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On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014.
So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no.
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On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no.
You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level.
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On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level.
It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly.
I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing.
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On December 03 2013 02:21 Ghanburighan wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level. It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly. I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing.
First of all, that report represents a short time period so you can't draw conclusions from it. Second, it shows all matchups within a rounded +5/-5, which is Blizzard's target and probably corresponds to the margin of error.
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Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014.
I don't think we are going to see terran dominance subside.. its to rewarding to be a good terran player. Seriously it doesn't matter how many nerfs you give To Terran Taeja would win anyways.... I think if we made it so marines had 1 HP and did 1 Damage per shot he would still come out with the big W on his tournaments or atleast place really high 
Its not the race respect the player
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On December 03 2013 02:26 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:21 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level. It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly. I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing. First of all, that report represents a short time period so you can't draw conclusions from it. Second, it shows all matchups within a rounded +5/-5, which is Blizzard's target and probably corresponds to the margin of error.
+-2 is better than +-5. They had +-2 made some changes and now they have +-5. Over year ago they had all matchups at 50% and then decided to buff quenns.
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On December 03 2013 02:35 Pirfiktshon wrote:Show nested quote +Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. I don't think we are going to see terran dominance subside.. its to rewarding to be a good terran player. Seriously it doesn't matter how many nerfs you give To Terran Taeja would win anyways.... I think if we made it so marines had 1 HP and did 1 Damage per shot he would still come out with the big W on his tournaments or atleast place really high Its not the race respect the player
Well Mvp managed to get the terran race nerfed numerous times, lets see for how many times Taeja goes. So far none.
On December 03 2013 02:54 keglu wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:26 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:21 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level. It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly. I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing. First of all, that report represents a short time period so you can't draw conclusions from it. Second, it shows all matchups within a rounded +5/-5, which is Blizzard's target and probably corresponds to the margin of error. +-2 is better than +-5. They had +-2 made some changes and now they have +-5. Over year ago they had all matchups at 50% and then decided to buff quenns.
The queen buff was required since back then all the terran needed to do was park a couple hellions near the natural of the zerg and it would take ages just to get a third since nothing could kill them and if you chased them, they would run in your base and roast your drones by the time you get back. We had 2base zerg vs 3base terran for gods sake.
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On December 03 2013 03:04 Assirra wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:35 Pirfiktshon wrote:Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. I don't think we are going to see terran dominance subside.. its to rewarding to be a good terran player. Seriously it doesn't matter how many nerfs you give To Terran Taeja would win anyways.... I think if we made it so marines had 1 HP and did 1 Damage per shot he would still come out with the big W on his tournaments or atleast place really high Its not the race respect the player Well Mvp managed to get the terran race nerfed numerous times, lets see for how many times Taeja goes. So far none. Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:54 keglu wrote:On December 03 2013 02:26 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:21 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level. It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly. I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing. First of all, that report represents a short time period so you can't draw conclusions from it. Second, it shows all matchups within a rounded +5/-5, which is Blizzard's target and probably corresponds to the margin of error. +-2 is better than +-5. They had +-2 made some changes and now they have +-5. Over year ago they had all matchups at 50% and then decided to buff quenns. The queen buff was required since back then all the terran needed to do was park a couple hellions near the natural of the zerg and it would take ages just to get a third since nothing could kill them and if you chased them, they would run in your base and roast your drones by the time you get back. We had 2base zerg vs 3base terran for gods sake.
Obviously it wasn't unless you prefer 55% winratio to 50%.
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On December 03 2013 03:04 Assirra wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:35 Pirfiktshon wrote:Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. I don't think we are going to see terran dominance subside.. its to rewarding to be a good terran player. Seriously it doesn't matter how many nerfs you give To Terran Taeja would win anyways.... I think if we made it so marines had 1 HP and did 1 Damage per shot he would still come out with the big W on his tournaments or atleast place really high Its not the race respect the player Well Mvp managed to get the terran race nerfed numerous times, lets see for how many times Taeja goes. So far none. Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 02:54 keglu wrote:On December 03 2013 02:26 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:21 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:On December 02 2013 19:30 Grovbolle wrote:http://aligulac.com/reports/balance/New numbers are out: PvT (55.05%) 812 games PvZ (49.72%) 1265 games TvZ (48.63%) 769 games Whine initiated. Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation! Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria. Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level. It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly. I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing. First of all, that report represents a short time period so you can't draw conclusions from it. Second, it shows all matchups within a rounded +5/-5, which is Blizzard's target and probably corresponds to the margin of error. +-2 is better than +-5. They had +-2 made some changes and now they have +-5. Over year ago they had all matchups at 50% and then decided to buff quenns. The queen buff was required since back then all the terran needed to do was park a couple hellions near the natural of the zerg and it would take ages just to get a third since nothing could kill them and if you chased them, they would run in your base and roast your drones by the time you get back. We had 2base zerg vs 3base terran for gods sake.
