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On January 06 2012 09:52 PhiliBiRD wrote:thing with dota is it was just 1 tourney... a good game for esports has MANY MANY opportunities. so just because dota 2 had #2 most money, doesnt mean its #2 best game for esports! Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 09:51 Ruscour wrote:On January 06 2012 08:23 Goldbullet wrote:
Not to hate on DOTA but I just don't see it competing with starcraft because it takes less skill to play and is basically a mirror of LoL. this is straight up the dumbest thing I've ever read How is that dumb? He's pretty much exactly right. THere is no arguing that SC2 takes more skill to play... we know this. Why is that a bad thing for Dota? It's not. It's different. SC2 doesnt have a rival. Dota has LOL and HON to compete with.
You can't compare DotA skills and Starcraft skills. It's stupid. And first quote is even dumber. And omg, I'm sure we'll be able to hit the 6mill in 2012 :D
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I think it's worth mentioning that since DOTA 2 is a team game inidividual payouts are probably much smaller than SC2. I wonder if anyone is tracking an average payout per participant figure.
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On January 06 2012 09:52 PhiliBiRD wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 09:51 Ruscour wrote:On January 06 2012 08:23 Goldbullet wrote:
Not to hate on DOTA but I just don't see it competing with starcraft because it takes less skill to play and is basically a mirror of LoL. this is straight up the dumbest thing I've ever read How is that dumb? He's pretty much exactly right. THere is no arguing that SC2 takes more skill to play... we know this. Why is that a bad thing for Dota? It's not. It's different. SC2 doesnt have a rival. Dota has LOL and HON to compete with.
SC2 and DotA are two completely different games, comparing them is just silly. DotA is a team game, SC2 is not.
SC2 is a RTS, DotA is not. Sure, SC2 needs way better game mechanics (blah, hate my spelling today-.-), in the sense that you don't have to multitask as much. On the other hand you need to have team play in DotA, which is something you don't need in SC2.
Don't compare two differnet games, it's like comparing swimming with football, and saying one is harder than the other...
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I believe there's an SC2 team league in Taiwan (Gamabears, the team Sen is on is one of them), it's worth mentioning!
I think SC2 might be the only one of the 3 games mentioned that has a sub-community especially for female gamers (especially competitive tournaments with prizes) which I think is something that is important for the growth of eSports as a whole.
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On January 06 2012 22:43 iChau wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 11:17 dekarp wrote:On January 06 2012 11:10 Eppa! wrote:On January 06 2012 10:48 dekarp wrote:On January 06 2012 10:30 Trevor.PGT wrote:dekarp: just dislike the fact that it's taken seriously as a competitive game. Did you even read what I said or did you just see "LoL... terrible"? I was trying to explain why it is more than just a casual game. The simplicity of LoL has shown to be great! The competitive aspect may seem lacking but this is mainly because the lack of experienced players. Once LoL players have played for months and years 8 and more hours a day it will bring a higher level of competition to LoL. Simplicity does not mean a game is lacking in competition. Competition is a contest between individuals, more individuals leads to an increased level of competition. Just no, it has nothing to do with experience. LoL has been out longer than Starcraft 2 btw... Yeah, its simplicity is great because it appeals to so many people, which is fine. Do you see me saying anything negative about a game like Banjo-Kazooie? Nothing wrong with being popular and easily accessible, as long as Rare doesn't fund some tournament series for millions of dollars to see who can collect all the puzzle pieces the fastest to promote it's esports legitimacy, whatever. May be a somewhat poor analogy, but I think you get the point. Simplicity never stopped chess. Funny, people liken Chess to SC all the time, guess SC is simple then! Mind = blown. Like someone said before (and you), bad analogy. Also, likening =/= equal. Mind = blown.
Thank you for explaining what the words "likening" and "equal" mean. I'm sure no one knew it, so thanks for clearing that up kind sir/ma'am ^_^
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On January 06 2012 08:12 Diglett wrote:
i thought bw and lol would be on the list. anyone know the numbers for these games?
If you added salary I bet BW would crush everything else.
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Dota 2 is going to be HUGE.
The DotA community is bigger than the SC2 community in terms of size in areas like China and Southeast Asia.
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On January 06 2012 09:52 PhiliBiRD wrote:thing with dota is it was just 1 tourney... a good game for esports has MANY MANY opportunities. so just because dota 2 had #2 most money, doesnt mean its #2 best game for esports! Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 09:51 Ruscour wrote:On January 06 2012 08:23 Goldbullet wrote:
Not to hate on DOTA but I just don't see it competing with starcraft because it takes less skill to play and is basically a mirror of LoL. this is straight up the dumbest thing I've ever read How is that dumb? He's pretty much exactly right. THere is no arguing that SC2 takes more skill to play... we know this. Why is that a bad thing for Dota? It's not. It's different. SC2 doesnt have a rival. Dota has LOL and HON to compete with.
It's dumb because skill in Dota is measured in a much different way than in SC2. There's no doubt that individually, SC2 takes more skill, but since DotA is a team game, there's a huge "team skill" factor involved, which is INCREDIBLY hard to get. You don't just put 5 good dota players and get a good team, there's a lot more to it.
And Dota 2 is a beta. And a lot of organizations are starting to put money in Dota 2. Most sponsorless big teams are now sponsored and some money is rolling in. Expect a lot of growth from Dota 2 this year.
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i'm curious to see how LoL is broadcasted. if production value is good it may have some wings.
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Awesome read! Very interesting stuff.
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On January 07 2012 03:30 Ownos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2012 03:12 aristarchus wrote:
The real measure is money taken in by the industry - subscriptions + sponsorships + ads. Clearly the other games are being supported as a form of advertising, but it's also worth pointing out that a decent amount of the SC2 money is speculative. Tournaments are (to an unclear extent) losing money now in order to position themselves for growth that they expect. What really makes it sustainable is money coming in. It's just that that's very hard to measure. I think organizations will dial things back a bit after the dust settles from all this ESPORTS hype.  That's my cynical view of it. I mean GOM's overall prize is lowered (longer, fewer tournaments, same prize pool). MLG's cutting employees to be "leaner" and I seriously doubt IGN will dump so much money into a ghost town tournament like they ran earlier (great online viewership though!)
Don't mistaken MLG cutting their employees as a sign that they aren't making banks atm.
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Even If other games get more in total winnings that doesn't mean much. If the developer is playing for everything then you can expect the whole scene to fall apart once the developer decides to move on. Its quite amazing how much sc2 made and almost none of it was sponsored by blizzard.(Exept blizzcon with GOM? )
By the way...Ive played Dota 2 beta. HOLY S**T it is boring. Matches take half an hour and you have to wait hours to get money to buy items. Everything is so slow(this sc2 on normal). Also the streaming/watch games client SUCKS. It is like 20 pages that tell you nothing about who is playing the game and are full of games you can watch.
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EPT
