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On May 10 2012 11:34 IMoperator wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 11:29 Blazinghand wrote:On May 10 2012 11:25 S_SienZ wrote:
Way to slap Terrans in the face. Terrans have historically had the most success at the professional level, and are generally regarded as the strongest race + Show Spoiler [GSL 2012 S2] +If you don't count the Ro4 results from this most recent GSL . The 5-range queen will be stronger against reapers and hellions, but won't be nearly as strong as the 50-energy queen. Overall, Blizzard made some relatively mild buffs to the non-terran races, and that's okay. These are huge buffs, it changes terrans early game entirely. The three most common openings TvZ were reactor hellion, 2 rax or reaper of some sort. This queen buff just completely denies all of these. Sure, it's not as bad as the 50 energy queen, but it's still pretty bad for terrans.
Perhaps the reason those are the most common openings is because they're easy to execute with almost no investment for the terran, yet for the zerg one minor mistake will literally just lose them the game outright? It's not like it's an opening that punishes greedy builds or something, all of those builds punish zergs for being zerg.
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On May 10 2012 16:28 Kich wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 11:34 IMoperator wrote:On May 10 2012 11:29 Blazinghand wrote:On May 10 2012 11:25 S_SienZ wrote:
Way to slap Terrans in the face. Terrans have historically had the most success at the professional level, and are generally regarded as the strongest race + Show Spoiler [GSL 2012 S2] +If you don't count the Ro4 results from this most recent GSL . The 5-range queen will be stronger against reapers and hellions, but won't be nearly as strong as the 50-energy queen. Overall, Blizzard made some relatively mild buffs to the non-terran races, and that's okay. These are huge buffs, it changes terrans early game entirely. The three most common openings TvZ were reactor hellion, 2 rax or reaper of some sort. This queen buff just completely denies all of these. Sure, it's not as bad as the 50 energy queen, but it's still pretty bad for terrans. Perhaps the reason those are the most common openings is because they're easy to execute with almost no investment for the terran, yet for the zerg one minor mistake will literally just lose them the game outright? It's not like it's an opening that punishes greedy builds or something, all of those builds punish zergs for being zerg.
tvz is the most balanced matchup. don't change what's not broken. with these huge maps nowadays, i have no trouble defending early attacks unless i play incredibly greedy. absolutely unnecessary buff to the queen.
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big buff for Z ...awesome !
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On May 10 2012 16:08 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:05 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. Except it doesn't just stop hellion openers. It stops like 3-4 different openers. Even IF there becomes a new opener, that will most likely be one of the only ones, simply because Zerg knows the other ones aren't as viable. it doesnt "stop" anything. u do not realize how stupidly bad queen DPS is. make enough marines and they pop... the only thing this buff does is make it to where u need to make MORE of a certain unit instead of getting away with just 4 hellions or 1 or 2 bunkers worth of rines. make more then 4 hellions and u can still easily deny tumors and expansions... u only need one volley to kill a tumor, u really think 6 or so hellions will die by one or 2 queens by the time that volley goes off? please.
Except I'm fully aware how quickly queens kill hellions. As it is, they are already an incredibly effective deterrent. There's no way you can deny creep tumors with 4 hellions vs this new change, you're crazy. And you're talking to a Zerg who bases his entire ZvT strategy on creep spread with multiple queens.
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Terran
* Bunker is not changed
LMAO. I find this to be the most hilarious change of them all. Or non-chance, considering that they've been messing with bunker build times since the beginning of time, especially with bunker rushes be prevalent since the beginning of time in both BW and SC2.
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I am totally fine with the Zerg changes... but I am not sure about the obs build time. Is it really needed?
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On May 10 2012 11:33 S_SienZ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 11:30 Blazinghand wrote:On May 10 2012 11:29 S_SienZ wrote:On May 10 2012 11:27 pPingu wrote:* Queen anti-ground weapon attack range increased from 3 to 5 ... This is such a big nerf to reapers, helions and bunker rushes Did they provide any reason behind those choices? They let us choose between super imba 50 energy and this. This had less harsh feedback. Kinda like telling hostages you're gonna kill them and saying you're just gonna starve them instead. I think you're taking things just a LITTLE out of proportion here. It's not like queens are suddenly outranging hellions or bunkers or reaper bunkers or something. Yes, it's a buff, but it's milder than the energy buff. I'm more disappointed in it not because it's overpowered, but it detracts from the game. Why bother microing hellions against queens anymore (if on creep) if they have the same range?
