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On May 12 2012 23:25 Belha wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 02:04 lastshadow wrote:On May 12 2012 02:03 QuanticTheognis wrote:
I heard from a Korean friend that word is going around that Jaedong is already gm on the KR server D: Not true. The only Pro that is GM is Effort, well, in the 'S' class sc1 progamers. Enough with the stupid GM debate. GM does not work properly, any top top master is as good as any gm, even more in korea. The system pick just 200 random names in above certain mmr level, and there are like +350 players above that line in korea. Huk is in masters, flash is in masters, hero was in masters in some season, nestea was masters, MC is master, ganzi is master, there is some koreans top masters with +65 win%; while tod, yong or princess are in gm.
And MKP has multiple accounts in Master, obviously.
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I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc
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On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc
Dare to dream.
I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse.
If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up.
Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit.
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On May 12 2012 23:25 Belha wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 02:04 lastshadow wrote:On May 12 2012 02:03 QuanticTheognis wrote:
I heard from a Korean friend that word is going around that Jaedong is already gm on the KR server D: Not true. The only Pro that is GM is Effort, well, in the 'S' class sc1 progamers. Enough with the stupid GM debate. GM does not work properly, any top top master is as good as any gm, even more in korea. The system pick just 200 random names in above certain mmr level, and there are like +350 players above that line in korea. Huk is in masters, flash is in masters, hero was in masters in some season, nestea was masters, MC is master, ganzi is master, there is some koreans top masters with +65 win%; while tod, yong or princess are in gm.
Meanwhile ForGG has 3 accounts in grandmaster on korea.
Ladder hero number 1.
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On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit.
As much as I love watching player streams(And would kill to watch Flash or Bisu or any TBLS stream) I agree with you completely.
Also KeSPA/BW teams 99% likely won't let their players stream.
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Regular streaming doesn't work when you have a Proleague system. All their time revolves around preparing or helping other players to prepare for televised games. They have no time for independent streaming.
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On May 12 2012 23:40 Necro)Phagist( wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. As much as I love watching player streams(And would kill to watch Flash or Bisu or any TBLS stream) I agree with you completely. Also KeSPA/BW teams 99% likely won't let their players stream.
At the point where different teams are not even practicing Sc2 together, streams seems unlikely any time soon.
For those unfamiliar with the BW teams, i will note that players do practice and play casually together against each other normally. However, with the transition going on they're keeping their cards close to their chests and not letting anyone openly practice out of house.
I'll repeat my earlier request - does anyone have a link to the vod (not replay) of the Flash v KawaiiRice game that works? The one back on pg 41 doesn't work for me, i just get his page, but can't access recordings.
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Awesome! Well, he still needs a lot of work, obviously all the top BW players will have the mechanics to drop them in master league, but the gap between being solid masters and the current top level of the SC2 pros is going to take a lot longer to bridge. I'm glad MOST people seem to be changing their opinion that the BW pro's will just come out and roll the current sc2 scene within a month or something silly though. I'm just looking forward to hopefully seeing flash and JD etc in tournaments with the GSL pros and top foreigners when they get to that level, thats when all this will get really interesting! Good post though.
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GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit.
Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental.
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On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental.
There is a lot of emphasis on hiding specific strategies, but teams do allow players to practice online together normally. They're just not now with Sc2.
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yeah i remember when progamers release their replays it was like getting a gift from god. of course it was like 2-3 year old. now a days everyone sharing replays and will just hurt them in the long run.
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he looks unbelievably clean
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On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental.
I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse.
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On May 13 2012 00:13 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental. I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse.
When they transition to SC2 this will have to change.
The way bnet work in SC2 it will be hard to withhold information about games.
Also, the game isn't as figured out as Brood war was yet.
In order to make sure that your builds are solid, laddering a lot will be of great importance.
This means that players will be identifiable through things like their hotkey setup.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES50577 Posts
On May 13 2012 00:34 one-one-one wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2012 00:13 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental. I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse. When they transition to SC2 this will have to change. The way bnet work in SC2 it will be hard to withhold information about games. Also, the game isn't as figured out as Brood war was yet. In order to make sure that your builds are solid, laddering a lot will be of great importance. This means that players will be identifiable through things like their hotkey setup.
it doesn't have to change, you just want it to change.
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On May 13 2012 00:04 tx.zyclon wrote:
he looks unbelievably clean
yeah, I guess he takes a shower everyday 
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On May 13 2012 00:35 BLinD-RawR wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2012 00:34 one-one-one wrote:On May 13 2012 00:13 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental. I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse. When they transition to SC2 this will have to change. The way bnet work in SC2 it will be hard to withhold information about games. Also, the game isn't as figured out as Brood war was yet. In order to make sure that your builds are solid, laddering a lot will be of great importance. This means that players will be identifiable through things like their hotkey setup. it doesn't have to change, you just want it to change.
