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No Kespa Players in Upcoming GSL - Page 73

Forum Index > SC2 General
1864 CommentsPost a Reply
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rysecake
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2632 Posts
August 24 2012 03:55 GMT
#1441
On August 24 2012 12:11 LuckoftheIrish wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 12:05 blade55555 wrote:
On August 24 2012 12:01 AndAgain wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:54 Sc2Null wrote:
I don't think people realize the best players in sc2 are far superior than the BW transfers..and will be for a long time. You also must remember the lack of english casting for the OSL which is limited to doa (lol) so in the long run. Gom will be fine, its kespa that will suffer.


Eh, really?
Effort flat out outplayed DRG.
By.Sun beat Curious and Leenock
Roro Beat Leenock.
HerO beat Puzzle.
Soulkey beat Coca.

These GSL players are pretty damn high up there. At the very least, it shows that Kespa players don't have a long ways to go to catchup.


Don't forget Jaedong beating Genius a code S finalists on the first gsl this year iirc.


In fairness, there are way, way more replays of DRG and Leenock playing SC2 than there are of By.Sun and Effort. Preparing for players whose playstyle is still a bit unknown is always hard. The BW players have much more information about their opponents.


You think that it makes up for a 2 year experience gap though? I'm iffy on that one
The Notorious Winkles
Daozzt
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1263 Posts
August 24 2012 03:56 GMT
#1442
The players don't have a choice but to follow orders, as Kespa is the one signing their paychecks. It sucks for the players that want to compete, but hey, they're not gonna disobey as long they get stable 5-6 digit salaries.
Zhasona
Profile Joined March 2011
57 Posts
August 24 2012 03:57 GMT
#1443
Surprisingly, out of the 70 plus pages, no one threw out the possibility that Kespa might switched to the cracked LAN version of SC2 for their tournaments if Blizzard really blacklisted their IPs. And also, considering Kespa's links to the government, they can always do some backdoor dealings to block/slow down Blizz's lawsuits in Korea.

And if Kespa really plans to open war with Gom, they really need to prepare lots of carrots for the Federation teams, otherwise they might pull out of OSL out of protest considering the effects if Gom really gets killed off.
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
August 24 2012 03:59 GMT
#1444
On August 24 2012 12:57 Zhasona wrote:
Surprisingly, out of the 70 plus pages, no one threw out the possibility that Kespa might switched to the cracked LAN version of SC2 for their tournaments if Blizzard really blacklisted their IPs. And also, considering Kespa's links to the government, they can always do some backdoor dealings to block/slow down Blizz's lawsuits in Korea.

And if Kespa really plans to open war with Gom, they really need to prepare lots of carrots for the Federation teams, otherwise they might pull out of OSL out of protest considering the effects if Gom really gets killed off.


The illegal LAN hack was already brought up and it would never work out for them, sponsors would not allow them to do something illegal like that and Blizzard would sue their pants off.
DanceSC
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States751 Posts
August 24 2012 04:01 GMT
#1445
On August 23 2012 16:45 artosismermaid wrote:
what is kespa's problem!

I can see your upset, but don't you think pointing fingers is quite childish?
The GSL has been going on for how long? Their players are refined and are playing at their top level. KeSPAs gamers have been competing in both Sc2 AND Broodwar. If they say the 'Gamers' are not ready, then I can fully understand that.
Dance.943 || "I think he's just going to lose. There's only so many ways you can lose. And he's going to make some kind of units. And I'm going to attack him, and then all his stuff is going to die. That's about the best prediction that I can make" - NonY
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States5810 Posts
August 24 2012 04:02 GMT
#1446
On August 24 2012 12:47 Lunareste wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 12:37 oBlade wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:33 mongmong wrote:
back in brood war kespa claimed that they had the rights to broadcast broodwar (which really isnt since all the copyrights
are entitled to blizz),

You don't think the intellectual property created during a game of Starcraft might belong to the players (whose rights you're otherwise trying to defend) who put so much skill into creating them?


