EPTTiG Opinion Article on NASL Situation - Page 29
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toadyy
United Kingdom179 Posts
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Korlinni
125 Posts
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On August 13 2011 20:02 Korlinni wrote: Not really fair to accommodate for a good playing time for koreans when the league is not based in korea. I stay up till 8am sometimes to watch the GSL. Why don't they go and do it at 5pm my time instead? Again, wouldn't like 8am KST have been a better choice for NASL to do. Unless 3pm PST is too late/early for them lol. Accommodating for viewers is different than players. You don't need mental fortitude to watch GSL at 6 am, nor is anything on the line for you. They already do a decent job of scheduling foreigner matches in GSL around midnight CDT/CST. | ||
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:18 Carush wrote: meh i don't see why this is nasl's fault international flights are absurdly expensive and it just kinda sucks that way :/ yep 1000 for every player is rly enough ... i mean sure koreans also have to pay their "own" money but with everyone at least get 1k they will make a +, and if you say "3 months and only a few dollar" well its the CHANCE not more not less. ask puma i am sure he was confident with his price on NASL | ||
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two.watup
United States371 Posts
Koreans are guests. | ||
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Chenz
Sweden1197 Posts
Since the NASL isn't aired live, there really shouldn't be a problem accommodating things like this. | ||
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two.watup
United States371 Posts
On August 13 2011 20:30 Chenz wrote: I really don't understand why they can't let the Koreans play at reasonable times. A Korean player facing a US player? Play at 12:00 PM KST, which means the time is somewhere between 6:00 and 9:00 in the US. A Korean player facing a European player? Play at 9:00 PM KST, which means the time in Europe is about 12:00 PM. Since the NASL isn't aired live, there really shouldn't be a problem accommodating things like this. Korean time is 13 hours ahead of Eastern US, and 16 hours ahead of pacific. NASL is casted and recorded Live, in studio. You're asking them to change their entire system, or stay until 8PM to start matches at a studio during the week. Imagine if your boss told you that you now start work at 8PM. Korean vs Euro doesn't look like as much of a problem unless they go to sleep incredibly early. | ||
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Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
On August 13 2011 20:40 two.watup wrote: Korean time is 13 hours ahead of Eastern US, and 16 hours ahead of pacific. NASL is casted and recorded Live, in studio. You're asking them to change their entire system, or stay until 8PM to start matches at a studio during the week. Imagine if your boss told you that you now start work at 8PM. Korean vs Euro doesn't look like as much of a problem unless they go to sleep incredibly early. That's NASL's problem. It's their terrible format that causes the scheduling problems. After watching s1, I really don't see the point in casting the matches 'live' anymore, when you're not broadcasting live anyhow. Just do it from replays and everyone wins. Players get to play at decent times, casters get to cast at decent times, and production will benefit from it (cast in sequence instead of spoiling match 2-3-4-5 in the first match of the night that for some reason was recorded last.). NASL being casted 'live' doesn't add anything, it's just stupid at this point. | ||
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nanaoei
3358 Posts
On August 13 2011 20:40 two.watup wrote: Korean time is 13 hours ahead of Eastern US, and 16 hours ahead of pacific. NASL is casted and recorded Live, in studio. You're asking them to change their entire system, or stay until 8PM to start matches at a studio during the week. Imagine if your boss told you that you now start work at 8PM. Korean vs Euro doesn't look like as much of a problem unless they go to sleep incredibly early. that, and as far as i can remember, they had players from different regions mixed into each play-day obviously meaning you cant have every bo1 at that same 12pm-4pm KST with all the other games coming after them on each and every week day | ||
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Chenz
Sweden1197 Posts
On August 13 2011 20:40 two.watup wrote: Korean time is 13 hours ahead of Eastern US, and 16 hours ahead of pacific. NASL is casted and recorded Live, in studio. You're asking them to change their entire system, or stay until 8PM to start matches at a studio during the week. Imagine if your boss told you that you now start work at 8PM. Korean vs Euro doesn't look like as much of a problem unless they go to sleep incredibly early. Aye, my mistake on the time difference between the US and Korea, but it would still be possible. Changing from casting live and casting replays wouldn't be hard at all, and for us viewers it would be exactly the same as it is now, assuming the casters aren't aware of the results beforehand. If their current system isn't working, it's obvious changes has to be made. On August 13 2011 20:55 nanaoei wrote: that, and as far as i can remember, they had players from different regions mixed into each play-day obviously meaning you cant have every bo1 at that same 12pm-4pm KST with all the other games coming after them on each and every week day Matches from the same play-day aren't all recorded at the same day. Match 1 and 3 in group A might have been played Monday the week before, while match 2 might have been played Wednesday the week before. This is how they currently do it. | ||
