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On November 15 2011 17:19 pdd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 17:15 zeru wrote:
They dont deserve a second chance imo. match fixing is never acceptable. This is stupid. What they did was wrong and this punishment itself is a little too harsh. Permanent bans is stupid. There was no monetary gain for any of the parties involved and it's not like they had a grander scheme to fix it. They just made a stupid mistake. You're ruining the careers of two good players over something petty.
i agree that there should be no perm ban for this case. they were not match fixing for money or for a spot, they were just having fun. They broke rules (unspoken rules) and they ought to be punished. after they mature they should be able to compete again with a clean slate.
If they did it many times for money or for other reasons, They should be perm banned from all leagues to preserve the integrity of the sport.
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I think his withdrawal from Code S is pretty fucking obvious.
Propositions:
1. GSL is the biggest tournament in Korea. You could even say that the Korean SC2 scene will die out without it atm.
2. Coca blatantly left a game that he had won. He took a tournament as a joke, thereby taking away its legitimacy.
3. Coca is a pro gamer participating in GSL.
4. Right now, his mere presence in code S is a stain on the legitimacy of the Korean SC2 scene
Conclusion:
1. It was necessary for Coca to forfeit his spot to ensure the survival of starcraft 2 in Korea
He needs to take some time off whether or not he's already learned from his mistakes. He'll eventually make it back to the scene when the Korean spectators calm the fuck down and accept that he's just a little kid that got a bit too cocky. He'll eventually be forgiven.
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On November 15 2011 17:12 AsmodeusXI wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 17:00 karpo wrote:On November 15 2011 16:56 AsmodeusXI wrote:
Hot_Bid Hot_Bid
Yeah @SlayersCella said "Just remember what happened today. And never forget it" ... interesting how strongly you come down on this kid
Hot_Bid Hot_Bid
... but when some kids get molested in a clan it's all "we can confirm nor deny" and no strong statements #idontforget
Awesome tweets from the Hot_Bid, reminding us that match fixing is bad, but shit HAS been way worse... and ignored. Maybe because one is a real criminal offence while the other one is not? Are you even allowed to talk about who did what in a molestation case if it isn't settled? Why even compare those two things? Don't you think it's a little fucked up to be so serious about this (relatively) small incident, but not get more upset about molestation bullshit that was happening in the scene? I mean, match fixing is a BIG DEAL, but Cella also wasn't getting so vocal when kids were getting hurt. Sure, this isn't a perfect comparison (I mean... at all, really), but a little perspective can really help.
Take it from Cella's perspective, if he had condemned the accused of the crime and it turned out the accused was innocent, then what? He would have just accused an innocent man of a crime he did not commit. That move would have damaged his own reputation as well as the accused which I'm sure can be used to open up a suit for defamation.
Now Coca on the other hand. It's obvious that he threw the game, regardless of the reasons. He was caught red handed with video and picture proof, not just some person going "Hey, I think they fixed the match." and saying things based on evidence that had not yet been brought to light.
What Coca did, to put it crudely, is throw all the hard work that the organisers of the tournament did to get to the level it is back to their faces. It could also have cost potential sponsors with a mark like this which calls into question the legitimacy of e-sports tournaments.
He might not have intended to do it and we can blame it on niaveté. But ignorance doesn't mean he should be allowed to get away unscathed. With how Boxer views e-sports and him basically having given his life for the game, it seems a fair punishment to lower Coca down to the B-team, and an indefinite suspension.
Even if Coca hadn't withdrawn from the Code S spot, it makes sense for GomTV to take away his spot because in light of this, who is to say that fans won't call the outcome of his games into question? It's setting themselves up for potential backlash.
He did the right thing by withdrawing from the spot and saying that he will reflect on his actions instead of being stubborn and fighting it out. It's damage control, rather than letting things snowball out of hand.
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On November 15 2011 13:42 Megaliskuu wrote:
hahahahaha morons
i think megalisk said it best, as always
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Idra would be great at match fixing. People would just pass it off as rage.
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There is no permanent ban. Both players are just reflecting on their actions until their respective teams deem them ready to come back.
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All this justification of the extremely harsh punishment because it may prevent a lead into a slippery slope of more serious match fixing is BS. I guess we should give life sentences out for shop lifters because that could lead into, pick pocketing, into armed robbery and finally murder.
It's funny how so many people advocate fair punishment in the judicial system in the their own countries but when disproportionate punishment gets dished out in an environment that would not affect them its ok.
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coca should have just said after the game that he cant continue in the tournament due to something more important and byun would prpbably move on
they are stupid xD
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On November 15 2011 17:29 robih wrote:
coca should have just said after the game that he cant continue in the tournament due to something more important and byun would prpbably move on
they are stupid xD
If he left without saying a word, then they can make up any excuses. But they lay it all down on fine print.
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On November 15 2011 17:25 .Sic. wrote:
I think his withdrawal from Code S is pretty fucking obvious.
Propositions:
1. GSL is the biggest tournament in Korea. You could even say that the Korean SC2 scene will die out without it atm.
2. Coca blatantly left a game that he had won. He took a tournament as a joke, thereby taking away its legitimacy.
3. Coca is a pro gamer participating in GSL.
4. Right now, his mere presence in code S is a stain on the legitimacy of the Korean SC2 scene
Conclusion:
1. It was necessary for Coca to forfeit his spot to ensure the survival of starcraft 2 in Korea
He needs to take some time off whether or not he's already learned from his mistakes. He'll eventually make it back to the scene when the Korean spectators calm the fuck down and accept that he's just a little kid that got a bit too cocky. He'll eventually be forgiven.
