EPTbegin the game of pong
The Official Live On Three Thread - Page 23
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joinDota
Germany41 Posts
begin the game of pong | ||
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Yeaaaah
Belarus27 Posts
What do you want me to say ? It's a world of adult you're living in. And as they say : "If you can't take the heat : get out of the kitchen" If you know of any rethorical way of kindly saying to somebody that he sux at what he does without hurting him, I'm all ears. Unless you're implying that people shouldn't have the right to voice their opinion on the quality and nature of your streams ? Basically it all comes down to 3 choices : 1) Not saying something 2) saying it differently 3) or simply saying it. I chose the last option, as I don't really believe there is quite a different way to say it, and I'm not very good either at being a hypocrit. | ||
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dacthehork
United States2000 Posts
On August 03 2011 12:50 Tobi_Wan_Kenobi wrote: and you have a pm back begin the game of pong btw grats on the gamescom job, can't wait to watch. Sucks no co caster though, solocasting that whole tournament is gonna be tough. | ||
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djWHEAT
United States925 Posts
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ArchDC
Malaysia1996 Posts
On August 03 2011 13:01 djWHEAT wrote: Tobi has been confirmed for the show and we're happy to have him on. Cool, we should all do what we can for eSports overall. ^^ | ||
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dacthehork
United States2000 Posts
On August 03 2011 13:01 djWHEAT wrote: Tobi has been confirmed for the show and we're happy to have him on. Nice, hopefully it's a well done interview/discussion. | ||
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Ophi13
Canada238 Posts
 Sorry DJWheat  | ||
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Loodah
335 Posts
LMAO that was nothing compared to when boxer won in the semis..... I'm not saying fighting fans aren't crazy, they are (I am one too) - but that's not on the same level as the noise that was going on at MLG for Boxer. Believe me | ||
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Ladnil
United States93 Posts
On August 03 2011 16:36 Loodah wrote: LMAO that was nothing compared to when boxer won in the semis..... I'm not saying fighting fans aren't crazy, they are (I am one too) - but that's not on the same level as the noise that was going on at MLG for Boxer. Believe me We didn't carry on quite as long. Boxer isn't as much of a showboater, he actually seems kind of shy on stage sometimes. Maybe humbled by how awesome our crowd was. | ||
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gobrin
Canada96 Posts
On August 03 2011 12:56 Yeaaaah wrote:What do you want me to say ? It's a world of adult you're living in. And as they say : "If you can't take the heat : get out of the kitchen" Adults also say "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all." On August 03 2011 12:56 Yeaaaah wrote: If you know of any rethorical way of kindly saying to somebody that he sux at what he does without hurting him, I'm all ears. You can try constructive criticism. On August 03 2011 12:56 Yeaaaah wrote: and I'm not very good either at being a hypocrit. You're good at being a huge dbag though. | ||
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rotegirte
Germany2859 Posts
On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote: Since I've been somewhat blasted about the questions I asked (especially due to some not knowing the context of the discussion), I thought I would give my "thinking" on each question as I was writing it. And why I was asking the question in relation to my own knowledge. - Of the established leagues and competitions, who is the largest, what is the frequency of said events, and how much prize money has been given out (average) during these competitions? This one is pretty obvious. There are hundreds of competitions out there I don't know about, from Smash Bros. to Trackmania to DotA. My thinking was that by asking this question I could get a large sample of events from people to see the scope better. That's exactly what most answers produced. Almost everyone named the largest leagues and then talked about leagues they took interest in. Because my knowledge was pretty limited to things like ESWC and BlizzCon, I thought it would be appropriate. Yeah a lot of it has already been covered by others by now. To give you a rough crunch on the numbers, you could say you have 3-4 annual events ranging 20-40k USD, midrange events (couple of months) ranging 5-10k USD and the rest being random online leagues with swagger - 5K USD. