EPTcArn and eSahara parts ways - Page 7
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
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Agathon
France1505 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:12 Hossinaut wrote: I dont understand where eSahara's hubris is coming from. I understand that at a certain point you have to let a player go, but with latency being cited as an issue, with time differences an issue, with no support system visible, by their condemnation of him as undedicated.... I am wondering whether or not eSahara is actually worth time and energy to consider as worthwhile. cArn is one of the most dedicated players in eSports-moving to Korea with no SC or RTS background to play SC2. He abandoned everything and has been living without much money by his own will... I do not see any of these things as lack of dedication. I do see a lack of support structure on eSahara's part that would help cArn to motivate him, to help him understand (kindly) that he needs to show up to represent eSahara at the qualifiers, even if he has no hope. To the meat of the matter, eSahara has posted no notable results. Naama's top 8 @ Dreamhack Winter 2011 I believe can be attributed to his displayed skill moreso than eSaraha's care for him, as shown by their bungling of his travel material. If eSahara has posted no results, how can they-another team with no results in the sea of eSports teams-get mad at a player that is performing likewise? As an atheist i don't particularly enjoy this analogy, however: why aren't they looking at the beam in their own eye rather than seeing the splinter in cArns? You're right in many ways. But there's something important that you're forgeting. A team works with sponsors. Sponsors want much visibility. This visibility is carried by the players making results in competition (even it's small results, qualify, get out the group stages, etc.., the farthest players go, the most satisfied the sponsors are). cArn is in Korea, where he wants to be obviously, he never plays online cups in EU (theses cups give much visibility, that how Stephano has been known at strat, Nerchio aswell), he never plays qualifications for IEM/IPL etc, and don't play GSL qualifier for code A. We can have much respect for cArn (and i have), but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it. It's sad, for sure, but it's real life, and life do not always reward the the bravest. | ||
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EtherealBlade
660 Posts
Of course the only way to see is by making the effort, which is commendable but hey it's 2012 already. | ||
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inamorato
United States263 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:18 gullberg wrote: Naniwa/Sjow haven't played in the qualifiers though. You're right. They got a seed directly to Code A and wiped immediately along with EVERY other foreigner. What sort of fly by night team is this eSahara? I've never heard of them and then 10 days ago 13 threads pop up about how they acquired Maka and Check and people are going to Korea and . Haha, that must be why they're getting rid of cArn. As far as I'm concerned cArn was the only interesting person on the team. They're threads are cheesy. Which includes their banners, font, P.R. linguism. ROFL they think they sign a oldschool bw pro because they observed him on the NA ladder for a few days where he managed to do "well". Who is commandeering this vessel? I see more dismay coming from this cracksquad of highly motivated individuals. | ||
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k!llua
Australia895 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:38 karpo wrote: I love how you, K!llua, knows what's beneficial and what's best for both esahara and cArn. He's not good enough, so he should go home to europe? Maybe if he got the chance to join a solid training house he would be able to gain a code A spot, how would you know? Maybe he will get a chance to join one of the korean teams? Maybe he's stuck teamless in korea for another year? I don't know and neither do you. Getting really tired of know-it-alls that apparently know exactly what other people should and shouldn't do. there's a lot of "maybe" in what you say there. professional organisations can only continue to operate on the basis of a "maybe" for so long. maybe cArn will get into GSL and prove everyone wrong. i hope he does. but after a year of no results - for whatever reason - surely you can understand why esahara decided to cut the cord. they're not a charity, after all. | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:39 Muki wrote: Well tbh who did not see this coming? Just because someone decides to live in Korea does not mean they have what it takes to be an SC2 pro let alone qualify for GSL. Tried, failed, end of story. Of course the only way to see is by making the effort, which is commendable but hey it's 2012 already. Just because someone decides to live in Korea doesn't mean they get access to training partners or a decent place to practice. It's not as black and white as either you try and win or try and fail. There's lots of circumstances that affect the outcome. On January 12 2012 23:42 k!llua wrote: there's a lot of "maybe" in what you say there. professional organisations can only continue to operate on the basis of a "maybe" for so long. maybe cArn will get into GSL and prove everyone wrong. i hope he does. but after a year of no results - for whatever reason - surely you can understand why esahara decided to cut the cord. they're not a charity, after all. Maybe it's beneficial for esahara to kick cArn. But what irks me is that people like you can just breeze in and say "It's best if you do X". Do you know cArn, do you know all the circumstances or are you just sprouting your opinion as some kind of fact? Maybe you should use the word "maybe" some in your posts as it seems like you're just guessing. | ||
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FiNTer
Finland153 Posts
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Plus, judging by the tone of this and previous esahara press releases, and the other fiascos they've been involved in, I'm betting that no one ever went up to cArn and said "hey man you need to go to the qualifiers, the bosses think its really important and they're going to boot you if you don't go," which would presumably have led him to go. This seems more spur of the moment. If this is how esahara does things then it doesn't seem like a sustainable part of esports. Maybe they're more professional in their native language (French, I think?) but it's hard to see how a team this disorganized manages to get enough sponsorships to hire players and keep a team going in Korea. To cArn: I hope this doesn't force you to split up from your practice partners at ProS, that would be super lame now that you've finally got good practice again. | ||
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theBALLS
Singapore2935 Posts
BUT As a professional team, you should NEVER make a statement like that. Let your unhappiness be between the team and the player. Why try to discredit and disgrace him like that? If a team like EG were to release a player for "lacking motivation", their statement would be along the lines of "The team and player had different goals and therefore parted ways." Don't put someone down like he's a dog. eSahara, you have lost my respect. Your are an extremely, extremely unprofessional team. | ||