I think you are seriously misunderstanding what intellectual property is.

Basically, Blizzard invented and created Starcraft, so the intellectual property belongs to them.

No, you just weren't reading close enough to get the specific point I made.
On August 24 2012 12:37 oBlade wrote:
You don't think the intellectual property created during a game of Starcraft might belong to the players (whose rights you're otherwise trying to defend) who put so much skill into creating them?
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
lowreezy08
Profile Joined June 2011
United States143 Posts
August 24 2012 04:02 GMT
#1447
On August 24 2012 07:41 NoobSkills wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 07:38 soullogik wrote:
some bs

they have to get all the players together...

it will make the game that much better


Everyone does need to realize that over saturation is also bad.

GSL Code A
GSL Code S
GSL Team League
Pro League
OSL
Foreign events

Though a complete combination of everything would be nice.
4 Foreign events a year.
3 OSL
3 GSL
Team League Season

Though the SC gods probably couldn't make that happen

If over saturation is a problem, then we damn sure got it good here in starcraft, pretty good problem to have.
sup
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 04:03:47
August 24 2012 04:02 GMT
#1448
On August 24 2012 13:01 DanceSC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2012 16:45 artosismermaid wrote:
what is kespa's problem!

I can see your upset, but don't you think pointing fingers is quite childish?
The GSL has been going on for how long? Their players are refined and are playing at their top level. KeSPAs gamers have been competing in both Sc2 AND Broodwar. If they say the 'Gamers' are not ready, then I can fully understand that.


It has nothing to do with them not being ready, Kespa players are in WCG and WCS. They were even going to play at MLG if it was not for the MLG weekend timeslot being so important for Proleague that they couldn't afford to miss the matches.
SarcasmMonster
Profile Joined October 2011
3136 Posts
August 24 2012 04:03 GMT
#1449
On August 24 2012 13:01 DanceSC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2012 16:45 artosismermaid wrote:
what is kespa's problem!

I can see your upset, but don't you think pointing fingers is quite childish?
The GSL has been going on for how long? Their players are refined and are playing at their top level. KeSPAs gamers have been competing in both Sc2 AND Broodwar. If they say the 'Gamers' are not ready, then I can fully understand that.


That's not the reason. They can't avoid playing each other since OSL has both GSL and Kespa players.
MMA: The true King of Wings
Zhasona
Profile Joined March 2011
57 Posts
August 24 2012 04:04 GMT
#1450
On August 24 2012 12:59 Dodgin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 12:57 Zhasona wrote:
Surprisingly, out of the 70 plus pages, no one threw out the possibility that Kespa might switched to the cracked LAN version of SC2 for their tournaments if Blizzard really blacklisted their IPs. And also, considering Kespa's links to the government, they can always do some backdoor dealings to block/slow down Blizz's lawsuits in Korea.

And if Kespa really plans to open war with Gom, they really need to prepare lots of carrots for the Federation teams, otherwise they might pull out of OSL out of protest considering the effects if Gom really gets killed off.


The illegal LAN hack was already brought up and it would never work out for them, sponsors would not allow them to do something illegal like that and Blizzard would sue their pants off.



As much as that was illegal, suing a government-linked Kespa in Korea would have a low chance of success, considering the number of ways Kespa can delay or block the lawsuits. Though I have to admit if they really went and used the lan crack, new sponsors would definitely be much more hesitant to sponsor Kespa's stuffs.
P7GAB
Profile Joined June 2012
Canada486 Posts
August 24 2012 04:04 GMT
#1451
On August 24 2012 13:01 DanceSC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2012 16:45 artosismermaid wrote:
what is kespa's problem!

