• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:14
CEST 00:14
KST 07:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash8[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy12ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book20
Community News
Weekly Cups (March 23-29): herO takes triple5Aligulac acquired by REPLAYMAN.com/Stego Research3Weekly Cups (March 16-22): herO doubles, Cure surprises3Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool49Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win4
StarCraft 2
General
What mix of new & old maps do you want in the next ladder pool? (SC2) herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational Weekly Cups (March 23-29): herO takes triple Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy Aligulac acquired by REPLAYMAN.com/Stego Research
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Season 4 announced for March-April StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) WardiTV Mondays World University TeamLeague (500$+) | Signups Open
Strategy
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026]
External Content
Mutation # 519 Inner Power The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 518 Radiation Zone Mutation # 517 Distant Threat
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Build Order Practice Maps [ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Pros React To: SoulKey vs Ample
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues 🌍 Weekly Foreign Showmatches [ASL21] Ro24 Group E [ASL21] Ro24 Group D
Strategy
What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Darkest Dungeon
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Canadian Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1548 users

Why 1/1/1 is considered to be imbalanced in Korea - Page 90

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 88 89 90 91 92 143 Next
Can we stop talking about nerfing things please? - 9:10 KST
blooblooblahblah
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia4163 Posts
August 23 2011 12:18 GMT
#1781
On August 23 2011 21:15 DertoQq wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:13 Bakkendepao wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:03 Ravomat wrote:
Nexus first is still very vulnerable to all ins. It's just different ones.

I think the key to holding this off is phoenix/immortal/zealot into colossi but I need to play against it a lot more to be certain.

In my experience Ive been able to hold almost every terran allin with nexus first, ofcourse, these are to be done on the bigger maps.


Didn't Killer lost like 3 time in a row trying to nexus first ?


Well ironically the one game he won was against a 1-1-1 all-in.
Ganzi beat me without stim. Ostojiy beat me with a nydus. Siphonn beat me with probes. Revival beat my sentry-immortal all-in.
ClueLessx3
Profile Joined April 2011
Australia53 Posts
August 23 2011 12:20 GMT
#1782
On August 23 2011 21:16 Yaotzin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:15 w_Ender_w wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:13 Yaotzin wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:09 w_Ender_w wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:34 Joseph123 wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:32 w_Ender_w wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:28 Joseph123 wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:21 w_Ender_w wrote:
I think if people played as much as they theorycrafted in this thread someone might come up with a solution to 1/1/1

u mean guys like Alicia who only write on twitter about 1-1-1 and not play at all right?

Sorry, I must have missed Alicia's posts about what Terran units need to be nerfed to solve 1 build

so now Alicia is a balance designer?

I think there must be some misunderstanding lost in translation here.

All I'm saying is that this balance discussion and theorycrafting is kind of worthless. Nothing is going to do anything but getting into games and working it out. That's what Alicia is doing, not posting on TL about it.

No he's posting on twitter because his practice sessions have lead him to same conclusions as everyone elses: you can't stop it.

Then everyone should just quit playing Protoss. Or keep trying. Up to you? :D

People look pretty close to race switching, as Zergs were before the patches saved them. Many Protoss look on tilt from the start in PvT, including MC.

Agreed been off racing as Zerg for a few weeks cause i just don't wanna touch protoss at this state losing to it makes me rage QQ
GinDo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
3327 Posts
August 23 2011 12:21 GMT
#1783
On August 23 2011 21:00 ClueLessx3 wrote:
What about hallucinations?
- Sentries hallucinating a few more zealots to make your main army more robust.
- FF All the marines towards you and let the splash dmg from the Siege tank work in our favour
- Sentries can't be PDDed so destroy it by focusing it down. If possible snipe the raven
* Possible contain to delay the push and thus getting more units out to deal with it

So that's the pros. Cons:
- Uses too much gas, meaning slow tech and therefore slower robo for the observer.
- Sentries are really fragile and can be focused down easily (:0 siege tank target fire them, painful to watch QQ
- Need a lot of them for GS, FF and Hallucination thus hurting your main army

What do you think? :x


Um....The 1-1-1 PDD push has a Raven O_o.
ⱩŦ ƑⱠẬ$Ħ / ƩǤ ɈƩẬƉØƝǤ [ɌȻ] / ȊṂ.ṂṼⱣ / ẬȻƩɌ.ȊƝƝØṼẬŦȊØƝ / ẬȻƩɌ.ϟȻẬɌⱠƩŦŦ ϟⱠẬɎƩɌϟ ȻⱠẬƝ
DertoQq
Profile Joined October 2010
France906 Posts
August 23 2011 12:21 GMT
#1784
On August 23 2011 21:18 blooblooblahblah wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:15 DertoQq wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:13 Bakkendepao wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:03 Ravomat wrote:
Nexus first is still very vulnerable to all ins. It's just different ones.

