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Just be real people. You can't keep a player forever if they never produce any results. Afaik they are housing him in Korea? Or maybe he paid for himself but if they are I think they at least can make some demands and he probably didn't fulfill with not even trying to qualify. Imagine if this was a football club, he would've been gone a long time ago. Anyway I don't wanna sound like a complete hater because I don't actually know who cArn is, I've just read his name a few times but it's just about being realistic.
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On January 12 2012 23:57 Lysanias wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote:
but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it.
They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on.
It's normal (and generally healthy) for most of the community to defend a player over an organization. I will always do this when there is not enough information either way - teams are businesses as they often times say themselves, and businesses should be under scrutiny at all times. It's up to them to keep their image clean, and it is not up to me to think about their interests.
eSahara should either clarify their position and fix the situation (if they do believe they are in the right) or deal with the negative comments. So that maybe in the future, they will think harder about which players they sign and release and consider all the implications before making any moves.
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Wow, the more I hear about eSahara, the more it solidifies my impression that they (not the players) are really nasty people. They get players who they think will make them look good and get rid of long term players just because they haven't been achieving? What's more they're to blame for Carn being unable to play at his best. Really not impressed.
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cArn is just full of shit guy stole famous cs players nickname and then tries to become pro-player and not practice in 5-6months LOL. Be real its not a fucking school where you just go and get the degree.
User was warned for this post
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On January 13 2012 00:04 Yonnua wrote:
Wow, the more I hear about eSahara, the more it solidifies my impression that they (not the players) are really nasty people. They get players who they think will make them look good and get rid of long term players just because they haven't been achieving? What's more they're to blame for Carn being unable to play at his best. Really not impressed.
Hey lets make a deal. I do some work for you and you pay me $. But after a month im not gonna work, cus i dont want to and i am terrble at doing that work. But if you fire me your a terrible person.
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I feel bad for the guy but maybe it's time to move on? If you don't have what it takes, you don't have what it takes. Can't blame esahara for dropping dead weight.
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On January 13 2012 00:06 Wazakhaq wrote:
cArn is just full of shit guy stole famous cs players nickname and then tries to become pro-player and not practice in 5-6months LOL. Be real its not a fucking school where you just go and get the degree.
This is completely uncalled for, keep your shit talking out of the thread please. In this case, sure cArn hasn't posted results, but the way the statement is worded and eSahara's problems up until now I find it hard to beleive that they kicked him because of "lack of motivation." There are ways that you let a player go, and trashing them when you do it is unprofessional and not needed at all.
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I think it's time for cArn to hang it up or move back to EU. He made it close in one of the GSL qualifiers, making it to the second to last round but ultimately failing. Dedicating yourself to 1.5 years in Korea for a game with no results can really set you back in life...... he used all his saved money to try and make his dream come true.
I knew this would happen too. cArn was one of the first person to join eSahara and after seeing eSahara add a lot of more known players, it's logical to think that they would try to drop their lesser known ones. It's a shame that they had to stoop so low and do it this way though.
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On January 13 2012 00:02 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 23:57 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote:
but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it.
They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on. It's normal (and generally healthy) for most of the community to defend a player over an organization. I will always do this when there is not enough information either way - teams are businesses, as they often times say themselves, and businesses should be under scrutiny. It's up to them to keep their image clean, and it is not up to me to think about their interests. eSahara should either clarify their position and fix the situation (if they do believe they are in the right) or deal with the negative comments.
I actualy don't mind they give the reason that cArn did not practice enough for them. Unfortunatly they do not back that up with any evidence, something they should have, or it becomes nothing more then putting your former player in a bad light.
I just find the blind hate here rather disturbing, bringing up irrelivant past topics and make eSahara look like tools and an evil business. Let's be honest that's not true either.
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Why is cArn's statement totally acceptable and he's just saying the thing as it is, but yet eSahara's the one trashing someone?