I can see your upset, but don't you think pointing fingers is quite childish?
The GSL has been going on for how long? Their players are refined and are playing at their top level. KeSPAs gamers have been competing in both Sc2 AND Broodwar. If they say the 'Gamers' are not ready, then I can fully understand that.


there not ready yet so they allow gsl players into the osl? they are completely taking advantage of gom here
Wingblade
Profile Joined April 2012
United States1806 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 04:05:45
August 24 2012 04:05 GMT
#1452
On August 24 2012 13:01 DanceSC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2012 16:45 artosismermaid wrote:
what is kespa's problem!

I can see your upset, but don't you think pointing fingers is quite childish?
The GSL has been going on for how long? Their players are refined and are playing at their top level. KeSPAs gamers have been competing in both Sc2 AND Broodwar. If they say the 'Gamers' are not ready, then I can fully understand that.


If their players weren't ready, they wouldn't be letting GOM players in the OSL. They will still get smashed, it doesn't matter where, just that now, Kespa gets all the money from profiting off the Kespa v GOM matches.

Basically what the above guy said.
PartinG fanboy to the max, Rain/Squirtle/Dear/Scarlett/Bbyong are cool too. I don't always watch Dota2 but when I do I have no clue what's going on. GOGO POWER RANGERS
LighT.
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4501 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 04:11:26
August 24 2012 04:06 GMT
#1453
let's look at the sponsors for the Kespa Korean teams which makes up the federation that makes the final call:
CJ Entus
SKT1 Telecom
KT Rolster
Woojin
STX
Samsung Khan
Air Force Ace
Team 8.

Of this list; few things stand out.
Air Force Ace first of all, is a team that is to be discounted in future events as they're impeding any future recruits bringing a halt to their esport history.

So now..7 teams.
Of the 7 teams, Team 8 does NOT have a sponsor, and run purely by kespa

So now, we're looking at 6 teams.

CJ Entus, KT, SKT1 Telecom, are phone companies (much like Verizon in US, Telus in Canada), in which their focus in business is national across Korea rather than intentional. It would be illogical for them because expanding overseas would mean little to their entire aspect of sponsoring the team which is to advertise the brand name of their phone companies.
This ALSO hapepns to be where the giants of BW players stand: aka bisu, fantasy, flash, Leta, effort. They have quite the stronghold.

Woongjin just happens to be a bank firm. Like the telecom companies. Do they care about intentional recognition? No. because there's little beneficialness out of it. Their best interest is to let the product and their firm known in Korea, and could care less about the US.

STX Korea - Trading Company for creating Ships, trade and banking.
Samsung - Electronic Manufacturing Company.

These are 2 teams which are intentionally based. Aka. They WANT sponsorship and and their name value raised.
Most likely these teams want to venture more intentionally to make their product known and Samsung has especially let its voice heard in its eagerness for intentional relations having hosted League of Legends tournaments. If anyone's pushing the movement of Kespa towards the intentional,sponsor wise, it's these two teams.

As you can see, the final weight is rather large with an overwhelming amount of companies that only should care about national interest outnumbering those sponsors who would push for intentional interest. It's the interest of such why they're reluctant.

...

We've heard the coaches interviews with Coach Lee, January etc. and their views. We've heard interviews from Kespa players on their perspective as well. Of course, as gamers and people with passion of the game, they want to go outside of Korea, and grow the e-sports scene, play in GSL, play in MLG, Dreamhack, IPL etc. The coaches and the players are the last people to blame. Sadly, the politics doesn't work that way. under obligated contracts players have to do what they're told.

Kespa won't adjust that easy. They will eventually play in the GSL. That will happen, perhaps not this season, maybe not the next but in a few.
Why??
1) Fan pressure + uproar + to appease
2) In the interest of business (GomTV does have a korean audience after all)

The big announcement they have planned?
Most likely some national tournament to gain further exposure nationally within Korea because that's the sponsor's interest.

I almost wonder what the conversations are like amongst the representatives of each sponsor at meetings heh.

TL:DR; The coaches and players may have the passion and desire to play the game and expand esports; but the goal of Kespa is not of esports, I feel but nationally advertising their product which would not create an increase in stock, advertising overseas. Aka, they don't care about esports.


