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On December 21 2013 06:32 Destructicon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 05:39 Plansix wrote:On December 21 2013 05:35 Squat wrote:On December 21 2013 05:28 Plansix wrote:On December 21 2013 05:21 govie wrote:On December 21 2013 05:08 Plansix wrote:On December 21 2013 05:00 Zealously wrote:On December 21 2013 04:58 Happygreek wrote:On December 21 2013 04:52 Survivor61316 wrote:On December 20 2013 23:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
[quote]
That rule is never going to be used and in case it is used it will be amazing and absolutely reward skill. Being able to play multiple races in a single series nothing to look down upon or to obstruct with a ruleset. I'm pretty sure what they mean by the wording of that rule is that you must play as one race for an entire series, but can then switch races for your next series (match). Generally, a match refers to the overall BoX, whereas a game refers to each map played. I interpret match as a single game and a set as in a best of three is a set of matches. Basically the way it's used in tennis. Definitely should be clarified if there's this much confusion. I'm pretty sure "match" is interpreted as whatever amount of maps (sets) that make up a BoX. For example, a player may have a 65% win rate but a 72% match win rate, meaning that he wins 65% of the maps he plays but 72% of the matches (Best of X-series) that said player participates in. To clear up the subject, a match is a BO3. Is random a race? Yep, awaiting the chosen one to come and take Blizzcon with random. He'll stand up the booth, hold his hand up, palm out, and all the bullets from the stimmed bio will clatter to the ground, the forcefields will evaporate and the mutas will crash to the ground. Then Dustin Browder will charge up on stage and start raining blows on him at supersonic speed, only for the chosen one to easily deflect them using only a single hand. See threads are way more fun when we focus on making stupid comments and saying dumb thing. Rather than bitch about rules we don't like. Priorities people! We are taking about competitive vigya games here! So, is Major the oracle and what will Browder start seeing after he copies himself on to him?
If Dustin Browder copies himself to Major I'm pretty sure the result would be Desrow.
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On December 21 2013 06:32 Destructicon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 05:39 Plansix wrote:On December 21 2013 05:35 Squat wrote:On December 21 2013 05:28 Plansix wrote:On December 21 2013 05:21 govie wrote:On December 21 2013 05:08 Plansix wrote:On December 21 2013 05:00 Zealously wrote:On December 21 2013 04:58 Happygreek wrote:On December 21 2013 04:52 Survivor61316 wrote:On December 20 2013 23:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
[quote]
That rule is never going to be used and in case it is used it will be amazing and absolutely reward skill. Being able to play multiple races in a single series nothing to look down upon or to obstruct with a ruleset. I'm pretty sure what they mean by the wording of that rule is that you must play as one race for an entire series, but can then switch races for your next series (match). Generally, a match refers to the overall BoX, whereas a game refers to each map played. I interpret match as a single game and a set as in a best of three is a set of matches. Basically the way it's used in tennis. Definitely should be clarified if there's this much confusion. I'm pretty sure "match" is interpreted as whatever amount of maps (sets) that make up a BoX. For example, a player may have a 65% win rate but a 72% match win rate, meaning that he wins 65% of the maps he plays but 72% of the matches (Best of X-series) that said player participates in. https://twitter.com/askjoshy/status/414101648768659456To clear up the subject, a match is a BO3. Is random a race? Yep, awaiting the chosen one to come and take Blizzcon with random. He'll stand up the booth, hold his hand up, palm out, and all the bullets from the stimmed bio will clatter to the ground, the forcefields will evaporate and the mutas will crash to the ground. Then Dustin Browder will charge up on stage and start raining blows on him at supersonic speed, only for the chosen one to easily deflect them using only a single hand. See threads are way more fun when we focus on making stupid comments and saying dumb thing. Rather than bitch about rules we don't like. Priorities people! We are taking about competitive vigya games here! So, is Major the oracle and what will Browder start seeing after he copies himself on to him?
He is the hybrid that the choosen one most battle after mastering all three races. Then he seals Browder in a tree and closes off the spirit world forever.... Or something like that.
