Lack of content, flaming (of the French or anyone) and useless posts will be punished. Please keep it from being too inflammatory and keep discussion on-topic. -semioldguy (p.103)
On September 20 2011 05:13 FaRess wrote: Live Report : The manager stated that this is not happening because stephano was trying to get the best offer
All in all i think Stephano may have felt pressured into signing with CoL. (Especially if they offered more money) and stephano may have made a naive mistake with some kind of verbal and/or contractual agreement singing/verbal agreement.
I think the best thing to happen is for CoL.(Complexity) to leave the situation alone legally. Since it would cause an unecessary Shit Storm. Also, after reading the whole thread it seems many people are saying that the Contract isn't valid in France; or Stephano has a whole month since the day Stephano was binded to the so called contract.
Col should just leave it alone let Stephano Stay on Millenium and let the Situation go away. Complexity will Exacerbate the Situation by taking Legal Action.
Let Stephano choose for himself; seems he has a way to work around the contract according to French laws people are saying.
All in all hope Stephano the best in E-sports. Such a talented Zerg player..
On September 20 2011 05:21 marttorn wrote: Wait... So what is mill offering stephano?
coL: "We'll give you one of the highest salaries in SC2 and send you around the world to tournaments, and to korea to practice with the MVP team"
Mill: "Hey kid, if you sign with us we'll let you stay in France"
I must be missing something huge here
It seems like Mill may have used their reputation/friendship with Stephano to talk him into staying, kind of like a guilt trip or something. Maybe not, I really don't know, but that's exactly what it sounds like just based on the content in the OP.
Also, I never really noticed before but they spelled Millennium wrong.. lol.
On September 20 2011 05:23 Drenz wrote: coL contract is just a joke, nothing professionnal so it's quite funny to see people thinking they want to improve eSport
All we have now is coL's version. And even that won't matter that much. Either side can claim all they want, in the end only a court can give the answer to whether a contract was legally binding or not. That is neither for coL, nor Mil, nor us to decide.
On September 20 2011 05:15 Hipsv wrote: What this shows me is that Stephano is just a kid, he obviously didn't seriously consider the legal and non legal ramifications of his actions and as a result flopped on his decision.
I too at 18 did lots of flopping on big decisions (nothing as legally binding), so I can sympathize with his situation, however I also realize that its youthful irresponsibility that caused this whole situation whether or not his fans or the coL haters want to admit it. I can't imagine what it would be like to be young and have big amounts of money thrown at you to play a game you enjoy, but its also his responsibility to carefully decide his course of action and to follow contracts he signed.
I think that what coL should take from this is that they really need to be thorough when dealing with players from other countries at explaining their contracts and what it means. They absolutely have a right to either pursue Mill to buy out his contract or have Stephano play for them, however I personally think seeking Mill to buy the contract out is the more diplomatic approach.
Stephano definitely needs to grow up. Flopping on HUGE decisions like this makes him seem childish and it at least partially rubs off onto the scene. Staying true to your word (in most ordinary circumstances) is one of the most important aspects of being an adult and he definitely has not stayed true to his word to at least one party here.
Mill definitely needs to learn about contract law at least, and idk it seems like they pressured him into staying
I agree it was an extremely immature decision on stephano's part and in the future other teams will probably be hesitant to deal with him regardless of his skill.
I absolutely think legal action should be taken , Col needs to set a precedent for the esports scene , i think it would negatively affect the esports scene if they just let this go.
The problem is Stephano is still just a kid, only 18 years old. He probably doesn't know a lot about contracts and the such, and only has the two opposing parties to listen to.
IMO he needs some sort of agent, like professional sports players have (NHL, NFL, NBA...all the players regardless of how old have agents). Young players like Stephano need someone not affiliated with either party to negotiate and work out contracts and to make sure contracts are honored. An agent/lawyer would be extremely beneficial to him.
I don't really get the legal backgroud, but it seems to me that Stephano signed a contract and now Millenium's manager is searching for a cheap excuse to get him out of it. Glad that I was never a fan of both parties...
On September 20 2011 05:09 Fionn wrote: Also why would any team ever want to sign Stephano again after this?
Why would EG, TL, or any Korean team next year, even if Stephano is doing amazing, want to try and get him? In the end, there contract he signs is trash and can be thrown out in a 30 day window. Why waste your time with a player who doesn't respect a contract that he signs?
While a contract can (apparently) be thrown within a certain "probation" window, it's silly to assume that it will be the case with any other team and any other contract. It just provides players with an additional safety catch in case their experience in the new team doesn't really turn out to be as expected (or things that were verbally promised don't come true).