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Tonttu
Finland606 Posts
Completely understand eSahara's decision here.. though their wording could've been a bit better. GL for both eSahara and cArn.. Hope they'll get naama to Korea too, properly this time.. ;P | ||
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:43 karpo wrote: Just because someone decides to live in Korea doesn't mean they get access to training partners or a decent place to practice. It's not as black and white as either you try and win or try and fail. There's lots of circumstances that affect the outcome. Yea, these would be things to take care of BEFORE you go to Korea. You don't just hope that someone will come along and pay for/set up all that for you... | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:38 Agathon wrote: but if you put yourself in eSahara's shoes, you would have to ask yourself if it worth it. They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:46 SupLilSon wrote: Yea, these would be things to take care of BEFORE you go to Korea. You don't just hope that someone will come along and pay for/set up all that for you... Agreed. What i was saying is that he might got what it takes but circumstances and the lack of a solid team hurt his chances. | ||
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kyllinghest
Norway1607 Posts
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Lysanias
Netherlands8351 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:48 Talin wrote: They should have thought about that before they signed him. They strike me as one of those teams that will sign anyone they've heard of given a chance. Their entire roster is a random collection of players that they picked up at random places and that they obviously know nothing or very little about. When they signed cArn, he was somewhat known in the community and he was in Korea, so at the time it was a good choice for a completely new team. Now that they've managed to pick up Naama and the Koreans, they no longer need him any more. It's such a fickle and petty management, but then again that's nothing new for organizations with counterstrike background. Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. | ||
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:49 karpo wrote: Agreed. What i was saying is that he might got what it takes but circumstances and the lack of a solid team hurt his chances. He's been in Korea for a long time. Even when he was practicing/streaming a lot he was only mid masters. Hell, any random masters player might "got what it takes" if allowed to practice 12 hours a day in a Korean environment. But this is a business environment and time and money are very real factors. If he hasn't qualified for GSL yet, chances are he won't ever, the competition in the GSL is rising rapidly and with BW pros switches very soon, foreigner chances in the GSL are almost over. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:51 Lysanias wrote: Your complained works both ways, cArn himself would have known they had no place for him to stay, or did they fool him to sign a contract. I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. | ||
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Lysanias
Netherlands8351 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:55 Talin wrote: I would actually love to hear a clarification of whether or not carn knew this beforehand. Then again, it might not even matter. If they failed to provide support and a practice environment from him, and then make expectations that, in order to be met, required him to practice, the blame still falls on them. Instead, they are blaming HIM for not practicing and presenting it as evidence for his lack of dedication. Indeed we do not know the insight of the contract so it's only speculations but it bothers me that eSahara's get's the flame without people know what exactly is going on nether do we, i doubt you just dumb a player if he shows great form or promise. | ||
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gregnog
United States289 Posts
On January 12 2012 23:18 cArn- wrote: I'm bit tired of people not knowing a quarter of what is up to jump on conclusion, I didn't want to say anything about all this but if people are to say things that are not true I guess I'll have to shed some lights. I'm gonna be very short as it was something I was gonna talk about in the rest of my blogs anyway. So long story short, I joined eSahara, they couldn't provide me with the possibility to pratice since I left the GOM house, so I wasn't able to practice for 5 or 6 months. Guess what, when you can't practice for this long, you're not gonna have any results. For the qualifiers I had a bit over a month of practice at the ProS house, but I was still not in good shape enough to be able to win it, and if I were to go to the qualifiers it would be to win. It wasn't going to happen this time, and I had more than enough experience playing in every single one of the previous qualifiers (except the one when I was in Europe for ESWC). There also was no real coverage whatsover of the qualifiers this time so it's not like there was any exposure to get out of it for the team, instead of continuing the disappointments that were ESWC and PPSL I would rather get my skill level and my confidence in my game back, improve as much as possible and be ready to win the next qualifier. I just find really disappointing that eSahara tries to discredit me like this, that they interpret me not going as a lack of motivation, sure no problem that's what they think, but to then try to make people think I'm not practising is just not something you do. Especially since I choose to stick with them when I had better options just because I felt they were going in the right direction and had the right ideas and that we could build something together. I was wrong, it was just talking. I could have things to say about what went wrong with eSahara and I, but I'm not gonna be that guy who crosses the line even though they went out of their way to spread misinformation about me. It's fine, I know what I want and what I'm capable of, people who know me and know the details about all of this are supporting me, and those who don't have all the informations have to keep this in mind : they don't have all the informations. So thanks to those who are still supporting me. The ones who are doubting me it's fine, it's just a matter of time before you are made wrong. I know it, people who know me know it, eSahara knows it. Just next time ... say it how it is : no results. Which I obviously understand, but that's all there is to it. I'm not going into further details now, everything is gonna be covered in my next blogs when I get to that point. As for this issue there is not much more to say. GL GL in the future man. I agree, it's extremely unprofessional and childish for them to go out of their way to discredit you. Hopefully people will take note of how ridiculous eSahara is. Citing all those reason to let you go, while recruiting gold league players... | ||
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