). It was almost as if he was an AI that was playing against itself. He somehow would know exactly where the hidden stacked lurkers on hold command would be, and at the last second right before having all his marines sliced up, would split and stim in while scanning. When many tried to cheese him or do crazy builds hoping for a cheap win, he would sniff it out like a bloodhound hot on the scent and send the scv scout to places on the map it would never otherwise go. Flash just had an eerie ability to see moves before they materialized. BW was a far more technically challenging game than SC2, but there were less variables. One of the greatest things about SC2 is the fundamental game design (skewed towards amateurs), w/ all the crazy unit options/strategies/maps that give anyone a fighting chance to beat someone far better in a single game or short series. BW at its core didn't offer that constant unpredictability, and Flash was able to construct a play-style and general build that all but eliminated the minute possibilities of losing early. As far as I could tell, Flash simply understood the game on a deeper, more intuitive level than anyone else. At the end of the day, Flash at his best, was better at Starcraft than I've ever seen anyone else at anything. Which is why a non-religious, non-believer like myself, will always consider him God. | ||
SlayerS_BunkiE
Canada1706 Posts
On March 24 2016 12:23 Orr wrote: I watched Flash throughout his prime when he transcended to God tier. Yes, his micro was incredible, but I never thought that was what separated him from the other greats (like others here are saying). His 'star-sense' as it was frequently termed back then was what made him the GOAT. The meta during his reign was very mature, and since BW didn't have balance updates/patches, you were stuck with what you had (maps did their best to fix obvious unit design issues, but there were still clear flaws). As BW became increasingly figured out during the golden years where Flash, Jaedong, and the other greats pushed the basic game design (of something conceived in the late 90's) to the absolute max of human ability, there were relatively few viable strategies and the meta was understood almost down to a science at the highest level. Flash had incredible micro (notably in his constant mech ball control and positioning of tank lines) coupled w/ amazing nonstop macro. But neither was flawless. And wasn't good enough from pure mechanics alone to accomplish anywhere near what he did. He did perfect the fast two-base, into turtling till you secure a third, while getting quick double armory and researching dual vehicle weapon upgrades, and then moving out w/ the deadly mech ball that hits right when 2/2 upgrades come online (lots of tanks supported by vultures laying mine fields, w/ typically limited goliaths for anti-air). But the key to his immortality lay in possessing that singular extra sense, where he seemed to always know exactly what his opponent was doing (even before they did). It was almost as if he was an AI that was playing against itself. He somehow would know exactly where the hidden stacked lurkers on hold command would be, and at the last second right before having all his marines sliced up, would split and stim in while scanning. When many tried to cheese him or do crazy builds hoping for a cheap win, he would sniff it out like a bloodhound hot on the scent and send the scv scout to places on the map it would never otherwise go. Flash just had an eerie ability to see moves before they materialized. BW was a far more technically challenging game than SC2, but there were less variables. One of the greatest things about SC2 is the fundamental game design (skewed towards amateurs), w/ all the crazy unit options/strategies/maps that give anyone a fighting chance to beat someone far better in a single game or short series. BW at its core didn't offer that constant unpredictability, and Flash was able to construct a play-style and general build that all but eliminated the minute possibilities of losing early. As far as I could tell, Flash simply understood the game on a deeper, more intuitive level than anyone else. At the end of the day, Flash at his best, was better at Starcraft than I've ever seen anyone else at anything. Which is why a non-religious, non-believer like myself, will always consider him God. Very true. Although Flash did have eerily fantastic macro and micro despite his relatively low apm, his star sense really was in certain ways supernatural. Flash was probably the player most jokingly accused of cheating in-game because of how many times he would scout proxies or just flat out guess what his opponent was going for even without seeing anything. I remember this TvZ game, I think this was the ace match of a PL game, where flash didnt build a turret (cant remember whether he even made an eng bay) but opted for a bunker in his natural even though from his perspective, there was absolutely no indication that his opponent went 2hatch lurks instead of mutas. Someone commented after that if he did that in an iccup game, he wouldve gotten himself banned for hacking. | ||
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