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On September 02 2011 11:35 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:02 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:57 DonKey_ wrote:On September 02 2011 10:55 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:51 Airship wrote:On September 02 2011 10:50 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:49 Airship wrote:On September 02 2011 10:47 billyX333 wrote:
I kind of understand the fear that it will hurt the stakes and hype of the tournament finals, but I disagree.
I've got a question for those who are against this, do you think cash prizes would help basketball or football sporting events? I don't think so. Part of the appeal of college sports is that we can be sure most of them are doing it for the passion for competition because they are amateurs who aren't getting paid salaries. I'd get significantly more emotional for the guy who is tearing up on the main stage because he finally gets a major championship title rather than a sick pay check.
Also, from what I understand, players like huk and idra make significantly more money from salaries than they do from tournament winnings. The value of a championship is not in the prize itself but the glory, fame, marketability, and negotiating leverage a player gets for future teams and sponsors. Even if the prize disparity between 1st and 2nd is significantly reduced behind closed doors, the incentive to win is still there. I'd much rather see emotions running high because of the championship title and not the big cash payout. When TT1 threw his game against Fenix your entire argument was proven invalid and it was proven that it can and has effected play sorry You didn't understand the argument then sorry I understand that you think progamers will play their hearts out regardless of money and that TT1 proved you wrong. I am not missing anything. My primary point is that the incentive to win is there not because of the prizepool. Bringing up a case to the contrary doesn't invalidate any argument. I'm making an argument for what is the case for most progamers. But he provides evidence for his post, when you present none for your own. Evidence for my argument? My argument was that the incentive to win is there regardless of prize pool. Why the fuck would anybody compete in MLG. The only players who will on average net a profit from flying across the globe to MLG would be the 4 koreans put in group play. Everyone else is playing for love for the game, competition, or for sponsors. Just because players like TT1 ignore all incentives except for cash prizes doesn't invalidate any argument. All it does is prove there are idiots out there who don't give a shit about the game or competition. TT1 proved that a long time ago. Thats why TT1 will probably never have fans and that's also why he should go find a new job anyway if all he wants is cash hahaha i dont care about the competition, thats the only reason why i still play this game u think naniwa is a hardcore competitor? just because hes been in the spotlight much longer than me that doesnt mean he has more heart/drive than me, u dont know the half it bro i promise u theres no one in this game that wants to win to more than me, whenever i get knocked out of tournament i dont even stick around in the tournament area because i feel so ashamed of myself, youve never seen me once i get home after one of my failed mlg runs, i get so fucking depressed that i start thinking my future and whether or not im washed up and should quit playing, u dont know wat goes through my head so pls dont act like u do
If losing makes you so depressed why did you 1base carrier?
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On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:36 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:30 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:24 Medrea wrote:
[quote]
Then I'm following the same line of logic. I'm no longer a fan of pro's who have made deals.
So who has done this? That we know? ToD Grubby TT1? ToD, Grubby, TT1, Fenix (reneging on the deal doesn't change the fact that he initially made it), and according to Fayth, the teams Reign, EG, mouz, Dignitas, and SlayerS. Have fun, dude. That is fucking awful. SC2 pro's should feel awful about themselves right now. I bet SlayerS is doing bad in GSTL because they already have there hands in the other teams pockets. I know Frank and Tranqfx of Reign personally, Im gonna go ask them about this. EG Dignitas and mouz are on my shitlist now. Um, note that this takes place between teammates, not between teams. And while you're at it, you should probably stop watching professional SC2 altogether. I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it? I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely. The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc.
When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that?
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a deal is a deal is a deal. Fenix is wrong if he did go back on his word. No excuses.
In a 1v1 game making deals is wrong. Flat out, both are wrong in this situation. No excuses.
The integrity of the game is tarnished. Why try if all is equal anyways? That is the difference between poker and starcraft. Its straight forward who wins in poker, that is not the case in starcraft.
