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On March 08 2012 08:16 lastshadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 07:58 dragonborn wrote:On March 08 2012 05:38 lastshadow wrote:
Wow he beat Hero and drg in bo1's congratulations. Wanna know Juan's record vs Forgg on ladder? 8-5. Juan > Forgg now? It's called random BoX's don't mean shit, especially when Koreans dont even wanna waste their breathe studying you.
It's sickening how much people credit Bo3's to skill, there is a reason Korean's don't hand out titles of calling someone skilled until they prove it over X months and or X Bo3's. Do you think Stephano would be able to replicate his results daily? Clearly not. We saw that in his IPL to MLG and GSL to HSC performances.
Juan? thats major guy not even pass round 1 in EWM, right? also lets talk about mechanics, in your world IdrA is the best zerg with best mechanics, but he is keep losing to eu players. WHY? because mechanics isnt everything in sc2. SjoW with 80 apm and superior to Major, and stephano superior to IdrA in every way. good ol' lastshadow. I said idra has the best overall mechanics for Zerg for foreigners, which is true. I've said DRG has the best overall mechanics for Zerg, in the world, which is true. Did you just bring up EWM? Then bring up every other top korean that also dropped in round 1, oh now you just look silly, guess you didn't consider that. I never said Stephano was bad, again, he's a great player, infact his egg-mechanic is something to be admired (many koreans gave up trying to learn in fact), but [overall] his mechanics are worse than IdrAs, what we see stephano be great at is his timings/awareness, which is superior to IdrA's And I'm not even going to comment on your Sjow thing lol.
Hotkeying eggs is awesome once you get used to it. You dont need to scroll around looking for your rally'd units then hotkey them. So you can constantly keep watching your army during fights.
I even noticed Nestea was hotkeying his eggs when he was steaming the other day.
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On March 07 2012 18:37 zefreak wrote:
Considering that people like Nerchio, Bratok and Bly have reasonably similar winrates, I would have to conclude that EU ladder is really not that tough?
well just logic: if more people have very high winrates it gets difficult to have one...so it's the opposit of what you said
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On March 08 2012 08:44 hunts wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 08:41 dsousa wrote:On March 08 2012 08:38 hunts wrote:On March 08 2012 08:36 n0ave wrote:On March 08 2012 08:34 hunts wrote:On March 08 2012 07:28 Odoakar wrote:
Stephano's stream - 10k views
MKP's stream - 1,7k views
Destiny's stream - 1,6k views
He's good but it's incredible how quickly people hop on a bandwagon I'm not a big fan, but I watched because the zergs that are better than him weren't streaming (idra/sen/sleep/violet) He's still good to watch, though you're not gonnna learn too much given his playstyle. Stephano is better then those 4 zergs that you mentioned. No he's not, but being he's so overhyped I can definitely see why people would be mislead to believe that. He's tangible better. By prize money, by ELO, by # of wins, by head-to-head. Maybe Sen is in the discussion , the rest are hardly arguable. If you wouldn't mind providing evidence and not trolling anymore, it would be nice. But again, with how overhyped stephano is I can see why people would be mislead to believe he's that great. And comparing prize money to players that were in GSL is silly. GSL is the hardest tournament in the world, in which Idra has spent 4 or so months playing, sen 3, and I'm not sure how many seasons sleep and violet were in GSL. Unless you're one of the lucky few you make very little money in GSL and even getting to code S like Idra and sen did (originally, not the seed they recently got) is much more difficult than winning some foreign tourney.
So you are saying because Idra was better than Stephano 1 year ago (when he was in GSL and it was true) so he is still better today even with around 20% winrate in tournaments, where he dies to nearly every European protoss and terran. On the other hand Stephano did not lose against Protoss in a long while having lately score like 30+:1 (maps). Against terrans he is similarly dominant actually and even when losing (to code S level players) provides good games. Compare that to Idra's series against alive or Kas or whoever. The only matchup where they are "close" is ZvZ and even there Stephano is better.
Sleep has no results and Sen did not show any great form recently. I agree with violet, not that he is better but that they are comparable.
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On March 07 2012 18:50 Za7oX wrote:
He's non Koreans best shot at winning a GSL. Someone please offer him a fuck load of $$$ to get him over there.
well im pretty sure complexity tried, but we all know how that worked out
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On March 08 2012 08:16 lastshadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 07:58 dragonborn wrote:On March 08 2012 05:38 lastshadow wrote:
Wow he beat Hero and drg in bo1's congratulations. Wanna know Juan's record vs Forgg on ladder? 8-5. Juan > Forgg now? It's called random BoX's don't mean shit, especially when Koreans dont even wanna waste their breathe studying you.