Hellions take forever to kill a queen....
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On May 10 2012 16:22 Femari wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:19 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:15 KivTM wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. hellions kill queens even slower lol. so whats your point? you do realize that hellions main purpose is to NOT kill a queen right? why try to kill a queen with hellions? there main purpose is to deny creep spread, stop zerg from taking a fast 3rd, clear watch towers, gain map control, and etc. all of which they are still able to do even with the buff to queens.... On May 10 2012 16:19 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:16 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:14 SgtCoDFish wrote:
I'd love for someone to explain how hellions are now "useless" in TvZ
Hellions have 90HP. Queens have an attack power of 4x2, to give 8 if the zerg doesn't micro the queen halfway through the attack. We'll assume zerg's not doing that.
It still takes 12 shots from a queen to kill a single hellion. The queen attacks once every second. There are 4 hellions.
Hellions shouldn't be in range of queens when creep isn't being spread, which occurs once every 30 to 40 seconds; they should be their attack range away from the edge of the creep. When creep is being spread (or if a drone comes out to take a quick third) hellions should be darting in and out to kill or force cancels on tumours.
This patch doesn't change any of the above AT ALL. It just means that hellions will take some extra shots where they wouldn't have before. The micro involved here is pulling back damaged hellions if you really want to engage a queen. But you shouldn't be doing that.
So what does the patch affect with regards to hellion openers? Barely anything; hellions are still a hell (no terrible pun intended) of a lot faster, so any attempts by zerg to spread creep greedily are just as denied as they were before. Darting in and popping a tumour is still the same as it was. There will be a "dance" between hellions and queens to deny creep, but queens aren't going to start spearing hellions and snapping them in half. Hellions will still also deny any attempt to take a third until roaches or lings are out to fend them off.
Hellions are slightly worse, but will still be able to do their job... every time something is nerfed even a little, hordes of people seem to say it's now useless. hellions arnt useless, ppl are just overreacting like babies once again... they will get over it in less then a week once they find out how fail queen DPS truly is. hellions do less damage to queens bud again, whats your point? My point is to show you that the queen's DPS is irrelevant.
queen DPS has always been irrelevant and so has hellions... u dont kill a queen with a hellion unless the zerg is awful anyway. the new range buff is simply to fend off a low number of hellions unless the zerg makes a shit ton of queens.
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The overlord and obs changes should make some huge impacts.
I don't know if the obs change is really necessary, but I think the overlord change should help out zergs a lot
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On May 10 2012 16:34 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:22 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:19 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:15 KivTM wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. hellions kill queens even slower lol. so whats your point? you do realize that hellions main purpose is to NOT kill a queen right? why try to kill a queen with hellions? there main purpose is to deny creep spread, stop zerg from taking a fast 3rd, clear watch towers, gain map control, and etc. all of which they are still able to do even with the buff to queens.... On May 10 2012 16:19 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:16 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:14 SgtCoDFish wrote:
I'd love for someone to explain how hellions are now "useless" in TvZ
Hellions have 90HP. Queens have an attack power of 4x2, to give 8 if the zerg doesn't micro the queen halfway through the attack. We'll assume zerg's not doing that.
It still takes 12 shots from a queen to kill a single hellion. The queen attacks once every second. There are 4 hellions.
Hellions shouldn't be in range of queens when creep isn't being spread, which occurs once every 30 to 40 seconds; they should be their attack range away from the edge of the creep. When creep is being spread (or if a drone comes out to take a quick third) hellions should be darting in and out to kill or force cancels on tumours.
This patch doesn't change any of the above AT ALL. It just means that hellions will take some extra shots where they wouldn't have before. The micro involved here is pulling back damaged hellions if you really want to engage a queen. But you shouldn't be doing that.
So what does the patch affect with regards to hellion openers? Barely anything; hellions are still a hell (no terrible pun intended) of a lot faster, so any attempts by zerg to spread creep greedily are just as denied as they were before. Darting in and popping a tumour is still the same as it was. There will be a "dance" between hellions and queens to deny creep, but queens aren't going to start spearing hellions and snapping them in half. Hellions will still also deny any attempt to take a third until roaches or lings are out to fend them off.
