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lol
o wow im just now getting to the latest pages.
double lol.
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If they were ot allow korean or europeans to play games of WCS America on their own servers then they would need to allow american and korean players to play on their own servers in WCS Europe. This would probably screw over a lot of the streamers streaming WCS Europe since you can't expect them to have accounts on every server.
I think MajOr and HerO should be happy enough that they don't need to play the tournament on american soil.
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On May 02 2013 01:49 Sated wrote:
I like how this argument is still going on as if the quality of the games won't be affected at all by the fact that the casters, observers and admins are going to be in the game from NYC -> KR...
in short: because your argument is wrong and makes no sense.
repeating bullshit doesn't make it right.
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On May 02 2013 01:44 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:35 Bumblebee wrote:On May 02 2013 01:28 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On May 02 2013 01:23 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:16 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On May 02 2013 01:11 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:07 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On May 02 2013 01:05 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:00 Tppz! wrote:[quote] Waxangel aint part of the team: http://www.teamliquidpro.com/playerscheck your stats. and obviously the players talked to you and tried to make you change the region they play on for their kr-kr matches. its this way you work that makes you problems. "there is a rule about that but everyone would agree that it makes more sense to do it the supposed way? well lets allow it in this case since its just for better games on which everyone would gain something. but no there is a rule. we cant change." thats why ppl like esls administration and organisation a lot more. they think about the stuff and change if it makes more sense. Waxangel is a member of the Team Liquid staff, which sponsors the Team Liquid SC2 and Dota2 teams. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/TeamLiquid.net_Staff That's the Site staff buddy. Waxangel does write-ups and translations, but he's not part of the Team's actual management or decision-making staff. I guess we can split hairs like that if we really want to. I think MLG can still be grumpy and request that Team Liquid and its staff for both the site and team not make threads like this without sending a single email. That is the level of professional courtesy I would expect. It's not splitting hairs. TeamLiquid.net and Team Liquid the pro team are two separate entities, although they have very evident tie-ins. While someone like Nazgul or Bumblebee represents both, the TL.net staff do not represent the official stance of the actual pro team through their posts. Keep in mind this community was built on volunteers. Again, just because they're an integral part of keeping the community running doesn't necessarily mean they're involved with the team itself. I get that and respect the work they did. But I don't think it is unreasonable to the Team Liquid team to ask the website staff: "Hey, before you create a thread complaining about the rules for a particular event, please let us try to handle it internally first. We have to work with these people and we should let them respond first before bringing it to the community." This thread was created last night and the issue is not super urgent. An email could have been sent or a phone call could have been made this morning to MLG and checked on the rule, rather than go right to a public forum to complain about the issue. On May 02 2013 01:21 Bumblebee wrote:
Adam, you need to understand that first of all editors in chief of a website is not affiliated to our team and have nothing to do with how we operate. I did write to Jason Nye and I just got the response that there was nothing we could do about it. What more do you want? That is pretty much a case of having your cake and eating it too. "The people who work for our website that also has the same name as our team are not affiliated with the team. Also, we advertise for the team on that website and broadcast all MLGs events through that site as well. But they aren't affiliated with the team directly." I wouldn't accept an argument like that from Blizzard, MLG or any other business out there. I don't know why that is not acceptable. The team and the website is two different things, two different companies owned by the same person. We happen to share a brand and yes, you are right, we are here together but as stated in my post just above this one it was brought to our attention, but WaxAngel is completely free to do what he thinks is suitable as the editor in chief and for the community site side. If he wants to report and call people out, then that's his thing. I am not or don't want to be responsible for that. I see where you are coming from, but from the outside viewer the TL community site and the TL team are the same thing. This includes sponsors, team and other communities, who all see Team Liquid and don't think that the website and the team are separate. My firm has a separate title company owned by the partners. They are separate companies all the way down to pay roll, but none of our clients care and view us and one entity. We can make the argument till we are blue in the fact, but all they care about is that the company is owned by the same people. The only people who know that the website staff and the team managers are separate entities are committed community members. To everyone else in the world Team Liquid the site and Team Liquid the team are the same.
do ppl really think those editors get money from the sponsors?
if anyone thinks the team liquid internetside staff is on the same team as the team liuquid progaming staff doesnt know anything about life. its a complete other firm. they dont have anything to do with each other than the ceo.
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On May 02 2013 01:49 Sated wrote:
I like how this argument is still going on as if the quality of the games won't be affected at all by the fact that the casters, observers and admins are going to be in the game from NYC -> KR...
It won't. It is not a peer-to-peer client. Unless the casters lag that much, they stall the game, the quality will not be influenced.
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This whole issue is mainly Blizzard's fault for letting anyone play in the NA quals then still calling it WCS NA. MLG wants everything played on NA so there are no exceptions made because they probably have no rules in place for that. There should be exceptions made because its not WCS NA its WCS International, yet I see where they're coming from and its probably not as easy as everyone thinks it is to make those exceptions, though I don't know if it is.