It's sickening how much people credit Bo3's to skill, there is a reason Korean's don't hand out titles of calling someone skilled until they prove it over X months and or X Bo3's. Do you think Stephano would be able to replicate his results daily? Clearly not. We saw that in his IPL to MLG and GSL to HSC performances.
Juan? thats major guy not even pass round 1 in EWM, right? also lets talk about mechanics, in your world IdrA is the best zerg with best mechanics, but he is keep losing to eu players. WHY? because mechanics isnt everything in sc2. SjoW with 80 apm and superior to Major, and stephano superior to IdrA in every way. good ol' lastshadow. I said idra has the best overall mechanics for Zerg for foreigners, which is true. I've said DRG has the best overall mechanics for Zerg, in the world, which is true. Did you just bring up EWM? Then bring up every other top korean that also dropped in round 1, oh now you just look silly, guess you didn't consider that. I never said Stephano was bad, again, he's a great player, infact his egg-mechanic is something to be admired (many koreans gave up trying to learn in fact), but [overall] his mechanics are worse than IdrAs, what we see stephano be great at is his timings/awareness, which is superior to IdrA's And I'm not even going to comment on your Sjow thing lol.
You are said MajOr is better than Kas/SjoW, which is false.
You are said IdrA is better than Stephano and best overall mechanics for foreigner zerg, which is false.
You've said top players in EWM, which is false because they are in code S/A.
Stephano is the SUPERIOR player to IdrA in every possibly way.IdrA's mechanics was good when first 8 month of starcraft 2, now IdrA isnt something special.
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_MLG_Pro_Circuit/Raleigh who is the highest placed foreigner? Where was MajOr?
oh wait, he was busy for losing SEA player JazBas in blizzcon 
Stop being jealous/ignorant and face with the truth, these players superior to your friends like IdrA/MajOr.
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Sen plays too little in major tournaments these days to do a good comparison. I do think he has fallen off in form but then again he doesn't have much to play for. Going back, I first learned about Stephano in the game Sen played against him for a team league back when Sen was on Fnatic. Sen off-raced Protoss and beat Stephano, who nonetheless did put up a good fight. Months later, Stephano beat Sen ZvZ in a Bo3 at a major LAN tournament - back when Sen was owning IdrA and Zenio in ZvZ - and his rise since then has been non-stop.
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Saying that Idra is better than Stephano, is just like sayiing that Stephano is better than DRG.
If you are a crazy fan boy you may want to believe it, but deep down you know it's not true.
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On March 08 2012 04:52 The_Darkness wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 03:33 Shellshock1122 wrote:On March 08 2012 03:15 The_Darkness wrote:On March 08 2012 02:27 hunts wrote:On March 08 2012 02:25 Benjamin80 wrote:On March 08 2012 02:22 hunts wrote:On March 08 2012 02:19 HyDrA_solic wrote:On March 08 2012 02:16 hunts wrote:On March 08 2012 02:12 Benjamin80 wrote:On March 08 2012 02:01 hunts wrote:
[quote]
But you do realize most of the tournaments he did well in were at the same time as bigger and better tournaments, which means they had very little competition, right? Like Asus rog, when almost every good player was at MLG winter arena? Yea only the best foreigners was there except Naniwa together with Puma and Polt andLucky . Just becuase you are overhyped and played in MLG winter arena doesnt mean you better. And most of the tournaments really ? IPL 3, ESWC and IPL 4 UK qualifier did you see the player list? Man now you just finding bad excuses and hating come on bro You're definitely right man. Puma and Polt definitely better than overhyped baddies like MKP and MVP. Lucky definnitely better than overhyped baddies like DRG and nestea. And no I don't have bad excuses for disliking stephano. I dislike him because of his fans that overhype him when he's just another good foreigner. He's good, just that. He's not the best foreigner, and definitely not the best zerg foreigner, or best zerg, or best player like people seem to think, If you want to blindly overhype him go to his fan club. and to All the best foreigner players was in Asus only one who was missing was Naniwa im sorry to tell you that You forgot the other foreigners like Idra and huk, who are better than basically every other foreigner that was at asus rog. so who's the best foreigner for you, may I ask? There isn't one right now. Every top foreigner has their moments of brilliance and moments of just getting owned, so far no foreigner has consistently done well enough vs other foreigners or koreans to be considered "top foreigner" haha so what do you have todo to be consistently doing well? I really want to know becuase if it isnt enough what Stephano has done the last 6months then im not sure. The kid wins allmost everything Again, he wins in the underdog tournaments. If he can win an MLG with actual good koreans there, or if he can even qualify for code A in GSL, or win any tournaments with more than just a couple koreans in it, then he can be considered a top foreigner. MKP lost in the qualifiers to Stephano -- he tried out and failed to make it, which speaks to the level of competition, but point taken. IPL 3 had MMA, MKP and a slew of other top Koreans. It is a "grand slam" event for the Starcraft (with far more money at stake than MLGs had at the time) and he won it. Try again, or better yet don't. (I will say that you're doing a good job trolling the forum.) MKP wasn't at IPL3 but it was still an impressive tourney win with several top names. Stephano is a great player. I'm not the biggest fan but a 90% win rate on EU is still impressive MKP lost in the qualifier to Stephano at IPL 3 (and didn't qualify), but point taken.