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JesusOurSaviour
United Arab Emirates1141 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:31 T0fuuu wrote: Uh too much drama over this. Summary is. Some kr teams cant afford participating in NASL -> all teams threaten to withdraw from nasl if travel expenses arent paid -> NASL wont budge -> Kr teams withdraw then bitch online about the deposits and unfairness. Just let the koreans stand by their decision and hopefully by season 3 when they realise puma has been paid and their deposits from season 1 returned, that they were silly to not paricipate in season 2 because now the prize is doubled and staying in the leaugue itself would of paid for itself. This. Money is all people want these days. $$$. A humble student like me just wants to watch Kr v Foreigners (rooting for foreigners to pull off huge upsets ofcourse ~~) Yea two seasons later the Kr's will be regretting their decision. I see the US community a very viable market even without the Korean hype. | ||
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echO [W]
United States1495 Posts
On August 13 2011 21:09 JesusOurSaviour wrote: This. Money is all people want these days. $$$. A humble student like me just wants to watch Kr v Foreigners (rooting for foreigners to pull off huge upsets ofcourse ~~) Yea two seasons later the Kr's will be regretting their decision. I see the US community a very viable market even without the Korean hype. There is one more thing to this, the fact that some of the Koreans have signed contracts and are now breaking them. It's one thing to complain and object to NASL, the league, it's practices, and it's requirements to play in the league, it's another thing to participate in qualifiers, and sign contracts and then back out at the last minute. | ||
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Vinski
505 Posts
On August 13 2011 20:17 CoR wrote: yep 1000 for every player is rly enough ... i mean sure koreans also have to pay their "own" money but with everyone at least get 1k they will make a +, and if you say "3 months and only a few dollar" well its the CHANCE not more not less. ask puma i am sure he was confident with his price on NASL I agree entirely. I also agree with what someone else said earlier how about we pay them to come over and live in a flat for a few months like our players do to get into Code A which some aren't even in. You have to spend money to make money in this world and if you want to compete in the biggest tournaments you should not be asking them to pay for you to play in it. Even though Koreans are the best really seems bad of the teams to act like all of them will make it into the final 16. As much as I like having the best players face of against the best players and how that helps e-sports. But when people are trying to take of other people hurts e-sports more than best verse best would help. | ||
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DjSpectre
United States62 Posts
Further, the times for the online qualifiers and such are in American times because this is in America. People here have lives and jobs too and running an event that's convenient for Korean's entirely alienates the events host country. I don't see any Korean tournaments catering to the U.S. times that are convenient, so what are they bitching about? | ||
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Krehlmar
Sweden1149 Posts
On August 13 2011 22:27 DjSpectre wrote: This is an american tournament, we run it as we see we need, flaws and all. If the Korean's didn't like it the first time, maybe they should have only sent 1 team the second time around instead of all of them. That way the cost is lower for them, NASL would be more willing to accomodate them and the Korean's could see what has improved since the last time. If it hasn't, then they've put an minimal investment, but if it has, then they can send a full force of teams in Season 3 and NASL might be less rigid. Plus more money will be present also. Further, the times for the online qualifiers and such are in American times because this is in America. People here have lives and jobs too and running an event that's convenient for Korean's entirely alienates the events host country. I don't see any Korean tournaments catering to the U.S. times that are convenient, so what are they bitching about? Well you can go hug your flag mate, it won't bring viewers to your precious tournament either way and it won't live without those "bitching" koreans. | ||
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DexVitality
