• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:18
CEST 15:18
KST 22:18
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202542Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up5LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments3[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder10EWC 2025 - Replay Pack4Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced58
StarCraft 2
General
Clem Interview: "PvT is a bit insane right now" Serral wins EWC 2025 TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy Would you prefer the game to be balanced around top-tier pro level or average pro level? Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up
Tourneys
WardiTV Mondays $5,000 WardiTV Summer Championship 2025 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars
Brood War
General
Which top zerg/toss will fail in qualifiers? BW General Discussion Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced How do the new Battle.net ranks translate? Nobody gona talk about this year crazy qualifiers?
Tourneys
[ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 1
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition Does 1 second matter in StarCraft?
Other Games
General Games
Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Bitcoin discussion thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread 9/11 Anniversary
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
The Link Between Fitness and…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 633 users

Becoming God - Page 7

Forum Index > SC2 General
159 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 5 6 7 8 Next All
Gwavajuice
Profile Joined June 2014
France1810 Posts
April 08 2016 14:56 GMT
#121
On March 24 2016 21:58 Cele wrote:
nice article, wrong section as always

How flash became a top player has zero relevance to Starcraft 2.


no it's perfect, we the sc2 players are the one that need info on this.

For instance I kinda new all this, but I didn't quite realize how recent it was,to me Flash reign was old memories, instead it actually occured when sc2 beta was about to start...

Will best sc2 player come in 2025?
Dear INno and all the former STX boys.
lxginverse
Profile Joined May 2008
Monaco1506 Posts
April 11 2016 07:28 GMT
#122
how i missed the old broodwar times, nice article
fromis_9 enjoyer
jake1138
Profile Joined September 2011
United States82 Posts
April 11 2016 14:28 GMT
#123
Great article. I never watched much BW so it was nice to have a quick read of how Flash rose to fame.
KatjaKean
Profile Joined August 2015
Hungary59 Posts
April 11 2016 16:25 GMT
#124
Great piece of writing, thank you!

As a Jaedong fan, it was difficult for me to see Flash steamroll over him, but I have to give God plenty of credit.
Quidquid Latine dictum sit altum videtur - Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound
Hyperbola
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States2538 Posts
April 15 2016 11:28 GMT
#125
Great article dude. Shame to see the starcraft scene dry up so much from its glory days. I wonder what flash is doing now...
####
SlayerS_BunkiE
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Canada1707 Posts
April 16 2016 13:38 GMT
#126
On April 08 2016 08:27 Lebesgue wrote:
Anybody remembers the Winner's League? Flash would come up at freaking all-kill top teams, one after the other. And the ease with which he was doing it against top pros was unbelievable. It seriously seemed as if he solved the game at that time.

I remember connecting the pc to my tv for the KT vs MBC winners league final. MBC was up 3-1 and everyone knew that the real games were only just about to begin. And KT was very well still the favorite, coz Flash hasnt played yet. I still remember the PR writeup: MBC had three chances to try and take down Flash, and they threw everything they had at him. Sea, DT cheese, Carrier cheese. It all failed. Flash was absolutely indestructible.
iloveby.SlayerS_BunkiE[Shield]
rotta
Profile Joined December 2011
5588 Posts
April 16 2016 16:00 GMT
#127
On April 15 2016 20:28 Hyperbola wrote:
I wonder what flash is doing now...

Still at it:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/504027-flash-stream-thread
don't wall off against random
deafhobbit
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States828 Posts
April 19 2016 01:23 GMT
#128
Started watching BW right around when Flash's run started. He basically defined the game for me.

Fuck me, I miss this game.
I cheer for underdogs and Flash
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2013 Posts
April 21 2016 20:41 GMT
#129
Man how mad I was when they shut down OSL, MSL...

But on the brightside it left a aura of myth and wonder around BW proscene.
We can only fantasize what would have happened.
It's like when Firefly was shut down and became a legendary sci-fi show.
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
Gryffindor_us
Profile Blog Joined November 2002
United States5606 Posts
May 06 2016 23:47 GMT
#130
Call me a homer or old but NaDa will always remain the greatest for me. It was a great article and very convincing which is the highest praise I can give you as someone with the staunchest of allegiances. I will never forget the grand slam of him winning OSL, KPGA( what became MSL) and GhemTV SL, or going 15-1 in KT-KTF to cruise through Boxer to a win.