Oh man, have you seen the games? They were absolutely TERRIBLE >.> The lag was a veritable thunderbolt!
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obviously nobody can say stephano is the best foreigner indefinitely, However over the last year. Stephano has proved time and time again he is the best foreigner ,anybody saying stuff like idra is better or idra has better mechanics has deluded themselfs with pure bias.
If you go into stephano's fanpage, you will see some replays of him vs idra (cale) while he was in korea. Stephano never dropped a map against him and even embarrassed him with a masssssssssssss queen push in zvz, 3 games, 3-0.
then i heard guys say these guys are better "idra/sen/sleep/violet" . Good joke i say.
As said , he already ran circles around idra, The last time stephano and sen meet stephano won. I dont think stephano has ever faced sleep but im sure he would rape him. And the last time stephano meet violet was in IPL3 where he dominated him. Keep bringing them on, haters gonna hate. He is our best
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Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
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I was just watching his stream today and he seemed so calm. He seemed to be able to stay very calm under pretty intense situations, and would even comment during little micro battles. I am sure that ability must be helping him out some.
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On March 08 2012 10:00 Gevna wrote:
Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
following this logic pretty much 70-80% of the threads shouldnt be opened since they give ground one way or another to debate between biased fans, haters and trolls
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On March 08 2012 10:09 Geo.Rion wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 10:00 Gevna wrote:
Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
following this logic pretty much 70-80% of the threads shouldnt be opened since they give ground one way or another to debate between biased fans, haters and trolls
Honestly, Stephano fans are just expressing their admiration and hopes that he'll do great on a larger stage. Few, if any, are saying he's clearly the worlds best.
The trolls however, just say silly things. No need to equivocate....
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On March 08 2012 10:00 johnny123 wrote:
obviously nobody can say stephano is the best foreigner indefinitely, However over the last year. Stephano has proved time and time again he is the best foreigner ,anybody saying stuff like idra is better or idra has better mechanics has deluded themselfs with pure bias.
If you go into stephano's fanpage, you will see some replays of him vs idra (cale) while he was in korea. Stephano never dropped a map against him and even embarrassed him with a masssssssssssss queen push in zvz, 3 games, 3-0.
then i heard guys say these guys are better "idra/sen/sleep/violet" . Good joke i say.
As said , he already ran circles around idra, The last time stephano and sen meet stephano won. I dont think stephano has ever faced sleep but im sure he would rape him. And the last time stephano meet violet was in IPL3 where he dominated him. Keep bringing them on, haters gonna hate. He is our best
I don't disagree with your point that Stephano MAY be the best foreigner but you should realize that you are only comparing Stephano's zvz with other zergs. That isn't an indication of skill.
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On March 08 2012 10:00 Gevna wrote:
Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
You're so completely right. Too much hype around a player, then an other one pops out, wins some tourney and here we go again. Please, everyone should try to be at least reasonable, everytime i see someone being hyped like this i can't stop disliking him. Stephano's ladder run is impressive but ladder doesn't mean shit, some pro are not even trying to do good builds, they just build stuff trying to react well and practice mechanics and such. Stephano has done well in many small to medium tournaments but i'll call him the best foreigner when he'll do at least as good as Huk or Jinro. I'm not saying those two are better than him or w/e but they did better than he has. Actually, i don't know if there is a "best foreigner" and i'm pretty sure nobody can win a GSL or even get close to win a GSL. Even a Code A final would be pretty amazing. We all are waiting for a foreigner to step up but that's not gonna happend before sometimes when foreigners will commit themselves in Korea for a long time.
Anyway, Gz to Stephano, i hope seing him a bit more in the future. I'm looking forward to MLG colombus.
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On March 08 2012 10:12 dsousa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 10:09 Geo.Rion wrote:On March 08 2012 10:00 Gevna wrote:
Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
following this logic pretty much 70-80% of the threads shouldnt be opened since they give ground one way or another to debate between biased fans, haters and trolls Honestly, Stephano fans are just expressing their admiration and hopes that he'll do great on a larger stage. Few, if any, are saying he's clearly the worlds best.