I think the key to holding this off is phoenix/immortal/zealot into colossi but I need to play against it a lot more to be certain.

In my experience Ive been able to hold almost every terran allin with nexus first, ofcourse, these are to be done on the bigger maps.


Didn't Killer lost like 3 time in a row trying to nexus first ?


Well ironically the one game he won was against a 1-1-1 all-in.


Why would you say "ironically" ? The build is made to beat 1-1-1 all-in, it would have been ironical if he had lost this one also ^^
"i've made some empty promises in my life, but hands down that was the most generous" - Michael Scott
Toadvine
Profile Joined November 2010
Poland2234 Posts
August 23 2011 12:23 GMT
#1785
Even if I wanted to race switch, I don't like playing Terran at all. I like Zerg, but ZvZ makes me want to kill myself, can't stand that matchup for some reason. Besides, it's not like I keep losing to this, I just 1 base all-in and the average Masters player doesn't have the execution needed to defend with a 1/1/1 opening. 3 Gate VR and the 4 Gate Warp Prism work quite well.
"There are always some Eskimos ready to instruct the Congolese on how to cope with heat waves." - S.J.Lec
ClueLessx3
Profile Joined April 2011
Australia53 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-23 12:27:44
August 23 2011 12:24 GMT
#1786
On August 23 2011 21:21 GinDo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:00 ClueLessx3 wrote:
What about hallucinations?
- Sentries hallucinating a few more zealots to make your main army more robust.
- FF All the marines towards you and let the splash dmg from the Siege tank work in our favour
- Sentries can't be PDDed so destroy it by focusing it down. If possible snipe the raven
* Possible contain to delay the push and thus getting more units out to deal with it

So that's the pros. Cons:
- Uses too much gas, meaning slow tech and therefore slower robo for the observer.
- Sentries are really fragile and can be focused down easily (:0 siege tank target fire them, painful to watch QQ
- Need a lot of them for GS, FF and Hallucination thus hurting your main army

What do you think? :x


Um....The 1-1-1 PDD push has a Raven O_o.


I was thinking of sniping it...somehow =3= dw
i'm running out of ideas

Lets watch the gsl to see if he holds the 111 :D CMON YOU CAN DO IT GENIUS!
Yaotzin
Profile Joined August 2010
South Africa4280 Posts
August 23 2011 12:25 GMT
#1787
On August 23 2011 21:23 Toadvine wrote:
Even if I wanted to race switch, I don't like playing Terran at all. I like Zerg, but ZvZ makes me want to kill myself, can't stand that matchup for some reason. Besides, it's not like I keep losing to this, I just 1 base all-in and the average Masters player doesn't have the execution needed to defend with a 1/1/1 opening. 3 Gate VR and the 4 Gate Warp Prism work quite well.

Ya it's not really an issue at our scrub level because the Terrans don't know how to defend a whole bunch of allins in response. But when they do....
shammythefox
Profile Joined May 2010
United Kingdom286 Posts
August 23 2011 12:26 GMT
#1788
I was under the impression every region held this opinion...
MLG_Wiggin
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States767 Posts
August 23 2011 12:27 GMT
#1789
On August 23 2011 21:16 Yaotzin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:15 w_Ender_w wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:13 Yaotzin wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:09 w_Ender_w wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:34 Joseph123 wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:32 w_Ender_w wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:28 Joseph123 wrote:
On August 23 2011 20:21 w_Ender_w wrote:
I think if people played as much as they theorycrafted in this thread someone might come up with a solution to 1/1/1

u mean guys like Alicia who only write on twitter about 1-1-1 and not play at all right?

Sorry, I must have missed Alicia's posts about what Terran units need to be nerfed to solve 1 build

so now Alicia is a balance designer?

I think there must be some misunderstanding lost in translation here.

All I'm saying is that this balance discussion and theorycrafting is kind of worthless. Nothing is going to do anything but getting into games and working it out. That's what Alicia is doing, not posting on TL about it.

No he's posting on twitter because his practice sessions have lead him to same conclusions as everyone elses: you can't stop it.