Just my two cents.

Edit: (added)
And finally, why I think Kespa is holding out out of the GSL?
Exactly of the "big event thats being planned', it's likely some league that's going to get airtime with OGN or even MBC Korea, that would attractive viewership, acknowledgment of their products/sponsors.
They're seeing and weighing what's the best option out there to catch the big fish, before settling in with what IS going to be available to them anytime they wish to grab (GomTV's GSL); having the scheduling open so that if a big agreement is made that's to be aired nationally, they'll have the players and the time to execute it.
Chexx
Profile Joined May 2011
Korea (South)11232 Posts
August 24 2012 04:15 GMT
#1454
CJ Entus is wide more than a phonecompany.
WriterFollow me @TL_Chexx
jpak
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States5045 Posts
August 24 2012 04:15 GMT
#1455
On August 24 2012 13:06 LighT. wrote:
let's look at the sponsors for the Kespa Korean teams which makes up the federation that makes the final call:
CJ Entus
SKT1 Telecom
KT Rolster
Woojin
STX
Samsung Khan
Air Force Ace
Team 8.

Of this list; few things stand out.
Air Force Ace first of all, is a team that is to be discounted in future events as they're impeding any future recruits bringing a halt to their esport history.

So now..7 teams.
Of the 7 teams, Team 8 does NOT have a sponsor, and run purely by kespa

So now, we're looking at 6 teams.

CJ Entus, KT, SKT1 Telecom, are phone companies (much like Verizon in US, Telus in Canada), in which their focus in business is national across Korea rather than intentional. It would be illogical for them because expanding overseas would mean little to their entire aspect of sponsoring the team which is to advertise the brand name of their phone companies.
This ALSO hapepns to be where the giants of BW players stand: aka bisu, fantasy, flash, Leta, effort. They have quite the stronghold.

Woongjin just happens to be a bank firm. Like the telecom companies. Do they care about intentional recognition? No. because there's little beneficialness out of it. Their best interest is to let the product and their firm known in Korea, and could care less about the US.

STX Korea - Trading Company for creating Ships, trade and banking.
Samsung - Electronic Manufacturing Company.

These are 2 teams which are intentionally based. Aka. They WANT sponsorship and and their name value raised.
Most likely these teams want to venture more intentionally to make their product known and Samsung has especially let its voice heard in its eagerness for intentional relations having hosted League of Legends tournaments. If anyone's pushing the movement of Kespa towards the intentional,sponsor wise, it's these two teams.

As you can see, the final weight is rather large with an overwhelming amount of companies that only should care about national interest outnumbering those sponsors who would push for intentional interest. It's the interest of such why they're reluctant.

...

We've heard the coaches interviews with Coach Lee, January etc. and their views. We've heard interviews from Kespa players on their perspective as well. Of course, as gamers and people with passion of the game, they want to go outside of Korea, and grow the e-sports scene, play in GSL, play in MLG, Dreamhack, IPL etc. The coaches and the players are the last people to blame. Sadly, the politics doesn't work that way. under obligated contracts players have to do what they're told.

Kespa won't adjust that easy. They will eventually play in the GSL. That will happen, perhaps not this season, maybe not the next but in a few.
Why??
1) Fan pressure + uproar + to appease
2) In the interest of business (GomTV does have a korean audience after all)

The big announcement they have planned?
Most likely some national tournament to gain further exposure nationally within Korea because that's the sponsor's interest.

I almost wonder what the conversations are like amongst the representatives of each sponsor at meetings heh.

TL:DR; The coaches and players may have the passion and desire to play the game and expand esports; but the goal of Kespa is not of esports, I feel but nationally advertising their product which would not create an increase in stock, advertising overseas. Aka, they don't care about esports.


Just my two cents.


CJ is not a telecom company. CJ is an entertainment company and actually is the company that owns OGN.