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not to sound like a carn apologist
nothing wrong with what esahara has done but how it is done is pretty much a dick move.
it seems to me that the team pulled the plug on the player without any communication.
did they make clear to the player that he must try for code a preliminary regardless of his level of preparedness?
did they talk to the player after hearing from the coach that he isnt practising like he should but instead playing dota?
did they try to motivate the player upon conclusion that he is unmotivated.
ultimately is the parting of ways mutual? because it doesnt seem like it.
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Esahara pretty unprofessional.
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On January 13 2012 00:12 Lysanias wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 00:02 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:57 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote:
but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it.
They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on. It's normal (and generally healthy) for most of the community to defend a player over an organization. I will always do this when there is not enough information either way - teams are businesses, as they often times say themselves, and businesses should be under scrutiny. It's up to them to keep their image clean, and it is not up to me to think about their interests. eSahara should either clarify their position and fix the situation (if they do believe they are in the right) or deal with the negative comments. I actualy don't mind they give the reason that cArn did not practice enough for them. Unfortunatly they do not back that up with any evidence, something they should have, or it becomes nothing more then putting your former player in a bad light. I just find the blind hate here rather disturbing, bringing up irrelivant past topics and make eSahara look like tools and an evil business. Let's be honest that's not true either.
As far as I'm concerned, every business is evil until proven otherwise. xP
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On January 13 2012 00:14 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 00:12 Lysanias wrote:On January 13 2012 00:02 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:57 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote:
but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it.
They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on. It's normal (and generally healthy) for most of the community to defend a player over an organization. I will always do this when there is not enough information either way - teams are businesses, as they often times say themselves, and businesses should be under scrutiny. It's up to them to keep their image clean, and it is not up to me to think about their interests. eSahara should either clarify their position and fix the situation (if they do believe they are in the right) or deal with the negative comments. I actualy don't mind they give the reason that cArn did not practice enough for them. Unfortunatly they do not back that up with any evidence, something they should have, or it becomes nothing more then putting your former player in a bad light. I just find the blind hate here rather disturbing, bringing up irrelivant past topics and make eSahara look like tools and an evil business. Let's be honest that's not true either. As far as I'm concerned, every business is evil until proven otherwise. xP
That's why your on a website of one of these evil teams ! I see let's keep that quiet.
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Not going to take sides, but I do think that cArn needs to be in a Korean team to achieve his full potential. Goodluck cArn, hope a Korean team recognizes your work ethic and picks you up.
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On January 13 2012 00:17 Lysanias wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 00:14 Talin wrote:On January 13 2012 00:12 Lysanias wrote:On January 13 2012 00:02 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:57 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote:
but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it.
They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on. It's normal (and generally healthy) for most of the community to defend a player over an organization. I will always do this when there is not enough information either way - teams are businesses, as they often times say themselves, and businesses should be under scrutiny. It's up to them to keep their image clean, and it is not up to me to think about their interests. eSahara should either clarify their position and fix the situation (if they do believe they are in the right) or deal with the negative comments. I actualy don't mind they give the reason that cArn did not practice enough for them. Unfortunatly they do not back that up with any evidence, something they should have, or it becomes nothing more then putting your former player in a bad light. I just find the blind hate here rather disturbing, bringing up irrelivant past topics and make eSahara look like tools and an evil business. Let's be honest that's not true either. As far as I'm concerned, every business is evil until proven otherwise. xP That's why your on a website of one of these evil teams ! I see let's keep that quiet.
Actually no. I said until proven otherwise, and this specific team/website has proven otherwise (with massive contribution to the community over the last decade and being the cornerstone of the starcraft scene).
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True a business is there to make money not to for players with dedication(even though it can be their secondary objective). If carn didn't want to goto qualifiers it's like wasting the companies time investing in him. Should I be fired for not turning up to work and get paid for it? No I shouldn't be fired and should keep my job and continue not going to work and expect to get paid because I think I'm not skilled enough to do it . So Carn even he can be the most dedicated person to Starcraft, sadly unless an enormous amount of people are aware of it and gains a huge fan base because of it, it won't mean a thing to the company as ey probably make a loss out of it.
