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On July 20 2011 21:41 opisska wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2011 21:02 Morfildur wrote:On July 20 2011 20:50 opisska wrote:
People should never be sued, investigated, threatened byt the police etc... for anything they say, be it in person, on the internet, anywhere. The sad fact is, that this is definitely not the case in most of the so called "developed" countries. There is almost no place on the Earth where really free speech could be found.
I was once taken to the police because of a man, who - strangely enough - has said much worse things than about me than I have about him. Luckily, the policemen were reasonable and the case was quickly abandoned and I was suggested to sue him back. But I would never do that, I would feel like the silliest person ever.
Please, everyone out there, be reasonable and do not ever sue/report to the police/whatever other people for anything they say. You may have the right given to you by law, but you should understand that it is fundamentally wrong and refrain from using it. Do not let our freedom of speech be decided by lawyers. Oh, so it's ok that i tell everyone you know that you drink a bottle of whisky every evening before going to bed and you bring a flask full of booze to work and drink from it secretly every time you go to the bathroom... oh, and that when you had your LSD trip, you slept with the girlfriend of your best friend? Oh, and don't forget that time you raped that girl after the disco, lucky she didn't recognize you and you didn't get caught... It's true, really. You told me all that when you were drunk 2 nights ago. Well, the point is: Things you say can have serious influences on how other people see the person you are talking about. It starts with little things like "Yeah, that girl puts out with anyone who asks" which can destroy the reputation of a perfectly fine person and cause serious mental issues. I'm not even talking about the worst stuff someone could say. Words have power, just because you know they are wrong doesn't mean others won't perceive you differently if someone says something about you. You have to fight it or you get destroyed by them as they will follow you for your whole life. Or people can just learn not to believe anything they hear? I have had endless hours of this argument with my friends and many of them would say exactly what you did. But it's not about "I will just start saying aything". When what i call "true freedom of speech" is established, people will start to realize, that words being simply thrown around do not mean anything. Actually, I argue that in such a world it would be easier for people to handle bad things being said about them. Without the presumption that any wrongful statements would be fought against by their subject, it is less likely that they are taken seriously. I am sorry for starting a debate that is slightly off-topic, but I felt that the sheer amount of "oh yeah, Korea is so great for beating internet trolls" has to be balanced somehow.
so everyone should waste time fighting wrong statements? that's the ideal internet for you? because just because the target and the perpetrator know certain statements are wrong doesn't mean everyone else does.
freedom of speech doesn't justify the targeted harassment in this case, nor should it justify any crude, explicit attack on a person in any other case. i don't agree with jessica's methods by which she puts these tweets for all to see and fueling the flames, but the underlying reasons for doing this is not an overreaction.
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On July 20 2011 21:41 opisska wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2011 21:02 Morfildur wrote:On July 20 2011 20:50 opisska wrote:
People should never be sued, investigated, threatened byt the police etc... for anything they say, be it in person, on the internet, anywhere. The sad fact is, that this is definitely not the case in most of the so called "developed" countries. There is almost no place on the Earth where really free speech could be found.
I was once taken to the police because of a man, who - strangely enough - has said much worse things than about me than I have about him. Luckily, the policemen were reasonable and the case was quickly abandoned and I was suggested to sue him back. But I would never do that, I would feel like the silliest person ever.
Please, everyone out there, be reasonable and do not ever sue/report to the police/whatever other people for anything they say. You may have the right given to you by law, but you should understand that it is fundamentally wrong and refrain from using it. Do not let our freedom of speech be decided by lawyers. Oh, so it's ok that i tell everyone you know that you drink a bottle of whisky every evening before going to bed and you bring a flask full of booze to work and drink from it secretly every time you go to the bathroom... oh, and that when you had your LSD trip, you slept with the girlfriend of your best friend? Oh, and don't forget that time you raped that girl after the disco, lucky she didn't recognize you and you didn't get caught... It's true, really. You told me all that when you were drunk 2 nights ago. Well, the point is: Things you say can have serious influences on how other people see the person you are talking about. It starts with little things like "Yeah, that girl puts out with anyone who asks" which can destroy the reputation of a perfectly fine person and cause serious mental issues. I'm not even talking about the worst stuff someone could say. Words have power, just because you know they are wrong doesn't mean others won't perceive you differently if someone says something about you. You have to fight it or you get destroyed by them as they will follow you for your whole life. Or people can just learn not to believe anything they hear? I have had endless hours of this argument with my friends and many of them would say exactly what you did. But it's not about "I will just start saying aything". When what i call "true freedom of speech" is established, people will start to realize, that words being simply thrown around do not mean anything. Actually, I argue that in such a world it would be easier for people to handle bad things being said about them. Without the presumption that any wrongful statements would be fought against by their subject, it is less likely that they are taken seriously. I am sorry for starting a debate that is slightly off-topic, but I felt that the sheer amount of "oh yeah, Korea is so great for beating internet trolls" has to be balanced somehow.
