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its weird when people think that Naniwa should get an apology for having to play a meaningless game.. -_-
think about this: at the end of a football season, pretty much everything is decided except for a few things. Big clubs like Barca and ManU usually have already secured 1st place while some other teams are last and cant escape from it anymore with just a few remaining matches. but does any team or any team member just sit down on the ground and stop running? just because it doesnt matter anymore??? if any player did that the club will punish him, and if a star player did it, any awards he might have been awarded could get cancelled, and if a whole team refused to play, uefa or fifa could have taken actions against the team.
"meaningless" games exist in any sport and in any tounament. it does not mean you can forfeit and disrespect the opponent by intentionally thowing the game, because of professionalism and the expectations of the fans. it just isnt morally correct. rules are not everything in this world. there are no rules about respecting a person, but we are still encouraged to do so. if somebody tells me that there is no need to respect others because there isnt a rule about it then that person doesnt deserve any respect.
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On December 15 2011 23:58 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 23:55 Diizzy wrote:
purposely losing no matter what reason should always be prohibited. Then there would be a crap load of more players being punished. Formats and incentives have to be revised. Cannot force players.
GOM already announced the plan for 2012 GSL with change in the format. Besides a few Korean players have been already punished and kicked out of GSL because they purposely lose the game.
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not only that nani gets punished with no rule that actually shows that what he did was not allowed but also the horrible new invite format ?
goodbye gsl subscription
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Their statement came late, their decision was a knee-jerk reaction.. however they sugar coat things it doesn't add up. GOM comes out as scummy in this ordeal, bit time. imo
Do not expect from others what you are not capable of yourself (like professionalism) .. a lot of people who can look past personal disliking of Naniwa, professionals and level headed people are likely to do just that. GOM is not between those, and so, look pretty fucking bad for doing this, imo.
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On December 16 2011 00:17 Skyreaper wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 23:58 StarStruck wrote:On December 15 2011 23:55 Diizzy wrote:
purposely losing no matter what reason should always be prohibited. Then there would be a crap load of more players being punished. Formats and incentives have to be revised. Cannot force players. GOM already announced the plan for 2012 GSL with change in the format. Besides a few Korean players have been already punished and kicked out of GSL because they purposely lose the game.
Who? I don't remember that.
CoCa is the only one that throwed a match yet... and it was worst. It was not meaningless for any one, and it was to let the spot to a team mate. It's cheating.
And CoCa was not removed from GSL. He gave up is spot, after a discution with Boxer and Jessica. It's no way near the same thing. GOMTV did nothing against him. There was not even an announcement from them regarding this.
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its so hilarious that even long after naniwa admitted the mistake and realised himself, ppl here are still thinking he didnt break any rule!
if he, who actually "played" that game, understands and can see why it was unacceptable, why can't ppl here?
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On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy.
1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game.
2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom.
3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would get from a swedish tournament host...
added: to enforce point 3. imagine someone misbehaving during the DH valencia invite tournament, do you think that person would be banned from the following DH summer/winter? it's ridiculous
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On December 16 2011 00:11 Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 23:48 Eko200 wrote:
Does anyone else feel like both Naniwa and Gomtv have stooped to a new low? Naniwa's actions were hotheaded as always but in a "I should know better" kind of way. While Gom isn't making one big glaring mistake regarding this, a bunch of other mistakes they made including tournament format and succumbing to fan pressure have culminated to some of the worst foreign press reactions. They also need to change the rules to state players can't act in the way Naniwa did before they hand out punishments for a rule that isn't even in the books. Nope. Naniwa made a quick mistake feuled by emotion and has admitted his mistake and will live with it. I can forgive that GOM, on the other hand, had time to write their explanation of their policy and came up with this solution which still seems to me like they're trying to rewrite history and establish a league based on subjectivity. This does indeed have shades of KeSPA to me where they don't admit when they're wrong. Naniwa comes out ahead in my eyes.
While I agree that establishing a league on subjectivity is probably not the best idea, how would you propose GOM even recover at this point? Were they supposed to just let it go and then write the rule for next time? ( This is probably what should have happened in my opinion )
I think one of the fundamental problems here is that GOM is really the only governing body of SC2 in Korea as it stands. There is really no system for checks and balances in place, outside of really the community and the players offering their opinions here and there. GOM can really do whatever they want and if they feel that it is the right way to handle it, then it will be done that way. It is hard to imagine they are consulting other entities in the SC2 community to try and determine the best way to handle it.
Is something like KeSPA becoming nessicary to handle situations like this or is it just a result of poor planning and hasty, rash decision making?
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On December 16 2011 00:22 Jameser wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy. 1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game. 2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom. 3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would from a swedish tournament host...
yeah right, how can you expect Naniwa to know that he should play like a professional sc2 player on a tournament.... oh wait!
he got kicked out of other tournaments as well so he has experience with this....
and what has this to do with swedish tournament hosts anyway?!