The trolls however, just say silly things. No need to equivocate....
Yeah, like this silly guy:
On March 08 2012 04:09 dsousa wrote:
He is the most amazing player in SC2.... he plays the best music on his stream..... and as a zerg fan he is pure win.
Stephano is the best viewing experience since Seinfeld went off TV.
He could be the best player in the world..... I guess that scares people who are in BW/KR community, because he's so different.
What would it mean to the KR scene if a French WC3 player became the Bonjwa..... it hasn't happened yet... but if you've seen Stephano play enough, you know that he has that potential in him. Certainly more than any other foreign player in Starcraft history.
There are some insane people on this thread 
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On March 08 2012 10:24 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 10:12 dsousa wrote:On March 08 2012 10:09 Geo.Rion wrote:On March 08 2012 10:00 Gevna wrote:
Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
following this logic pretty much 70-80% of the threads shouldnt be opened since they give ground one way or another to debate between biased fans, haters and trolls Honestly, Stephano fans are just expressing their admiration and hopes that he'll do great on a larger stage. Few, if any, are saying he's clearly the worlds best.
The trolls however, just say silly things. No need to equivocate.... Yeah, like this silly guy: Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 04:09 dsousa wrote:
He is the most amazing player in SC2.... he plays the best music on his stream..... and as a zerg fan he is pure win.
Stephano is the best viewing experience since Seinfeld went off TV.
He could be the best player in the world..... I guess that scares people who are in BW/KR community, because he's so different.
What would it mean to the KR scene if a French WC3 player became the Bonjwa..... it hasn't happened yet... but if you've seen Stephano play enough, you know that he has that potential in him. Certainly more than any other foreign player in Starcraft history. There are some insane people on this thread
You win! For now
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On March 08 2012 10:19 zJayy962 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 10:00 johnny123 wrote:
obviously nobody can say stephano is the best foreigner indefinitely, However over the last year. Stephano has proved time and time again he is the best foreigner ,anybody saying stuff like idra is better or idra has better mechanics has deluded themselfs with pure bias.
If you go into stephano's fanpage, you will see some replays of him vs idra (cale) while he was in korea. Stephano never dropped a map against him and even embarrassed him with a masssssssssssss queen push in zvz, 3 games, 3-0.
then i heard guys say these guys are better "idra/sen/sleep/violet" . Good joke i say.
As said , he already ran circles around idra, The last time stephano and sen meet stephano won. I dont think stephano has ever faced sleep but im sure he would rape him. And the last time stephano meet violet was in IPL3 where he dominated him. Keep bringing them on, haters gonna hate. He is our best
I don't disagree with your point that Stephano MAY be the best foreigner but you should realize that you are only comparing Stephano's zvz with other zergs. That isn't an indication of skill.
let me guess, you are an idra fanboy and you follow his mentality that zvz means nothing because its coinflip and does not prove skill. Yet they are guys out there with over 70% winrate in the matchup. One would wish the coin could have flipped atleast once for idra? , he lost to lucky in gsl, he lost to nestea in gsl, he lost to darkforce yesterday in iem,he lost to nestea in mlg, he can never beat zenio to save his life. Boy that coin should have flipped for him atleast one series.
stephano raped lucky in ipl, stephano always beats darkforce on eu ladder, Against nestea i dont know who would win, but it would be close in my opinion between those 2. Only bads say zvz is luck /coinflip
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On March 08 2012 09:36 Elean wrote:
Saying that Idra is better than Stephano, is just like sayiing that Stephano is better than DRG.
If you are a crazy fan boy you may want to believe it, but deep down you know it's not true.
100%
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On March 08 2012 10:12 dsousa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2012 10:09 Geo.Rion wrote:On March 08 2012 10:00 Gevna wrote:
Those kind of threads should really stop, even if mentioning awesome performance is pretty cool, in the case of stephano it always ends into a non-sense war between awful troll of haters, and over-enthusiasm from fanboys.
following this logic pretty much 70-80% of the threads shouldnt be opened since they give ground one way or another to debate between biased fans, haters and trolls Honestly, Stephano fans are just expressing their admiration and hopes that he'll do great on a larger stage. Few, if any, are saying he's clearly the worlds best. The trolls however, just say silly things. No need to equivocate....
Honestly, the people doubtful of stephanos skill are just expressing their admiration of better players and hopes that they'll do great on a large scale. The trolls however, call him the best, or the next flash.
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EPT