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On December 21 2013 04:08 TRaFFiC wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 04:03 Spektor wrote:On December 21 2013 04:01 TRaFFiC wrote:
The no chat thing seems totally out of the blue. When has chat ever been a problem? That's what everyone wants to see. Chat! But seeing as blizz is clueless on making battlenet more social.... Because during a WCS game I care about social and not the playing. When Nerchio loses to Protoss, I want to see his true rage. I want to see him write a paragraph about how the guy should be ashamed to use the imba race. Not just gg. Whether you agree with it or not, this is what gives huge viewer numbers. People love passionate players, not robots.
And people are so in love with Nerchio, he has 30 paged fanclub after being ~top5 foreigner for over 3 years 
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On December 21 2013 05:19 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 05:16 Dazed_Spy wrote:On December 21 2013 05:15 Squat wrote:On December 21 2013 05:07 Dazed_Spy wrote:
Ridiculous rules, as usual when a centralized organization attempts to tell others what is appropriate and what isnt. I'm pretty sure that if you fund, organize and promote an event, you have a fairly strong case for making the rules for said event. Where did I say they had no legitimacy in creating their own rules? Oh right, I didnt. I said the rules were ridiculous, as one ought to expect. *Thats* what I said. No, you said: Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 05:07 Dazed_Spy wrote:
Ridiculous rules, as usual when a centralized organization attempts to tell others what is appropriate and what isnt. A centralized organization (Blizzard in this case) isn't "attempting to tell others what is appropriate and what isn't", they're explaining to us how they're going to run their tournaments (played in their game) and how the people participating, in one way or another, in their tournaments, competing for their money or being paid with their money, are expected to behave. There is nothing about what is appropriate and what isn't in the document, they're only explaining, quite clearly, what they won't accept. I realise that you may consider this a fine line, but still. As for the rules themselves, you didn't actually explain what parts are ridiculous or why. "attempting to tell others what is appropriate and what isn't", they're explaining to us how they're going to run their tournaments" Distinction without a difference.
As for the rules themselves, you didn't actually explain what parts are ridiculous or why." The inability to criticize the organization freely, the inability to chat during the game, the inability to insult others without heavy fines, the inability of the casters to talk about the personality or skill of the player, and the attendant grey lines in the rules that blizzard can [and will] abuse.
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On December 20 2013 23:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2013 23:36 MajOr wrote:
I. Players may switch races after each match. < retarded That rule is never going to be used and in case it is used it will be amazing and absolutely reward skill. Being able to play multiple races in a single series nothing to look down upon or to obstruct with a ruleset.
Yeah it sounds great on paper... but when we've seen it in practice isn't as glorious. Take Namhcir, who switched races at MLG Columbus (or perhaps Anaheim) and 4 gated a Terran... or a Protoss who switches to Terran versus Zerg so they can roll the dice with a 2 Rax; I've seen that too.
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On December 21 2013 04:58 Happygreek wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 04:52 Survivor61316 wrote:On December 20 2013 23:53 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On December 20 2013 23:36 MajOr wrote:
I. Players may switch races after each match. < retarded That rule is never going to be used and in case it is used it will be amazing and absolutely reward skill. Being able to play multiple races in a single series nothing to look down upon or to obstruct with a ruleset. I'm pretty sure what they mean by the wording of that rule is that you must play as one race for an entire series, but can then switch races for your next series (match). Generally, a match refers to the overall BoX, whereas a game refers to each map played. I interpret match as a single game and a set as a group of matches, meaning a best of three is a set of 3 matches. Basically the way it's used in tennis. Definitely should be clarified if there's this much confusion.
Happygreek, that's not how game, set, and match are used in tennis though.
A game in tennis is the first person to win 4 points (win by two, ignoring the additional rules for deuces and ads because they're irrelevant to the terminology). You start at 0 (love), and then the scoring per won point goes 15, 30, 40, game.
If you win 6 games (win by two, yadda yadda), then you win the set. Some sets can be longer depending on the rules, but several games make up a set.
Then once you win the desired number of sets (e.g., best 2 out of 3 sets), you win the match.
