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On April 27 2012 06:56 KillerDucky wrote: Code-B player ties for 3rd place at Dreamhack. Code-B = tied for 73rd place at best.
Dreamhack at least 73/3 ~= 24X harder than GSL.
Q.E.D.
Ro8 Code-S player out before top 16 at Dreamhack. Ties for 17th place at best.
Dreamhack at least 2X harder than GSL.
Did I do it right?
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Yeah Monster, because one foreign tournament automatically means that all foreign tournaments are 100 times easier than GSL. Would love to see you go through Iron Squid/MLG/IP4 open bracket to show how much "easier" foreign tournaments are....
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On April 27 2012 04:56 CosmicSpiral wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 04:53 Logros wrote: Bit dumb for Monster to say that about Naniwa, he's only been practicing PvP and PvT for like the last month because that's all he's had to face in the GSL. Naniwa was always subpar in PvZ. Beating Nestea, Leenock, and DRG never changed that fact because those were the only zergs he actually defeated.
Yeah Naniwa's PvZ is sooooo subpar that he can only beat those top three zergs in the world. Oh wait...
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I dont know how Monster knows GSL is harder than foreign tournaments when he aint even in code A GSL :D You first gotta be in it to judge it. If DRG, MC, Nestea... accomplished players would say stuff like this it would be ok, but for someone who just went to his first outside tournament its hilarious.
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On April 27 2012 07:06 ramask2 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 07:01 dAPhREAk wrote:On April 27 2012 06:57 ramask2 wrote: He doesn't exactly have a winning personality, but he's sort of right.
Its probably easy to get far into this tournament. However, its a whole different story winning it. You have the fatigues from fighting so many bo3s, the nerves from playing in front of thousands of people. Its a different sort of challenge than playing at the GOM studio. Consider how he completely choked during the match with Thorzain, I think he probably gets it now. im not sure why people are ragging on him for saying that GSL is a harder tournament; there is no controversy in that statement. in the rest of the interview, he comes off as bland, but not condescending. he even compliments nerchio and says he had a lot of luck in beating the foreigners up to that point. how many people are just reading the title to this op and not the rest of the interview? Not sure why you quoted me there, but I'm not ragging on him at all. I'm just pointing out that a LAN weekend tournament has a different sets of challenges than playing online or at GOM studio. The bit about the winning personality is as you said, the bland answers. straw that broke the camel's back, and apparently based on a misinterpretation of what you meant by winning personality. ;-)
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idk about 100 times easier, but maybe 10 times easier would be a fair thing to say. I'd say for every good foreign player, there about 10 or so Koreans at about an equal level of skill. You also have to factor in travel, but I guess you could say the same thing about foreigners traveling across the ocean to compete at LANs in other continents.
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monster went through dreamhack... not MLG
theres a big difference of what he experienced
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United States15275 Posts
On April 27 2012 07:07 mcgriffin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 04:56 CosmicSpiral wrote:On April 27 2012 04:53 Logros wrote: Bit dumb for Monster to say that about Naniwa, he's only been practicing PvP and PvT for like the last month because that's all he's had to face in the GSL. Naniwa was always subpar in PvZ. Beating Nestea, Leenock, and DRG never changed that fact because those were the only zergs he actually defeated. Yeah Naniwa's PvZ is sooooo subpar that he can only beat those top three zergs in the world. Oh wait...
Beat Nestea, lose to Haypro and Slivko and Hyun. Beat a DRG sick from Mexican food (who wasn't even good at ZvP at the time) with two 2 base colossus all-ins, get spanked by Ret a few months later. There's a pretty obvious pattern here.
P.S. Leenock is weak at ZvP. Beating him isn't that impressive bro.
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United Kingdom38149 Posts
On April 27 2012 07:08 Ryps wrote: I dont know how Monster knows GSL is harder than foreign tournaments when he aint even in code A GSL :D You first gotta be in it to judge it. If DRG, MC, Nestea... accomplished players would say stuff like this it would be ok, but for someone who just went to his first outside tournament its hilarious.
