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Criticism is allowed. Undue flaming is not. Take a second to think your post through before you submit.
Bans will be handed out.
Should go without saying, but don't link restreams here either. |
Creating a blog post on this issue and using pathos rhetoric aint cool. So here......
Well, today brings us a huge announcement from MLG's very own, and very awesome, Sundance DiGiovanni. MLG's Winter Arena will be a PPV (Pay per View) event. Now, before you come out with your pitch forks and ready to kill the man, lets think about this...
YOU (the fans) say that you "want ESPORTS to be main stream." YOU consistently make posts on reddit (when you're not posting stupid pictures) and TL asking what you can do to grow the sport, or how to help, or what else is out there that can be done to create growth. This brings us to how you can actually support ESPORTS. If you want this thing that we all love to talk about, play, discuss, rage, and love together to continue to grow, then you need to begin to support it. Yes, in 2011 your viewership or attendance at an event or barcraft was indeed huge for the community, but now we need to back our baby monetarily.
MLG needs to develop a model that can make itself self sufficient. They need to generate their own income so they can cover the many costs it takes to run the events. Of course, no one wants to be told to spend their money to support something, and I agree with your statement. You make your money and you spend it as you please. However, if you want this thing we call ESPORTS to grow, then this $20 for the winter arena is indeed you extending help to our lovely child.
Please think about this situation rationally, monetarily, and ESPORTily(?), before you go off posting "bad guy sundance" or "Sundance is killing ESPORTS" threads or saying these things in general. He indeed wants it to grow just like you and me, and he is doing his best for us. So, lets do our best for him.
In the end, I want you to think about this thing as a whole. Past, present, and future. Think about what you want to put in and what you want to get out. This is ours to grow as a community. All in all, who is really "killing ESPORTS" ? ...............
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So on one hand the GSL has an free LQ steam + 1 month ad-supported subscription for $14.99 and premium packages while MLG Arena on the other hand has no free stream and charges $20 for 2 days of Starcraft.
I don't really like the one-size fits all approach that MLG does, there should be a premium and a light option, even if there is no free LQ stream.
I will have to weigh this matter in my head, 7 arenas for one year is much money, let me think about it.
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So there seems to be quite a bit of rage in regards to this issue. It seems to me that MLG will end up making more money on this in the short term, but if they're looking for sustainability, this isn't the way to go.
I say this for a specific reason.
According to the poll on page 1 of the comments, about 15% of SCII fans would pay for this service. 15%, at $20.00 a piece will certainly bring in quite a bit of money for MLG. However, it also means that only around 15% of people are engaged in MLG. This is a mistake, and I cannot stress that enough.
They essentially are cutting their fan base to 15% of what it was. This means the majority of the community is no longer involved in most MLG events. Eventually this will render MLG less important as fewer and fewer fans discuss it in the community. Fewer sponsors will want to get involved as their viewing numbers drop, they'll have to charge even more for PPV, etc etc etc.
It's a slippery slope MLG! I love what you do, but I'm not sure this will pan out in the way you want it to!
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I am still on the fence, maybe chip in with a friend and watch it at a place together. Right now MLG is experimenting, the price point is just a price point right now. It is likely they they will be adjusting it if they see fit. If this does work out MLG can change the face of SC2 for a long time and any other esport after that. Once they find the correct price point it is going to only go up from there(tournament quality and prize pools).
If you don't like it don't pay they are releasing the VOD's for free a week later for you to enjoy.
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I really really hope this works. Personally, I think its a tad high. $10 and I'd buy it right now. I'm guessing that'll be the case for most people. This isnt UFC. I think most people can't split the cost with friends and throw a party because they dont know enough people locally who are that into SC2. Its a niche and that means businesses need to do something that makes sense to individuals.
Again, I really hope this works because it will be a really good sign for SC2 as a sustainable sport.
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I'm not against paying but when I put 2 days for $20 up against the $15 GSL light ticket for ~2 months of content it's an easy choice to make. Combine that with Assembly being on the same weekend and I'm not likely to forgo sleep to watch Starcraft for 72 hours straight so I think I'll just stick with Assembly. Again, I have nothing against a price I just think it's a bad comparison to competitors at an especially bad timing. Also feel bad for the shafted MLG Gold members.
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I will not be able to watch because of this. So I obviously dislike it.
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Kind of disappointed that this isn't included in the gold package.
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On February 14 2012 08:55 halfies wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 08:52 Prochainezo wrote:
This thread is why starcarft WILL fail... please read on if you want to support esports...
Are these people really so dumb to not support this for a measly $20?????
Everyone knows starcraft is losing money atm. It is down to MLG and other leagues to find a way to monetize it otherwise the scene will quite simply collapse. Nobody is making money atm, and nobody can get big sponsors because there are no hard figures behind these kind of events. (Money talks, free stream viewers doesn't)
Now MLG take the initiative to try to prove esports can work as a viable bussiness, and all these turds on here say they wont pay....
Well enjoy killing your own hobby idiots. I can't beleive how moderate Sundance is being about this. He has put on so many high quality events, that none of you assholes have ever paid for, and this is the thanks he gets for trying to get $20 for 5 STREAMS and HOURS of content. He even suggests pulling together with friends, or going to barcrafts.
Jesus christ, starcraft doesn't deserve to succeed if its fanbase are so short minded as to not support this.
Seriously this is so sad it is beyond words. I bet you guys wouldnt blink an eyelid at spening $20 for a new mouse/keyboard/game or even freaking pizza, now when the time coomes to truly support esports, you all can't be asked to spend your doritoes money on a company that has given you so much already for free.