Yep. Especially given the Broodwar match fixing scandal that nearly scared away corporate sponsors, GSL couldn't risk tolerating this.
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On November 15 2011 17:25 Rah wrote:
Idra would be great at match fixing. People would just pass it off as rage.
At least Idra make it slightly more "believable".....
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On November 15 2011 17:25 Skytalker wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 17:23 Not_That wrote:
I am very sad to read about this.
Personally I blame Byun more than Coca. Byun should've known better than to ask for this. Coca, while also in the wrong, I can understand him a bit more. He's young, Byun is his friend, and when Byun asked Coca made an on-the-spot decision in reaction to what Byun asked him. Coca made the wrong decision, but it was not premeditated. Byun, by asking Coca to give him the win, already came to the game with the mentality that if he loses then it's 'okay' to ask this of his friend Coca. I felt more upset with coca, but you have a very good point there.
I agree. The match should have stopped the instant the offer to fix the match was offered.
I too, am sad. But integrity once compromised becomes harder to maintain once the first one gets in.
If you fix a match once, it becomes harder when the next friend comes along and asks the same of you.
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i am not that well informed atm (only have the time to watch/play sc2 at the weekend) hence i dont follow GSL as close as i used to (just reading TL here and there) but this is just so stupid... -.- i hope the 2 slayersboys already realized themselves so we wont have to facepalm too hard.
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This is so sad. I hope Coca and Byun can learn from their mistakes and come back even stronger.
Losing that Code S spot is heartbreaking. I feel so bad for Coca.
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On November 15 2011 17:25 .Sic. wrote:
I think his withdrawal from Code S is pretty fucking obvious.
Propositions:
1. GSL is the biggest tournament in Korea. You could even say that the Korean SC2 scene will die out without it atm.
2. Coca blatantly left a game that he had won. He took a tournament as a joke, thereby taking away its legitimacy.
3. Coca is a pro gamer participating in GSL.
4. Right now, his mere presence in code S is a stain on the legitimacy of the Korean SC2 scene
Conclusion:
1. It was necessary for Coca to forfeit his spot to ensure the survival of starcraft 2 in Korea
He needs to take some time off whether or not he's already learned from his mistakes. He'll eventually make it back to the scene when the Korean spectators calm the fuck down and accept that he's just a little kid that got a bit too cocky. He'll eventually be forgiven.
i agree totally. I would rather much prefer that Coca had been DQ from GSL and maybe banned for 2 seasons etc (sent to code B) but that would have a weird effect as GSL is just a league with no control over the players and the incident was not in a GOM run event.
His team took responsibility and withdrew him so that would have a similar effect but what if some other team had noy pulled their player? Would anyone take his matches seriously? the LR threads will be filled with "OMG HE THREW HAT" whenever he loses a lead. Coca and Byun should lie low for awhile before they compete again
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On November 15 2011 17:30 Gijian wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 17:29 robih wrote:
coca should have just said after the game that he cant continue in the tournament due to something more important and byun would prpbably move on
they are stupid xD If he left without saying a word, then they can make up any excuses. But they lay it all down on fine print.
In that case Coca should have 'accidentally' kick the power cord or internet cable off the computer he was playing. But yeah, lay it all out leaves absolutely no room for doubt here...
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Byun is stupid and shameless if the translations were correct, never liked him anyways, one of those terrans that turtles forever and generally gives pretty boring games in GSL. He lost nothing from this incident except maybe some suspension from his coach.
Coca on the other hand is a far better player and lost his Code S spot which is pretty much the holy grail in SC2. Why he left the game is beyond me, maybe its just him being too cock.
But byun going fuck fuck leave the game and Round 3 is pathetic. You lost, stfu and quit, why are u even asking ur opponent to leave.
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Isn't it the players choice if he would like to have a third game or not? Or if he would like to throw the game? Maybe IdrA shouldn't be allowed in the GSL because he threw that game against MMA at MLG...
This looks like 2 friends having fun that has been blown up because people are afraid that coca is going to be freaking savior 2.0...
I feel pretty bad for both of them considering what they did wasn't actually as much as in the wrong as people are making it seem.
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On November 15 2011 17:21 Tofugrinder wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 17:05 summernova wrote:
A seventeen year old boy left a game where he was winning to do something nice for his friend in a small, relatively meaningless tournament and now his life is in the dumpster.
Look closer. exactly this.
No, not exactly this.
"Exactly this" would imply that we allow such behaviour in eSports, that we not only tolerate it but also support it by just letting it pass. Do you think that looks like it is a legitimate thing to do?
Do you allow people to just say
"Hey you won but leave the game lol kk?"? Do you honestly say "This is okay. I don't mind it. Let them do what they want."
This might be a "relatively small tourney" for you but the korean weekly is actually pretty huge in the online scene and if not one of the most pretigious online tournaments out there that doesn't have "high money standards" or something like that.
However, since he IS a kid, we should treat him like one. He was dumb, especially because he made it so obvious(in the gamechat?rly?), and he gets a second chance if he grows up from this shit, fair enough. I think this whole situation was handled pretty good by all authorities and we have to wait and see what happens in the next few weeks.
I don't think this is something savior-like, but I don't really know how the whole situation was back then, so my opinion on that is definitely flawed. However, I think that this should be handled with seriousness but we should not forget that he is just a teenage kid.
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United States7483 Posts
In the immortal words of Captain Jean Luc Picard:
*Facepalm*
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EPT