Other than that, I think the best way to get Kespa to bend is through Team 8. If you offer up a major company willing to sponsor that team in return for certain conditions, then Kespa will consider.
CJ Entusman #50! #1 클템 fan TL!
Taefox
Profile Joined March 2010
1533 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 04:17:27
August 24 2012 04:17 GMT
#1456
* grasp popcorn *

Every threads with #kespa #broodwar in Starcraft 2 selection probably going to be drama, flame, trolls and more. Very entertainment

Oh fanbois fanbois go go go
@taefoxy
VManOfMana
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States764 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-24 04:24:49
August 24 2012 04:21 GMT
#1457
On August 24 2012 12:11 SarcasmMonster wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 12:05 ShadeR wrote:
On August 24 2012 12:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:
On August 24 2012 12:00 ShadeR wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:52 Xiphos wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:50 mongmong wrote:
jesus christ cant believe so called brood war fans dont even know how retarded kespa is.

oh by the way here is the link to kespa saying "starcraft is public goods (LOL! )

http://www.gamemeca.com/news/news_view.html?seq=15&ymd=20100531&page=1&point_ck=1&search_ym=&sort_type=&search_text=&send=&mission_num=&mission_seq=


that's because they are looking toward the future of esport.

a sport or game for that matter is public property that belongs to the mass.

But then later we all learned that esport(s) are just fads.

Precisely, in fact it's disingenuous to actually use the term ESPORTS if it isn't public property.


Are you guys seriously saying the Starcraft (and SC2 as well?) are public domain? I thought that would be indefensible outside of Korea...

Nope we are saying it is no ESPORTS since it is not public domain.

On August 24 2012 12:03 LuckoftheIrish wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:50 artosismermaid wrote:
I hope some players quit their kespa teams and move to the federation teams, pretty funny how this deal was negotiated to have no team transfers for a year. I bet kespa spearheaded that move to further screw gom over


Not necessarily. The traditional BW teams also have more money. While this deal does prevent the GOM-affiliated teams from reaching out to potentially disaffected BW players, it also prevents a big, rich BW team from buying up players. Imagine if a team like KHAN, which IIRC has struggled in SC2, made offers to Creator, Hack, Maru, Vampire, Shine, Life, Yoda, Sniper and AcE. They could offer higher wages to those players, snapping up emerging talent, hurting the SC2 teams which can't compete financially while at the same time hurting their own younger practice players.

Khan is not struggling with SC2.


If that the bar is set that high, is there any game that would be ESport? I can't imagine a company spending the time, money, and effort to develop a popular game and then forfeit their right's on the work to put it in public domain.


Blizzard creates video games, not eSports.

eSports is the result of playing a game at a highly competitive level, and creating a production around it: maps, players, commentators, gaming booths, eSport stadiums, HUDs, hype videos, etc. What should be "public domain" is the ability to create eSports. This is derivative work, which the game producer does not create, and Blizzard didn't get involved in for a whole decade.

Blizzard has all the right to ask a fee for using Starcraft, but Blizzard demanding intellectual ownership of all the derivative work related to Starcraft was the original douchebag move.

Blizzard having big control on eSports is extremely dangerous. It makes eSports gravitate around the game Blizzard wants to sell, not the game that provides the better competition. They can stretch the life of Starcraft II as they see fit, or kill the game when they want to sell the next big thing. It sets everything up for planned obsolescence. It makes eSports nothing but glorified advertisement. And as I see it, a farce.

Love them or hate them, OGN, MBC and then KeSPA managed to create a scene where a game thrived way past its expected shelf life. The life of the game is no longer determined by the commercial interest of the game creator, but how well the organization can develop competition, groom talent, and provide a good product that attracts sponsors. And each organization can develop their own talent and scene.