Then everyone should just quit playing Protoss. Or keep trying. Up to you? :D

People look pretty close to race switching, as Zergs were before the patches saved them. Many Protoss look on tilt from the start in PvT, including MC.

I don't think you're giving professional protoss and zerg players enough credit. Patches didn't give Nestea and MC their GSL wins. Sure, in the past some things have changed (notably 5 rax reaper was nerfed, but honestly I bet if they left it in Zergs would be stopping it today though the metagame would look completely different). I mean just look at the whole 2 rax/pulled SCV all-in trend that looked unstoppable for almost an entire GSL. Nothing really changed, but now most Terran's don't do that because it got 'solved' to an extent.

Alicia made a post on twitter. I bet he's still practicing every day, not waiting for a patch to solve his problems or switching his race.
@DBWiggin, SC2 ref
IVN
Profile Joined October 2010
534 Posts
August 23 2011 12:29 GMT
#1790
On August 23 2011 21:09 DertoQq wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:07 IVN wrote:

So why would MVP say 111 is imbalanced, if it werent really the case? What could he possibly gain from this?


More popularity ? : D

:D

LOLz, made my day.


But seriously, isnt he already the most popular terran player in the world?
rpgalon
Profile Joined April 2011
Brazil1069 Posts
August 23 2011 12:29 GMT
#1791
phoenix 25 energy graviton beam against light units. so they can try to kill marines

no, it would not make hydras useless, you can only fight hydras with phoenix if you have 1 phoenix for each hydra, so energy almost never is a problem. and the counter to mas phoenix is not hydra, the counter is spore crawlers or corruptors.
badog
Yaotzin
Profile Joined August 2010
South Africa4280 Posts
August 23 2011 12:29 GMT
#1792
On August 23 2011 21:27 w_Ender_w wrote:
Alicia made a post on twitter. I bet he's still practicing every day, not waiting for a patch to solve his problems or switching his race.

Probably. But probably not much PvT, and he'll probably just allin a bunch. Look at the ludicrous G3 of MC v Puma to see how insane this is making Protoss players. Phoenix into blink into DT into hidden base into base trade to try and beat it. Nobody has a clue what to do and they've basically given up trying.
DertoQq
Profile Joined October 2010
France906 Posts
August 23 2011 12:31 GMT
#1793
On August 23 2011 21:27 w_Ender_w wrote:
I mean just look at the whole 2 rax/pulled SCV all-in trend that looked unstoppable for almost an entire GSL. Nothing really changed, but now most Terran's don't do that because it got 'solved' to an extent.



kinda different, it was never "unstoppable", it was just really hard to scout and happened unexpectedly. But if you know its coming, you don't lose. Like any all-in.
"i've made some empty promises in my life, but hands down that was the most generous" - Michael Scott
Severedevil
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4839 Posts
August 23 2011 12:34 GMT
#1794
The Terran race is so 'versatile' because their tech is cheap. 3/1/1 costs only 900/300 in infrastructure, and unlocks access to all but three units, as well as access to the research for those units. It would appear to fulfill similar roles to Twilight Council + Stargate + Robo + Bay, which is much more expensive. (For ~900/300, a Protoss can have two Gateways + Core + Warp Tech + two tech structures. Not as sexy.)

If Protoss is to compete one-base to one-base with Terran, perhaps Protoss need to open with faster gas.
My strategy is to fork people.
DertoQq
Profile Joined October 2010
France906 Posts
August 23 2011 12:35 GMT
#1795
On August 23 2011 21:29 IVN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:09 DertoQq wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:07 IVN wrote:

So why would MVP say 111 is imbalanced, if it werent really the case? What could he possibly gain from this?


More popularity ? : D

:D

LOLz, made my day.


But seriously, isnt he already the most popular terran player in the world?


He was probably jealous of the "sick nerd baller" MC ^_^
"i've made some empty promises in my life, but hands down that was the most generous" - Michael Scott
MLG_Wiggin
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States767 Posts
August 23 2011 12:36 GMT
#1796
On August 23 2011 21:29 Yaotzin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:27 w_Ender_w wrote:
Alicia made a post on twitter. I bet he's still practicing every day, not waiting for a patch to solve his problems or switching his race.

Probably. But probably not much PvT, and he'll probably just allin a bunch. Look at the ludicrous G3 of MC v Puma to see how insane this is making Protoss players. Phoenix into blink into DT into hidden base into base trade to try and beat it. Nobody has a clue what to do and they've basically given up trying.