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On September 02 2011 11:48 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:47 KingPaddy wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:36 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:30 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:24 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:22 Kaitlin wrote:
[quote]
Players have been banned from MLG for "deal making". Then I'm following the same line of logic. I'm no longer a fan of pro's who have made deals. So who has done this? That we know? ToD Grubby TT1? ToD, Grubby, TT1, Fenix (reneging on the deal doesn't change the fact that he initially made it), and according to Fayth, the teams Reign, EG, mouz, Dignitas, and SlayerS. Have fun, dude. That is fucking awful. SC2 pro's should feel awful about themselves right now. I bet SlayerS is doing bad in GSTL because they already have there hands in the other teams pockets. I know Frank and Tranqfx of Reign personally, Im gonna go ask them about this. EG Dignitas and mouz are on my shitlist now. Um, note that this takes place between teammates, not between teams. And while you're at it, you should probably stop watching professional SC2 altogether. I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it? I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely. The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You do realize, that what you are describing, is exactly what happen, if they male a 50/50 deal? OK this is twice now so I guess people are lost. Read my post carefully please. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use.
You're looking at it wrong. Placing first already brings a player far more benefits than placing second. Prestige, reputation, invitations to other tournaments, sponsors, bragging rights, etc. Honestly, if all players are motivated by is money, then why do any of them go to MLG? It has a 5k first prize, which is puny. The answer is, "Glory." MLG brings a shit-ton of press if you get first place.
Anyways, the solution is actually to make the prizes less top-heavy. Also, not everyone splits 50/50 (which is dumb, IMHO). Splitting 60/40 or 55/45 still provides a monetary motivation for the players.
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On September 02 2011 11:53 Tektos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:35 TT1 wrote:On September 02 2011 11:02 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:57 DonKey_ wrote:On September 02 2011 10:55 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:51 Airship wrote:On September 02 2011 10:50 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:49 Airship wrote:On September 02 2011 10:47 billyX333 wrote:
I kind of understand the fear that it will hurt the stakes and hype of the tournament finals, but I disagree.
I've got a question for those who are against this, do you think cash prizes would help basketball or football sporting events? I don't think so. Part of the appeal of college sports is that we can be sure most of them are doing it for the passion for competition because they are amateurs who aren't getting paid salaries. I'd get significantly more emotional for the guy who is tearing up on the main stage because he finally gets a major championship title rather than a sick pay check.
Also, from what I understand, players like huk and idra make significantly more money from salaries than they do from tournament winnings. The value of a championship is not in the prize itself but the glory, fame, marketability, and negotiating leverage a player gets for future teams and sponsors. Even if the prize disparity between 1st and 2nd is significantly reduced behind closed doors, the incentive to win is still there. I'd much rather see emotions running high because of the championship title and not the big cash payout. When TT1 threw his game against Fenix your entire argument was proven invalid and it was proven that it can and has effected play sorry You didn't understand the argument then sorry I understand that you think progamers will play their hearts out regardless of money and that TT1 proved you wrong. I am not missing anything. My primary point is that the incentive to win is there not because of the prizepool. Bringing up a case to the contrary doesn't invalidate any argument. I'm making an argument for what is the case for most progamers. But he provides evidence for his post, when you present none for your own. Evidence for my argument? My argument was that the incentive to win is there regardless of prize pool. Why the fuck would anybody compete in MLG. The only players who will on average net a profit from flying across the globe to MLG would be the 4 koreans put in group play. Everyone else is playing for love for the game, competition, or for sponsors. Just because players like TT1 ignore all incentives except for cash prizes doesn't invalidate any argument. All it does is prove there are idiots out there who don't give a shit about the game or competition. TT1 proved that a long time ago. Thats why TT1 will probably never have fans and that's also why he should go find a new job anyway if all he wants is cash hahaha i dont care about the competition, thats the only reason why i still play this game u think naniwa is a hardcore competitor? just because hes been in the spotlight much longer than me that doesnt mean he has more heart/drive than me, u dont know the half it bro i promise u theres no one in this game that wants to win to more than me, whenever i get knocked out of tournament i dont even stick around in the tournament area because i feel so ashamed of myself, youve never seen me once i get home after one of my failed mlg runs, i get so fucking depressed that i start thinking my future and whether or not im washed up and should quit playing, u dont know wat goes through my head so pls dont act like u do If losing makes you so depressed why did you 1base carrier?
Exactly. That's the 1 million dollar question.
I hope this gets the proper attention.
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On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:36 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:30 babylon wrote:
[quote]
ToD, Grubby, TT1, Fenix (reneging on the deal doesn't change the fact that he initially made it), and according to Fayth, the teams Reign, EG, mouz, Dignitas, and SlayerS.
