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1 Month later... Is Queen Range still too strong [TvZ]? -…

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This thread is going nowhere and I'm tired of dealing with it. Either drop the personal attacks and whining and replace it with actual discussion or it'll be closed.

12:09 KST Page 98
BEARDiaguz
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Australia2362 Posts
June 20 2012 17:32 GMT
#421
On June 21 2012 02:06 KawaiiRice wrote:
its painful reading stuff in this thread from ppl that obviously do not play or understand the game at a high level ~~ like they think all the pros sit around and cry and haven't tried anything new ever since the patch... or that they understand something we never thought of lol



It's fucken ravens mate, haven't you ever heard of them?!?!?!!?!?!!?!?!!?!?!!?!?!?!?
ProgamerAustralian alcohol user follow @iaguzSC2
Algar
Profile Joined September 2010
United States27 Posts
June 20 2012 17:32 GMT
#422
Why isn't this just part of the designated balance discussion thread. Nothing new is being said that hasn't already been said there and the whole thread is just a loaded question anyhow.
Thanks. I like to play.
bakedace
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States672 Posts
June 20 2012 17:34 GMT
#423
On June 21 2012 02:31 Shiori wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:30 bakedace wrote:
On June 21 2012 02:06 KawaiiRice wrote:
its painful reading stuff in this thread from ppl that obviously do not play or understand the game at a high level ~~ like they think all the pros sit around and cry and haven't tried anything new ever since the patch... or that they understand something we never thought of lol


says the kid that said "all zergs are losing cause they are bad" back before all the nerfs / buffs.

It was a fact. I'm not sure what nerfs/buffs you're referring to, but for the past ~6 months at least, this has been the truth. Zergs are losing to all-ins, Archon Toilets, and other mistakes. No Zerg who plays a solid macro game and who scouts all-ins well is losing regularly unless they screw up hard.


This was way before the last 6 months. This was when the game came out and for about an entire year after that. ALOT of nerfs to terrans and protoss since then and almost none for zerg. The only major nerf to zerg in that time was the roach supply.
KawaiiRice
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States2914 Posts
June 20 2012 17:34 GMT
#424
On June 21 2012 02:30 bakedace wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:06 KawaiiRice wrote:
its painful reading stuff in this thread from ppl that obviously do not play or understand the game at a high level ~~ like they think all the pros sit around and cry and haven't tried anything new ever since the patch... or that they understand something we never thought of lol


says the kid that said "all zergs are losing cause they are bad" back before all the nerfs / buffs.

k? lol
@KawaiiRiceLighT
NaEjeOn88
Profile Joined August 2011
United States134 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-20 17:37:26
June 20 2012 17:36 GMT
#425
Banshee Raven dies to 4 queens even with pdd. End of discussion with that please.....

And Zerg is my new race pretty soon.

Also Recent zerg stats
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/2509/tgth.jpg

Also if i might add 2 zergs got out the group last night ez pz (GSL)
Shewklad
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden482 Posts
June 20 2012 17:37 GMT
#426
The argument "terran was op before, now you know how we feel" is really, really weird to me. Just cause they fucked up earlier doesn't mean they have to fuck up in another way again?
Bomber || Thorzain || Startale >< No gods, no masters.
Aphod
Profile Joined March 2012
United States72 Posts
June 20 2012 17:40 GMT
#427
On June 21 2012 02:36 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
Banshee Raven dies to 4 queens even with pdd. End of discussion with that please.....

Gonna have to disagree there. Two banshees and a raven can ravage the creep lines and either take out a queen or two, or fly away when the PDD is up.
Dude, suckin’ at something is the first step to being sorta good at something.
NaEjeOn88
Profile Joined August 2011
United States134 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-20 17:41:53
June 20 2012 17:41 GMT
#428
On June 21 2012 02:40 Swipe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:36 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
Banshee Raven dies to 4 queens even with pdd. End of discussion with that please.....

Gonna have to disagree there. Two banshees and a raven can ravage the creep lines and either take out a queen or two, or fly away when the PDD is up.


Not even gonna argue, you obviously dont play Terran.
Even idra said on state of the game how raven banshee isnt that great.
Sick of poeople saying this is the answwer. Thats a joke.
zhurai
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States5660 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-20 17:48:23
June 20 2012 17:47 GMT
#429
On June 21 2012 02:30 bakedace wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:06 KawaiiRice wrote:
its painful reading stuff in this thread from ppl that obviously do not play or understand the game at a high level ~~ like they think all the pros sit around and cry and haven't tried anything new ever since the patch... or that they understand something we never thought of lol


says the kid that said "all zergs are losing cause they are bad" back before all the nerfs / buffs.

on the bright side, if you do lose from all-ins/etc, then the zerg probably is actually really really really bad then - why aren't you making queens and units rather than lazily making drones


then again there's no stable all-in timing then so all timings are now also gimmicky
Twitter: @zhurai | Site: http://zhurai.com
TeslaTrooper
Profile Joined May 2011
United States8 Posts
June 20 2012 17:50 GMT
#430
On June 21 2012 02:31 Swipe wrote:
Banshee Raven is still a valid way to deny creep, Dreamhack taught us that. Terrans are figuring this out.

Yes please tell us how wildly succesful terran was at dreamhack.
NaEjeOn88
Profile Joined August 2011
United States134 Posts
June 20 2012 17:52 GMT
#431
On June 21 2012 02:50 TeslaTrooper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:31 Swipe wrote:
Banshee Raven is still a valid way to deny creep, Dreamhack taught us that. Terrans are figuring this out.

Yes please tell us how wildly succesful terran was at dreamhack.