Hong Kong234 Posts
However I was kind of shocked when the article pointed out that players didnt get their security checks and prize money checks??? So has Puma gotten his money? or is it just a few players? This is pretty serious if any player didn't get their money back so I would think this is NASL's fault there. I personally think that NASL providing the players with $2000 travel expenses seems fair to me though, I do not really like how the Koreans demand for full payment for the travel costs though, I do not feel that Korean's should get special treatment, if NASL were to provide full travel costs for Koreans what about the Europeans who will most likely pay the same amount to go themselves... | ||
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FunnelC4kes
Ireland462 Posts
1. $500 deposit: There is no other league that asks for a deposit. Saying it is for accountability is a bit of a blow to the pride of the teams. You're effectively saying you don't trust them. Whether you mean it like that is beside the question. Sure, you pay a deposit when you rent a property (car, room, house), but an appointment is not the same. You could say "hey, if you miss your games, we'll apply a penalty of $XX to any possible winnings." Problem solved. $500 is a lot of money, as well, especially if what they say about lack of sponsorship is true. That's quite a burden. 2. 2 am Games... well, everybody brings this up. Yeah, a bit better than 4am games, but... some players last season were forced to wait 4 hours to play their games. This probably isn't a deal breaker, but for those who had to wait up all night, that leaves a bitter taste in their mouth. NASL could mediate times for players to play, and request replay 48 hours in advance of filming... or on a certain day of the week---like Friday the week before filming. Though I don't think this is a deal-breaker, but I could understand if this makes Koreans feel like their getting the short end of the stick. But, NASL, despite having growing pains in the first season, was entertaining to watch. Casting got better through the season, production became much more stable (though quality of games were.... so so--until the FINALS! BEST GAMES EVAR!!!1!!). I want the NASL to succeed, but doing some things differently is not always a step in the right direction. Just my 2 cents. I'm willing to bet if NASL asked SK managers "what would it take to get your players into our league?" these two points would likely come up. Cheers, and Good luck on another successful season! | ||
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Longshank
1648 Posts
On August 13 2011 22:40 DexVitality wrote:However I was kind of shocked when the article pointed out that players didnt get their security checks and prize money checks??? So has Puma gotten his money? or is it just a few players? This is pretty serious if any player didn't get their money back so I would think this is NASL's fault there. Some teams, wemadeFOX for example, have gotten their deposits other haven't. It was agreed that they would pay the money within two months and they will keep that promise. I don't know why the Koreans are crying about this now, two months haven't passed yet. Know that it takes some time for all tournaments to pay the price money, there's nothing odd about it. It can take some months like with GSL, MLG, Dreamhack(afaik) or even years like with IEM. | ||
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Longshank
1648 Posts
On August 13 2011 22:49 FunnelC4kes wrote: I really can't help but think that there is two big hurdles: 1. $500 deposit: There is no other league that asks for a deposit. Saying it is for accountability is a bit of a blow to the pride of the teams. You're effectively saying you don't trust them. Whether you mean it like that is beside the question. Sure, you pay a deposit when you rent a property (car, room, house), but an appointment is not the same. You could say "hey, if you miss your games, we'll apply a penalty of $XX to any possible winnings." Problem solved. $500 is a lot of money, as well, especially if what they say about lack of sponsorship is true. That's quite a burden. Well to be frank, season 1 proved that progamers can't be trusted. Painuser didn't care for showing up for his games and White-Ra forgetting/decided to go partying instead, just to name a few. If you can't trust Sir MannerToss then who can you trust? | ||
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iamthedave
England2814 Posts
On August 13 2011 22:30 Krehlmar wrote: Well you can go hug your flag mate, it won't bring viewers to your precious tournament either way and it won't live without those "bitching" koreans. It'll get lots of viewers when Idra plays, at least. To be honest the exodus of the Koreans now opens up something new for us to pay attention to: how does their absence affect viewers, if it all? I seem to recall the average broadcast hit 8-10k (bit less than Idra or Destiny's streams), and the finals were way up. MLG certainly believed the presence of the Koreans brought in enough money to justify the effort to get them over. Maybe NASL will come to the same conclusion? | ||
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