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Hopefully he truly learned from this.
As for idra. Idra never rages or BMs in GSL and such. He knows how to be a professional. That's the point.
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Well handled. Best of luck to you Naniwa in your quest to regain that Code S spot!
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This is just too bad, Naniwa looked scary in his matches. Will continue to support him, everyone makes mistakes.
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On December 15 2011 14:15 Kimaker wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 12:38 crms wrote:
now that he's being fake everyone will like him again lol....
honest:
game was meaningless and he was too tired, stressed and upset to play it out, community mad.
community:
'just 4 gate, pretend you're trying for me!!'
honest:
gives his explanation on why he did what he did.
community: still mad.
Phony:
gives full blown recantation and apology through his team's press release with major 'self realizations about esports' that not only seem completely out of his character but don't feel to have an once of truth behind them after shit storm gets to big'
community: well now that's a nice statement, we can move on now.
people are so weird, i feel like there should be a troll face somewhere in here. This is how I feel about the whole thing. I mean I think everyone agrees he could have handled it better, but it's not exactly something wshould be expecting apologies over...the entitlement mentality from the community is blowing my mind right about now.
The self entitlement and disgusting bias. So many of the posts on the subject about how Naniwa's actions are worse than similar actions by other players due to arbitarily defined reasons. I wish he'd just 4 gated so all that would have happened is some people in the LR thread would have posted 'aww I guess he just didn't want to play out a meaningless game.' and I wouldn't feel like punching myself in the brain.
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On December 15 2011 11:42 poorcloud wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 11:14 Tula wrote:On December 15 2011 11:00 diehilde wrote:
So bending over and saying what is expected of you instead of what you really think is the kind of professionalism we are getting here. A great day for professionalism, a sad day for gaming imo. posts like this make me question our world... Since when has "saying what you really think" ever been considerd professional in any context? It might be honest, but it seldom is professional. No salesperson in the world will ever tell you what they think. No reporter will ever ask a politician if he is fucking serious even if they probably should. Why is that? Because we as a society have certain norms we consider professional behaviour and blunt honesty (which is a nicer phrasing of "tactless" or "unfriendly" in many cases) is not a part of it in many jobs. Respect and Courtesy is far more likely. This. I don't know why so many people think its awesome to speak your mind directly. Hope these people go to any shops and have the sales person whos on a bad day shout at them. Then what are all you gonna do, are you gonna say "Good job for being yourself?". No you will be rightfully pissed as a customer. The salesperson should be professional and not let feelings get in the way of his/her job. We have standards in life. I don't go around telling people they suck just because i think they do. I don't hurt people feelings just because i say whats on my mind. And i don't fuck up my job just because i don't feel like. I don't understand why so many people have no standards at all.
Just because people do not have exactly the same standards as you does not mean they have no standards at all. Also your analogy is kind of bad. Salesperson is mostly not selling me something quality of which depends on his state of mind. Him being "fake" friendly has no bearing on the product I will get. In case of meaningless games that is not the case. It is biological impossibility that players will play their best in such circumstances (some might , most won't). Societal rules that go completely against biology of a normal human are mostly bad. This is a case of such rule.
To make your analogy work you would need to compare salesperson's behavior with Naniwa's behavior in interviews and other sales parts of his job. So what he did at MLG was wrong and he should have been punished for that. I would be first to support it. What he did in GSL was slightly impolite but otherwise case of bad tournament format and the rage and punishment case of bad societal rule and them forcing him to conform to it is just an example of hurtful excessive conformism of some Asian cultures (see suicide rates of South Korea). There is nothing good to be gained by faking/conforming in this case.
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Good for Naniwa. Sounds like he realizes that given his popularity he's become a lot more than just a gamer, but an ambassador of the sport. Hope he continues to see success.
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On December 15 2011 12:38 crms wrote:
now that he's being fake everyone will like him again lol....
honest:
game was meaningless and he was too tired, stressed and upset to play it out, community mad.
community:
'just 4 gate, pretend you're trying for me!!'
honest:
gives his explanation on why he did what he did.
community: still mad.
Phony:
gives full blown recantation and apology through his team's press release with major 'self realizations about esports' that not only seem completely out of his character but don't feel to have an once of truth behind them after shit storm gets to big'
community: well now that's a nice statement, we can move on now.
people are so weird, i feel like there should be a troll face somewhere in here.