Survivor61316's account of games and matches happens to be closer to tennis, and I agree (as does the clarification, fortunately). Less confusion, yay 
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On December 21 2013 07:00 mijagi182 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 04:08 TRaFFiC wrote:On December 21 2013 04:03 Spektor wrote:On December 21 2013 04:01 TRaFFiC wrote:
The no chat thing seems totally out of the blue. When has chat ever been a problem? That's what everyone wants to see. Chat! But seeing as blizz is clueless on making battlenet more social.... Because during a WCS game I care about social and not the playing. When Nerchio loses to Protoss, I want to see his true rage. I want to see him write a paragraph about how the guy should be ashamed to use the imba race. Not just gg. Whether you agree with it or not, this is what gives huge viewer numbers. People love passionate players, not robots. And people are so in love with Nerchio, he has 30 paged fanclub after being ~top5 foreigner for over 3 years
What? He was maybe top 5 foreigner during broodlord infestor.
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On December 21 2013 07:23 Baum wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 07:00 mijagi182 wrote:On December 21 2013 04:08 TRaFFiC wrote:On December 21 2013 04:03 Spektor wrote:On December 21 2013 04:01 TRaFFiC wrote:
The no chat thing seems totally out of the blue. When has chat ever been a problem? That's what everyone wants to see. Chat! But seeing as blizz is clueless on making battlenet more social.... Because during a WCS game I care about social and not the playing. When Nerchio loses to Protoss, I want to see his true rage. I want to see him write a paragraph about how the guy should be ashamed to use the imba race. Not just gg. Whether you agree with it or not, this is what gives huge viewer numbers. People love passionate players, not robots. And people are so in love with Nerchio, he has 30 paged fanclub after being ~top5 foreigner for over 3 years What? He was maybe top 5 foreigner during broodlord infestor.
Probably sarcasm?
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On December 20 2013 23:56 Sly Faux wrote:
I understand the reasons behind this, we need to act professional fi we are to be taken seriously, but this just rustle my jimmies. No offensive language, no in game chat... basically all the lovable friendly trash talk that really gets me hyped, is out. No more personalities everybody! Remember how much we loved Idra's "Fuck you" to Huk after that Halluc VR match? NO MORE OF THAT NOW!. Robots everybody, just play the game and get out.
4thelolz: No CHEATING!? Looks like the whole Protoss race is out... those advanced imbalanced theocratic dicks.
User was warned for this post
Thank god, I *hated* that moment.
Really glad to see some standardized rules and expected behavior. Time to put the "professional" back into pro gamers
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On December 21 2013 07:33 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2013 07:23 Baum wrote:On December 21 2013 07:00 mijagi182 wrote:On December 21 2013 04:08 TRaFFiC wrote:On December 21 2013 04:03 Spektor wrote:On December 21 2013 04:01 TRaFFiC wrote:
The no chat thing seems totally out of the blue. When has chat ever been a problem? That's what everyone wants to see. Chat! But seeing as blizz is clueless on making battlenet more social.... Because during a WCS game I care about social and not the playing. When Nerchio loses to Protoss, I want to see his true rage. I want to see him write a paragraph about how the guy should be ashamed to use the imba race. Not just gg. Whether you agree with it or not, this is what gives huge viewer numbers. People love passionate players, not robots. And people are so in love with Nerchio, he has 30 paged fanclub after being ~top5 foreigner for over 3 years What? He was maybe top 5 foreigner during broodlord infestor. Probably sarcasm?
Nah, Nerchio was a force to be reckoned with way before that. Best ZvZ in the bizz and an online killer.
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Blizzard want to make esports more like a real sports... Not gonna work. Different "athletes", different spectators than in real sports.
I don't know who need those stupid rules (other than delaying, not cheating etc, ie the usual ones) except Blizzard and a small part of "omg omg BM mules, someone call sponsors" type of viewers.
SC2 is a niche sport, it's even a niche esport if compare to MOBA games. And most likely will stay that way no matter what.
Just my 2c though.
And at least there's still DH and HSC.
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On December 21 2013 07:57 TJ31 wrote:
Blizzard want to make esports more like a real sports... Not gonna work. Different "athletes", different spectators than in real sports.
I don't know who need those stupid rules (other than delaying, not cheating etc, ie the usual ones) except Blizzard and a small part of "omg omg BM mules, someone call sponsors" type of viewers.