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote:- DotA is popular in Asia, so are a million really bad MMO's... what efforts have been made to bring DotA OUT of Asia to other countries? (i.e. GomTV began English broadcasting several years ago). Does it need to leave Asia? Ok, I didn't need to put the jab about the really bad MMO's in there. However, I've done events from China, I've worked with gaming companies in China, and I'm very aware about the gaming bubble which exists over there (it's quite amazing as I'm sure many of you know). I asked this question because while I was doing research on the leagues and the Chinese player base I saw quite a few parallels between DotA and SC:BW. That's why I also asked if it needs to leave Asia because I wanted to know if people had a similar perspective. Many foreigner BW fans were fine with it in Korea because they had exposure to it. So it's almost leading up to a BW->SC2 scenario where SC2 starts mimicking Korea in foreign markets. Again I was looking for a DotA fan's perspective. There was one post addressing that already. Basically, the direction is the other way round. It all started in Europe / NA, arguably even more so in NA. In this first era we had an all-dominant powerhouse from NA, namely EG pitting against nordish MYM and SK. They were shaken by the emergence of russian based Virtus.Pro, that gave the first base for today's UKR / RUS based teams. Dota then happened to gain momentum first in SEA and only "recently" with the foreseeable death of WC3 also in CN. The initial cross-realm interaction was through online leagues only, where the asians got demolished due to inexperience and lag. Fast forward a year or two, western teams traveled to Malaysian SMM for the first time in history and asian teams were invited to ESWC in Paris and that marked the absolute domination of a new crop of asian teams. That said, your parallel is not completely off. Dota in Asia was being developed completely independent from the rest of the world, with an own approach to pro gaming culture and training regiment, a stand-alone ecosystem and tournament structure. Even within asia, there is only recent attempts on interaction between the respective countries, including invites, and player exchange. You could say that Dota, rivaling the "other legion of crappy MMO's" (that are absolutely there), has emerged as the winner. There is strong belief that this is due to Dota's refined and unbeatable gameplay in its genre. The argument is, that the more skilled team will consistently win more, and with every passing big tournament, the skill cap has been consistently breached again and again. Sky's the limit. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote:- Who is the Day[9] of DotA? I asked the same question prior to this list but it was worded differently. Who is the ambassador of DotA? With such an expansive community it seems like the field is quite limited in that regard. It was very obvious to me while researching that there are some die hard mother fuckers in DotA. I respect the hell out of that. I was wondering who those people are. I think maybe using Day[9] with out additional context prompted some people to say, "Well shit, there isn't anyone who does a Daily like Sean" (although it sounds like there is based on some tweets I got). I was more or less wondering who is the man sitting on top the mountain spilling the word to the community? To give credit to day9, he has created a very unique category of content. It is his very combination of extensive knowledge, experience and outgoing character that allowed him to do it. Sadly, this mix of person doesn't exist in Dota. It is like a Venn diagramm, where there is no overlap in all 3 areas, let alone 2. Dota is very Player - Team centric, since they are 1) the most visible ones and 2) pure skill being regarded the only legit currency. That said, currently respected players, that also have been around for long enough to give extensive oversight over the major lifespan of Dota are Maelk, Kuroky, Demon for EU/NA, LightOfHeaven, Dendi, Puppey for UKR/RUS and 2009/Dai for CN. Honorable mention goes to V1lat, NiNCOMPOOP for being most prominet people behind the EU/RUS scene. A special case are the casters / 3rd party content creators. They are somewhat of a more recent phenomenon, since shoutcasting is partly underdeveloped. TobiWanKenobi is the most popular english speaking one, V1lat caters the russian speaking audience. Third we have Luminous and all of Dotacommentaries.com. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote: - Does the population of Chinese players (which sounds like it's the biggest landscape of players) rely on non-legit versions of WarCraft 3: TFT? I always felt like one of the biggest issues with the advancement of DotA dating back to like BlizzCon 2005 was the fact that new players had to purchase WC3... this was also a problem with games like Quake 3. I'm just curious how that works in China (and everywhere else for that matter) I feel like some individuals interpreted this question as me attacking the community because I asked about the piracy. Not the case. Quake 3 CPMA had similar problems. For one, people had to get a copy of quake. Then they had to download this and that and make their config and it was impossible to get anyone into the game. THEN if you got them in... you might slaughter them and they don't want to play anymore. What I found out was most use systems similar to iCCUP which just happens to be the method of playing the game. Yes, it is safe to assume that a large majority of the worldwide Dota population does not own a legit copy of WC3. This is due to various reasons, the most obvious one being money. Second, Especially in asia, Dota is being played in bangs, where it is up to the owner of the place. Third, Bnet sucks, has been as 1.0 and (as we all know) still does in it's 2nd generation. That is why 100% of all leagues and 99% of all public play is being organised via VPN, regardless of having a legal copy or not. