EPTBut I dont understand why its so objectionable that someone wants to make a living out of esports. I mean, can we expect everyone to do tourneys and leagues as voluntary community work, without any profit? If so, you can't really complain about bad production or other standards. Isnt esport trying to be a semi serious sport, with sponsors, public recognition and the lot, not just a kids game?
MLG Potential Prize Pool Increase - Page 22
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Marooned
Norway161 Posts
But I dont understand why its so objectionable that someone wants to make a living out of esports. I mean, can we expect everyone to do tourneys and leagues as voluntary community work, without any profit? If so, you can't really complain about bad production or other standards. Isnt esport trying to be a semi serious sport, with sponsors, public recognition and the lot, not just a kids game? | ||
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Buckus
United States14 Posts
On July 29 2011 14:40 MisterFred wrote: Ok, so we have a yearly budget of $50 million dollars a year, give or take $15 million. So for prize pools to be 1% of their total budget, they'd need to be giving out $500,000 in total prize pool. Grand total prize pool for SC2 in 2011: $170,000 dollars. So if prize pools for the other games combined are greater than $330,000 dollars (and they may well be, MLG pays them way more per viewer than SC2), then MLG pays somewhere between 1-2% of their budget to prize pool. If total prize pools for other games combined are greater than $330,000 dollars, then MLG probably is paying less than 1% of their budget as prize pool. Suck on math, bitches. For the record, I hope MLG does well & raises their prize pools. And I plan to enjoy watching their tournament. Hell Sundance, worry not, I'll buy a few Dr. Peppers I wouldn't have. But I'm not going to pretend SC2 pros aren't getting a raw deal for the second year in a row. Edit: nor should the community demand companies give a certain % of their budget or profit to prize pools. But I still refuse to call $5,000 for first prize a major tournament. The championship will be a major tournament. This is a sponsor fest or minor circuit event. /Edit But if you want to support SC2 e-sports on a budget, watch the standard MLG stream and buy a computer peripheral from a sponsor of your favorite team. Sponsorships are why your favorite players show up to Anaheim. not sure where you are getting you numbers from but if you look at the prize pools for just sc2, the national event alone has 120,000 plus 14000x5 (the prize pool for an event, times the amount of events not counting nationals) 70000, 120000 + 70000 = 190000, This is just for sc2 alone, counting the rest of the numbers (each game at all events), it equals 750000 (Not counting Halo reach nationals, I could not find numbers for it and didnt want to guess) The 750000, is all games at every event, plus the final national prize pool for the games. ( as stated not counting halo reachs, National numbers) Plus MLG gives each "PRO" 400 dollars per event. But just say we give Halo Reaches National numbers, sc2s (120000) We are looking at minimum 870000 in prize money.(+400 per pro, per event) all this means buy the pass, they need more money to raise prize pools =) | ||
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Sabu113
United States11071 Posts
It's already a pretty competitive marketplace for my StarCraft Dollar. $10 for the GSL -Tournament with the highest caliber play and best players if a bit Terran heavy. $25 -3 months of the GSTL - See some stars who have not yet broken through in the GSL. Support your "club" team. (Never bought this so my sales pitch might not be that great) NASL -3 months of 5 games a day 4(?) days a week with an adequate guest commentators from time to time. MLG 3 days every few months of some of the best StarCraft -$15 a tournament I think guessing 2 tournes during the 3 month period? Bonus is that it attracts Top end Euros and more than few watchable Terrans. Most koreans of any major offlineforeign tourny. DreamHack -Free largest tourne in Europe with the top NA players fewer koreans IEM -$10 for pass? Major Euro tournament Homestory - Whatever you feel guilty enough to pay. - Excellent tournament with possibly the best commentary. Also not the norm and not expected to be the norm. That's not chump change when I used to go to youtube for BW. To be fair ofc, the production and quality is much higher and it helps grow the scene. At the same time, there are other forms of entertainment I want to consume and only so much utility to be gained from purchasing the marginal SC tournament. And to put everything into context, I am a diehard manchester united fan, but I've spent more on StarCraft than I have spent on any pay per view in total. | ||
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Terminal
United Kingdom2109 Posts
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FunnelC4kes
Ireland462 Posts
On July 30 2011 06:24 Terminal wrote: Unfortunately mlg screwed EU this time around, so they won't be breaking any record numbers. Yeah. definitely going to miss first day--wtf starting at 01:00 IST? boo  | ||
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Slider954
United States342 Posts
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PresenceSc2
Australia4032 Posts
On July 30 2011 02:41 SundanceMLG wrote: Months ago you gave me shit about the prize pool and now I'm putting a simple and obtainable goal out there for the entire community and you give me shit again - and that's fine. I still respect you and appreciate what you've done and will continue to do for the scene. My question is this - if the number was 50,000 would you take an issue with my approach? How about 15,000? What if I didn't say a thing and just watched my spreadsheets populate with numbers and kept the community in the dark? Shouldn't the people who love this have some insight into what is needed for success? You're either in or you're out. $30 a year from 100,000 people makes this company a real business and not just a passion project from a guy with a hippy name who refuses to quit. $30 a year from 10,000 people means that we're all wrong and there isn't enough fan support to sustain a business of scale. Less than a dime a day from less than 10% of the people who visit our site over the course of an event weekend allows me to flip a switch and change next year to a structure that supports 24 live events & 28 meaningful ladders. 52 competitions with nearly 2 million dollars of prize money and stipends. Again - I don't care if you think I'm an asshole or a money grubbing prick. I just want to find out if what we do is actually meaningful to enough of you to step up. Don't worry. Im sure that like every other time he does something stupid, he will say he regrets saying/doing that. | ||