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Austria24422 Posts
On May 02 2013 01:51 Batch wrote:
If they were ot allow korean or europeans to play games of WCS America on their own servers then they would need to allow american and korean players to play on their own servers in WCS Europe. This would probably screw over a lot of the streamers streaming WCS Europe since you can't expect them to have accounts on every server.
I think MajOr and HerO should be happy enough that they don't need to play the tournament on american soil.
Creating an account on a different server takes about 5 seconds.
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On May 02 2013 01:50 MichaelDonovan wrote:
Yeah sorry Wax I gotta agree with most of the people in this thread. Why should KR players be allowed to play in an NA tournament (presumably to take advantage of easier competition) and then also be allowed to play on the KR server? That would be silly and I really hope they don't change this decision.
I believe that the distinction between allowing Koreans to play in WCS NA and punishing them for playing there (such as having to play three games on the North American server against Americans) should not be done with what's being discussed here. They have allowed them to play and when they're playing eachother - considering how easy and fast it is to change region - they should be playing on the server that will create the best games for them. Two Koreans on North American server does not make much sense in terms of punishing them. If they don't want Koreans to be playing in the WCS NA, the restriction should be elsewhere if you ask me.
On May 02 2013 01:52 Sated wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:51 grs wrote:On May 02 2013 01:49 Sated wrote:
I like how this argument is still going on as if the quality of the games won't be affected at all by the fact that the casters, observers and admins are going to be in the game from NYC -> KR... It won't. It is not a peer-to-peer client. Unless the casters lag that much, they stall the game, the quality will not be influenced. Why do you assume that casters won't lag NYC -> KR but the players will lag KR -> NA?
The casters will have a high ping on the map, but what difference does it make? None. They don't have to do anything that is affected by the latency in StarCraft itself, that is why it doesn't matter.
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Well apparently expecting a day to go by without this community getting butt-hurt over something is too much to ask. If you are playing in a North American tournament, and don't expect to have to play on the North American server then you're just simply an imbecile. And besides, even if they play on Korea the observers and casters are still in NYC..
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On May 02 2013 01:46 Bumblebee wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:44 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:35 Bumblebee wrote:On May 02 2013 01:28 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On May 02 2013 01:23 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:16 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On May 02 2013 01:11 Plansix wrote:On May 02 2013 01:07 MasterOfPuppets wrote:That's the Site staff buddy. Waxangel does write-ups and translations, but he's not part of the Team's actual management or decision-making staff. I guess we can split hairs like that if we really want to. I think MLG can still be grumpy and request that Team Liquid and its staff for both the site and team not make threads like this without sending a single email. That is the level of professional courtesy I would expect. It's not splitting hairs. TeamLiquid.net and Team Liquid the pro team are two separate entities, although they have very evident tie-ins. While someone like Nazgul or Bumblebee represents both, the TL.net staff do not represent the official stance of the actual pro team through their posts. Keep in mind this community was built on volunteers. Again, just because they're an integral part of keeping the community running doesn't necessarily mean they're involved with the team itself. I get that and respect the work they did. But I don't think it is unreasonable to the Team Liquid team to ask the website staff: "Hey, before you create a thread complaining about the rules for a particular event, please let us try to handle it internally first. We have to work with these people and we should let them respond first before bringing it to the community." This thread was created last night and the issue is not super urgent. An email could have been sent or a phone call could have been made this morning to MLG and checked on the rule, rather than go right to a public forum to complain about the issue. On May 02 2013 01:21 Bumblebee wrote:
Adam, you need to understand that first of all editors in chief of a website is not affiliated to our team and have nothing to do with how we operate. I did write to Jason Nye and I just got the response that there was nothing we could do about it. What more do you want? That is pretty much a case of having your cake and eating it too. "The people who work for our website that also has the same name as our team are not affiliated with the team. Also, we advertise for the team on that website and broadcast all MLGs events through that site as well. But they aren't affiliated with the team directly." I wouldn't accept an argument like that from Blizzard, MLG or any other business out there. I don't know why that is not acceptable. The team and the website is two different things, two different companies owned by the same person. We happen to share a brand and yes, you are right, we are here together but as stated in my post just above this one it was brought to our attention, but WaxAngel is completely free to do what he thinks is suitable as the editor in chief and for the community site side. If he wants to report and call people out, then that's his thing. I am not or don't want to be responsible for that. I see where you are coming from, but from the outside viewer the TL community site and the TL team are the same thing. This includes sponsors, team and other communities, who all see Team Liquid and don't think that the website and the team are separate. My firm has a separate title company owned by the partners. They are separate companies all the way down to pay roll, but none of our clients care and view us and one entity. We can make the argument till we are blue in the fact, but all they care about is that the company is owned by the same people. The only people who know that the website staff and the team managers are separate entities are committed community members. To everyone else in the world Team Liquid the site and Team Liquid the team are the same. I think it's obvious to anyone who is a regular user on TeamLiquid that it's not the same and we don't share the same sponsors either. You don't see Barracuda, Razer, Twitch and ShinyThings logos roll around here on the frontpage or a part of the banners.
