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I really can't take this part about imbalance serious. What is his problem? Does he wanna force Blizzard to buff his race that the race which is already doing by far best in pro play since the release of the game gets even better? This is really rediculous. The fact he says Protoss is the strongest, then Zerg and then Terran is just the complete opposite then the results in pro play show. Protoss is doing better right now but both Zerg and Protoss struggled since the release. Only Terran can win constantly it seems like. The fact that so many BW pros switch away from Zerg shows that it isn't Zerg which is OP...
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I don't understand why people are arguing.
Everyone knows protoss is OP , Flash just confirmed it.
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So protoss is imba because Flash says so. The amount of championships taken by the so called imba toss and the statistics support his claim.
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Just because he's Flash doesn't mean he's right, it's SC2 after all not BW.
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Protoss is overpowered so I hope they balance it out.
LOL xD terra has most wins and even this season will mvp win and again a p is to strong talk ...
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If there's one single persons opinion I'd put over all others, despite having less experience with the game, it's fucking Lee Young Ho's.
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On May 12 2012 06:42 S_SienZ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:39 testthewest wrote:On May 12 2012 06:29 RazorHedge wrote:On May 12 2012 06:21 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:18 Skaminator wrote:On May 12 2012 06:09 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:07 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 06:05 Bayyne wrote:On May 12 2012 06:04 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 05:56 rEalGuapo wrote:
[quote]
He said that Colossus tech is cheap compared to the Vikings you had to get.
He stated that for 2 Colossi you need about 8 Vikings and that eats too much into your Bio.
8 Vikings = 600 Gas.
2 Colossi = 800 Gas, yeah so cheap.... you obviously need the range upgrade, or you will not force Vikings.
After I heard him say that 2 Colossi cost less Gas then 6-8 Vikings I shut down the stream in anger.
So I could not care less about his opinion, that is like IdrA saying Vortex is imbalanced while he INTENTIONALLY moves his entire army into one only to prove his point instead of having spread his units in the first place.
collossi cost 300/200 though. sorry, but lol. He's factoring in the Thermal Lance upgrade. it's 200 200, so 2 collossi with thermal lance still arent 800. I love your ignorance you still need the robotics bay. Guess the Gas cost, Guess it. Or do you think every Protoss has it anyway because of the Obvserver upgrades? Well then Observers are pretty freaking expensive for the fact that every decent player can see them and kill them with one scan. 1 Broodlord 850 gas yes? completely out of context. He was talking about a very specific example, 2 Colossi vs Bio/Vikings which actually is a pretty common situation. I'm not trying to pick a fight or anything here,just trying to understand, but unless you're 4-gating it's pretty safe to assume EVERY protoss gets at least 1 robo, so you can substract that to the equation. Also, if the Viking/Colossus Ratio is 4 to 1. That requires 2 reactored starports te let's say.. have "equivalent" production. Not completely necessary though. But if you are constantly producing Colos, 2 SP comes by default. You are also forgetting +1 air attack, (At least, and it does count since you are considering thermal lance) So, again, not trying to pick a fight, but I do think the argument to analyze here is a different one, since we can safely assume the costs for that tech are pretty much alike. Is how cost effective are the units for that cost? My pick goes for the colos. P.S: I'm just stating simple scenarios and using basic math, not implying OPness or w/e. Why do you need 2 Starports? Isn't Viking build time 42s and colossus 75 sec? so one reactored starport is already enough to get to a ratio of 1:3,5. 2 Starports will get you to 1:7 ratio (collossus /viking). +1 air attack is absolute unnessecary to fight 2 colossus, while thermal lance is absolute nessecary to even force viking. Otherwise the Marauders kill a colossus in 2 volleys (=stimmed marauders =2sec) Because there's no large pop up saying "I'm making Colossi". If T goes blind air and P goes HT T loses. Also, if you only have 1 Starport you won't be able to keep up Medivac production. And saying that T can't protect their Medivacs is a bit unfair considering after a certain point HTs one shot them.
Well if Terrran, that can always drop and scout this way or just Scan BLINDLY switches to Vikings I would not consider his opinion on Balance, Strategy or anything revolving around Starcraft 2 relevant.
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I just think Terrans don't have any end game advantage vs toss. Toss has kept its AoE from SC1 whilst Terran mech is nerfed (tanks do less damage / cost more food, and toss have blink to bulldog the tanks). Bio will always only be a timing strategy before tosses get their AoE.
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the whine rate in this thread is too damn high.
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how can terran win everything and call themself worst 
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I can understand Flash's issue with warpgate. The Instant units makes it unbelievable strong late game. If that is fixed, and toss is given an early game buff, everything would be fine.
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God said "protoss is overpowered"
Blizzard continues to Buff protoss.
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Well, Protoss huh? They needed faster observers though.
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Every top terran has brought up the issue of Protoss being too strong in the late game. Why are people complaining that Flash brought it up? I hope someone can compile some statistics of win rates in late game TvP.
A game is not balanced when Terrans are sitting on a time bomb, which Blizzard apparently thinks is ok according to their latest statements and patches.
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On May 12 2012 06:45 FidoDido wrote:
God said "protoss is overpowered"
Blizzard continues to Buff protoss.
Because a god of BW is not instantly fit for commenting on the Balance of Command and Conquer.
Or SC II
Or any other game except BW.