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On December 16 2011 00:20 Xalorian wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:17 Skyreaper wrote:On December 15 2011 23:58 StarStruck wrote:On December 15 2011 23:55 Diizzy wrote:
purposely losing no matter what reason should always be prohibited. Then there would be a crap load of more players being punished. Formats and incentives have to be revised. Cannot force players. GOM already announced the plan for 2012 GSL with change in the format. Besides a few Korean players have been already punished and kicked out of GSL because they purposely lose the game. Who? I don't remember that. CoCa is the only one that throwed a match yet... and it was worst. It was not meaningless for any one, and it was to let the spot to a team mate. It's cheating. And CoCa was not removed from GSL. He gave up is spot, after a discution with Boxer and Jessica. It's no way near the same thing. GOMTV did nothing against him. There was not even an announcement from them regarding this.
Boxer already took action before GomTV can do anything to him. This is why GomTV did nothing against him, because CoCa's team promised Gom that Coca will be banned from participating any tournament for unspecified amount of time.
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On December 16 2011 00:25 gTank wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:22 Jameser wrote:On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy. 1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game. 2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom. 3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would from a swedish tournament host... yeah right, how can you expect Naniwa to know that he should play like a professional sc2 player on a tournament.... oh wait! he got kicked out of other tournaments as well so he has experience with this.... and what has this to do with swedish tournament hosts anyway?!
obviously he knows he is expected to be respectful to other players and so on. but to be disqualified from a completely different tournament based on not trying to win a match that has no meaning in a trounament he already lost? that's completely different
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On December 16 2011 00:22 Jameser wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy. 1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game. 2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom. 3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would get from a swedish tournament host...
I did not say he should have known anything. I merely stated that there is precidence here for removing code S status. CoCa threw a game in a non-GOM administered tournament and had his Code S status revoked as well. Is this any different because his team had the balls to make that decision before GOM did? I don't think so.
It does not matter if the tournament was Code-S or not. GOM operates both tournaments and as it stands, they can freely punish however they will for whatever they want. Either way, it creates a negative connotation for GOM, whether it happens in their All Star Tournament or Code S. I really fail to understand this logic. If someone threw a game in MLG or Dreamhack, do you also think that it is unfair to punish them in upcoming tournaments hosted by the same companies?
And as far as "Swedish tournament hosts", If you're going to sit there and tell me that Dreamhack doesn't care whether or not people throw matches in their tournaments and depriciate the quality of the games, then I would be concerned about the quality of the product that they are producing.
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in what culture is "intentionally throwing a game in a professional event" accepted? i dont understand why people talk about korean culture not accepting naniwa's action. naniwa's action must be discouraged in whatever culture you are in and it has got nothing to do with rules.
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On December 16 2011 00:27 Jameser wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:25 gTank wrote:On December 16 2011 00:22 Jameser wrote:On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy. 1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game. 2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom. 3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would from a swedish tournament host... yeah right, how can you expect Naniwa to know that he should play like a professional sc2 player on a tournament.... oh wait! he got kicked out of other tournaments as well so he has experience with this.... and what has this to do with swedish tournament hosts anyway?! obviously he knows he is expected to be respectful to other players and so on. but to be disqualified from a completely different tournament based on not trying to win a match that has no meaning in a trounament he already lost? that's completely different
but he himself said that the match was not meaningless:
"I wasn’t thinking clearly, and acted unprofessionally. At first I didn’t realize how big of a deal it really was, but when I saw how much everyone wanted to see my game against NesTea, I felt terrible and truly began to realize what I had done. I first thought that the match against NesTea was meaningless, but now I realize that it really did mean a lot, and that there’s no such thing as a “meaningless game” in eSports."
copied out of:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=295023
so what is your point anyway?
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On December 16 2011 00:27 turamn wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:22 Jameser wrote:On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy. 1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game. 2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom. 3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would get from a swedish tournament host... I did not say he should have known anything. I merely stated that there is precidence here for removing code S status. CoCa threw a game in a non-GOM administered tournament and had his Code S status revoked as well. again, not the same circumstances
It does not matter if the tournament was Code-S or not. GOM operates both tournaments and as it stands, they can freely punish however they will for whatever they want. Either way, it creates a negative connotation for GOM, whether it happens in their All Star Tournament or Code S.
and that is exactly what I'm criticizing, they should not base their punishments on whatever they feel is adequate "revenge" for "offending them", they should have rules in place and if you break those rules there should be clearly pre-defined punishments for breaking those rules.
I really fail to understand this logic. If someone threw a game in MLG or Dreamhack, do you also think that it is unfair to punish them in upcoming tournaments hosted by the same companies?
if they are separate events, yes.