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TooN
1046 Posts
On July 30 2011 05:25 iNcontroL wrote: No. When you get more money you reinvest in areas that need imporovement first. The current prizepool doesn't alienate anyone. If they hit 100k dubs they won't be like " finally! Now that we raised 30 million dollars we can increase the prize pool 10k " if you think thatnus how it works you are A Damn fool My math might be wrong but I don't think 100,000 subscribtion equals 30 million. You hate on TotalBiscuit, now Sundance. Maybe you should protest your beliefs and not participate in any MLG. I'm sure Jesus would approve of Sundance and eSports. | ||
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Nesto
Switzerland1318 Posts
So why not, support a company with 30 bucks, that promots e-sports with very professional 3 day events, which may draw additional sponsors into eSports and which might in the end increase "Inc's much needed" prizepool money anyway. In comparison, I dumped 25 dollars into NASL and got an embarassing facepalm finals event. I don't think any company, that watched that trainwreck is considering investing a dollar into eSports. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On July 30 2011 06:26 Slider954 wrote: And for all the people that are saying $5000 is a low prize, thats all on Blizzard, that is limit they place on all SC2 tourneys unless the tournament organizers go thru a ton of hoops for each time they want to award more than 5g. 5k is only for first place. -_- They already have to deal with Blizzard. MLG is a poor example of what you are trying to argue, lol. I do agree that it is bullocks that Blizzard takes a huge cut into the proceeds when it goes over that though. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On July 30 2011 06:13 Vadrigar wrote: My response is to Sundance's response (which is in OP's post) to Incontrol's response. How is that unrelated?  1. You didn't read the thread. 2. Look at the first 7 words of your other post. 3. Need I say more? | ||
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Maliris
Northern Ireland2557 Posts
On July 30 2011 05:41 Serene wrote: To Malaris* - Matter of opinion here. I watched both and enjoyed watching MLG by far, Columbus that is. But it's my opinion and I concede that fantastic may have been an inaccurate choice of words. except it's not a matter of opinion, Dreamhack's production was systematically superior to MLGs.. whether you liked MLG better or not is irrelevant to the topic at hand. | ||
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sekalf
Sweden522 Posts
I used to be such a huge fan, but these strange comments you are making lately is really making me confused. Why the hate? | ||
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Maliris
Northern Ireland2557 Posts
On July 30 2011 06:41 sekalf wrote: Incontrol you are making me a bit sad. I used to be such a huge fan, but these strange comments you are making lately is really making me confused. Why the hate? This is who incontrol really is mate lol, he has been like this since BW. It can only be a good thing that he shows his true colours so people know how to judge him. | ||
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sanddbox_tl
United States20 Posts
On July 30 2011 06:41 sekalf wrote: Incontrol you are making me a bit sad. I used to be such a huge fan, but these strange comments you are making lately is really making me confused. Why the hate? Incontrol has always been like that; he's pretty much the only "professional" gamer that I actually hate as a person. | ||
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Slider954
United States342 Posts
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ixi.genocide
United States981 Posts
On July 30 2011 02:41 SundanceMLG wrote: Months ago you gave me shit about the prize pool and now I'm putting a simple and obtainable goal out there for the entire community and you give me shit again - and that's fine. I still respect you and appreciate what you've done and will continue to do for the scene. My question is this - if the number was 50,000 would you take an issue with my approach? How about 15,000? What if I didn't say a thing and just watched my spreadsheets populate with numbers and kept the community in the dark? Shouldn't the people who love this have some insight into what is needed for success? You're either in or you're out. $30 a year from 100,000 people makes this company a real business and not just a passion project from a guy with a hippy name who refuses to quit. $30 a year from 10,000 people means that we're all wrong and there isn't enough fan support to sustain a business of scale. Less than a dime a day from less than 10% of the people who visit our site over the course of an event weekend allows me to flip a switch and change next year to a structure that supports 24 live events & 28 meaningful ladders. 52 competitions with nearly 2 million dollars of prize money and stipends. Again - I don't care if you think I'm an asshole or a money grubbing prick. I just want to find out if what we do is actually meaningful to enough of you to step up. I would suspect that columbus's success was slightly (at least) limited by the technical difficulties of Dallas'. What do you expect to see in anaheim? | ||
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Maliris
Northern Ireland2557 Posts
On July 30 2011 06:44 Slider954 wrote: Yes it is a matter of opinion, you cant decide for somebody if they feel something is better than something else. That's THEIR opinion. You have no empirical data to back up your claim that DH's "production was systematically superior to MLGs". Just cause you or other people say it was doesn't make it fact. better sound, better quality, player interviews post-game, better shots of the players in the booths, better coverage, a lot less downtime and a lot less advertisements too. how is that NOT superior? what does MLG do better? The difference between my points and yours are mine are backed up by empirical evidence and you just give your opinion | ||
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Aurdon
United States2007 Posts
On July 30 2011 05:30 iNcontroL wrote: Not sure why hyping nasl means i cannot be critical of other leagues. When i encouraged people to support nasl I said so we can do more of them... Not to raise the prizepool. Read syndances post... He essentially meant to say "so we can do more mlgs" not anything about the prizepool. I think when you posted this on twitter: @Hot_Bid @LiquidRet pretty classy when an organizer of TSL3 openly criticizes another league! Grow up Ken. Wed Jun 22 21:10:02 +0000 2011 That's why people are taking offense to what you are doing. You can't go criticizing other people and then complain when others do it. | ||
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TooN
1046 Posts
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