I miss those days.
Remember 11-12-04. 이윤열 ~. |||| ZerO, IriS, JangBi, Stork, BackHo! Mah Jae Yoon is no longer a feared entity.
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
May 07 2016 00:03 GMT
#131
Guys like NaDa and Julyzerg are timeless man because time and time again they would rise up when people thought they were done especially in the BW days.

Good thing is they're still at it
Daniel C
Profile Joined October 2010
Hong Kong1606 Posts
May 07 2016 18:50 GMT
#132
fANTASTIC!!
In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.
Node
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States2159 Posts
May 09 2016 18:54 GMT
#133
I'd like to point out that during his 2010 run Flash gave us what I consider to be the greatest TvT series of all time against Fantasy, who actually managed to give God a run for his money. If you still think it's a boring matchup, check out this nail-biter.

whole lies with a half smile
Letmelose
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Korea (South)3227 Posts
May 11 2016 08:40 GMT
#134
Yet, even the reigning greatest-of-all-time couldn’t help but seem lacking compared to the young Terran. Flash had been more dominant at his peak, winning more games at a better rate. Flash had won multiple Proleague MVP awards and had dragged his team to a championship; NaDa had no such accolades. Flash had triumphed over the second best player of his era to attain greatness; NaDa had been challenged, but not to that extent. In spite of NaDa’s immense stature, the facts suggested that he who shined brightest had eclipsed he who shined longest.

I think this paragraph in particular rubs off the wrong way. It's simply flawed logic.

1) Flash had been more dominant at his peak, winning more games at a better rate.

The best season that Flash had saw him reach levels that no player had ever reached before, but are we simply going by the number of championships and pretend that Flash had accumulated a career that is similar to NaDa's, and have him win by default due to his peak being more memorable?

Even if we go by what happened purely in OGN StarLeagues and MSL, it is painfully clear that NaDa outstrips Flash in every single measurement possible except for the number of titles. That's right. More finals reached. More round of four appearances. Same goes for every single bracket stage possible, made more impressive by the fact that it was harder to sustain that level of excellence in the past due to the relative shortage of seeds in NaDa's era. Hell, there were MSL tournaments you were punished for dropping out of the round of 16 by not being able to enter the following MSL. Flash played in an era where you started off the round of 32, and were seeded automatically into the next MSL if you got to the round of 8.

Now it is true that NaDa did it over a much longer time frame, and it is entirely possible that Flash would have gone on to achieve more before being rendered to a mere shadow of his former self like NaDa during his latter years. However, I believe that we should be dealing with tangibles here when we're discussing such lofty titles like the greatest player of all time. Otherwise we can make believe ourselves into just about anything.

It's simply not fair to disregard all the accomplishments that NaDa had over Flash.

2) Flash had won multiple Proleague MVP awards and had dragged his team to a championship; NaDa had no such accolades.

Really? Are we going to judge everyone by modern standards? That's like me saying NaDa had won over a dozen individual tournaments outside of his six majors, compared to the measly five that Flash managed over his entire career. Flash played in an era where ProLeague performances greatly determined how you were judged as a player. NaDa played in an era where the ProLeague MVPs were claimed by the likes of Zerglee and SiLvEr. Hardly the stellar trophy everybody longed for like the modern era.

In comparison, NaDa's greatest year in 2002 saw zero ProLeague or Team League format available, and the subsequent years had him split time between one versus one games, and two versus two games. Even so, his record in these leagues are not that shabby. He was the third most successful player in terms of individual wins in the Team League, only behind XellOs and JJu, and ahead of the likes of iloveoov and ChoJJa. He had the most number of one versus one wins in the ProLeague ahead of any other player until Jaedong displaced him in an era where you could get like 50 wins in a season due to the massive inflation in the number of matches available. I haven't even begun to mention the fact that NaDa boasted a two versus two win rate of over 80%, and hard carried his team with his one versus one and two versus two prowess, and this article is horribly reducing his past performance to basically nothing, when by the same harsh standards NaDa's contemporaries (such as BoxeR, and YellOw) would pale even further in comparison to the impressive accomplishments that the modern ProLeague setting allows.

3) Flash had triumphed over the second best player of his era to attain greatness; NaDa had been challenged, but not to that extent.