Have fun, dude. That is fucking awful. SC2 pro's should feel awful about themselves right now. I bet SlayerS is doing bad in GSTL because they already have there hands in the other teams pockets. I know Frank and Tranqfx of Reign personally, Im gonna go ask them about this. EG Dignitas and mouz are on my shitlist now. Um, note that this takes place between teammates, not between teams. And while you're at it, you should probably stop watching professional SC2 altogether. I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it? I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely. The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that?
I really don't understand your position. You're against people making deals but you're fine to FORCE them to make a deal.
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I know I will certainly be questioning whether a competitor is really competing 100%. This thread has pretty much ruined competitive sc2 for me. How do I know how far this goes? How do I know how many matches where setup like this?
Does ANYONE really believe players will play at the same level, with the same preparation, intensity, passion, and tension when there is nothing to gain or loose? When compared with if you win it's twice as much money as if you loose? I will never believe these 2 things are equal and produce the same quality of matches.
This just sucks, it's a damn shame. There is nothing "Professional" in this type of scenario IMO. It's completely disingenuous.
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On September 02 2011 11:51 StutteR wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:50 ilbh wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 ReignFayth wrote:On September 02 2011 11:30 roymarthyup wrote:
im actually more of a fan of FENIX after hearing what he did
fenix did what needs to be done. if tournaments dont fix dealmaking by changing their rules or how the tournaments are run, then players themselves should use dealmaking to their advantage. fenix told TT1 he would do a deal, then he won the finals because of that advantage, and kept all the money for himself and laughed at TT1
hahahaha. alls fair in love and war boys. kudos to fenix and i support him more as a fan for his brilliant actions. approving of thievery and being proud of it what kind of world do we live in -.- thievery? TT1 knew his chances of winning against Fenix were like less than 20% and proposed this shit of a deal. Fenix would have to be stupid to split it with TT1. This is before the tournament occurred. Before both reached the finals. Fenix agreed to the deal, so did he also think that TT1 was better than him?
no, he probably didn't think straight and accepted, but then realized he was cheated by his friend who proposed that shit and took the money he deserved for winning.
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On September 02 2011 11:55 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:36 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 Medrea wrote:
[quote]
That is fucking awful. SC2 pro's should feel awful about themselves right now. I bet SlayerS is doing bad in GSTL because they already have there hands in the other teams pockets.
I know Frank and Tranqfx of Reign personally, Im gonna go ask them about this. EG Dignitas and mouz are on my shitlist now.
Um, note that this takes place between teammates, not between teams. And while you're at it, you should probably stop watching professional SC2 altogether. I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it? I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely. The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that? I really don't understand your position. You're against people making deals but you're fine to FORCE them to make a deal.
Im fine with any way to force players to give 100 percent to the game. It's only fair to the spectators.
Instead we get pro's saying "Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp"
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On September 02 2011 11:35 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:02 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:57 DonKey_ wrote:On September 02 2011 10:55 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:51 Airship wrote:On September 02 2011 10:50 billyX333 wrote:On September 02 2011 10:49 Airship wrote:On September 02 2011 10:47 billyX333 wrote:
I kind of understand the fear that it will hurt the stakes and hype of the tournament finals, but I disagree.
I've got a question for those who are against this, do you think cash prizes would help basketball or football sporting events? I don't think so. Part of the appeal of college sports is that we can be sure most of them are doing it for the passion for competition because they are amateurs who aren't getting paid salaries. I'd get significantly more emotional for the guy who is tearing up on the main stage because he finally gets a major championship title rather than a sick pay check.