lol what a load of shit, that never happened to good zergs before the patch.
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lol what a load of shit, that never happened to good zergs before the patch.
Yea I was going to say the same thing but i didn't want to be controversial LOL Blizzard when at even winrates seems to not like it... they like to rock the boat to challenge us again and again I guess......
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On December 02 2013 07:20 keglu wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 06:59 Ben... wrote:On December 01 2013 21:21 vthree wrote:
And it takes Terran a while to try new things? At leas they try, when Protoss lost to 1-1-1 and ghost EMPs, Thors, they just cried and got the Terran units nerfed and their own unit buff. Granted, I think some of the changes was needed, but let's not try to suggest that Protoss adapted all by themselves.
Do you really think Protoss tried nothing over that time period? What changes were made to address 1/1/1 build? +1 immortal range (from 5 range to 6, the same range a stalker has). It made the immortal go from being basically useless to actually competent against the 1/1/1. Prior to that they would almost always get stuck behind stalkers (due to being slower and having a shorter range) and wouldn't be able to hit anything, not to mention they were outranged by a ton of units. That buff allowed Protoss to finally be able to target tanks and bunkers in a fashion that would not end with their immortals being dead a vast majority of the time. It sounds like a minor change but it completely changed how Protoss could defend against tank-based 1/1/1s and in general made the immortal's cost much easier to justify.
On December 03 2013 04:38 Chaggi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 03:04 Assirra wrote:On December 03 2013 02:35 Pirfiktshon wrote:Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. I don't think we are going to see terran dominance subside.. its to rewarding to be a good terran player. Seriously it doesn't matter how many nerfs you give To Terran Taeja would win anyways.... I think if we made it so marines had 1 HP and did 1 Damage per shot he would still come out with the big W on his tournaments or atleast place really high Its not the race respect the player Well Mvp managed to get the terran race nerfed numerous times, lets see for how many times Taeja goes. So far none. On December 03 2013 02:54 keglu wrote:On December 03 2013 02:26 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:21 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:14 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 02:09 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 03 2013 02:08 Salient wrote:On December 03 2013 01:56 Hider wrote:On December 02 2013 19:59 Salient wrote:
[quote]
Zerg is back. Someone wake Stephano from hibernation!
Just kidding, the numbers look pretty much balanced around Blizzard's +5/-5 criteria.
Not really. These numbers will eventually go towards 50-50 as well (just as blizzard's ladder stats), and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. The only thing that really strikes my eye is how underrepresented terran is on the tournament scene with much fewer games played. This once against signals that terran is hugely underrepresented at the competitive/pro level. There are roughly 50% less terran games than with the other races which signals a giant imbalance - similarly to what we see on the ladder. It's really a shame that Blizzard doesn't have a proper system in place for interpreting results in a meaningufl way. With a proper stastistic, terran's adjusted w/r would likely be below 40%. Terran dominated WCS in 2013. Zerg was grossly underrepresented at Blizzcon due to overpowered Hellbats and to a much lesser extent widow mines. Let's see if the Terran dominance finally subsides in 2014. So we wait for the next Blizzcon. How about no. You can QQ all you want. But the fact remains that the game has never been more balanced at the pro level. It's not QQ to suggest that having a) a year to wait to judge balance, and b) to base it on an arbitrary measure of points won at tournaments, is silly. I agreed and argued that the game was as balanced as it has been several months ago. The recent Aligulac clearly shows that the trend is changing. First of all, that report represents a short time period so you can't draw conclusions from it. Second, it shows all matchups within a rounded +5/-5, which is Blizzard's target and probably corresponds to the margin of error. +-2 is better than +-5. They had +-2 made some changes and now they have +-5. Over year ago they had all matchups at 50% and then decided to buff quenns. The queen buff was required since back then all the terran needed to do was park a couple hellions near the natural of the zerg and it would take ages just to get a third since nothing could kill them and if you chased them, they would run in your base and roast your drones by the time you get back. We had 2base zerg vs 3base terran for gods sake. lol what a load of shit, that never happened to good zergs before the patch. Was going to say a nicer version of what you said. I played Zerg for a good chunk of 2011 and early 2012 and never had that issue. All you had to do was make a couple roaches and then take your third. Plus the whole runby issue was solved with a simple wall, something a ton of zergs were starting to do back then until the queen buff hit. The queen buff didn't even start the mass queen opening that people started associating with it, Losira was doing 6 queen openings in late 2011 with a ton of success. All the queen buff did was let bad Zerg players get away with being way greedier than their skill would have previously allowed them to. It's kind of analogous to the oracle buff in a way. Good players could already keep their oracles alive longer, the speed boost just lets worse Protoss keep their oracle alive when they would not have been able to before. It doesn't help them improve, it does the opposite.