Hellions are slightly worse, but will still be able to do their job... every time something is nerfed even a little, hordes of people seem to say it's now useless. hellions arnt useless, ppl are just overreacting like babies once again... they will get over it in less then a week once they find out how fail queen DPS truly is. hellions do less damage to queens bud again, whats your point? My point is to show you that the queen's DPS is irrelevant. queen DPS has always been irrelevant and so has hellions... u dont kill a queen with a hellion unless the zerg is awful anyway. the new range buff is simply to fend off a low number of hellions unless the zerg makes a shit ton of queens.
why? do people have such a hard time defending against a low number of hellions that blizzard needs to buff the queen? i never have trouble when people reactor hellion expand and use a few hellions to deny creep. also isn't blizzard's main goal to balance at the highest level? tvz is statistically incredibly even. why change it?
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The observer change is more significant than it seems. It means faster immortal busts, faster colossi, or faster blink stalker all ins.
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On May 10 2012 16:31 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:08 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:05 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. Except it doesn't just stop hellion openers. It stops like 3-4 different openers. Even IF there becomes a new opener, that will most likely be one of the only ones, simply because Zerg knows the other ones aren't as viable. it doesnt "stop" anything. u do not realize how stupidly bad queen DPS is. make enough marines and they pop... the only thing this buff does is make it to where u need to make MORE of a certain unit instead of getting away with just 4 hellions or 1 or 2 bunkers worth of rines. make more then 4 hellions and u can still easily deny tumors and expansions... u only need one volley to kill a tumor, u really think 6 or so hellions will die by one or 2 queens by the time that volley goes off? please. Except I'm fully aware how quickly queens kill hellions. As it is, they are already an incredibly effective deterrent. There's no way you can deny creep tumors with 4 hellions vs this new change, you're crazy. And you're talking to a Zerg who bases his entire ZvT strategy on creep spread with multiple queens.
thats my point and the point of this change. queens are to make it where zerg has a easier time defending against LOW number of hellions, but queens wont do shit against higher hellion counts unless u completely over make a ton of queens.
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It is kinda okay that we zergies finally got a buff but this ruins ZvZ a bit. They need to fix that as well.
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On May 10 2012 16:38 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:31 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:08 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:05 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. Except it doesn't just stop hellion openers. It stops like 3-4 different openers. Even IF there becomes a new opener, that will most likely be one of the only ones, simply because Zerg knows the other ones aren't as viable. it doesnt "stop" anything. u do not realize how stupidly bad queen DPS is. make enough marines and they pop... the only thing this buff does is make it to where u need to make MORE of a certain unit instead of getting away with just 4 hellions or 1 or 2 bunkers worth of rines. make more then 4 hellions and u can still easily deny tumors and expansions... u only need one volley to kill a tumor, u really think 6 or so hellions will die by one or 2 queens by the time that volley goes off? please. Except I'm fully aware how quickly queens kill hellions. As it is, they are already an incredibly effective deterrent. There's no way you can deny creep tumors with 4 hellions vs this new change, you're crazy. And you're talking to a Zerg who bases his entire ZvT strategy on creep spread with multiple queens. thats my point and the point of this change. queens are to make it where zerg has a easier time defending against LOW number of hellions, but queens wont do shit against higher hellion counts unless u completely over make a ton of queens.
Unless you're terrible you shouldn't have problems defending low amounts of hellions.
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On May 10 2012 16:38 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:31 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:08 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:05 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. Except it doesn't just stop hellion openers. It stops like 3-4 different openers. Even IF there becomes a new opener, that will most likely be one of the only ones, simply because Zerg knows the other ones aren't as viable. it doesnt "stop" anything. u do not realize how stupidly bad queen DPS is. make enough marines and they pop... the only thing this buff does is make it to where u need to make MORE of a certain unit instead of getting away with just 4 hellions or 1 or 2 bunkers worth of rines. make more then 4 hellions and u can still easily deny tumors and expansions... u only need one volley to kill a tumor, u really think 6 or so hellions will die by one or 2 queens by the time that volley goes off? please. Except I'm fully aware how quickly queens kill hellions. As it is, they are already an incredibly effective deterrent. There's no way you can deny creep tumors with 4 hellions vs this new change, you're crazy. And you're talking to a Zerg who bases his entire ZvT strategy on creep spread with multiple queens. thats my point and the point of this change. queens are to make it where zerg has a easier time defending against LOW number of hellions, but queens wont do shit against higher hellion counts unless u completely over make a ton of queens.
so blizzard's balancing team was looking around, and the only thing they found in tvz was that a low number of hellions to deny creep tumors was deemed to be so imbalanced and hard to deal with that they have to buff the queen.