Also, from what I understand, players like huk and idra make significantly more money from salaries than they do from tournament winnings. The value of a championship is not in the prize itself but the glory, fame, marketability, and negotiating leverage a player gets for future teams and sponsors. Even if the prize disparity between 1st and 2nd is significantly reduced behind closed doors, the incentive to win is still there. I'd much rather see emotions running high because of the championship title and not the big cash payout. When TT1 threw his game against Fenix your entire argument was proven invalid and it was proven that it can and has effected play sorry You didn't understand the argument then sorry I understand that you think progamers will play their hearts out regardless of money and that TT1 proved you wrong. I am not missing anything. My primary point is that the incentive to win is there not because of the prizepool. Bringing up a case to the contrary doesn't invalidate any argument. I'm making an argument for what is the case for most progamers. But he provides evidence for his post, when you present none for your own. Evidence for my argument? My argument was that the incentive to win is there regardless of prize pool. Why the fuck would anybody compete in MLG. The only players who will on average net a profit from flying across the globe to MLG would be the 4 koreans put in group play. Everyone else is playing for love for the game, competition, or for sponsors. Just because players like TT1 ignore all incentives except for cash prizes doesn't invalidate any argument. All it does is prove there are idiots out there who don't give a shit about the game or competition. TT1 proved that a long time ago. Thats why TT1 will probably never have fans and that's also why he should go find a new job anyway if all he wants is cash hahaha i dont care about the competition, thats the only reason why i still play this game u think naniwa is a hardcore competitor? just because hes been in the spotlight much longer than me that doesnt mean he has more heart/drive than me, u dont know the half it bro i promise u theres no one in this game that wants to win to more than me, whenever i get knocked out of tournament i dont even stick around in the tournament area because i feel so ashamed of myself, youve never seen me once i get home after one of my failed mlg runs, i get so fucking depressed that i start thinking my future and whether or not im washed up and should quit playing, u dont know wat goes through my head so pls dont act like u do
Every time I try to argue for the integrity and passion of the competitors, the story about 1 base carriers and match throwing is always brought up as a counter argument. Obviously I dont know what happened so I won't say anything else except if its true then it hurts the game, the tournament, and the credibility of all other competitors
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On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:36 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:30 babylon wrote:
[quote]
ToD, Grubby, TT1, Fenix (reneging on the deal doesn't change the fact that he initially made it), and according to Fayth, the teams Reign, EG, mouz, Dignitas, and SlayerS.
Have fun, dude. That is fucking awful. SC2 pro's should feel awful about themselves right now. I bet SlayerS is doing bad in GSTL because they already have there hands in the other teams pockets. I know Frank and Tranqfx of Reign personally, Im gonna go ask them about this. EG Dignitas and mouz are on my shitlist now. Um, note that this takes place between teammates, not between teams. And while you're at it, you should probably stop watching professional SC2 altogether. I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it? I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely. The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that?
But in most tournaments you don't have the time to prepare extra for the finals, instead you prepare for the whole tournament. Only counter example that comes to mind are GSL and TSL and I guess winning them, would be a good reason to prepare for.
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On September 02 2011 11:56 ilbh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:51 StutteR wrote:On September 02 2011 11:50 ilbh wrote:On September 02 2011 11:34 ReignFayth wrote:On September 02 2011 11:30 roymarthyup wrote:
im actually more of a fan of FENIX after hearing what he did
fenix did what needs to be done. if tournaments dont fix dealmaking by changing their rules or how the tournaments are run, then players themselves should use dealmaking to their advantage. fenix told TT1 he would do a deal, then he won the finals because of that advantage, and kept all the money for himself and laughed at TT1
hahahaha. alls fair in love and war boys. kudos to fenix and i support him more as a fan for his brilliant actions. approving of thievery and being proud of it what kind of world do we live in -.- thievery? TT1 knew his chances of winning against Fenix were like less than 20% and proposed this shit of a deal. Fenix would have to be stupid to split it with TT1. This is before the tournament occurred. Before both reached the finals. Fenix agreed to the deal, so did he also think that TT1 was better than him? no, he probably didn't think straight and accepted, but then realized he was cheated by his friend who proposed that shit and took the money he deserved for winning.
you can't just deny a deal you've already made because "you didn't think straight"
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It should not be made illegal because there is no way to enforce. If two people make it to the finals of the tourney no matter what anyone says the prize money of the tourney is theirs and however they want to use it is their decision. There is a huge risk in doing this, ripping off being one. And the fact that whoever actually wins gets the fame. So no matter what i think that both players will think twice about playing their best.
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On September 02 2011 11:56 Reborn8u wrote:
I know I will certainly be questioning whether a competitor is really competing 100%. This thread has pretty much ruined competitive sc2 for me. How do I know how far this goes? How do I know how many matches where setup like this?
Does ANYONE really believe players will play at the same level, with the same intensity and tension when there is nothing to gain or loose? When compared with if you win it's twice as much money as if you loose? I will never believe these 2 things are equal and produce the same quality of matches.