Yet in truth what people say has great impact upon one's image, that image, the reputation is the immortal part of man. Because that reputation is important. It must be protected. True Freedom of Speech. There can be no such thing. Because What people say have weight, that's why there is a limit on what you can say. If what people say has no value (which is why speech is limited) we might as well not speak at all. It's because we encourage truth and punish lies, that our words have weight and value. If I could just throw words at you. My words would just a waste of my time and yours because they have no value.
I prefer value in my words over saying any crap that I want which hold no value
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On July 20 2011 21:49 Blasterion wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2011 21:41 opisska wrote:On July 20 2011 21:02 Morfildur wrote:On July 20 2011 20:50 opisska wrote:
People should never be sued, investigated, threatened byt the police etc... for anything they say, be it in person, on the internet, anywhere. The sad fact is, that this is definitely not the case in most of the so called "developed" countries. There is almost no place on the Earth where really free speech could be found.
I was once taken to the police because of a man, who - strangely enough - has said much worse things than about me than I have about him. Luckily, the policemen were reasonable and the case was quickly abandoned and I was suggested to sue him back. But I would never do that, I would feel like the silliest person ever.
Please, everyone out there, be reasonable and do not ever sue/report to the police/whatever other people for anything they say. You may have the right given to you by law, but you should understand that it is fundamentally wrong and refrain from using it. Do not let our freedom of speech be decided by lawyers. Oh, so it's ok that i tell everyone you know that you drink a bottle of whisky every evening before going to bed and you bring a flask full of booze to work and drink from it secretly every time you go to the bathroom... oh, and that when you had your LSD trip, you slept with the girlfriend of your best friend? Oh, and don't forget that time you raped that girl after the disco, lucky she didn't recognize you and you didn't get caught... It's true, really. You told me all that when you were drunk 2 nights ago. Well, the point is: Things you say can have serious influences on how other people see the person you are talking about. It starts with little things like "Yeah, that girl puts out with anyone who asks" which can destroy the reputation of a perfectly fine person and cause serious mental issues. I'm not even talking about the worst stuff someone could say. Words have power, just because you know they are wrong doesn't mean others won't perceive you differently if someone says something about you. You have to fight it or you get destroyed by them as they will follow you for your whole life. Or people can just learn not to believe anything they hear? I have had endless hours of this argument with my friends and many of them would say exactly what you did. But it's not about "I will just start saying aything". When what i call "true freedom of speech" is established, people will start to realize, that words being simply thrown around do not mean anything. Actually, I argue that in such a world it would be easier for people to handle bad things being said about them. Without the presumption that any wrongful statements would be fought against by their subject, it is less likely that they are taken seriously. I am sorry for starting a debate that is slightly off-topic, but I felt that the sheer amount of "oh yeah, Korea is so great for beating internet trolls" has to be balanced somehow. Yet in truth what people say has great impact upon one's image, that image, the reputation is the immortal part of man. Because that reputation is important. It must be protected. True Freedom of Speech. There can be no such thing. Because What people say have weight, that's why there is a limit on what you can say. If what people say has no value (which is why speech is limited) we might as well not speak at all. It's because we encourage truth and punish lies, that our words have weight and value. If I could just throw words at you. My words would just a waste of my time and yours because they have no value. I prefer value in my words over saying any crap that I want which hold no value
There isn't encouraging truth and punishing lies though, there's encouraging saying nice things (even when quite a bit of it is lies) and punishing anything construed as mean (even when it's true).