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On May 10 2012 16:14 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:10 kaelle_sc wrote:
i wonder how this will affect how zerg gets a 3rd in ZvT now. stephano uses a few roaches to block hellions, defend tumors and secure a 3rd. now i think that getting ~4 queens instead early game is better now, cause of the range buff, to do everything that a few early roaches did before this. except for the fact that 4 queens is 600 minerals and 4 roaches is only 300 minerals. ppl need to take this into consideration before they start to "abuse" this queen buff...
And 100 gas, a roach warren, an extractor ...
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On May 10 2012 16:38 Flummie wrote:
It is kinda okay that we zergies finally got a buff but this ruins ZvZ a bit. They need to fix that as well.
wtf? How does it ruin ZvZ?
This makes queens better vs lings and banes, which means defending ling bane attacks gets easier, which makes ZvZ less volatile in the early game ling bling wars. That's great in my book.
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On May 10 2012 16:37 akalarry wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:34 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:22 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:19 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:15 KivTM wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. hellions kill queens even slower lol. so whats your point? you do realize that hellions main purpose is to NOT kill a queen right? why try to kill a queen with hellions? there main purpose is to deny creep spread, stop zerg from taking a fast 3rd, clear watch towers, gain map control, and etc. all of which they are still able to do even with the buff to queens.... On May 10 2012 16:19 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:16 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:14 SgtCoDFish wrote:
I'd love for someone to explain how hellions are now "useless" in TvZ
Hellions have 90HP. Queens have an attack power of 4x2, to give 8 if the zerg doesn't micro the queen halfway through the attack. We'll assume zerg's not doing that.
It still takes 12 shots from a queen to kill a single hellion. The queen attacks once every second. There are 4 hellions.
Hellions shouldn't be in range of queens when creep isn't being spread, which occurs once every 30 to 40 seconds; they should be their attack range away from the edge of the creep. When creep is being spread (or if a drone comes out to take a quick third) hellions should be darting in and out to kill or force cancels on tumours.
This patch doesn't change any of the above AT ALL. It just means that hellions will take some extra shots where they wouldn't have before. The micro involved here is pulling back damaged hellions if you really want to engage a queen. But you shouldn't be doing that.
So what does the patch affect with regards to hellion openers? Barely anything; hellions are still a hell (no terrible pun intended) of a lot faster, so any attempts by zerg to spread creep greedily are just as denied as they were before. Darting in and popping a tumour is still the same as it was. There will be a "dance" between hellions and queens to deny creep, but queens aren't going to start spearing hellions and snapping them in half. Hellions will still also deny any attempt to take a third until roaches or lings are out to fend them off.
Hellions are slightly worse, but will still be able to do their job... every time something is nerfed even a little, hordes of people seem to say it's now useless. hellions arnt useless, ppl are just overreacting like babies once again... they will get over it in less then a week once they find out how fail queen DPS truly is. hellions do less damage to queens bud again, whats your point? My point is to show you that the queen's DPS is irrelevant. queen DPS has always been irrelevant and so has hellions... u dont kill a queen with a hellion unless the zerg is awful anyway. the new range buff is simply to fend off a low number of hellions unless the zerg makes a shit ton of queens. why? do people have such a hard time defending against a low number of hellions that blizzard needs to buff the queen? i never have trouble when people reactor hellion expand and use a few hellions to deny creep. also isn't blizzard's main goal to balance at the highest level? tvz is statistically incredibly even. why change it?
because its quite obvious how strong terrans early game is and how weak zergs early game is. blizz has been wanting to do something about zergs early game for over a year now (the overlord buff in particular) and now they are finally addressing it without having to nerf terrans early game directly.
calm down, the buff isnt OP in the slightest and there is no reason to even complain about it.
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On May 10 2012 16:41 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:37 akalarry wrote:On May 10 2012 16:34 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:22 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:19 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:15 KivTM wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. hellions kill queens even slower lol. so whats your point? you do realize that hellions main purpose is to NOT kill a queen right? why try to kill a queen with hellions? there main purpose is to deny creep spread, stop zerg from taking a fast 3rd, clear watch towers, gain map control, and etc. all of which they are still able to do even with the buff to queens.... On May 10 2012 16:19 Femari wrote:On May 10 2012 16:16 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:14 SgtCoDFish wrote:
I'd love for someone to explain how hellions are now "useless" in TvZ
Hellions have 90HP. Queens have an attack power of 4x2, to give 8 if the zerg doesn't micro the queen halfway through the attack. We'll assume zerg's not doing that.