It's all about the money, the world we live in is getting by because somehow we humans are now being controlled by a number. Our life somehow depends on a number. It's sad and yet a number makes us so greedy.
Reading Carns blog he seems very under prepared coming with only a laptop. I think his best option is to return home train hardcore on korean ladder (seems he does it in Korea anyways) or train with some people and popularized himself this way. However this is his choice and I guess he was fearless to do so. Then again I left my job to change my career path as well and 7 months later I make $80k in a business where I only spent $99 to invest on. Did people think I was stupid? Yes but dedication and hardworking brought me there and hope to make like 200k by end of this year? Do u think I'm stupid for think that? Probably but who cares I learnt so much from a field that I had absolutely no skill in to become someone that had this ability to do something. So carn believe in hardworking and determination, perfection is key here, I hope perfects all his error he has and prove once again that hard work is achievable. Oh wait I forgot Koreans are also hardworking and determined so it cancels out carn
Too many people won't do things because of only 2 things: fear and laziness. Get past that and believe.
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On January 13 2012 00:12 Lysanias wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2012 00:02 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:57 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote:On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote:On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote:
but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it.
They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on. It's normal (and generally healthy) for most of the community to defend a player over an organization. I will always do this when there is not enough information either way - teams are businesses, as they often times say themselves, and businesses should be under scrutiny. It's up to them to keep their image clean, and it is not up to me to think about their interests. eSahara should either clarify their position and fix the situation (if they do believe they are in the right) or deal with the negative comments. I actualy don't mind they give the reason that cArn did not practice enough for them. Unfortunatly they do not back that up with any evidence, something they should have, or it becomes nothing more then putting your former player in a bad light. I just find the blind hate here rather disturbing, bringing up irrelivant past topics and make eSahara look like tools and an evil business. Let's be honest that's not true either.
I don't recall reading anywhere that eSahara stated that cArn didn't practice enough rather that he didn't attend the qualifiers.
As for your diplomatic stance and bringing up irrelevant past/blind hate. Where? They're a business who wants to try and make money through esports, their PR sucks and they deserve to be shelled for it. Any repputable organization that releases a player includes his or her statement thats 1 strike.
After cArn bringing to light that they supported him with next to 0 for nearly 5 monthes is 2, and the fact that they are some fly by night orgazation is pushing strike 3.
They signed 2 decent beta Koreans and sent 2 players to Korea. Thats the only "irrelevant past" hence the fly by night.
I'm with cArn on this one, and I would be lieing to say that I'm indifferent toward future endeavors of eSahara.
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On January 13 2012 00:01 DwD wrote:
Just be real people. You can't keep a player forever if they never produce any results. Afaik they are housing him in Korea? Or maybe he paid for himself but if they are I think they at least can make some demands and he probably didn't fulfill with not even trying to qualify. Imagine if this was a football club, he would've been gone a long time ago. Anyway I don't wanna sound like a complete hater because I don't actually know who cArn is, I've just read his name a few times but it's just about being realistic.
You're from Sweden so I am assuming that when you say football you talk about euro football which in this analogy it doesn't really matter. Their are players in American football and soccer that never play a game but are just as much part of the team as anyone else.
You can't be MORE signed than anyone else.
And you want to talk about realism, they signed 2 korean beta players who have since fallen off and sent 2 players to Korea. Naama who placed 8th at Dreamhack being his highest and most notable achievement and Deathangel who doesn't have any legitimate accomplishments.
BEING REALISTIC they aren't going to achieve anything. I would be suprised to even see the seasoned beta koreans qualified for Code A.
edit: and that isn't an emotional judgement call referring my beliefs that stems from my disliking of eSahara, it is just truth.
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EPT