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You guys who say this is a Korean phenomenon should take a look at this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberstalking_legislation
Quite a few states in the U.S. have already enacted legislation and several cases have already been prosecuted. The UK has even enacted similar laws.
No one follows the news? I remember "facebook" suicides being covered extensively a few years back.
Of course, unless Eve has been spammed on her twitter page or has an account on these sites where she's being pmed or subjected to some other method of direct abuse, any reaction to peripheral conversations is imo, an overreaction.
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On July 20 2011 21:52 Cathasaigh wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2011 21:49 Blasterion wrote:On July 20 2011 21:41 opisska wrote:On July 20 2011 21:02 Morfildur wrote:On July 20 2011 20:50 opisska wrote:
People should never be sued, investigated, threatened byt the police etc... for anything they say, be it in person, on the internet, anywhere. The sad fact is, that this is definitely not the case in most of the so called "developed" countries. There is almost no place on the Earth where really free speech could be found.
I was once taken to the police because of a man, who - strangely enough - has said much worse things than about me than I have about him. Luckily, the policemen were reasonable and the case was quickly abandoned and I was suggested to sue him back. But I would never do that, I would feel like the silliest person ever.
Please, everyone out there, be reasonable and do not ever sue/report to the police/whatever other people for anything they say. You may have the right given to you by law, but you should understand that it is fundamentally wrong and refrain from using it. Do not let our freedom of speech be decided by lawyers. Oh, so it's ok that i tell everyone you know that you drink a bottle of whisky every evening before going to bed and you bring a flask full of booze to work and drink from it secretly every time you go to the bathroom... oh, and that when you had your LSD trip, you slept with the girlfriend of your best friend? Oh, and don't forget that time you raped that girl after the disco, lucky she didn't recognize you and you didn't get caught... It's true, really. You told me all that when you were drunk 2 nights ago. Well, the point is: Things you say can have serious influences on how other people see the person you are talking about. It starts with little things like "Yeah, that girl puts out with anyone who asks" which can destroy the reputation of a perfectly fine person and cause serious mental issues. I'm not even talking about the worst stuff someone could say. Words have power, just because you know they are wrong doesn't mean others won't perceive you differently if someone says something about you. You have to fight it or you get destroyed by them as they will follow you for your whole life. Or people can just learn not to believe anything they hear? I have had endless hours of this argument with my friends and many of them would say exactly what you did. But it's not about "I will just start saying aything". When what i call "true freedom of speech" is established, people will start to realize, that words being simply thrown around do not mean anything. Actually, I argue that in such a world it would be easier for people to handle bad things being said about them. Without the presumption that any wrongful statements would be fought against by their subject, it is less likely that they are taken seriously. I am sorry for starting a debate that is slightly off-topic, but I felt that the sheer amount of "oh yeah, Korea is so great for beating internet trolls" has to be balanced somehow. Yet in truth what people say has great impact upon one's image, that image, the reputation is the immortal part of man. Because that reputation is important. It must be protected. True Freedom of Speech. There can be no such thing. Because What people say have weight, that's why there is a limit on what you can say. If what people say has no value (which is why speech is limited) we might as well not speak at all. It's because we encourage truth and punish lies, that our words have weight and value. If I could just throw words at you. My words would just a waste of my time and yours because they have no value. I prefer value in my words over saying any crap that I want which hold no value There isn't encouraging truth and punishing lies though, there's encouraging saying nice things (even when quite a bit of it is lies) and punishing anything construed as mean (even when it's true).
But the point it is that what people say has power that's why True Freedom of Speech cannot be allowed. Even you Americans have laws against slander and lies
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Using the coercive power of the state to pursue someone over statements made on the internet is far worse than any wrong that could've provoked it.
And banning speech that is deemed "harmful to another's image or self-esteem" is something out of 1984.
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On July 20 2011 21:54 Blasterion wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2011 21:52 Cathasaigh wrote:On July 20 2011 21:49 Blasterion wrote:On July 20 2011 21:41 opisska wrote:On July 20 2011 21:02 Morfildur wrote:On July 20 2011 20:50 opisska wrote:
People should never be sued, investigated, threatened byt the police etc... for anything they say, be it in person, on the internet, anywhere. The sad fact is, that this is definitely not the case in most of the so called "developed" countries. There is almost no place on the Earth where really free speech could be found.