SC2 is a niche sport, it's even a niche esport if compare to MOBA games. And most likely will stay that way no matter what.
Just my 2c though.
And at least there's still DH and HSC.
Stuff like manner mules and manner nexus is still fine. It's no different from spiking the ball after a touchdown or some of the celebrations I've seen in soccer. (I personally don't like those kinds of displays myself, but that's not really on topic). What isn't fine is players using abusive and hateful language, and doing things to tarnish the image of the game and the scene as a whole.
I also applaud the effort to warn/penalize people for airing grievances in public. It's a horrendous practice that keeps happening in eSports and it really makes everyone look terrible. Keep that shit private, resolve it like adults.
Time for everyone to start taking stuff seriously if they want to "be legit"!
PS: There are still plenty of instances of acceptable trash talking in "traditional" sports that can bring enjoyment and extra hype and I imagine players will find room for the same in SC2.
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Simple if you don't like the rules, then don't watch the WCS tournies as a sign of protest. They'll be forced to comply.
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Rules similar to this have been around for a long time, so it's not like there is anything new to this. The only thing that specifically worries me is the idea that you're not allowed to criticize the tournament (is this right? I sort of skimmed most of the discussion), but otherwise the lack of in-game chat and forcing players to be on time is all harmless. If players want to show personality they can have their own blog or there can be interviews or comments on twitter and so on. But the only reason we care about these players is ultimately their ability to play the game and it's this ability that should be highlighted. I sometimes think that many people in the community are just here out of habit or they follow the scene for the drama and the players and the ambiance etc. and are only barely interested in the actual game (as is true for most sports I guess). But on some level everyone loses out when the game is no longer central. I think it's a very good idea to say that when the game start you focus on the game, period. (The "sanctity of the game", and so on.)
I don't really like the idea of e-sports too much though. I have two sort of competing ideas and I don't know how to directly reconcile them. On one hand I think that you should respect the game and that many of Blizzard's rules are in the spirit of this thought, but on the other hand I don't like the idea of e-sports as a spectacle show where we want to emulate wrestling or something, with the community not caring about playing the game, just caring about the gladiator fight between Jaedong & Flash. It's this sort of mentality that makes people think it's a good idea to have mindless thrash talking to create equally mindless drama. Since if we're going to appeal to the lowest common denominator it's better to have players that show "personality" by acting like your typical loudmouth football player. (I mean, there are plenty of people that act like Innovation and Scarlett have no personality, just because they're shy/polite) Many of Blizzard's rules are in the spirit of creating a family-friendly spectacle event as marketing for Blizzard, that just seems offensive to me on some level.
I do like competition though, it's more pure. I wish there was some billionaire that would acquire an island and invite the best 100 Starcraft players and just have them compete in a massive tournament. No broadcasting, no show, just competition and it only needs to be relevant to the people playing there. But of course, in today's world you need business models and that sort of thing to even have competition in the first place, and the powers-that-be only care about competition in the sense that it can draw in an audience.
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Kespa? We're getting there.
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"D. Communication & Storage Devices – Players must consult with the organizer before bringing electronic storage devices to any event and are not allowed to use any mobile or external communication equipment during a match. All personal equipment must be in an enclosed bag or be given to an administrator while a match is played. "
Do people need to ask permission to bring their smartphone to events? :/
Edit: And I still think it's stupid that you can switch race between maps. Makes map vetos kind of stupid. Like the blind pick part though(not that I think it will ever be used).
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cannot comment negatively on the player’s overall skill or character
really ? Is it like that in other "pro" sport / discipline ?
That make no sense at all.
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I dont understand the rule against the game chat.
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On December 20 2013 23:56 Sly Faux wrote:
4thelolz: No CHEATING!? Looks like the whole Protoss race is out... those advanced imbalanced theocratic dicks.
User was warned for this post
You should of said software exploitation playing as Protoss, it would have been funnier... Anyway these seem like standard no-nonsense rules the only downside is the prize reduction and the way the infractions cumulate over the season. By the end of the season I'd wonder who gets the whole prize.
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EPT