I think it's an awesome thing and should be universally implemented (especially in e-sports that had more than a fair share of manipulation). There's no reason why players would use this option to re-negotiate better deals with other teams - they can just as well do that before signing the contract anyway (which is why that whole theory sounds too wacky and improbable in this case as well).
It's good for the players, therefore it's good period. It allows them to make a fully informed decision and one that is best for them. Teams that have, metaphorically speaking, nothing to hide - shouldn't be concerned with this at all.
On September 20 2011 05:23 Drenz wrote: coL contract is just a joke, nothing professionnal so it's quite funny to see people thinking they want to improve eSport
I am stunned by this news. I think Stephano made a terrible decision and will bitterly regret it in the near future. He is with ToD one of the only 2 frenchies that have the potential to compete at an international level, and he decided to stay in a clueless french organisation when one of the best gaming-house of the USA made him what seemed to be an offer he couldn't refuse.
ToD with his huge W3 experience quickly understood that Millenium would not be able to provide the support he deserved (a shot at Code A for instance), so he went on a team with actual competent managers. Stephano could have go to Korea aswell, MLG IGN and whatnot, but he decided to stay with an organisation that, imo, does not stand a chance compared to a powerhouse like compLexity.
I hope this drama won't affect the constant progress of Stephano, but i doubt it.
If coL even tries to go in court, in France, if they present the contract to lawyers, they will say that the contract does not match with the french rights. Llewellys (Millenium Team Manager) is explaining this on live on Millenium TV. He says that a correct contract would have been negotiated correctly. The manager has been informed at 4AM that Stephano was leaving the team. Millenium TV (French) : http://www.millenium.org/home/milleniumtv/?chaine=millenium_tv
Stephano's contract with compLexity made him one of the highest paid SC2 players in the world
I do like the statement from col in general but with the exception of this very sentence, which I think is not appropriate here. How would they possibly know what every SC2 player in the world earns anyway?
On September 20 2011 05:15 Hipsv wrote: What this shows me is that Stephano is just a kid, he obviously didn't seriously consider the legal and non legal ramifications of his actions and as a result flopped on his decision.
I too at 18 did lots of flopping on big decisions (nothing as legally binding), so I can sympathize with his situation, however I also realize that its youthful irresponsibility that caused this whole situation whether or not his fans or the coL haters want to admit it. I can't imagine what it would be like to be young and have big amounts of money thrown at you to play a game you enjoy, but its also his responsibility to carefully decide his course of action and to follow contracts he signed.
I think that what coL should take from this is that they really need to be thorough when dealing with players from other countries at explaining their contracts and what it means. They absolutely have a right to either pursue Mill to buy out his contract or have Stephano play for them, however I personally think seeking Mill to buy the contract out is the more diplomatic approach.
Stephano definitely needs to grow up. Flopping on HUGE decisions like this makes him seem childish and it at least partially rubs off onto the scene. Staying true to your word (in most ordinary circumstances) is one of the most important aspects of being an adult and he definitely has not stayed true to his word to at least one party here.
Mill definitely needs to learn about contract law at least, and idk it seems like they pressured him into staying
I agree it was an extremely immature decision on stephano's part and in the future other teams will probably be hesitant to deal with him regardless of his skill.
I absolutely think legal action should be taken , Col needs to set a precedent for the esports scene , i think it would negatively affect the esports scene if they just let this go.
The problem is Stephano is still just a kid, only 18 years old. He probably doesn't know a lot about contracts and the such, and only has the two opposing parties to listen to.
IMO he needs some sort of agent, like professional sports players have (NHL, NFL, NBA...all the players regardless of how old have agents). Young players like Stephano need someone not affiliated with either party to negotiate and work out contracts and to make sure contracts are honored. An agent/lawyer would be extremely beneficial to him.
Not an agent, a lawyer. No one should ever sign a business contract of this nature without a lawyer.
On September 20 2011 05:23 Drenz wrote: coL contract is just a joke, nothing professionnal so it's quite funny to see people thinking they want to improve eSport
they are trying to recruit top talent from around the globe and
1) pay them a shit ton of money
2) give them the best possible training
3) fly them to European, North American, and Korean LANS
so wait, stephano signs a contract which, i would assume given the general high level of competence that complexity has, has something like "this contract is subject to the laws of (wherever coL is based)", and millenium are making out that french law would supercede that? that sounds hilarious if that is actually the case. oh well, everything's a school day even for those of us who actually have some idea of legal systems
EPT