It still takes 12 shots from a queen to kill a single hellion. The queen attacks once every second. There are 4 hellions.
Hellions shouldn't be in range of queens when creep isn't being spread, which occurs once every 30 to 40 seconds; they should be their attack range away from the edge of the creep. When creep is being spread (or if a drone comes out to take a quick third) hellions should be darting in and out to kill or force cancels on tumours.
This patch doesn't change any of the above AT ALL. It just means that hellions will take some extra shots where they wouldn't have before. The micro involved here is pulling back damaged hellions if you really want to engage a queen. But you shouldn't be doing that.
So what does the patch affect with regards to hellion openers? Barely anything; hellions are still a hell (no terrible pun intended) of a lot faster, so any attempts by zerg to spread creep greedily are just as denied as they were before. Darting in and popping a tumour is still the same as it was. There will be a "dance" between hellions and queens to deny creep, but queens aren't going to start spearing hellions and snapping them in half. Hellions will still also deny any attempt to take a third until roaches or lings are out to fend them off.
Hellions are slightly worse, but will still be able to do their job... every time something is nerfed even a little, hordes of people seem to say it's now useless. hellions arnt useless, ppl are just overreacting like babies once again... they will get over it in less then a week once they find out how fail queen DPS truly is. hellions do less damage to queens bud again, whats your point? My point is to show you that the queen's DPS is irrelevant. queen DPS has always been irrelevant and so has hellions... u dont kill a queen with a hellion unless the zerg is awful anyway. the new range buff is simply to fend off a low number of hellions unless the zerg makes a shit ton of queens. why? do people have such a hard time defending against a low number of hellions that blizzard needs to buff the queen? i never have trouble when people reactor hellion expand and use a few hellions to deny creep. also isn't blizzard's main goal to balance at the highest level? tvz is statistically incredibly even. why change it? because its quite obvious how strong terrans early game is and how weak zergs early game is. blizz has been wanting to do something about zergs early game for over a year now (the overlord buff in particular) and now they are finally addressing it without having to nerf terrans early game directly. calm down, the buff isnt OP in the slightest and there is no reason to even complain about it.
You're clearly in the minority thinking this.
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On May 10 2012 16:40 Femari wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 16:38 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:31 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:08 Ballistixz wrote:On May 10 2012 16:05 FabledIntegral wrote:On May 10 2012 16:03 Ballistixz wrote:
i find it kinda sad that the FIRST thing ppl do with new balance changes is whine there cute lil eyes out instead of THINKING of new builds they can counteract this with.
use your head ppl and evolve. the game and its meta has always evolved with new balance changes. stop crying and waiting for a pro player to show u the light and do it ur damn selves -_-
"hellion openers are dead now"
boy, will these ppl feel stupid once they see pro/top level terrans still going hellion builds and then copy directly off of them.
tip: queens kill hellions stupidly slow. Except it doesn't just stop hellion openers. It stops like 3-4 different openers. Even IF there becomes a new opener, that will most likely be one of the only ones, simply because Zerg knows the other ones aren't as viable. it doesnt "stop" anything. u do not realize how stupidly bad queen DPS is. make enough marines and they pop... the only thing this buff does is make it to where u need to make MORE of a certain unit instead of getting away with just 4 hellions or 1 or 2 bunkers worth of rines. make more then 4 hellions and u can still easily deny tumors and expansions... u only need one volley to kill a tumor, u really think 6 or so hellions will die by one or 2 queens by the time that volley goes off? please. Except I'm fully aware how quickly queens kill hellions. As it is, they are already an incredibly effective deterrent. There's no way you can deny creep tumors with 4 hellions vs this new change, you're crazy. And you're talking to a Zerg who bases his entire ZvT strategy on creep spread with multiple queens. thats my point and the point of this change. queens are to make it where zerg has a easier time defending against LOW number of hellions, but queens wont do shit against higher hellion counts unless u completely over make a ton of queens. Unless you're terrible you shouldn't have problems defending low amounts of hellions.
before patch, u can kite 1 queen with hellions without ever getting touched if u were good. this meant that u can easily contain zerg with only 4 hellions, which was insanely cost effective considering how terran was free to do w/e they wanted behind there nice safe walls. that is now fixed and terrans are not free to do w/e they want anymore, why complain?
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EPT
