EPTThe information he provided recently is actually more substantial than what we used to de-feature him in the first place. But the problem with dealing with organizations and personalities and private information is that the information isn't ours to freely disseminate. It's disheartening when "no further comment" or "we choose to keep the information private" but that's beyond our control.
Revised Featured Stream Requirements for 2015 - Page 29
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
The information he provided recently is actually more substantial than what we used to de-feature him in the first place. But the problem with dealing with organizations and personalities and private information is that the information isn't ours to freely disseminate. It's disheartening when "no further comment" or "we choose to keep the information private" but that's beyond our control. | ||
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Jagermaister
Canada5 Posts
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ThorPool
Panama145 Posts
GL HF | ||
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Quateras
Germany867 Posts
On October 02 2015 23:25 Jagermaister wrote: All this has really shown me is if you cheat and lie to the system for a long enough period of time, the system finally stops caring. This, and its a sad thing its happening here too :S | ||
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TRaFFiC
Canada1448 Posts
Regarding Winter, it just doesn't make any sense that he has 2-6 times more viewers every time than the highest other streamer. Where is he pulling his viewers from? His ass? Cheaters rarely learn the 1st time. I'm sure he'll be busted again. | ||
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ProTech
United States498 Posts
On October 03 2015 00:49 TRaFFiC wrote: Someone explain to me how Protech is an asshole. I've been watching him on and off for years, but much more the last 2 months as I've really gotten into 2v2 and he's the only 2v2 streamer. On stream he seems like a nice enough guy. I don't care if he kills kittens in his free time. Regarding Winter, it just doesn't make any sense that he has 2-6 times more viewers every time than the highest other streamer. Where is he pulling his viewers from? His ass? Cheaters rarely learn the 1st time. I'm sure he'll be busted again. Because people make up fairy tales and lies ( which I have discredited on every instance ) and for whatever reason teamliquid believes them. After seeing all this negativity about winter, and him getting re featured, I want to re-apply for a featured spot. | ||
NonY
8751 Posts
On October 02 2015 18:31 lichter wrote: However, it's also the most logical situation for Winter to no longer bot himself because he was already caught and because his legitimate numbers (extrapolated from the data provided) are already high enough to be featured and to be #1 for SC2 on twitch. It's actually illogical for him to keep up botting because it harms his reputation and keeps people suspicious. In the beginning, the negatives of botting were the cost and the possibility of getting caught and banned or ostracized. He got "caught" and weathered the storm, avoiding any proof of guilt, and the chance of being banned or ostracized at this point is really low. So the value of botting has improved. And he's making a lot more money now from subs and donations, so the cost of botting is relatively less for him. But as you say, he has enough legit viewers to be #1 on SC2 on Twitch, so the potential benefit isn't as great. However that's only one threshold that he's crossed. There was a time when SC2 streamers got 5k+ viewers all the time. And twitch personalities, who stream any game, can regularly get 20k+. People do go to http://www.twitch.tv/directory/all and http://www.twitch.tv/directory/following so he may be trying to compete there. Who knows what he hopes to accomplish. I don't think it's clearly logical for him to stop if it's him doing it. In fact, the longer it goes on, the more insane it is that someone else is doing it. Their plan isn't working, whatever it is. | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
On October 02 2015 21:57 CaLiguLaa wrote: For SC2? Hardly. Most of the biggest SC2 streamers are EU and stream at EU friendly times. im very curious about this guy who made an account today, has only posted in this thread and is terribly concerned about what tl.net does with its own website. lol. i could care less about winter, but this is just too funny. | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
On October 03 2015 00:49 TRaFFiC wrote: Someone explain to me how Protech is an asshole. I've been watching him on and off for years, but much more the last 2 months as I've really gotten into 2v2 and he's the only 2v2 streamer. On stream he seems like a nice enough guy. I don't care if he kills kittens in his free time. Regarding Winter, it just doesn't make any sense that he has 2-6 times more viewers every time than the highest other streamer. Where is he pulling his viewers from? His ass? Cheaters rarely learn the 1st time. I'm sure he'll be busted again. when i used to play him in 2v2s (albeit back in WoL days), he loved to talk shit when he won with his rush strategies. this wasnt isolated occurrences, it was every time and i was constantly being matched against him and his cronies (who have since abandoned him). i have been talked shit by numerous people over the last 17 years, but protech is the only person i remember. when he got more popular, i would watch his stream to see him rage, and he doesnt talk shit as much anymore, but i assume there is a reason why nobody will play with him. also, he calls everyone a hacker whenever he loses like a child, but that only affects people on his stream, not the other players. | ||
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-Kyo-
Japan1927 Posts
On October 03 2015 05:23 dAPhREAk wrote: when i used to play him in 2v2s (albeit back in WoL days), he loved to talk shit when he won with his rush strategies. this wasnt isolated occurrences, it was every time and i was constantly being matched against him and his cronies (who have since abandoned him). i have been talked shit by numerous people over the last 17 years, but protech is the only person i remember. when he got more popular, i would watch his stream to see him rage, and he doesnt talk shit as much anymore, but i assume there is a reason why nobody will play with him. also, he calls everyone a hacker whenever he loses like a child, but that only affects people on his stream, not the other players. i'm pretty sure he called me a hacker and shit talked me the last time i played him lmao. dude is just crazy, i honestly have no idea how he manages those stream numbers especially considering he is only like mid-masters and hasn't even played in a 2v2 tournament in like... well... since 2011? There are so many better 2v2 players, especially some of the EU players who get way lower numbers. ;( also; u should care if people kill kittens in their free time haha | ||