Sometimes swallowing your pride is all people expect. How could he honestly offer reparations?
Being a grownup is admitting you were wrong, even if you don't believe it.
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On December 15 2011 13:52 diophan wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 13:47 mcc wrote:On December 15 2011 10:19 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:On December 15 2011 10:12 mcc wrote:On December 15 2011 09:50 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:I'm glad MLB, NBA, NHL, and NFL teams don't try to forfeit games where both teams are unable to reach the playoffs. Huk's blame placed on GOM for supposedly poor tournament design is ridiculous in light of this. Look at how hard Matt Barkley and the rest of USC played this season even though they knew from game 1 that they couldn't play in a conference championship game or bowl game (for the uninitiated, see: http://lostangelesblog.wordpress.com/). That is how sports are to be played and life is to be lived. This has absolutely nothing to do with any supposed cultural difference between Korea and NA / Europe. The OSL is the crown jewel of eSports, the shining example of how to make a computer game into an exciting cultural event. And just about every OSL round of 16 contains games between people who can't make the round of 8. I don't remember anyone throwing such games that badly. If a player did something that was suboptimal, they did something fun and creative for the fans, such as (I believe) Much trying to use Corsairs in PvT. Even though the Clippers are still not NBA Finals material with Blake Griffin, his enthusiasm and flashy dunks put more happy people in the seats. The very first GOM event with Tasteless, the very first eSport event I ever watched, the GOM Star Invitational, had a group with both Nada and Boxer. Tasteless had been talking them up all tournament but by the time they faced off, they were both 0-2 and couldn't make the next round. They had no problem with showing up, getting in the booths, and putting on a great show. Imagine how much worse my first impression of eSports would have been, how much less seriously I would take it, had one of them blatantly lost on purpose. I might never have watched another tournament. eSports is nascent; every day someone comes into contact with it the first time and for GOM TV and all of us who are trying to foster it, it is vital that we respect the virtues that keep its spirit alive. Losing a match on purpose, whether anyone bet on it or not, is unbecoming. Nobody on the other side of the planet wants to stay up until the wee hours of the morning to watch a sports show where at any time some player just might not feel like playing. That type of attitude is cancerous and NaNiWa already should have been on his best behavior given his team troubles, which makes his newest statement in response to his newest controversy too unreliable for GOM to keep him around for Code S. The job of the eAthlete is to put their honest best effort into the contests. It doesn't matter if you are the supposed best actor in the world, if you talk like a robot on purpose and don't show up on set just because you think the movie sucks then you deserve to get fired. But why this has to be standard ? Not all fans care for the fun pretend games. Not all players are good at pretending. Why cannot there be a diversity, why not let players that want to play for fans do that and those that do not likewise ? Do we really want a bunch of dishonest actors, it seems that majority (although not overwhelming majority) wants fake, but nicely looking facade. This is exactly the place where market forces would work great. Players that do not attract fans and sponsors would just not have them, there is no reason to force everyone into the same box. Point of the professional scene is in money, so let the market decide. And yes I support tournaments to just not invite players that they do not like, but in transparent manner and with the knowledge that it might bite them in the ass. No game is a pretend game; that is the proper attitude. Especially not a game that is in booths, on a stage, in front of fans (some of them paying), and in front of real commentators, and with real sponsors. The point, though, is never money; money is means. I am especially disappointed that Naniwa would throw a game against Nestea, with whom he has developed a special rivalry with recently. If he can't get excited about showing that, even at 0-3, he is still playing better than Nestea, than it seems Naniwa's motivations are far too narrow, as he has indicated in his statement. So, I hope he takes that to heart. So you are imputing your personal preferences to everyone else. Not only personal, but biologically impossible ones. There will always be pretend games in such circumstances and there is no way to prevent it. The only thing you can do is force the players to hide the "fakeness" of the game by being better at pretending. But that just seems pointless. Yes, Naniwa will take to heart that next time he has to pretend and everything will be fine, because some fans just seem to love the lies and fake games. That is what irks me, people are supporting lies and deceit as proper professional conduct. It is true that in real professional sports lies and deceit are par for the course, does not mean it is a good thing or I have to support it and I won't by not watching GSL. Easy as that. You really think everyone on every team pretends to try when they're out of playoff contention. Or maybe they try 'cause it's their job?
Not necessarily pretend as until now there was no reason to pretend too much and players just threw games in more or less creative fashion. Now with this precedent the pretending will start, but they definitely won't try even close to what they could. At least most players in most such matches.
