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Dukat
United States235 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:14 Diamond wrote: No weekly tournament in the planet has refs in every match. Also Orb will admit to not previewing matches beforehand to prevent himself from accidentally spoilering a series. Even if he has guessed the outcome a couple of times. | ||
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Fubi
2228 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:16 anrimayu wrote: Nope, you're wrong. At the start of game 2, Coca told Byun that he can have the game. If you don't know, don't assume things. Right, but at the start of game 2 is still relatively DURING the game, hence the decision was made on the spot during the game, as oppose to actual match fixing where the outcome was already determined between the two players (and possibly other parties) before the whole match even happened. Also, there is next to none benefit for either parties as oppose to real match fixings where money is actually involved. Finally, they actually played the game for real, all the way till the end; If the match was to be fixed, Coca would of made it a lot closer than it looked like. They just literally wanted to play a 3rd game, that is all. Is it still wrong? Definitely, but it is not match-fixing, and not a mistake that deserve this harsh of a punishment that can ruin a promising young player's career. | ||
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OnFiRe888
United States629 Posts
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Mithriel
Netherlands2969 Posts
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nakedsurfer
Canada500 Posts
On November 15 2011 14:51 Corrosive wrote: Would you ban a team from the NHL/NBA/NFL if they messed around during an exhibition game? No, 100% for sure not. Obviously this game was part of a tournament, and wasn't an exhibition game, but it's similar as it has no effect on any important, serious games. How can you compare a team and a player?... If a professional NBA/NHL/NFL player jacked off in the corner for half a game would you not change him for another player and tell him to straighten his act up or he won't play the next game or any game afterwards? I think so, actually i'm 100% sure. This makes more sense than what you were trying to say. | ||
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JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:17 blacksheepwall wrote: Not to beat a dead horse here, but I think that their openness about it in the in-game chat demonstrates that they didn't really understand the seriousness of the situation. I'm not saying that what they did was appropriate, or that ignorance is a valid excuse, but if they were actually attempting to fix the match they probably wouldn't have openly talked about it in-game. I think it was just a couple friends fucking around and not realizing the consequences. pretty much this. let's be honest, there wasn't much money on the line either, "only" 200$ distributed amongst the top 4 with 100$ for the winner, so they probably treated it more like a casual event. | ||
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:20 Sabu113 wrote: One of the arguments against harsh punishment is that it's "just a show match" or less than that. So one of the arguments for gentler treatment is that these matches don't matter. Two. These games are important enough for a player with a significant lead to drop a game just for the hell of it. These aren't the vaunted great games of code b. Edit: The foreign scene because it was much smaller and less serious has a long history of repeatedly allowing cheaters back in. Admittedly there were fewer good/competitive players so I suppose they were forced, though I am sure some sort of an old boys network might have come into play. ESV isn't a joke, if you don't watch the games so don't say bad things about it. Very good tourney and I prefer it 10x more than NASL. | ||
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Biane
Australia645 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:21 McFeser wrote: They should do an emergancy vote on who should fill Coca's code S spot. This really messes up the bracket (Maybe even giving the spot back to IdrA). While giving the spot back to Idra is a bit far fetch. I do agree/can see how this messes up the bracket especially when you consider the new system having to play both Code S and Code A (if they loose in the group matches before ro8). Giving a free win will prolly be the outcome but having to fix the brackets up afterwards might be a pain. | ||
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Hattori_Hanzo
Singapore1229 Posts
On November 15 2011 14:19 VPCursed wrote: Well for starters, Tiger woods wouldn't compete in a tournament that didn't offer him a fucking thing. I'm sure the players didn't think what they were doing through. It wasn't some elaborate conspiracy that they thought about, They announced it in chat thinking it was no big deal.. they felt it was just a friendly tournament and they felt the tournament wasn't very serious at all, ESL weekly isn't the GSL or the MLG and im sure any player that plays in it is not taking it very serious at all. The punishment is extremely harsh. A Code S player playing in a tournament that is "beneath" him is the same analogy as Tiger Woods in a minor tournament. So tournaments should be treated lightly if they don't have a prize? That they can come and go as they please? That they can announce in-game that they can just quit because the other guy said so? Either you are a major tool or you really have no idea the amount of work and preparation it takes to organise a broadcasted event. | ||