Maybe, I cannot be sure. I can tell you from personal experience that having a separate names, staff and phone numbers does not stop my clients from screaming about the title companies mistakes, even though I have nothing to do with them. As long as the both groups are owned and managed by the same or similar group of people, people are going to lump them together. Without digging into it to deeply, I don't think a lot of members would assume that the complains of the sites staff are similar to the complaints of the teams managers.
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On May 02 2013 01:52 Sated wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:51 grs wrote:On May 02 2013 01:49 Sated wrote:
I like how this argument is still going on as if the quality of the games won't be affected at all by the fact that the casters, observers and admins are going to be in the game from NYC -> KR... It won't. It is not a peer-to-peer client. Unless the casters lag that much, they stall the game, the quality will not be influenced. Why do you assume that casters won't lag NYC -> KR but the players will lag KR -> NA?
because you don't know what you are talking about.
they will have a higher ping, they won't "lag".
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United States33700 Posts
On May 02 2013 01:50 MichaelDonovan wrote:
Yeah sorry Wax I gotta agree with most of the people in this thread. Why should KR players be allowed to play in an NA tournament (presumably to take advantage of easier competition) and then also be allowed to play on the KR server? That would be silly and I really hope they don't change this decision.
It's okay, I'm more sorry that you and many people don't actually comprehend the argument
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Canada16217 Posts
On May 02 2013 01:51 Batch wrote:
If they were ot allow korean or europeans to play games of WCS America on their own servers then they would need to allow american and korean players to play on their own servers in WCS Europe. This would probably screw over a lot of the streamers streaming WCS Europe since you can't expect them to have accounts on every server.
I think MajOr and HerO should be happy enough that they don't need to play the tournament on american soil.
LOL. we have this thing where people can switch their regions.
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On May 02 2013 01:54 NovemberstOrm wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:51 Batch wrote:
If they were ot allow korean or europeans to play games of WCS America on their own servers then they would need to allow american and korean players to play on their own servers in WCS Europe. This would probably screw over a lot of the streamers streaming WCS Europe since you can't expect them to have accounts on every server.
I think MajOr and HerO should be happy enough that they don't need to play the tournament on american soil. LOL. we have this thing where people can switch their regions.
And it requires about 10 seconds! Woah that sounds hard right? Imagine the poor observers/admins having to waste 10 seconds from their life to accommodate the players
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On May 02 2013 01:54 Waxangel wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:50 MichaelDonovan wrote:
Yeah sorry Wax I gotta agree with most of the people in this thread. Why should KR players be allowed to play in an NA tournament (presumably to take advantage of easier competition) and then also be allowed to play on the KR server? That would be silly and I really hope they don't change this decision. It's okay, I'm more sorry that you and many people don't actually comprehend the argument
Daaaaaaang! Bombs dropped! Shots fired!
Telling a philosopher that he doesn't comprehend an argument just makes him lol.
Discarding an argument as irrelevant to the situation is not the same as misunderstanding it. In fact I wouldn't disregard an argument unless I understood it to be irrelevant. Standard practice.
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On May 02 2013 01:55 Sated wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:53 fleeze wrote:On May 02 2013 01:52 Sated wrote:On May 02 2013 01:51 grs wrote:On May 02 2013 01:49 Sated wrote:
I like how this argument is still going on as if the quality of the games won't be affected at all by the fact that the casters, observers and admins are going to be in the game from NYC -> KR... It won't. It is not a peer-to-peer client. Unless the casters lag that much, they stall the game, the quality will not be influenced. Why do you assume that casters won't lag NYC -> KR but the players will lag KR -> NA? because you don't know what you are talking about. they will have a higher ping, they won't "lag". High ping leads to lag... are you trolling?
god....
high ping does not mean the "lag screen" shows up. that is the only way casters lagging can affect the players...
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On May 02 2013 01:55 Sated wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2013 01:53 fleeze wrote:On May 02 2013 01:52 Sated wrote:On May 02 2013 01:51 grs wrote:On May 02 2013 01:49 Sated wrote:
I like how this argument is still going on as if the quality of the games won't be affected at all by the fact that the casters, observers and admins are going to be in the game from NYC -> KR... It won't. It is not a peer-to-peer client. Unless the casters lag that much, they stall the game, the quality will not be influenced. Why do you assume that casters won't lag NYC -> KR but the players will lag KR -> NA? because you don't know what you are talking about. they will have a higher ping, they won't "lag". High ping leads to lag... are you trolling?
That's hardly accurate in and of itself. I could play FPS games on American servers with 150-180 ms of latency with hardly any problems or hitches, and on European servers with 40-60 ms of latency with pretty severe lag.
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EPT