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awesome... this is all i really ever wanted from him... people make mistakes and thats fine... but men take accountability for them... i appreciate your apology and i will be rooting for you once again
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Quantic is backing up Nani like EG Idra, good work
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On December 15 2011 14:58 Honeybadger wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 12:38 crms wrote:
now that he's being fake everyone will like him again lol....
honest:
game was meaningless and he was too tired, stressed and upset to play it out, community mad.
community:
'just 4 gate, pretend you're trying for me!!'
honest:
gives his explanation on why he did what he did.
community: still mad.
Phony:
gives full blown recantation and apology through his team's press release with major 'self realizations about esports' that not only seem completely out of his character but don't feel to have an once of truth behind them after shit storm gets to big'
community: well now that's a nice statement, we can move on now.
people are so weird, i feel like there should be a troll face somewhere in here. Sometimes swallowing your pride is all people expect. How could he honestly offer reparations? Being a grownup is admitting you were wrong, even if you don't believe it.
It's hypocrisy. I will never understand why it works this way.
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Nani, regardless of the decision by Gom - its bull - a no worth game is just that. Keep it real bro!
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On December 15 2011 15:12 wangstra wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 14:58 Honeybadger wrote:On December 15 2011 12:38 crms wrote:
now that he's being fake everyone will like him again lol....
honest:
game was meaningless and he was too tired, stressed and upset to play it out, community mad.
community:
'just 4 gate, pretend you're trying for me!!'
honest:
gives his explanation on why he did what he did.
community: still mad.
Phony:
gives full blown recantation and apology through his team's press release with major 'self realizations about esports' that not only seem completely out of his character but don't feel to have an once of truth behind them after shit storm gets to big'
community: well now that's a nice statement, we can move on now.
people are so weird, i feel like there should be a troll face somewhere in here. Sometimes swallowing your pride is all people expect. How could he honestly offer reparations? Being a grownup is admitting you were wrong, even if you don't believe it. That is PRECISELY what not being a grown up is - chucking out sincerity in place for servile behavoir. That's why to an unattached observer the way this community has reacted is a joke.
Unfortunately that's how a lot of the world works. We like servile behavior in this society. Oftentimes, we take it over honesty.
Do I agree with this? No. But there's nothing to be done about it. It's really irritating and frustrating to those people who are typically blunt and honest with their words, but they have to learn to basically shut up or temper what they're saying. If you think your new boss is an incompetent asshole, and he asks you how you think he's doing, obviously you're going to tell him he's doing fine, especially at the rick of getting fired. Meh.
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Gotta love all the shit despite Idra ragequitting or flat out forfeiting his IPL3 matches. This will blow over.
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Nanis "second chance" part4 or 5...i stopped counting. But thank you for the statement...thats all you can do atm...
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This is why you need the team/coach to be there during the games. Send him there and hope he'll be fine.
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Great. I think now we should all be able to put this behind us and move on. I hope Naniwa will be welcome to play in the GSL again in the future, and will not misbehave like this again.
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On December 15 2011 15:20 Ravomat wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 14:58 Honeybadger wrote:On December 15 2011 12:38 crms wrote:
now that he's being fake everyone will like him again lol....
honest:
game was meaningless and he was too tired, stressed and upset to play it out, community mad.
community:
'just 4 gate, pretend you're trying for me!!'
honest:
gives his explanation on why he did what he did.
community: still mad.
Phony:
gives full blown recantation and apology through his team's press release with major 'self realizations about esports' that not only seem completely out of his character but don't feel to have an once of truth behind them after shit storm gets to big'
community: well now that's a nice statement, we can move on now.
people are so weird, i feel like there should be a troll face somewhere in here. Sometimes swallowing your pride is all people expect. How could he honestly offer reparations? Being a grownup is admitting you were wrong, even if you don't believe it. It's hypocrisy. I will never understand why it works this way.
More precise saying is that being "grownup" is knowing when you can be honest and when you have to lie or at least not say anything. You basically never have to say things that are completely contrary to what you think, but it is often required to bend the truth somewhat. Nothing wrong with that as in general it helps society function better, but up to a point and I think the whole Naniwa disrespecting people is far behind the necessary line as it is based on deformed version of "respect".
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what are the korean reactions on his writing ? does they understand a bit ?
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EPT