Think of any other sport, people pay the entry fee, they buy the merch, they spend money on food/drinks at the event.... and thats how the sport survives as a bussiness. You guys are so shortsighted its unbeleivable.
/rant over
TLDR; If you can't find $20 to support this, then dont complain when starcraft collapses in the west. It'll be on your head. If this fails, then esports fails. MLG can't continue making money like they have before, and If a company like MLG cant make money, then who the hell can? ummm Assembly?
I would almost guarantee Assembly do not make money on the tourney, its more a showcase for ASUS much like IEM is a showcase for Intel. MLG are trying for something more sustainable (although I saw 2GD saying Dreamhack was sustainable with no PPV at all, interested to see how that is possible)
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No way I'm supporting this. It would be terrible if they were successful and other tournaments copied the model. I pay for GSL because I like the tournament and I'm happy with the content I get for the price. I pay because I want to, not because I have to.
For MLG it would be the opposite. No thanks, Assembly has good enough line-up to keep me satisfied for the weekend.
edit: and I'd be incredibly pissed if I was a gold member. That's just ugly.
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On February 14 2012 07:57 CuteZergling wrote:
They make a good point though, $20 is twice the cost of a movie, and you are getting 20 hours of entertainment, not 2.
millions of dollars are poured into movies, though.
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For $20 you get a full weekend of nothing but the absolute best StarCraft 2 in the world. That’s roughly the same cost as a trip to the movies (with a stop at the concession stand), a large pizza, a small venue concert, or a round of drinks.
MLG trying to justify their greed. Sad really real people in the Starcraft community to make you bigger than ever before then reach into their pockets great job.
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P.S. I admire MLG for having the balls to test this out.
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As long as they aren't moving to a PPV only system I think it'll be okay. A large portion of the esports scene are college age people (i.e. without a lot of extra expendable income). Some will be more cost adverse than others, and it's a really just a personal test.
There is a chance that if the leap is made too hard that you will price out a portion of your audience. Not in that single $20, but if events routinely cost that much we beginning talking about money that may go elsewhere.
I'm in law school myself, which is more expensive than I'd like to elaborate on. So I have to pick and choose in advance what kinds of things I want to invest money into. I'm a bit more miserly than most, so I'll stick to the free content, but I don't think MLG is wrong to try this out.
I also don't think the comparisons to Boxing or UFC are as apt--namely because their audiences are generally older. Not uniformly, but you're selling to people who are watching in their own homes, while a good portion of us are in dorms or small apartments or living at home. There is a difference in expendable income--so the trade off becomes how much value is placed on the product itself. For me, personally, I'm served fine by the other options, but for others it may very well be worth it due to the level of enjoyment they get out of it.
I do wish it well, and I've heard there is a barcraft not too far away from me--so perhaps I'll still catch some of the cast if they decide to pick it up.
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But if all the talent is going to be at MLG Winter Arena, who's going to be playing at Assembly?
A bunch of middle-of-the-road Koreans and some unimpressive Europeans/Americans?
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On February 14 2012 08:55 Whatson wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 08:54 Xxio wrote:On February 14 2012 08:43 Klonere wrote:
Man how will I ever afford this.
I guess I won't pay a cover charge and not buy 2 drinks this week :D LOL yes Personally, I might buy 1 less bottle of wine Yeah. Rich people who have got it made already... How about you live college life again and relearn how to scrounge for money?
Then don't spend your free time watching SC2? If you're hurting for cash you either (1) penny pinch and tough it out or (2) pick up another job/source of income... If you're having trouble making rent/buying food, but finding time to watch SC2 I'm not sure what to say.
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Oh so do they have free stream or not? If no, then good bye. I can't afford that much.
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On February 14 2012 08:48 Atlare wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 08:46 NoctemSC wrote:
Why is everyone getting so angry about this?
Watching the Arena isn't your right, it's a privilege.
No one is making you pay to watch it, if you don't want to invest the money, simply don't watch it.
Just because a Lamborghini is out of my price range doesn't mean that I'm going to be pissed off at the manufacturer. You would be pissed if you were told the Lamborgini is available for driving to you once a month for the weekend, only to be told randomly later on that you must buy it, and thats its a godamned privilege to support the company making the product.
Well then you'd be pretty retarded for believing the salesman int he first place.
Everyone is focusing on the negatives, Only the ARENA events are being charged. You can still watch basic streams (I.E the same thing as last year) for the pro circuit. The Arena is sepperate from the pro circuit. You're not being forced to pay to watch every MLG event, this is one of many to come. If you don't want to pay, well then don't pay.
Being the huge nerd I am, I'd much rather pay 20 bucks to watch a weekend of starcraft than go to the movies anyways.
Besides Big screen tv in the living room + 5 friends means we're each paying less than 5 bucks to watch a weekend of the best players.
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There are multiple reasons why I won't pay but one of them being I feel like those that invested into a gold membership are totally getting ripped off. Kinda feel bad for those that supported the company by paying 40 bucks but cannot even get this first event available to them, where's the logic behind that? Sounds like a bad business plan that hurts alot of the current viewership and popularity making it alot less enjoyable for those watching it.
MLG is a big business with many sponsorships, multiple games available to them to make tournament money off of, and have merchandise, silver/gold memberships, and other respectable assets that generate them cash. My point being if you're gonna pay the 20 bucks to, ''support esports'', you aren't actually doing so. In fact, MLG is being quite ridiculous to not atleast bump the prize pool alittle more. I don't care if they pay 100k for the players travel costs, that's nothing compared to the amount of money they collect from just one championship event.
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EPT
