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On October 22 2011 07:03 lowercase wrote:
I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, so I'll mention it here:
Thors are gonna be pretty damn OP with repair.
It's going to be a mobile planetary fortress that can shoot air and ground. How is this not a terrible idea?
Let me correct this for you: Thor is going to be pretty damn OP with repair.. wait Thor, without "s"? Yes thors are now unique and are basically the equivalent of mothership for terrans. I don't really like this idea, they saw how bad this concept was with the MS, yet they do it again.
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On October 22 2011 07:05 midoriiro wrote:
hmm...
1. use bio and kite enemy army to nearby Shredder
2. hop in medivac
3. ???
4 profit!
But if the medivac is near the shredder, will it operate? You might have to load up and move away. That would make the whole strat hard to pull off.
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On October 22 2011 07:05 ayaz2810 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 07:04 Lazerlike42 wrote:
Thinking about it, the Arc Shield is effectively a gigantic cannon rush buff. If it does 20 damage to light, you basically have to kill any warping pylons before they finish. You can't just dedicate your workers to killing the probe anymore, because if the pylon finishes, even if you kill the first one a second probe can set up a cannon safely. Incoming cannon rushes all day long brah. Seriously though, I would imagine that Blizz will get the balance right to prevent the kind of madness that COULD happen.
You need gateway to do it.
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On October 22 2011 06:55 Glacial wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 06:54 SolidMoose wrote:On October 22 2011 06:53 Ordained wrote:On October 22 2011 06:52 SolidMoose wrote:On October 22 2011 06:51 NeonFox wrote:
The more I think about it the more I think that the "grant detection" spell from the viper is useless, 50/50 overseers are great now, and having to dump 200 gas to have mobile detection is just... Welcome to Terran Move scan to the Raven and Welcome to Zerg. Nah, grant detection is permanent. Scans aren't. Wonder if you'll be able to use it on neutral critters as in Brood War ^^
The critter would become a detector, but since you don't control the critter, it doesn't do you any good.
Now, if you were to make the critter a detector and then neural parasite the critter, that would work. Not that you would ever want to do this.
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On October 22 2011 07:04 YosHGo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 06:33 sGs.Kal_rA wrote:On October 22 2011 06:12 Crisco wrote:On October 22 2011 06:11 forsooth wrote:On October 22 2011 05:50 0neder wrote:On October 22 2011 05:49 forsooth wrote:
If Blizzard thought blue flame needed to be nerfed, why would they even consider burrow move banelings? Mineral lines will cease to exist when Zerg is in a game. Scanner sweep is ridiculously huge in SC2. The least they can do it they don't nerf it is to buff burrowed stuff. Scanner sweep? Please tell me you're joking. We're talking about a tier 1 unit that has the ability to instantly annihilate any mineral line, anywhere on the map, at any time. This isn't a pull and scatter your workers scenario like when hellions/DTs/mutas/etc. show up and save a decent chunk of them if you do it right. This is an instant loss of 20 workers with no warning and no ability to save a single one of them. It's a terrible idea. you realize burrowed movement is tier 3 right? Okay. Tier 1 is a bad idea, duh. Tier 3 is still a bad idea. Example: Terran on 4-5 bases spread out across the map, trying to push the zerg. Zerg takes one ling, makes it into a bling, burrows and then just sneaks around to an expansion and blow up the scvs. What I'm trying to say is that the terran will be stretched way to thin in defending all his bases. Waste of money to put up turrets everywhere. 150 for a turret is no joke.. Positioning it will be a bitch to make sure it can cover the entire mineral line. Okay, now lets say youve successful managed to establish detection around your new expo. Now how the fuck are you supposed to kill the bings? Okay, hold back a couple marines to deal with the blings (well, now your main army is weaker......... -_-) or set up a planetary. Planatary = less orbitals = less scans = better for zerg as now pretty much everything can burrow and move around. Fuck. This is also a big rip in terran's econ. MULEs are pretty much useless mid-late game, cause you need to scan everything cause zerg will burrow pretty much everything (I'm accounting for people wanting to use the "trendy" new units). All in all, this is a bad idea. Burrowed bligns are a bitch already to deal with. Now you are FORCED to go raven. Banshee and dt work well as they dont do splash damage. As is, SVCs stack when mining... oh god this is such a bad idea. Reavers worked well cause their scarabs were fucking retarded, and you pretty much always knew when and how they were coming.. A reaver drop was never a surprise. Turrets were considerably cheaper and could deal wtih shuttles well. And reavers were slow as fuck lol. The lurker burrow idea was the best. Shit fuck crazy tons amount of damage, but useless when it's unburrowed, and you cannot move when burrowed. Plus the burrow animation took a while, which gave opponents a second to react accordingly (ie, stim in, pick off a lurker and pull out asap). Swarm host is pretty sick as it a lurker replacement. This is a very nice addition [= You mean like other races are fucking FORCED to react to terrans ? Thats right baby not the case anymore
Terran isn't supposed to be the reactionary race, baby 
This is assuming BW was done right. And I think everyone can agree that it was.