You know, like a real sport.
Woo Jung Ho, FIGHTING! | "With the death of BW comes the death of an idea. And that idea, held by many BW fans, was that a computer game could actually outlive the Next New Game cycle. And to some extent it did." -Falling
LighT.
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4501 Posts
August 24 2012 04:23 GMT
#1458
On August 24 2012 13:15 jpak wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 13:06 LighT. wrote:
let's look at the sponsors for the Kespa Korean teams which makes up the federation that makes the final call:
CJ Entus
SKT1 Telecom
KT Rolster
Woojin
STX
Samsung Khan
Air Force Ace
Team 8.

Of this list; few things stand out.
Air Force Ace first of all, is a team that is to be discounted in future events as they're impeding any future recruits bringing a halt to their esport history.

So now..7 teams.
Of the 7 teams, Team 8 does NOT have a sponsor, and run purely by kespa

So now, we're looking at 6 teams.

CJ Entus, KT, SKT1 Telecom, are phone companies (much like Verizon in US, Telus in Canada), in which their focus in business is national across Korea rather than intentional. It would be illogical for them because expanding overseas would mean little to their entire aspect of sponsoring the team which is to advertise the brand name of their phone companies.
This ALSO hapepns to be where the giants of BW players stand: aka bisu, fantasy, flash, Leta, effort. They have quite the stronghold.

Woongjin just happens to be a bank firm. Like the telecom companies. Do they care about intentional recognition? No. because there's little beneficialness out of it. Their best interest is to let the product and their firm known in Korea, and could care less about the US.

STX Korea - Trading Company for creating Ships, trade and banking.
Samsung - Electronic Manufacturing Company.

These are 2 teams which are intentionally based. Aka. They WANT sponsorship and and their name value raised.
Most likely these teams want to venture more intentionally to make their product known and Samsung has especially let its voice heard in its eagerness for intentional relations having hosted League of Legends tournaments. If anyone's pushing the movement of Kespa towards the intentional,sponsor wise, it's these two teams.

As you can see, the final weight is rather large with an overwhelming amount of companies that only should care about national interest outnumbering those sponsors who would push for intentional interest. It's the interest of such why they're reluctant.

...

We've heard the coaches interviews with Coach Lee, January etc. and their views. We've heard interviews from Kespa players on their perspective as well. Of course, as gamers and people with passion of the game, they want to go outside of Korea, and grow the e-sports scene, play in GSL, play in MLG, Dreamhack, IPL etc. The coaches and the players are the last people to blame. Sadly, the politics doesn't work that way. under obligated contracts players have to do what they're told.

Kespa won't adjust that easy. They will eventually play in the GSL. That will happen, perhaps not this season, maybe not the next but in a few.
Why??
1) Fan pressure + uproar + to appease
2) In the interest of business (GomTV does have a korean audience after all)

The big announcement they have planned?
Most likely some national tournament to gain further exposure nationally within Korea because that's the sponsor's interest.

I almost wonder what the conversations are like amongst the representatives of each sponsor at meetings heh.

TL:DR; The coaches and players may have the passion and desire to play the game and expand esports; but the goal of Kespa is not of esports, I feel but nationally advertising their product which would not create an increase in stock, advertising overseas. Aka, they don't care about esports.


Just my two cents.


CJ is not a telecom company. CJ is an entertainment company and actually is the company that owns OGN.

Other than that, I think the best way to get Kespa to bend is through Team 8. If you offer up a major company willing to sponsor that team in return for certain conditions, then Kespa will consider.


The thing is...Kespa will never really care about e-sports at heart. Thats what people are failing to realize. That's why they're hated in Korea, and everywhere on this forums.
Teams like KT an SKT will pursue national expansion, Samsung and STX would likely pursue international expansion. Rifts will likely create and the organization is in for a mess. I can ultimately see a powerful company like Samsung disbanding from the organziation and running its own thing, as they are starting to in all honesty, but Kespa wont budge.
It's really not about Kespa wanting to create e-sports or killing it. It's about greed, money and interest and in their minds, its not intentional for a lot of teams.