You know Monster once knocked MC out of the GSL entirely right? =p
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omg stop crying, ofc the GSL is tho top of the tops, and just watch the korean results in mlg/ipl/dreamhack overall. foreigners celebrate a winner not coming from korea like a superhuman, even when only 4-5 koreans from code A or lower take part, and we know why. everyone who thinks monster is just cocky or exaggerating is just afraid to face reality. he only straight says the truth, bear it and quit whining.
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On April 27 2012 07:03 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 06:58 ZenithM wrote:On April 27 2012 06:54 Azarkon wrote:On April 27 2012 06:51 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:On April 27 2012 06:48 CeriseCherries wrote: -_- DH this time around was not so deep with koreans...
but honestly MLG has turned into GSL in US -_- And it's great. No, it isn't. People don't seriously clamour for the old MLG's of laggy streams, no Tastosis and TT1 vs Jinro in the finals do they?
No, people want foreigners vs. Koreans, not Koreans vs. Koreans, and not foreigners vs. foreigners. This is why MLG's Spring Arena 2 is region limited, and David Ting from IPL said they're going to do the same thing. Well, at some point in the event it's always going to be Koreans vs Koreans anyway after they're done wiping the floor with foreigners, it's even sadder than to start with Koreans from the get-go and let the few foreigners that really deserve it have a shot against them :D Thing is, Koreans aren't wiping the floor with foreigners. They're pulling out wins, but seeing Genius struggle at Dreamhack, and the amount of matches that go to a third game, I think there's a dynamic to the foreigner vs. Korean rivalry that's still attractive to viewers. Not every Korean is going to go 22-1 - a lot of them are not that solid. Koreans aren't wiping the floor with top foreigners. And if it weren't for Genius (who is a bit of a wildcard anyway, I doubt he practices that regularly :D) being a buffoon at DH, I would have even said "Random Koreans aren't wiping the floor with top foreigners". There are like 4-5 guys who come remotely close to being a challenge to top Koreans...
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On April 27 2012 07:06 Batch wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 06:56 KillerDucky wrote: Code-B player ties for 3rd place at Dreamhack. Code-B = tied for 73rd place at best.
Dreamhack at least 73/3 ~= 24X harder than GSL.
Q.E.D.
Ro8 Code-S player out before top 16 at Dreamhack. Ties for 17th place at best. Dreamhack at least 2X harder than GSL. Did I do it right?
You didn't put Q.E.D. at the end. ;-)
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People say "a million times easier" as an expression. Doesnt literally mean a million times easier. Could just be a translation thing. Also i remember someone saying that Naniwa goes all in once he sees mutas. Think it was on Destinys stream when he was in Korea. So a while back, but nonetheless it shows he wasnt always confident against zerg. Could still be the case.
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On April 27 2012 07:03 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 06:58 ZenithM wrote:On April 27 2012 06:54 Azarkon wrote:On April 27 2012 06:51 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:On April 27 2012 06:48 CeriseCherries wrote: -_- DH this time around was not so deep with koreans...
but honestly MLG has turned into GSL in US -_- And it's great. No, it isn't. People don't seriously clamour for the old MLG's of laggy streams, no Tastosis and TT1 vs Jinro in the finals do they?
No, people want foreigners vs. Koreans, not Koreans vs. Koreans, and not foreigners vs. foreigners. This is why MLG's Spring Arena 2 is region limited, and David Ting from IPL said they're going to do the same thing. Well, at some point in the event it's always going to be Koreans vs Koreans anyway after they're done wiping the floor with foreigners, it's even sadder than to start with Koreans from the get-go and let the few foreigners that really deserve it have a shot against them :D Thing is, Koreans aren't wiping the floor with foreigners. They're pulling out wins, but seeing Genius struggle at Dreamhack, and the amount of matches that go to a third game, I think there's a dynamic to the foreigner vs. Korean rivalry that's still attractive to viewers. Not every Korean is going to go 22-1 - a lot of them are not that solid.
I love how you cherry pick results. Korean's not dominating? Yea ok. Tell yourself that.