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RezChi
Canada2368 Posts
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setzer
United States3284 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:14 NMx.StyX wrote: ^this. Setzer, read what you wrote and think for a minute before you click on post. No really... you don't even need to be in korean culture to understand this, its just common sense. Do you not know who slayersboxer is? Would this behavior been allowed in broodwar even for b teamers? no, and where did slayersboxer come from? I think the word started with brood and ended with war. Well if you read my previous post you would see I express my doubts CoCa made the decision of his own volition and not without internal pressure from SlayerS. Any respectable sports league in the world would have a players union immediately filing a complaint with the league and a lengthy review handed. What happens in SC2? A spontaneous reaction only hours after that is imo a huge overreaction probably made because the Korean public wants nothing less than a beheading for anyone that conspires in "match-fixing" (even though this wasn't technically match-fixing, at least not like the BW scandal). In the end CoCa made a bad decision but his decision should be met with equal enforcement. I don't find it acceptable to cut off a person's hand when they steal and I don't find it acceptable for SlayerS to force (and imo they did force) CoCa to remove himself from participation of all tournaments. The penalty enforced by ESV should be more than enough. | ||
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frequency
Australia1901 Posts
On November 15 2011 14:16 Redmark wrote:. It's entirely the same. What if Byun fucks up his build because his dog licked his face? Oh my god that would be so adorable. | ||
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Spacekyod
United States818 Posts
I'm glad to see that this has been handled in an appropriate way and they haven't gone too far in their punishments... yet (we'll have to see what happens come Jan. 1st). But so far i agree with the consequences and it sends a very loud message to all the other players. | ||
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nokz88
Brazil1253 Posts
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Termit
Sweden3466 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:21 Diamond wrote: We broadcast roughly 50+ games a week. We would not only have to pre scan them but send them to a translator to get screened. I'm working very hard to learn Korean but I am having a lot of difficulty. Pre scanning is really not an option for us at this point. You can use sc2gears for that if you didn't know. It would be a quick way to check in the future. Best option would be to just not allow chatting tho. | ||
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theBOOCH
United States832 Posts
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Leifish
851 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:26 tuho12345 wrote: ESV isn't a joke, if you don't watch the games so don't say bad things about it. Very good tourney and I prefer it 10x more than NASL. I prefer listening to Nickelback 10x more than NASL. And Nickelback killed my fucking family. | ||
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Magrath
Canada292 Posts
Though this is not as huge as the BW match fixing scandal which included illegal gambling and lots of money, it shouldn't be treated lightly. I just hope this doesn't become career defining for both these players are it was just a lapse of judgement on both players parts. | ||
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Oktyabr
Singapore2234 Posts
On November 15 2011 15:27 setzer wrote: Well if you read my previous post you would see I express my doubts CoCa made the decision of his own volition and not without internal pressure from SlayerS. Any respectable sports league in the world would have a players union immediately filing a complaint with the league and a lengthy review handed. What happens in SC2? A spontaneous reaction only hours after that is imo a huge overreaction probably made because the Korean public wants nothing less than a beheading for anyone that conspires in "match-fixing" (even though this wasn't technically match-fixing, at least not like the BW scandal). In the end CoCa made a bad decision but his decision should be met with equal enforcement. I don't find it acceptable to cut off a person's hand when they steal and I don't find it acceptable for SlayerS to force (and imo they did force) CoCa to remove himself from participation of all tournaments. The penalty enforced by ESV should be more than enough. If Coca wasn't happy with what Slayers was telling him to do, he could always leave the team voluntarily. I guess he treasured staying on the team more than his Code S spot. Furthermore, even if Slayers didn't tell him to drop it, GSL could always take it away from him, sort of like how they barred Choya from taking part in the teamleague when he was involved in the ladder incident. | ||
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
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