This just sucks, it's a damn shame. There is nothing "Professional" in this type of scenario IMO. It's completely disingenuous.
There's still plenty to gain by winning. Also not everyone chops 50/50. They may chop 40/40 and play for the remaining 20%.
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Two people have no obligation to provide good games for others. This is entirely different from throwing games for sports bettors, since both competitors agree to it and nobody besides them benefits. Obviously they shouldn't do it publicly, but it's their right to come to an agreement. If you don't like it, get better and don't let them get to the finals.
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On September 02 2011 11:57 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:55 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:36 babylon wrote:
[quote]
Um, note that this takes place between teammates, not between teams.
And while you're at it, you should probably stop watching professional SC2 altogether. I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it? I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely. The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that? I really don't understand your position. You're against people making deals but you're fine to FORCE them to make a deal. Im fine with any way to force players to give 100 percent to the game. It's only fair to the spectators. Instead we get pro's saying "Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp"
.......... You're attacking your own arguments now.
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On September 02 2011 11:59 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:57 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:55 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:On September 02 2011 11:38 Medrea wrote:
[quote]
I probably will. Whats the point? You think splitting is the worst of it?
I don't wanna watch a people play like shit intentionally. I want this out of my game completely.
The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling. Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that? I really don't understand your position. You're against people making deals but you're fine to FORCE them to make a deal. Im fine with any way to force players to give 100 percent to the game. It's only fair to the spectators. Instead we get pro's saying "Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp" .......... You're attacking your own arguments now.
No? Do people really like watching derpfests in the finals?
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On September 02 2011 11:58 FawkingGoomba wrote:
Two people have no obligation to provide good games for others. This is entirely different from throwing games for sports bettors, since both competitors agree to it and nobody besides them benefits. Obviously they shouldn't do it publicly, but it's their right to come to an agreement. If you don't like it, get better and don't let them get to the finals.
I don't care if the games are good. I care about the knowledge that both players have dedicated themselves 100% to trying to win that match.
I don't care if they marine scv all in 4 games in a row to win a best of 7, if that wins them games they should do it. Although if that wins them games, Blizzard needs to do some patching.
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On September 02 2011 12:00 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 11:59 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:57 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:55 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:39 babylon wrote:
[quote]
The fact that you think splitting automatically leads to shitty play is very telling.
Kiwi and Minigun probably split too, by the way. I'd assume most of the poker players do. Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit. I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash. You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that? I really don't understand your position. You're against people making deals but you're fine to FORCE them to make a deal. Im fine with any way to force players to give 100 percent to the game. It's only fair to the spectators. Instead we get pro's saying "Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp" .......... You're attacking your own arguments now. No?
1st and 2nd place are the same.
"Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp"
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On September 02 2011 12:00 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2011 12:00 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:59 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:57 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:55 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:53 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:50 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:47 Medrea wrote:On September 02 2011 11:45 MyNameWuzBoB wrote:On September 02 2011 11:43 Medrea wrote:
[quote]
Wow fuck it then. No point in watching the finals of anything. Even if the finals are outside the team its the same shit.
I hope we see a trend from 1st place having a higher prize money then. 1st and 2nd should ahve the same prize money. But the 1st place winner gets benefits only they can use. Trophies, additional press, gift certificates or whatever. Just not hard cash.
You're complaining about people making deals to split the 1st and 2nd prize. So why are you suggesting 1st and 2nd place get the same money? So that they play fair? 1st place gets more stuff. And no one can use it but the winner. Thereby ensuring that they can't split the true first place prize. How would they not play fair if they chopped? They already can't split the true first place prize, like sponsors, team deals, trophy, fame etc. When you are preparing for the finals of a tournament. It's like hell. You practice way harder and longer and it's brutal. And you try to fit in good rest somewhere in there. When you split the prize money, how much incentive is there to do that? I really don't understand your position. You're against people making deals but you're fine to FORCE them to make a deal. Im fine with any way to force players to give 100 percent to the game. It's only fair to the spectators. Instead we get pro's saying "Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp" .......... You're attacking your own arguments now. No? 1st and 2nd place are the same. "Lawl I just carrier rushed because I had the money in my pocket already derp"
Please go back and read what I have been saying. Your missing an extremely large part of the discussion.
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EPT