And yes, my mistake on CJ, however, they are still seeking national attention than intentional and I think that's the key argument.
jpak
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States5045 Posts
August 24 2012 04:24 GMT
#1459
On August 24 2012 13:21 VManOfMana wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 12:11 SarcasmMonster wrote:
On August 24 2012 12:05 ShadeR wrote:
On August 24 2012 12:04 SarcasmMonster wrote:
On August 24 2012 12:00 ShadeR wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:52 Xiphos wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:50 mongmong wrote:
jesus christ cant believe so called brood war fans dont even know how retarded kespa is.

oh by the way here is the link to kespa saying "starcraft is public goods (LOL! )

http://www.gamemeca.com/news/news_view.html?seq=15&ymd=20100531&page=1&point_ck=1&search_ym=&sort_type=&search_text=&send=&mission_num=&mission_seq=


that's because they are looking toward the future of esport.

a sport or game for that matter is public property that belongs to the mass.

But then later we all learned that esport(s) are just fads.

Precisely, in fact it's disingenuous to actually use the term ESPORTS if it isn't public property.


Are you guys seriously saying the Starcraft (and SC2 as well?) are public domain? I thought that would be indefensible outside of Korea...

Nope we are saying it is no ESPORTS since it is not public domain.

On August 24 2012 12:03 LuckoftheIrish wrote:
On August 24 2012 11:50 artosismermaid wrote:
I hope some players quit their kespa teams and move to the federation teams, pretty funny how this deal was negotiated to have no team transfers for a year. I bet kespa spearheaded that move to further screw gom over


Not necessarily. The traditional BW teams also have more money. While this deal does prevent the GOM-affiliated teams from reaching out to potentially disaffected BW players, it also prevents a big, rich BW team from buying up players. Imagine if a team like KHAN, which IIRC has struggled in SC2, made offers to Creator, Hack, Maru, Vampire, Shine, Life, Yoda, Sniper and AcE. They could offer higher wages to those players, snapping up emerging talent, hurting the SC2 teams which can't compete financially while at the same time hurting their own younger practice players.

Khan is not struggling with SC2.


If that the bar is set that high, is there any game that would be ESport? I can't imagine a company spending the time, money, and effort to develop a popular game and then forfeit their right's on the work to put it in public domain.


Blizzard creates video games, not eSports.

eSports is the result of playing a game at a highly competitive level, and creating a production around it: maps, players, commentators, gaming booths, eSport stadiums, HUDs, hype videos, etc. What should be "public domain" is the ability to create eSports. This is derivative work, which the game producer does not create, and Blizzard didn't get involved in for a whole decade.

Blizzard has all the right to ask a fee for using Starcraft, but Blizzard demanding intellectual property of all the derivative work related to Starcraft was the original douchebag move.

Blizzard having big control on eSports is extremely dangerous. It makes eSports gravitate around the game Blizzard wants to sell, not the game that provides the better competition. They can stretch the life of Starcraft II as they see fit, or kill the game when they want to sell the next big thing. It sets everything up for planned obsolescence. It makes eSports nothing but glorified advertisement. And as I see it, a farce.

Love them or hate them, OGN, MBC and then KeSPA managed to create a scene where a game thrived way past its expected shelf life. The life of the game is no longer determined by the commercial interest of the game creator, but how well the organization can develop competition, groom talent, and provide a good product that attracts sponsors.

You know, like a real sport.

Thank you for finally pointing that out! While it might not be the original, it was a very big deal and the main reason why the IP fight went on for so long at the detriment of both but especially Blizzard.
CJ Entusman #50! #1 클템 fan TL!
jpak
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States5045 Posts
August 24 2012 04:26 GMT
#1460
On August 24 2012 13:23 LighT. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2012 13:15 jpak wrote:
On August 24 2012 13:06 LighT. wrote:
let's look at the sponsors for the Kespa Korean teams which makes up the federation that makes the final call:
CJ Entus
SKT1 Telecom
KT Rolster
Woojin
STX
Samsung Khan
Air Force Ace
Team 8.