Dont worry about him, he obviously dosnt do his research and is just a random protoss bronze kid.
ScoSteSal
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States54 Posts
June 20 2012 17:55 GMT
#432
um, im sorry, but since any strategy using significant numbers of queens has pathetic ability to put on pressure (invested 300-600 extra mins in something that flat-out cannot attack), so if you scout your opponent going for mass queens why not go 4-5 OC on 2 base with lots of bunkers and/or PF's/good simcity and then go from there?
Iustum Agere Arduum Est...Sed Modo Sine Day9o
ProxyKnoxy
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom2576 Posts
June 20 2012 17:57 GMT
#433
On June 21 2012 02:55 ScoSteSal wrote:
um, im sorry, but since any strategy using significant numbers of queens has pathetic ability to put on pressure (invested 300-600 extra mins in something that flat-out cannot attack), so if you scout your opponent going for mass queens why not go 4-5 OC on 2 base with lots of bunkers and/or PF's/good simcity and then go from there?


Watch DRG vs MKP game 2 at MLG Anaheim. MKP was about as greedy as you could possibly be, but DRG just maxed at like 12 mins on muta/bling and went and killed him.
"Zealot try give mariners high five. Mariners not like high five and try hide and shoot zealot"
Blyadischa
Profile Joined April 2010
419 Posts
June 20 2012 17:59 GMT
#434
On June 21 2012 02:55 ScoSteSal wrote:
um, im sorry, but since any strategy using significant numbers of queens has pathetic ability to put on pressure (invested 300-600 extra mins in something that flat-out cannot attack), so if you scout your opponent going for mass queens why not go 4-5 OC on 2 base with lots of bunkers and/or PF's/good simcity and then go from there?


Zerg will max out by 14 minutes with 75% of the map covered in creep while terran is getting his/her 4th CC up. Even then, it doesn't help at all, zerg has a deathball late game army comp while terran doesn't
zhurai
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States5660 Posts
June 20 2012 17:59 GMT
#435
On June 21 2012 02:57 ProxyKnoxy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:55 ScoSteSal wrote:
um, im sorry, but since any strategy using significant numbers of queens has pathetic ability to put on pressure (invested 300-600 extra mins in something that flat-out cannot attack), so if you scout your opponent going for mass queens why not go 4-5 OC on 2 base with lots of bunkers and/or PF's/good simcity and then go from there?


Watch DRG vs MKP game 2 at MLG Anaheim. MKP was about as greedy as you could possibly be, but DRG just maxed at like 12 mins on muta/bling and went and killed him.

or if the Z scouts this, they get ridiculously fast hive, which is harder to deal with for terran.
Twitter: @zhurai | Site: http://zhurai.com
Fission
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada1184 Posts
June 20 2012 18:00 GMT
#436
On June 21 2012 02:36 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
Banshee Raven dies to 4 queens even with pdd. End of discussion with that please.....

And Zerg is my new race pretty soon.

Also Recent zerg stats
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/2509/tgth.jpg

Also if i might add 2 zergs got out the group last night ez pz (GSL)

Those stats look fine to me...
KawaiiRice
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States2914 Posts
June 20 2012 18:02 GMT
#437
On June 21 2012 02:55 ScoSteSal wrote:
um, im sorry, but since any strategy using significant numbers of queens has pathetic ability to put on pressure (invested 300-600 extra mins in something that flat-out cannot attack), so if you scout your opponent going for mass queens why not go 4-5 OC on 2 base with lots of bunkers and/or PF's/good simcity and then go from there?

terran making extra cc's delays their production. anything past a fast 3rd base isnt beneficial at all because 4th base isnt useful in the slightest since we aren't gas-starved and anything over 3base saturation is bad.
on the other hand since all z production comes from hatch them playing greedy doesnt have the same effect ... at all. so going 4 cc's or more is worse for terran basically lol
@KawaiiRiceLighT
zhurai
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States5660 Posts
June 20 2012 18:03 GMT
#438
On June 21 2012 03:00 Fission wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 02:36 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
Banshee Raven dies to 4 queens even with pdd. End of discussion with that please.....

And Zerg is my new race pretty soon.

Also Recent zerg stats
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/2509/tgth.jpg

Also if i might add 2 zergs got out the group last night ez pz (GSL)

Those stats look fine to me...

all pretty much green and red huh.
Twitter: @zhurai | Site: http://zhurai.com
algue
Profile Joined July 2011
France1436 Posts
June 20 2012 18:06 GMT
#439
On June 21 2012 03:03 zhurai wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 03:00 Fission wrote:
On June 21 2012 02:36 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
Banshee Raven dies to 4 queens even with pdd. End of discussion with that please.....

And Zerg is my new race pretty soon.

Also Recent zerg stats
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/2509/tgth.jpg

Also if i might add 2 zergs got out the group last night ez pz (GSL)

Those stats look fine to me...

all pretty much green and red huh.


Don't you see the blue dot ? Terran OP !
rly ?
dragoon
Profile Joined December 2010
United States695 Posts
June 20 2012 18:09 GMT
#440
"If Zerg is investing so much into queens, Terran can do a Triple Orbital build to get a faster third to get ahead."
- Yes, but this thread is talking about how terran can use their early-midgame army to punish Zerg mass queen. But for the sake of argument, Triple CC is a great build however, the goal of Triple CC is to get ahead economically in the midgame so you can kill the zerg in his lategame. Yes, Kill the Zerg in his LATEGAME. Ironic because lategame is Terrans weakest and Zergs strongest.


this is the same thing that zergs go through in PvZ
i love you
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