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I also don't understand Blizzard in their changes...
Last patch they buffed the mothership...to remove it then ?
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On October 22 2011 07:04 Eppa! wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 07:02 sereniity wrote:
I find it funny how every protoss is going OMG CARRIERS REMOVED WTF THEY WERE SO COOL AND FROM BTW ETC...
Before I've seen EVERY SINGLE PROTOSS go "OMG CARRIERS ARE SO FREAKING USELESS THE UNIT BARELY EXISTS, WHY DOES IT EVEN EXIST ANYWAY?!? HUK GOT DECIMATED VS STEPHANO WHEN HE USED 3-3-3 CARRIERS, I WILL NEVER MAKE THEM AGAIN"
And then you got a new cool unit which actually seems useful. How can you possibly be whining about that? Because Carriers are iconic. People wanted them being good not being removed (like Hydras as a core unit)
agree, all carrier needs is a slightly buff with build time or some shield. We love carrier, but doesn't want it to be removed like this 
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On October 22 2011 07:05 psteeleneg wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 07:03 lowercase wrote:
I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, so I'll mention it here:
Thors are gonna be pretty damn OP with repair.
It's going to be a mobile planetary fortress that can shoot air and ground. How is this not a terrible idea? They removed it's anti-air cannons and replaced it with the single-player ground aoe attack. Flock of mutas can take it down while the bounce kills the repairing scv's
Just to add to that... It will be Thor not Thors...
"Thors are 600 minerals now and require a fusion core. Theyve got the aoe ability from single player.You can only have 1 thor at a time now,.a la mothership"
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On October 22 2011 07:04 iNotZerg wrote:
Viper is not a spire unit. It's lair tech. Probably expensive too.
Viper does not provide detection, but instead plants a parasite on a friendly unit so it provides protection. As of right now, you can just give a friendly overlord the detection ability and be done with it, or a drone, or queen.
The whole dark swarm thing, Its more of a reverse disruption web. Would probably make Hydras with their buff somewhat useful now.
Viper's tongue ability cost 100 mana as of right now. I guess you Protoss players will have to work on that using recall, or protective forcefields, or hallucinations to bait zerg players into grabbing the wrong colossi. Im expecting more Ghost with emp/snipe against zezg now.
Burrowed movable banelings probably move very slow. Enough time to just walk away...Granted you have a raven/obs. By zerg tier 3, you should have at least 1 raven.
Now the ultra charge is op.
Well said except for the Last Part. How do you know Viper doesn't Require Spire?
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2 Port Banshee against Zerg FTW!!!
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United States7483 Posts
On October 22 2011 07:05 ayaz2810 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 07:04 Lazerlike42 wrote:
Thinking about it, the Arc Shield is effectively a gigantic cannon rush buff. If it does 20 damage to light, you basically have to kill any warping pylons before they finish. You can't just dedicate your workers to killing the probe anymore, because if the pylon finishes, even if you kill the first one a second probe can set up a cannon safely. Incoming cannon rushes all day long brah. Seriously though, I would imagine that Blizz will get the balance right to prevent the kind of madness that COULD happen.
According to the one report of it I heard, Artosis built a pylon in someone's mineral line and did arc shield on it to kill workers, the guy killed the pylon with his scv's without losing any workers at all. It's apparently a very low damage ability.
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On October 22 2011 07:06 Eppa! wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 07:05 ayaz2810 wrote:On October 22 2011 07:04 Lazerlike42 wrote:
Thinking about it, the Arc Shield is effectively a gigantic cannon rush buff. If it does 20 damage to light, you basically have to kill any warping pylons before they finish. You can't just dedicate your workers to killing the probe anymore, because if the pylon finishes, even if you kill the first one a second probe can set up a cannon safely. Incoming cannon rushes all day long brah. Seriously though, I would imagine that Blizz will get the balance right to prevent the kind of madness that COULD happen. You need gateway to do it.
Gotcha. Starting to sound pretty okay to me. Although proxy gates would become more popular wouldn't they?
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They got their wits together, and took out mothership, just to make thor one only?!