Of this list; few things stand out.
Air Force Ace first of all, is a team that is to be discounted in future events as they're impeding any future recruits bringing a halt to their esport history.

So now..7 teams.
Of the 7 teams, Team 8 does NOT have a sponsor, and run purely by kespa

So now, we're looking at 6 teams.

CJ Entus, KT, SKT1 Telecom, are phone companies (much like Verizon in US, Telus in Canada), in which their focus in business is national across Korea rather than intentional. It would be illogical for them because expanding overseas would mean little to their entire aspect of sponsoring the team which is to advertise the brand name of their phone companies.
This ALSO hapepns to be where the giants of BW players stand: aka bisu, fantasy, flash, Leta, effort. They have quite the stronghold.

Woongjin just happens to be a bank firm. Like the telecom companies. Do they care about intentional recognition? No. because there's little beneficialness out of it. Their best interest is to let the product and their firm known in Korea, and could care less about the US.

STX Korea - Trading Company for creating Ships, trade and banking.
Samsung - Electronic Manufacturing Company.

These are 2 teams which are intentionally based. Aka. They WANT sponsorship and and their name value raised.
Most likely these teams want to venture more intentionally to make their product known and Samsung has especially let its voice heard in its eagerness for intentional relations having hosted League of Legends tournaments. If anyone's pushing the movement of Kespa towards the intentional,sponsor wise, it's these two teams.

As you can see, the final weight is rather large with an overwhelming amount of companies that only should care about national interest outnumbering those sponsors who would push for intentional interest. It's the interest of such why they're reluctant.

...

We've heard the coaches interviews with Coach Lee, January etc. and their views. We've heard interviews from Kespa players on their perspective as well. Of course, as gamers and people with passion of the game, they want to go outside of Korea, and grow the e-sports scene, play in GSL, play in MLG, Dreamhack, IPL etc. The coaches and the players are the last people to blame. Sadly, the politics doesn't work that way. under obligated contracts players have to do what they're told.

Kespa won't adjust that easy. They will eventually play in the GSL. That will happen, perhaps not this season, maybe not the next but in a few.
Why??
1) Fan pressure + uproar + to appease
2) In the interest of business (GomTV does have a korean audience after all)

The big announcement they have planned?
Most likely some national tournament to gain further exposure nationally within Korea because that's the sponsor's interest.

I almost wonder what the conversations are like amongst the representatives of each sponsor at meetings heh.

TL:DR; The coaches and players may have the passion and desire to play the game and expand esports; but the goal of Kespa is not of esports, I feel but nationally advertising their product which would not create an increase in stock, advertising overseas. Aka, they don't care about esports.


Just my two cents.


CJ is not a telecom company. CJ is an entertainment company and actually is the company that owns OGN.

Other than that, I think the best way to get Kespa to bend is through Team 8. If you offer up a major company willing to sponsor that team in return for certain conditions, then Kespa will consider.


The thing is...Kespa will never really care about e-sports at heart. Thats what people are failing to realize. That's why they're hated in Korea, and everywhere on this forums.
Teams like KT an SKT will pursue national expansion, Samsung and STX would likely pursue international expansion. Rifts will likely create and the organization is in for a mess. I can ultimately see a powerful company like Samsung disbanding from the organziation and running its own thing, as they are starting to in all honesty, but Kespa wont budge.
It's really not about Kespa wanting to create e-sports or killing it. It's about greed, money and interest and in their minds, its not intentional for a lot of teams.

And yes, my mistake on CJ, however, they are still seeking national attention than intentional and I think that's the key argument.

Of course they don't care about 'E-sports' at heart. They're businesses. Once 'E-sports' and their bottom lines don't align, they will either bend 'E-sports' till it does, or just move onto something else.

I still think a fire sale on Kespa players is going to happen in the next year or two.
CJ Entusman #50! #1 클템 fan TL!
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