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On May 12 2012 06:06 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:04 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 05:56 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 05:46 Tippecanoe wrote:Implying hes the only pro to say that protoss was a bit too strong. Demuslim talked about it on his stream for about 5-10 minutes or so and he had really good points with real evidence. He said that Colossus tech is cheap compared to the Vikings you had to get. He stated that for 2 Colossi you need about 8 Vikings and that eats too much into your Bio. 8 Vikings = 600 Gas. 2 Colossi = 800 Gas, yeah so cheap.... you obviously need the range upgrade, or you will not force Vikings. After I heard him say that 2 Colossi cost less Gas then 6-8 Vikings I shut down the stream in anger. So I could not care less about his opinion, that is like IdrA saying Vortex is imbalanced while he INTENTIONALLY moves his entire army into one only to prove his point instead of having spread his units in the first place. collossi cost 300/200 though. sorry, but lol. yes but you need robbotics bay and the range upgrade 200 gas each, I do not count the starport that you have anyway same as Robo itself sorry but think.
Wow, really terrible logic. Have you even considered that vikings need seperate upgrades? Can you even comprehend how much it will cost to get my vikings to 3-3 so they can go up against your 3-3 army? I can't, so I just have to do with 3-0 vikings to fight an army with 3 attack and 3 armor. Now how's that for fair? I think Protoss have the better end whatever a robotics bay and/or what thermal lance costs.
A collosi switch can only be benefitial since: 1. Vikings suck. Period. They don't share upgrades with your main army and they are no good in a stratight up fight except for dealing with collosi. 2. They take up your starport so you can't make medivacs. 3. It will kill you if you are not prepared or at the very least cripple you.
I can't see why a protoss would not go collosi but I can see several reason why Terran really wouldn't want to get vikings if it weren't for the fact that we are forced to make them in order to survive the ultimate 1-a unit.
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On May 12 2012 06:47 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:45 FidoDido wrote:
God said "protoss is overpowered"
Blizzard continues to Buff protoss. Because a god of BW is not instantly fit for commenting on the Balance of Command and Conquer. Or SC II Or any other game except BW.
Blasphemy!
at least Jinro can sleep easy now.
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On May 12 2012 06:38 DemigodcelpH wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:30 testthewest wrote:
Somewhat funny:
He says: "I'm a noob!" (perhaps by progamer standarts)
But then whines about balance, it would make Idra pale... Flash is VERY humble. 14-0 win streaks in tournament matches is him being "noob". Additionally it's not "whine". It's an interview, and was he asked those questions.
I know he is a champion. But I used HIS WORDS. He feels like a noob in SC2. Just read his first answer (ffs)!!
The interviewer only asked about balance, as Flash used the first opportunity to whine (a very open question 3 "What are some difficulties for you?")
For somebody that hasn't watched any VoDs (stated in Interview, read before you hate on me for that), for somebody that doesn't even know what foreign tournament exist, that's quite a bold statement.
Sure he is honest, if he knew how much terran is dominating SC2 he would say such things.
Or just switch to toss, flash! We haven't had a toss champion for over a year in the GSL, we could use your help!
Show us your protoss imbalance!
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On May 12 2012 06:30 Skaminator wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:20 Roxor9999 wrote:On May 12 2012 06:15 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 06:09 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:07 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 06:05 Bayyne wrote:On May 12 2012 06:04 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 05:56 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 05:46 Tippecanoe wrote:Implying hes the only pro to say that protoss was a bit too strong. Demuslim talked about it on his stream for about 5-10 minutes or so and he had really good points with real evidence. He said that Colossus tech is cheap compared to the Vikings you had to get. He stated that for 2 Colossi you need about 8 Vikings and that eats too much into your Bio. 8 Vikings = 600 Gas. 2 Colossi = 800 Gas, yeah so cheap.... you obviously need the range upgrade, or you will not force Vikings. After I heard him say that 2 Colossi cost less Gas then 6-8 Vikings I shut down the stream in anger. So I could not care less about his opinion, that is like IdrA saying Vortex is imbalanced while he INTENTIONALLY moves his entire army into one only to prove his point instead of having spread his units in the first place. collossi cost 300/200 though. sorry, but lol. He's factoring in the Thermal Lance upgrade. it's 200 200, so 2 collossi with thermal lance still arent 800. I love your ignorance you still need the robotics bay. Guess the Gas cost, Guess it. Or do you think every Protoss has it anyway because of the Obvserver upgrades? Well then Observers are pretty freaking expensive for the fact that every decent player can see them and kill them with one scan. like i said. for vikings you need a second starport and additional upgrades. so please consider these costs too. 200 150 for the starport 525 525 for level3 attack upgrades. Well then the colossus cost Colossus= 300 200 3/3/3 upgrades= 1575 1575 Extended Thermal Lance= 200 200 Robotics Bay= 200 200 Robotic Facility=200 100 In total: 2475 minerals 2275 gas 1 Broodlord 200 spawning pool 150 100 lair infestation pit 100 100 hive 200 150 spire 200 200 greater spire 100 150 Corruptor 150 100 Brood lord morph 150 150 3/3 air 3/3 land upgrades 525 525 675 675 450 450 675 675 3575 minerals 3175 gas
Spawning Pool is 250 minerals since you sacrifice a drone for it as well, and infestation pit and spire is also 150 and 250.
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Well I think he´s right with TvP. But I also think Zerg is way stronger than Protoss and Terran.
Hope Flashs words have impact 
Greetings.
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The amount of Protoss damage control in this topic is astounding. Everybody is entitled to their opinion, and, believe it or not, a lot of people want to know Flash's opinion on balance.
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EPT