And as far as "Swedish tournament hosts", If you're going to sit there and tell me that Dreamhack doesn't care whether or not people throw matches in their tournaments and depriciate the quality of the games, then I would be concerned about the quality of the product that they are producing.
the quality of their product is ensured by not having a format that allows meaningless matches that cannot affect the larger tournament results that are also broadcasted on air.
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On December 16 2011 00:27 Jameser wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 00:25 gTank wrote:On December 16 2011 00:22 Jameser wrote:On December 16 2011 00:14 turamn wrote:On December 16 2011 00:08 Jameser wrote:On December 15 2011 23:53 turamn wrote:On December 15 2011 23:47 Jameser wrote:It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner. This was not only disappointing for his opponent NesTea and the GSL, but also for the many fans who had anticipated a great match. This behavior does not match with the definition of a progamer as laid out in the paragraph above. so basically anyone who doesn't conform to this arbitrary korean culture where everyone seems to think they're a samurai and honor bound to do pointless shit for the sake of nothing will be removed from the GSL seed that they earned in a proper contest environment that actually mattered? not acceptable for me personally I'm affraid. To do pointless shit for the sake of nothing, huh? However you may feel, the fact of the matter is that cultural differences will arise many times in a sport that is global. ... for this reason all decisions from a supposedly global organization should be motivated by an already established rule, and as gom themselves clearly said, naniwa did not break any rules. at no point was it stated that forfeiting a game would be punished by disqualification from code S. There was no way for naniwa to know he would be punished for what he did. This affects the legitimacy of the entire community. it is also going to upset the sponsors. I would not be surprised at all if GOM had its sponsor's breathign down it's neck, asking "Why did your best of the best all star player cop out and throw the game like a child?" This is not behavior that is going to make sponsors happy. 1. the GSL rules clearly state that you will be disqualified if you fail to show up to a game. How is that even relevant? It does not have to be stated. There was already precedent for this. Rain forfeited Code S games and was banned, for even longer than Naniwa. The only difference is Naniwa showed up and then threw the game. Rain didn't even bother to show, which is likely why his punishment was more severe. On top of that, a player needs to understand that when doing something like this, not only is it going to upset the league, but 2. he wasn't even playing in code S, the blizz cup is a separate tournament and is only linked to code S in that they are both hosted by gom. 3. "he should have known" is a fail argument. How can you possibly expect naniwa, who's been in korea for just a few months, to be able to predict the actions of an organization based on a culture system he has never been exposed to before in a country he's never been in before? I'll tell you right now this is not the reaction you would from a swedish tournament host... yeah right, how can you expect Naniwa to know that he should play like a professional sc2 player on a tournament.... oh wait! he got kicked out of other tournaments as well so he has experience with this.... and what has this to do with swedish tournament hosts anyway?! obviously he knows he is expected to be respectful to other players and so on. but to be disqualified from a completely different tournament based on not trying to win a match that has no meaning in a trounament he already lost? that's completely different
There is absolutely no difference. A GOM tournament is a GOM tournament, regardless of title. The reality of it is, they can punish him however they chose, whether you agree with it or not. How are they going to get their point across by punishing him in a tournament he's already lost and made himself look like a complete tool in? They aren't. They are going to use the leverage they have to get their point across.
As far as the rule situation goes, I do agree with you that they need to have rules in place. Hopefully every organization will be hard at work in the coming days to make sure that their rules are well defined and the like. As far as the punishment thing goes, it's blatantly obvious that we will never come to a common ground for that, so I will no longer address it.
As far as "meaningless matches" go, It is a matter of perception. You can believe they are meaningless if you like, but that is not the case. There will always be scenarios with people who believe that matches are meaningless and unless they are playing for money or position, I do not feel like there is any way to resolve this issue.
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I really think this is just cultural differences.
Outside of Korea, Naniwa would have been thought of as the owner of his performance in that game, and he can do absolutely whatever he wants with it as long as he isn't cheating.
And things that are considered disrespectful in Korea are thought of as more fun and jokey outside of Korea. Like players talking to each other during the early stages of a game, or trash talking each other during interviews.
These things are just part of the entertainment for us outside of Korea.
If Naniwa did this in an MLG or an IEM, Tastosis wouldn't think of it as an incident at all. They would just commentate on Naniwa's mental state, they'd take it as an expression of Naniwa's frustration with his performance, an expression of resignation and disappointment, etc.
It'd never be something that'd cost him a Code S seed, or require the intervention of a referee or anything like that.
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foreigners should be happy they are seeded to code s. dont know how many koreans work hard to even get that spot.
not even the end of naniwa in gom. he just needs to prove he can qualify, the way it should be from the start.
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this topic is now overkill, whats done is now done, people hating on gom get over it.
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Hmm according to their statement, GSL is for all fans. They forgot to mention there is no support for mac users. Atleast not an easy solution. I have yet to find a reliable way of watching GSL on my mac which i am forced to be on every second week.
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|
|
|
EPT