No. Flash played in the era of Taek-Beng-LeeSsang. NaDa brought an end to what was then thought to be the greatest domination the world had ever seen (BoxeR's era), and battled hard to challenge, and sometimes overcome the likes of Nal_rA, iloveoov, July, and sAviOr. This article tries to make it out as if one single rival is an accurate portrayal of a player's overall worth. It simply is not so. Flash may have lost out on titles due to the resistance that his contemporaries were able to put up, but it's the same for NaDa. In fact, I don't think it should be a slight to NaDa that he managed to accomplish so much battling against great players who were from entirely different eras. I actually find it even more impressive.
TL+ Member
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
May 13 2016 10:58 GMT
#135
Huh, I missed this when it was published.

I remember coming to TL as a wide-eyed little Terran player in late 07 / early 08, and seeing all the "Flash vs Mind" debates of the time. I don't remember why I decided I liked Flash more... maybe just because he was younger?

Being a Flash fan in late 2008 - mid 2009 was pretty painful. It was obvious that he was a "top player," but he lost his individual league magic (thanks 14CC?) and kept losing to the likes of Kwanro. I can imagine that a year later, Bisu fans must've felt the same thing, but by then, Flash was God and I didn't care about the likes of Bisu

2011-12 Flash was back to disappointing, at least compared to the absurd standard he'd maintained before. Versus other top players, he began looking a little mortal again. As a Flash fan, I'm sad to say that I doubt he would've returned to his previous heights had SC2 not come along; maybe he would've returned to #1, but staying God for so long, especially with his hand problems, seemed unlikely.

Thanks for the article, Wax
Writer
fezvez
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
France3021 Posts
May 16 2016 16:03 GMT
#136
Great article, thanks
BrixieTrix
Profile Joined May 2014
Australia1 Post
May 31 2016 12:31 GMT
#137
Good Read :D
Psyonic_Reaver
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States4336 Posts
June 02 2016 05:30 GMT
#138
Great write up. 07 to 10 truely was some of the greatest games of Brood War. Glad I was there to see it.
So wait? I'm bad? =(
dbssaber
Profile Joined September 2013
United States193 Posts
June 15 2016 08:04 GMT
#139
Great writeup. Brings me back to the days of staying up way too late to watch proleague
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) STYLE START SBENU ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Vansetsu
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States1454 Posts
July 14 2016 07:28 GMT
#140
Thanks for the great read!
Only by overcoming many obstacles does a river become - デイヴィ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ド
Prev 1 5 6 7 8 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Summer Champion…
11:00
Open Qualifier #1
WardiTV873
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Harstem 390
Lowko231
ProTech50
Codebar 11
Vindicta 6
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 6053
Bisu 2241
Shuttle 2113
Flash 1267
EffOrt 914
Larva 554
Killer 479
hero 470
ggaemo 421
Mini 380
[ Show more ]
Zeus 307
Soulkey 273
Hyuk 205
Mong 197
Pusan 196
ZerO 170
Soma 160
Dewaltoss 92
Sea.KH 81
Rush 70
TY 66
ToSsGirL 64
Movie 48
PianO 45
sSak 40
Sharp 39
sorry 29
JYJ27
[sc1f]eonzerg 25
scan(afreeca) 15
JulyZerg 13
SilentControl 13
IntoTheRainbow 7
Bale 5
Terrorterran 4
Dota 2
Gorgc3379
qojqva3258
XaKoH 519
XcaliburYe243
Counter-Strike
x6flipin543
byalli271
markeloff56
edward35
Other Games
singsing2316
B2W.Neo1513
hiko698
Beastyqt656
DeMusliM395
crisheroes351
Happy269
RotterdaM198
Fuzer 184
oskar108
rGuardiaN100
ArmadaUGS64
QueenE32
PartinGtheBigBoy31
ZerO(Twitch)6
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 16
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 43
• davetesta16
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1346
• WagamamaTV563
League of Legends
• Nemesis3959
• HappyZerGling187
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Summer Champion…
1h 42m
PiGosaur Monday
10h 42m
WardiTV Summer Champion…
21h 42m
Stormgate Nexus
1d
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 2h
The PondCast
1d 20h
WardiTV Summer Champion…
1d 21h
Replay Cast
2 days
LiuLi Cup
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
CSO Cup
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
RotterdaM Event
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
HCC Europe
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
Thunderpick World Champ.
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.