And you say alot of koreans aren't that solid, well guess what, maybe 3 foreigners in the world are solid then.
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A little confidence can go a long way. Hubris, on the other hand...
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I would like to see this interview transcript in Korean so that I can read what he actually said in his own language. Translation can often have a huge impact on how someone sounds in interviews.
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I'm pretty sure Monster was just exaggerating how easy the foreign tournaments are compared to the GSL. Most, if not all people would agree that GSL has the best in players and competition, compared to most foreign tournaments like Dreamhack, which doesn't invite too many Koreans compared to MLG or IPL.
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On April 27 2012 07:23 jj33 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 07:03 Azarkon wrote:On April 27 2012 06:58 ZenithM wrote:On April 27 2012 06:54 Azarkon wrote:On April 27 2012 06:51 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:On April 27 2012 06:48 CeriseCherries wrote: -_- DH this time around was not so deep with koreans...
but honestly MLG has turned into GSL in US -_- And it's great. No, it isn't. People don't seriously clamour for the old MLG's of laggy streams, no Tastosis and TT1 vs Jinro in the finals do they?
No, people want foreigners vs. Koreans, not Koreans vs. Koreans, and not foreigners vs. foreigners. This is why MLG's Spring Arena 2 is region limited, and David Ting from IPL said they're going to do the same thing. Well, at some point in the event it's always going to be Koreans vs Koreans anyway after they're done wiping the floor with foreigners, it's even sadder than to start with Koreans from the get-go and let the few foreigners that really deserve it have a shot against them :D Thing is, Koreans aren't wiping the floor with foreigners. They're pulling out wins, but seeing Genius struggle at Dreamhack, and the amount of matches that go to a third game, I think there's a dynamic to the foreigner vs. Korean rivalry that's still attractive to viewers. Not every Korean is going to go 22-1 - a lot of them are not that solid. I love how you cherry pick results. Korean's not dominating? Yea ok. Tell yourself that. And you say alot of koreans aren't that solid, well guess what, maybe 3 foreigners in the world are solid then. Only solid player is Cutter good sir... mofo snaps into a slim jim.
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On April 27 2012 06:47 ZenithM wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2012 06:40 Xarles wrote:On April 27 2012 06:35 ZenithM wrote: Dreamhack was quite an easy tournament in terms of top Korean presence, way easier than the concurrent MLG for example. DH was certainly not at Code A level until way far off in the final bracket. And even then, matched against one of the strongest pawn of the foreigner scene (which he deems ezpz), he was not able to beat him.
So yeah, he's probably spot on about DH's difficulty, BUT it's not his place to say that because he's far from being one of the best Koreans (i.e. far from being one of the best players), AND DH was one of the easiest tournaments we've seen in a while (way easier than MLG, IPL etc...) True, but we could however look at PuMa's record in Korea and outside of it to judge the difficulty, or how much time NaNiwa has had to spend in Korea before he was actually able to win a Bo3 in GSL let alone reach ro8. Well, yeah, it's obvious than GSL is way harder, that's why I didn't even talk about it when I compared DH to other tournaments. DH was easy even compared with OTHER foreign tournaments. It's essentially stomping random Swedes for 2 days before finally having to be matched against top foreigners in quarter finals. Obviously any Korean is going to do well... That's why I think that it's a bit conceited of a declaration from Monster. Again, saying GSL is the hardest shit in the world is Captain Obvious level imo. But the caliber of play at IPL 4 (for example) was comparable I think, while it was certainly not at DH. That's true; you pretty much have to earn your way to these statements among other things. It is unfortunate, but interview inexperience(due to not really winning anything) may have something to do with it. I remember NaNiwa being kinda awkward, and blunt at Providence with his statements, but he seems to have become more eloquent with his more recent interviews. While I understand it if that's the case, I'm not too fond of it either heh.
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Code S is by far the hardest tournament in the world. When IPL, or MLG are considered strong it's because there are many Code S players.
Fact is, any foreigner in the tournament will be worse than every player in Code S. There's also a reason a foreigner has never qualified for Code A-- because most foreigners aren't even Code A level.
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