People already created maps that can hide build orders, so it's really easy to hide your practice.
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On May 13 2012 00:34 one-one-one wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2012 00:13 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental. I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse. When they transition to SC2 this will have to change. The way bnet work in SC2 it will be hard to withhold information about games. Also, the game isn't as figured out as Brood war was yet. In order to make sure that your builds are solid, laddering a lot will be of great importance. This means that players will be identifiable through things like their hotkey setup.
That has never changed and I'm well aware of the new features of B.Net 2.0 and there are ways of hiding accounts if they don't play ladder at all and play on practice accounts in custom games with their practice partners.
Yes, Blizzard made it a bitch, but it is possible.
They can do whatever they want on ladder accounts. As for streaming. That can change as well. What do I mean by this ambiguous statement? Anything can happen. It can either open up or close up. In either case, we're going to see a lot of changes in the business model. It's going to be very soon too.
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On May 13 2012 00:41 SolHeiM wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2012 00:35 BLinD-RawR wrote:On May 13 2012 00:34 one-one-one wrote:On May 13 2012 00:13 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental. I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse. When they transition to SC2 this will have to change. The way bnet work in SC2 it will be hard to withhold information about games. Also, the game isn't as figured out as Brood war was yet. In order to make sure that your builds are solid, laddering a lot will be of great importance. This means that players will be identifiable through things like their hotkey setup. it doesn't have to change, you just want it to change. People already created maps that can hide build orders, so it's really easy to hide your practice.
Both of you miss the point.
Sc2 players need to play a lot of ladder.
When doing this, they will be identifiable through the replays.
The culture in SC2 is more open. Tournaments often release all the replays.
It is also doable to extract most useful information about builds etc from the vods in tournaments like the GSL that don't release replay packs.
This is not bad. The build orders only tell you so much. It is the execution that matters. Micro and decision making
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On May 13 2012 01:02 one-one-one wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2012 00:41 SolHeiM wrote:On May 13 2012 00:35 BLinD-RawR wrote:On May 13 2012 00:34 one-one-one wrote:On May 13 2012 00:13 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:56 amazingxkcd wrote:On May 12 2012 23:33 StarStruck wrote:On May 12 2012 23:31 Fabozi wrote:
I want to see the numbers when Flash starts streaming. I he does ofc Dare to dream. I honestly hope KeSPA doesn't agree to twitch or own3d's services. Some things are better to keep inhouse. If you want to add value to your tournaments and make it must-see. Player streams have to go and wages have to go up. Way too much overexposure atm when it comes to certain players and it's a bad habit. Kespa players cant stream nor share replays. Its to protect their strategies and keep their practice confidental. I am well aware of this and that's why I hope they continue to keep things inhouse. When they transition to SC2 this will have to change. The way bnet work in SC2 it will be hard to withhold information about games. Also, the game isn't as figured out as Brood war was yet. In order to make sure that your builds are solid, laddering a lot will be of great importance. This means that players will be identifiable through things like their hotkey setup. it doesn't have to change, you just want it to change. People already created maps that can hide build orders, so it's really easy to hide your practice. Both of you miss the point. Sc2 players need to play a lot of ladder. When doing this, they will be identifiable through the replays. The culture in SC2 is more open. Tournaments often release all the replays. It is also doable to extract most useful information about builds etc from the vods in tournaments like the GSL that don't release replay packs. This is not bad. The build orders only tell you so much. It is the execution that matters. Micro and decision making
There's no inherent reason why pro's need to ladder in Sc2. Pros rarely laddered in BW because they were so much better than the players on the ladder, and it was more valuable to practice with teammates, out of house practice partners, and other teams. On Iccup, pro's would skyrocket to A and hold 80% or higher win rates, it just wasn't worth the time. Right now, the difference between pro's and top ladderers in sc2 is large, but not so large that the ladder isn't a valuable part of training. Add in the need for many pro's to stream to supplement their income, and there's a decent chance that pros will hit other pros on the ladder, making it worth their time.
This will soon change. BW teams are sufficiently funded that streaming isn't a financial necessity, With the exception of Team 8, all the BW teams are large enough to have a strong internal practice environment, an environment which will only grow stronger as they bring in practice partners, acquire GSL players, and start practicing custom's with each other. Low to mid level pro's will ladder to maintain awareness of what's going on, but by the end of the year i expect anyone whose being played regularly in PL to not practice on the ladder at all. And once the best pro's aren't practicing on ladder, the value of mid level pro's practicing there goes down.
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EPT