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
I like the Zerg changes, the rest, not so much
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I actually kinda like the direction they are going with Protoss,
just on a pure conceptual level, like when you're explaining to a friend, you'd say that the zerg are the swarm race, terran are the humans they play like the typical RTS race on a basic level.
And the protoss are like terran...
something like mass recall on nexi is crazy enough to change that, toss were saying before that they didn't have enough harass options, in HOTS, all these changes along with the previous mechanics like WG, could very well make protoss the harass race. or atleast, how I have it in my head right now, when you're explaining it to someone. Toss are the fancy, artsy ninja race.
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On October 22 2011 07:07 Sakray wrote:
I also don't understand Blizzard in their changes...
Last patch they buffed the mothership...to remove it then ?
e le Fun while it Lasted *Buff*
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So lets see here... few scenarios:
Zealot / sentry expand early game vs zerg, then start producing replicants, wait for zerg to attack then have roach support for your zealots?
Zealot / sentry expand vs zerg who goes for fast infestor. Make heavy zealots and rush for charge. Replicant > infestor > infestor fungal + chargezealots utterly destroys zerg.
There must be restrictions on what units can be replicated, surely? you could create some seriously fucking imba army compositions. I cant even begin to imagine the balance in 2v2s, or more.
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On October 22 2011 07:04 Lazerlike42 wrote:
Thinking about it, the Arc Shield is effectively a gigantic cannon rush buff. If it does 20 damage to light, you basically have to kill any warping pylons before they finish. You can't just dedicate your workers to killing the probe anymore, because if the pylon finishes, even if you kill the first one a second probe can set up a cannon safely.
Who needs cannons ? As long as you have Nexus energy, all you need is pylons. No forge -> cannons necessary.
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From a reddit thread:
Viper
Description: The Viper is a new flying unit with three unique abilities. Blinding Cloud temporarily reduces the attack range of all ground units inside the cloud to melee range, and prevents energy-based abilities from being used. Abduct allows the Viper to physically pull a unit to the Viper’s location. Finally, the Viper has a one-time ability called Ocular Parasite, which allows it to detach its eye stalk and meld it onto any friendly, non-massive unit, turning that unit into a detector.
Interesting. So you build a Viper for detection, leave its detection ability with some unit or another. Weird.
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On October 22 2011 07:01 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 06:57 hocash wrote:On October 22 2011 06:50 Andytaker wrote:On October 22 2011 06:46 hocash wrote:On October 22 2011 06:31 XRaDiiX wrote:On October 22 2011 06:30 GGTesomas wrote:On October 22 2011 06:21 XRaDiiX wrote:On October 22 2011 06:19 Bayyne wrote:
So I'm basically going to have to go Spire in order to have mobile detection out? That's what i was thinking as well. How are Zerg going to Move out of the Base When Protoss can have Dark Templars Before Spire Timing. And Spire takes so long... Right now i'm seeing Protoss going for DT rushes sniping the Spire and GG This is actually pretty concerning. I'm sure Blizz wouldn't fuck Zerg like that though, not again That's Very True this is an issue we should discuss in the Thread right now .... "That's what i was thinking as well. How are Zerg going to Move out of the Base When Protoss can have Dark Templars Before Spire Timing.
And Spire takes so long...
Right now i'm seeing Protoss going for DT rushes sniping the Spire and GG" Spore Crawler by the Spire. No 3rd untill spire finishes? Protoss will rush to dt and expand like crazy due to the mapcontrol or just make suicide dts to kill all spores :/ this just doesnt seem right. You Get Spire Around 10 mins ready, But Toss gets Obsever so much faster ad Terran Has Scan Fastest DTs come out is 7:30 - if you're scouting correctly you'll see it coming as he has almost no gas units. Attack at 6:30 and it's auto gg if he opens dt. If he warps in sentries...well that just means he won't have dts for a while longer. You can finish a dark shrine before 7:00 if you go zealot-sentry at ramp... and notably earlier if you delay warpgate research and skip the sentry
If you skip warpgate research that's just about the biggest clue for any drone/scv/probe in the Protoss base. I'm talking real world here.
But if you poke the ramp and toss only has a zealot-sentry than it should be gg to any decent player.
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On October 22 2011 07:03 lowercase wrote:
I don't think anyone's commented on this yet, so I'll mention it here:
Thors are gonna be pretty damn OP with repair.
It's going to be a mobile planetary fortress that can shoot air and ground. How is this not a terrible idea?
Because The Thor won't shoot Air anymore, it get the Bombardement thingy from singleplayer.
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EPT