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TelecoM
United States10872 Posts
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Hotshot
Canada184 Posts
People often also say his chat is dead, but sometimes ill compare it to another chat (like pili or huk) with 200 peeps and winter with 2000, and winter seems to have 5-10x more activity. Then winter also has giveaways, which also attracts more people to his channel and keeps them there longer. Winter also has a loopy system, so there are people (like me sometimes) who idle just to collect loopys even if im not really focusing on watching his stream too much (or sometimes even stay on after he logs off and/or host someone else). Loopys are also used for betting, which can also make watching games a bit more interesting... And sometimes (been a long time now) he even does a giveaway with loopys to buy tickets. Then of course he gets donations/subs. And on a side note, I find it funny how current highest viewer is ESL_SC2 which is a rerun of WCS Premier League Season 1 2015... There are 1250 people watching a +6 month old tournament when they can watch it on youtube where they can pause/skip anytime they want. The chat is probably also less active then winters chat.... edit: So in conclusion, I have no clue if there are view bots, but I'm sure there are lots of people watching. | ||
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ProTech
United States498 Posts
On October 03 2015 06:47 -Kyo- wrote: i'm pretty sure he called me a hacker and shit talked me the last time i played him lmao. dude is just crazy, i honestly have no idea how he manages those stream numbers especially considering he is only like mid-masters and hasn't even played in a 2v2 tournament in like... well... since 2011? There are so many better 2v2 players, especially some of the EU players who get way lower numbers. ;( also; u should care if people kill kittens in their free time haha Fairy tales and lies. @daphreak wanting to keep the game clean isn't a sin, in fact it isn't promoted enough. 5 years ago is a long time for someone to mature and that's exactly what i've done. regardless though. There's a very big misconception that goes around about hack accusations, we wan't the game clean. You have 1 video on youtube " proving " that I was wrong about a hacker one time, outside of that you have nothing. Over the 5 years I've caught and gotten people like sorcery, stellarmango, purelegacy, loadblaster and many many more banned because of ME. That's an accomplishment, and why people think hack accusations are a bad thing is ludicrous, if some of us don't speak up then 100% of people get away with it. I have invested over 30,000 hours of starcraft since vanilla sc1 so i'd say im pretty good at catching ANY sort of cheating. | ||
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/user-streams/202566-stream-protech?page=33#657 also, when you were last unfeatured, i remember you talking about how it was better for you money wise to not be featured. what happened there? | ||
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RHoudini
Belgium3631 Posts
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ProTech
United States498 Posts
On October 03 2015 10:46 dAPhREAk wrote: i havent seen you be the ass you were when we played in WoL, but i am not sure you have matured as your own stream thread shows. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/user-streams/202566-stream-protech?page=33#657 also, when you were last unfeatured, i remember you talking about how it was better for you money wise to not be featured. what happened there? well facts are facts, having gotten de featured i've made a lot more money. but what's happening here with winter/destiny/avilo doesn't make a bit of sense. you can't even begin to make the argument that the " general asshoerly " factor is lower on avilo and destinys channel. furthermore, things have changed quite a bit on my channel, and as per what teamliquid is looking for my channel is right up their ally, creating youtube content for people, and offering a high level educational channel, not to mention having the numbers required in both active paying subscribers and concurrent viewer count. i can't begin to understand why or how i'm getting swept under the rug like this, but I think it's only fair that liquid reviews my page again and puts it up on their featured stream list. and let's not forget dude, most of the flame that comes out of my channel is instigated by trolls ( which i've learned to completely ignore took awhile, but i did ) | ||
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ProTech
United States498 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17925 Posts
On October 03 2015 00:48 Quateras wrote: This, and its a sad thing its happening here too :S when you tell a lie... keep it simple.. and keep repeating it.. eventually they'll believe you. i think the guy is viewbotting but i'm too lazy to research it and back up my speculation.. and of course he is heavily invested in proving his innocence. people should not hate on TL.Net management though. IF TL.net is being duped it is by a very well organized and disciplined fraud artist. An extremely well organized and disciplined fraud artist can achieve and maintain long term success. I was that guy for 7 years. For 7 years i committed a series of well executed, well thought out fraud schemes ... i never got caught and i made a tonne of cash. No matter what side of the "Winter is viewbotting" debate you are on everyone must acknowledge that Winter works very hard at controlling his public image and marketing his channel. Discipline, hard work and well thought out marketing strategies always improve your rate of success whether or not you are a fraud. | ||
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KT_Elwood
Germany1200 Posts
That his viewercount was boosted by ViewBots was proven (The thousands of accounts watching all followed the 2 same shady "streamers" that had not produced any content) . Now he has the same relatively high Viewercounts for SC2 as before. Isn't amazon/Twitch caring that all their Ad possibly get played to fake viewers? | ||
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ProTech
United States498 Posts
On October 05 2015 15:14 KT_Elwood wrote: Winter came back from the underground, having 6x More viewers than next SC2 featured Streamer. That his viewercount was boosted by ViewBots was proven (The thousands of accounts watching all followed the 2 same shady "streamers" that had not produced any content) . Now he has the same relatively high Viewercounts for SC2 as before. Isn't amazon/Twitch caring that all their Ad possibly get played to fake viewers? A padded viewer count brings more viewers than a non-padded viewer count. Why on gods green earth would they care if individuals using their service are boosting their numbers? | ||
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