I was once taken to the police because of a man, who - strangely enough - has said much worse things than about me than I have about him. Luckily, the policemen were reasonable and the case was quickly abandoned and I was suggested to sue him back. But I would never do that, I would feel like the silliest person ever.
Please, everyone out there, be reasonable and do not ever sue/report to the police/whatever other people for anything they say. You may have the right given to you by law, but you should understand that it is fundamentally wrong and refrain from using it. Do not let our freedom of speech be decided by lawyers. Oh, so it's ok that i tell everyone you know that you drink a bottle of whisky every evening before going to bed and you bring a flask full of booze to work and drink from it secretly every time you go to the bathroom... oh, and that when you had your LSD trip, you slept with the girlfriend of your best friend? Oh, and don't forget that time you raped that girl after the disco, lucky she didn't recognize you and you didn't get caught... It's true, really. You told me all that when you were drunk 2 nights ago. Well, the point is: Things you say can have serious influences on how other people see the person you are talking about. It starts with little things like "Yeah, that girl puts out with anyone who asks" which can destroy the reputation of a perfectly fine person and cause serious mental issues. I'm not even talking about the worst stuff someone could say. Words have power, just because you know they are wrong doesn't mean others won't perceive you differently if someone says something about you. You have to fight it or you get destroyed by them as they will follow you for your whole life. Or people can just learn not to believe anything they hear? I have had endless hours of this argument with my friends and many of them would say exactly what you did. But it's not about "I will just start saying aything". When what i call "true freedom of speech" is established, people will start to realize, that words being simply thrown around do not mean anything. Actually, I argue that in such a world it would be easier for people to handle bad things being said about them. Without the presumption that any wrongful statements would be fought against by their subject, it is less likely that they are taken seriously. I am sorry for starting a debate that is slightly off-topic, but I felt that the sheer amount of "oh yeah, Korea is so great for beating internet trolls" has to be balanced somehow. Yet in truth what people say has great impact upon one's image, that image, the reputation is the immortal part of man. Because that reputation is important. It must be protected. True Freedom of Speech. There can be no such thing. Because What people say have weight, that's why there is a limit on what you can say. If what people say has no value (which is why speech is limited) we might as well not speak at all. It's because we encourage truth and punish lies, that our words have weight and value. If I could just throw words at you. My words would just a waste of my time and yours because they have no value. I prefer value in my words over saying any crap that I want which hold no value There isn't encouraging truth and punishing lies though, there's encouraging saying nice things (even when quite a bit of it is lies) and punishing anything construed as mean (even when it's true). But the point it is that what people say has power that's why True Freedom of Speech cannot be allowed. Even you Americans have laws against slander and lies
The laws may exist but they're also incredible hard to prove to prevent too many people suing each other cause of slander and libel. And the bigger issue with this in Korea isn't about lying and telling the truth, cause you don't have to be lying to get in trouble for defamation in Korea.
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seems like jessica is ranting on twitter again:
@SlayerS_Jessica κΉκ°μ°SlayerS_Jessica
λ¨Όμ κ³ μκ΄λ ¨ μ¬μ§μ μ¬λ Έμλ νμλμ νΈμν°κ° 보μ΄μ
¨λ€κ³ κ·Έκ±°λ‘ μ κ° λμ κ³ μλμμλ‘ νμ€μμκ³ μ¬κΈ°μ κΈ°μ κΈμ μ°μ€λ μμ§ν λ§μ΄ νκ°λ¬μ΅λλ€.
νμλμ΄ μ μ νΈμν°λ₯Ό μ 리νμ
μ ν€λ°°μ§μ΄λΌκ³ μΉνλ©° μ¬κΈ°μ μ RTν΄λ¬λΌκ³ κΈμ μ°μ
μ μ κ° μ μ΄λ¦μΌλ‘ κ²μνλ©΄ μ΅κ·Όμ κΈμ΄ μ¬λΌμ΅λλ€.