Yes, I am a Protoss, and yes I hate the oracle buff. It has kinda ruined PvP and since I don't ever use them in PvT it doesn't help me in any way.
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Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally.
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On December 03 2013 05:17 Lock0n wrote:
Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally.
Storm will likely never be nerfed tbh If anything, they will buff terran lategame in some way to deal with it, and it'll likely be a mech buff considering the balance team seems to love mech so much. Terran should never win even-economy late games with bio against colossus-storm-archon deathball anyway, problem is it's hard for them to transition, and not much to transition TO (late game switch to mech is laughable)
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On December 03 2013 05:24 ffadicted wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 05:17 Lock0n wrote:
Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally. Storm will likely never be nerfed tbh If anything, they will buff terran lategame in some way to deal with it, and it'll likely be a mech buff considering the balance team seems to love mech so much. Terran should never win even-economy late games with bio against colossus-storm-archon deathball anyway, problem is it's hard for them to transition, and not much to transition TO (late game switch to mech is laughable)
Balance team loves mech? Then how come it's never been viable?
If anything an appropriate lategame balancing move would be to de-nerf ghost EMP AOE, either to where it was before the nerf or somewhere inbetween. Many korean terrans dont even bother with ghosts atm.
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If the balance team loves mech so much, then maybe the big buff to mech they announced with HotS shouldn't have been a nerf to mech.
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I meant balance team is in love with trying to get mech to be good again lol my bad for not being clear on that one
On December 03 2013 05:50 Bagi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 05:24 ffadicted wrote:On December 03 2013 05:17 Lock0n wrote:
Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally. Storm will likely never be nerfed tbh If anything, they will buff terran lategame in some way to deal with it, and it'll likely be a mech buff considering the balance team seems to love mech so much. Terran should never win even-economy late games with bio against colossus-storm-archon deathball anyway, problem is it's hard for them to transition, and not much to transition TO (late game switch to mech is laughable) Balance team loves mech? Then how come it's never been viable? If anything an appropriate lategame balancing move would be to de-nerf ghost EMP AOE, either to where it was before the nerf or somewhere inbetween. Many korean terrans dont even bother with ghosts atm.
Buffing EMP not really the way to go, I don't like the idea of matchup specific "bandaid" fixes (I'm looking at you spore crawler lol). Plus, the whole EMP vs. Feedback battle already has way too much of an impact on late game TvP
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On December 02 2013 20:05 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 19:30 chairmobile wrote:
Hey guys, what do you do to counter mass blink stalker? I'm not saying OP - I literally don't know what the answer to it is. I try mass speedling, but that doesn't work too well against a bunch of stalkers, and on maps like Daybreak where the 3rd is pretty choked, roaches don't do so well either. Hydras? Fungal Growth prevents blink micro and enables your roaches and lings to quickly dispatch of the stalkers.
Will try, thanks!