That every Protoss player in the world has given up is quite the assumption to make.
@DBWiggin, SC2 ref
IVN
Profile Joined October 2010
534 Posts
August 23 2011 12:37 GMT
#1797
On August 23 2011 21:24 ClueLessx3 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:21 GinDo wrote:
On August 23 2011 21:00 ClueLessx3 wrote:
What about hallucinations?
- Sentries hallucinating a few more zealots to make your main army more robust.
- FF All the marines towards you and let the splash dmg from the Siege tank work in our favour
- Sentries can't be PDDed so destroy it by focusing it down. If possible snipe the raven
* Possible contain to delay the push and thus getting more units out to deal with it

So that's the pros. Cons:
- Uses too much gas, meaning slow tech and therefore slower robo for the observer.
- Sentries are really fragile and can be focused down easily (:0 siege tank target fire them, painful to watch QQ
- Need a lot of them for GS, FF and Hallucination thus hurting your main army

What do you think? :x


Um....The 1-1-1 PDD push has a Raven O_o.


I was thinking of sniping it...somehow =3= dw
i'm running out of ideas

Lets watch the gsl to see if he holds the 111 :D CMON YOU CAN DO IT GENIUS!

Owned hard.

Although this wasnt the exact build we are discussing here. Stimed marines with shields + tanks and medivacs of one base.

I think the problem is either the MULE, which makes sooooo many marines for terran possible, or the marines are too strong.
DertoQq
Profile Joined October 2010
France906 Posts
August 23 2011 12:38 GMT
#1798
Artosis on GSL basically said "Protoss should stop playing so greedy. 1-gate expand vs 1 base all-in terran, what did he expected ?"

Can someone tell him how wrong he is ? : <
"i've made some empty promises in my life, but hands down that was the most generous" - Michael Scott
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
August 23 2011 12:39 GMT
#1799
hehe, in the GSL RO16 + Show Spoiler +
Genius just lost his first game to 1-1-1 but there was no banshees or ravens and he scouted the MT just as they were moving out so only got 1 immortal and messed up his ffs losing about 5 ffs with only 1 marine killed.
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
MLG_Wiggin
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States767 Posts
August 23 2011 12:43 GMT
#1800
On August 23 2011 21:31 DertoQq wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 23 2011 21:27 w_Ender_w wrote:
I mean just look at the whole 2 rax/pulled SCV all-in trend that looked unstoppable for almost an entire GSL. Nothing really changed, but now most Terran's don't do that because it got 'solved' to an extent.



kinda different, it was never "unstoppable", it was just really hard to scout and happened unexpectedly. But if you know its coming, you don't lose. Like any all-in.


I think it's a pretty apt analogy. Both are hard to scout (well, hard to scout what specific variation) and the push can happen unexpectedly. Eventually Zerg players figured out how to play less greedy without giving up an advantage, and it fell by the wayside. I think the Zerg over-all winrate for that GSL was probably similar to the Protoss over-all winrate is now in that match up.
@DBWiggin, SC2 ref
Prev 1 88 89 90 91 92 143 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 46m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SpeCial 28
CosmosSc2 26
ForJumy 25
EmSc Tv 18
StarCraft: Brood War
EffOrt 665
Artosis 215
ggaemo 109
Aegong 93
hero 67
IntoTheRainbow 15
Dota 2
monkeys_forever221
capcasts211
Counter-Strike
tarik_tv4317
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0206
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu365
Other Games
summit1g12896
FrodaN4709
Grubby2983
Fnx 1705
shahzam488
minikerr4
Organizations
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 18
EmSc2Tv 18
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta156
• musti20045 38
• Reevou 6
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV1502
League of Legends
• Doublelift2965
• TFBlade1261
Other Games
• imaqtpie835
• Scarra528
• Shiphtur135
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
1h 46m
Replay Cast
10h 46m
Afreeca Starleague
11h 46m
BeSt vs Leta
Queen vs Jaedong
Kung Fu Cup
12h 46m
Replay Cast
1d 1h
The PondCast
1d 11h
OSC
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
TriGGeR vs Cure
ByuN vs Rogue
Replay Cast
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Maru vs MaxPax
[ Show More ]
BSL
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
BSL
4 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS6
WardiTV Winter 2026
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 1
ASL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

CSL Season 20: Qualifier 2
Escore Tournament S2: W1
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.