νμλμ λΉλ‘―νμ¬ μ΅κ·Όμ μ μ΄λ¦μΌλ‘ κΈμ΄κ²μ΄ λ°λ‘보μ΄λκ²μ΄μ§μ,. μ΄λ² κ³ μκ΄λ ¨ν΄μ μλ£λ μν©κ³Ό μ ν© μ€λͺ
μ λͺ¨λ νμν©λλ€. νμ¬ νΈμν°μλ μ΄λ°κΈμ΄ λκ³ μλ€λΌλ μ¬μ€μ μ
μ¦ν΄μΌνμ£
κ·Έλμ μ λͺ¨μ μλ£μ΄κ΅¬μ νμλμ΄ κ·Έκ±Έ 보μκ³ μ κ° λμμλ‘ μ±μ νμ κ±Έλ‘ μΆμΈ‘νμ λ―ν©λλ€. μ μκ² νμΈνμ κ²λ μλλ° κ·Έκ±Έ μ¬κΈ°μ κΈ° νΌνΈλ¦¬λ κ±Έ 보면μ μμ§ν λμ΄ λλ₯Ό λμ΄μλ©΄ λ λν λμμλ‘ λ£μ΄μΌκ²λ€λ μκ°λ νμμ΄μ
μ...λ©μ
μ΄ μλλ€μ¬.. μ.. μ΄μ©μ§?
someone feel free to translate please. im not gonna post google translation. 
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One more tweet:
κ³ μλ μ μ°¨λ₯Ό λ°λμ€μ΄λΌ λ€μμκ°μ΄ 걸립λλ€. μ μΌλ¬΄μΌνμ§ μκΈ°μν΄ μ΅μ μ λ€νκ³ μꡬμ, μ¬λ μ΄μ΄μ€νμ΄ μ΅κ·Όμ λΆμ§νκ±° μ λ λ΅λ΅νκ³ λ§λ μνλλ€.
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Yeah another Twitter spree for Jessica. Usually if you screw around with Hangul on google translator you can figure everything out but I'm not even going to bother with these posts. Just more of the same I'm sure. -.-
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When people believe they have nothing to fear they are truly disgusting creatures. Good to see Jessica standing up and protecting her team members.
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im all for jessica standing up for eve but she has to calm down with what she says in public. shes not handling this professionally even if it seems like it. no need to get haters if not needed.
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Harassment, death threats, and stalking are typically all illegal in most major countries around the world and if she feels the need to exert her right to prosecute them for doing something illegal she should. I mean many people like to believe cyberbullying is fake but it is real, and can have similar results as the real thing, which could lead to way worse crimes.
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On July 21 2011 04:55 P0ckets wrote:
Harassment, death threats, and stalking are typically all illegal in most major countries around the world and if she feels the need to exert her right to prosecute them for doing something illegal she should. I mean many people like to believe cyberbullying is fake but it is real, and can have similar results as the real thing, which could lead to way worse crimes.
It's only as real as the person takes it.
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Somehow I'm starting to lose respect for her.
She handles the whole situation like a maniac / spoilt child - not like a grown, professional woman.
(I'm not saying sueing the photohop guys is bad - just how she's handling it).
@moonmeh:
Thanks for all the translations thus far 
Please keep continueing if you have time (and arent bored to death by it^^)
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that slayerS_jessica girl sucks.. I said something kindly to her on twitter and she "blocked me" I'm all for it, if she's going to be a whiny **** then ***** off **** 
edit: this is me whining about her whining***
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On July 21 2011 04:59 ranshaked wrote:
Fuck whoever that slayerS_jessica bitch is. I said something kindly to her on twitter and she "blocked me" I'm all for it, if she's going to be a whiny cunt about the situation, then she can screw off.
edit: this is me whining about her whining***
I would edit your post if I were you, it's coming off a bit over-board and may garner mod attention. It's also not the best way to get your opinion across.
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On July 21 2011 05:02 Mordiford wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 04:59 ranshaked wrote:
Fuck whoever that slayerS_jessica bitch is. I said something kindly to her on twitter and she "blocked me" I'm all for it, if she's going to be a whiny cunt about the situation, then she can screw off.
edit: this is me whining about her whining*** I would edit your post if I were you, it's coming off a bit over-board and may garner mod attention. It's also not the best way to get your opinion across.
I could care less, I hate being disrespected and she did that. Then again, she sounds like a stuck up bitch.
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From skim reading stuff so far, standing up for player on your team. Good for her
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EPT