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On December 03 2013 06:09 ffadicted wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 05:50 Bagi wrote:On December 03 2013 05:24 ffadicted wrote:On December 03 2013 05:17 Lock0n wrote:
Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally. Storm will likely never be nerfed tbh If anything, they will buff terran lategame in some way to deal with it, and it'll likely be a mech buff considering the balance team seems to love mech so much. Terran should never win even-economy late games with bio against colossus-storm-archon deathball anyway, problem is it's hard for them to transition, and not much to transition TO (late game switch to mech is laughable) Balance team loves mech? Then how come it's never been viable? If anything an appropriate lategame balancing move would be to de-nerf ghost EMP AOE, either to where it was before the nerf or somewhere inbetween. Many korean terrans dont even bother with ghosts atm. Buffing EMP not really the way to go, I don't like the idea of matchup specific "bandaid" fixes (I'm looking at you spore crawler lol). Plus, the whole EMP vs. Feedback battle already has way too much of an impact on late game TvP
How is buffing EMP not the way to go? If there's an easy solution that doesn't affect other match-ups then you would be an idiot not to take it. Its not like even creating weird new rules like with the spore crawler case.
I mean, nerfing EMP sure seemed to be the way to go to buff protoss at in PvT at one point where it was struggling. Why not the opposite?
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On December 03 2013 06:56 Bagi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 06:09 ffadicted wrote:On December 03 2013 05:50 Bagi wrote:On December 03 2013 05:24 ffadicted wrote:On December 03 2013 05:17 Lock0n wrote:
Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally. Storm will likely never be nerfed tbh If anything, they will buff terran lategame in some way to deal with it, and it'll likely be a mech buff considering the balance team seems to love mech so much. Terran should never win even-economy late games with bio against colossus-storm-archon deathball anyway, problem is it's hard for them to transition, and not much to transition TO (late game switch to mech is laughable) Balance team loves mech? Then how come it's never been viable? If anything an appropriate lategame balancing move would be to de-nerf ghost EMP AOE, either to where it was before the nerf or somewhere inbetween. Many korean terrans dont even bother with ghosts atm. Buffing EMP not really the way to go, I don't like the idea of matchup specific "bandaid" fixes (I'm looking at you spore crawler lol). Plus, the whole EMP vs. Feedback battle already has way too much of an impact on late game TvP How is buffing EMP not the way to go? If there's an easy solution that doesn't affect other match-ups then you would be an idiot not to take it. Its not like even creating weird new rules like with the spore crawler case. I mean, nerfing EMP sure seemed to be the way to go to buff protoss at in PvT at one point where it was struggling. Why not the opposite?
I'd like snipe to be easier to use.... it seems too easy to get mixed up with the previous move or attack command when you're trying to queue up snipes from time to time. (Maybe that's just me being bad.)
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On December 03 2013 06:56 Bagi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2013 06:09 ffadicted wrote:On December 03 2013 05:50 Bagi wrote:On December 03 2013 05:24 ffadicted wrote:On December 03 2013 05:17 Lock0n wrote:
Have people seen the latest Aligulac balance report: It looks like there's a significant advantage for Protoss in the TvP matchup now at 55% win rate. The oracle change may have affected this, but it seems like a ton of pros are opening with oracles then transitioning into high templar.
At least, it looks like Blizzard will finally have to address the Protoss deathball and the hit a few late game storms and win mechanics in TvP finally. Storm will likely never be nerfed tbh If anything, they will buff terran lategame in some way to deal with it, and it'll likely be a mech buff considering the balance team seems to love mech so much. Terran should never win even-economy late games with bio against colossus-storm-archon deathball anyway, problem is it's hard for them to transition, and not much to transition TO (late game switch to mech is laughable) Balance team loves mech? Then how come it's never been viable? If anything an appropriate lategame balancing move would be to de-nerf ghost EMP AOE, either to where it was before the nerf or somewhere inbetween. Many korean terrans dont even bother with ghosts atm. Buffing EMP not really the way to go, I don't like the idea of matchup specific "bandaid" fixes (I'm looking at you spore crawler lol). Plus, the whole EMP vs. Feedback battle already has way too much of an impact on late game TvP How is buffing EMP not the way to go? If there's an easy solution that doesn't affect other match-ups then you would be an idiot not to take it. Its not like even creating weird new rules like with the spore crawler case. I mean, nerfing EMP sure seemed to be the way to go to buff protoss at in PvT at one point where it was struggling. Why not the opposite?
Buffing EMP is such a short-sighted bandaid fix. It does nothing for the matchup. It leaves it in the sh*thole it is, does nothing to add more dynamic to it, and it will remain as stale as ever while MAYBE inching the matchup a bit closer to 50% in the most boring way.
Let's try to do something better imo
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EPT