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote:- Is the DotA community satisfied living in a self-contained bubble? It seems like other eSports games/audiences are fairly uneducated when it comes to the history Rotegirte provided in this thread. Man, if you didn't see this thread then that question probably made me look like the biggest douchebag. I believe there are quite a few people (and I'm one of them) that don't know jack shit about the competitive DotA scene. In my experience, people in pro-gaming (from my background) are "aware" of DotA, but not necessarily as indepth as the history provided in this thread. The usage of "self-contained bubble" probably came off as somewhat abrasive, but it's similar to the Fighting Game Scene here in the US. It was large, yet small, and then when SF4 hit the whole thing exploded. It was a self-contained bubble for quite sometime and was very successful even before the "boom". It wasn't meant to be disrespectful, but it is my philosophy that a game and community is better off without the bubble. It is a two-edged sword and not easy to answer. If asked straight up, no. Dota is craving for a break-through. We gain in numbers, but that growth is happening across mainstreet. The game is not easy to understand, and maybe never will be. That is the reason many feel being looked down on, since you really can only acknowledge the play with a certain level of insight. There is that elitism and the feeling of being abandoned. The fact that everything you see now is being built without any outside help or interest. It is an explosive and unfortunate mix of high entry barrier, defensive attitude and urge for recognition at the same time. A problem certainly to be solved. It will take dedicated members of our community like Dotacommentaries to open it up. On a different note, I want to apologize in behalf of the rude responses you have indirectly gotten from GG.net and Playdota.com. It's a cut-throat game. If you suck, people will dwell on it, the winner takes all bragging rights. That in itself is another huge problem of the game. I'll just say, that there are many people that remember you from the fateful episode of Lo3. But again, there are indeed people that think different. If you went back on GG.net, there has been a second thread discussing the very questions you made. And also on Playdota.com, there were really good and honest responses also. To understand Dota, understand that we have been growing up as outcasts, embracing shit-talk and trolling, but ultimatively taking the decisive argument to the battle-field, that is the only thing that counts. And many old-guards tend to uphold that feeling. That is something to be changed. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote:- Why do you think there are people (like myself) who have extensive knowledge in eSports, yet don't know much about DotA? Is this the fault of the individual? Or is it the fault of the collective DotA community? Or is there no fault at all and it's just two paths that have not crossed? Someone else actually said it best. It was more self-reflection. I asked for it in this one. Some blamed me, others blamed the community, some said it was the game itself. My interest in gaming has expanded over many games. I knew that if I asked this question I would get straight responses and I was hoping to get them from the perspective of a dedicated DotA player/fan. A large part of it I already addressed in the previous answer. Let's leave it at unfortunate circumstances, and again an insanely high entry barrier. However, if there is blame to take, I will take it for our community. I have grown attached to the every-day trolling, but it is certainly menacing for anyone outside. We like to play the bad-boys more often than not, but the number of people willing to give a hand and help interested individuals is growing. In fact, if you look closely, there are numerous threads on Playdota asking for help of beginners, and if being polite and sincere, they were always being helped (minus 30% trolling). On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote:- If someone heard about DotA and wanted to get into it at the most basic level, which website would you send them to? If I had no one to ask, how hard would it be for me to find? Would it be PLAYDOTA.com? Playdota.com, read every page including "Heroes", "Items", "Guides". That's the toughest part really. Then take it to the forums, finding playing partners and next step would be Dotacommentaries and last GG.net for competitive news and replays. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote:- SC2 and Street Fighter 4 have been two games that have proven that they can carry an active audience of people who do not even play the game. Do you think this audience already exists in the DotA scene and if not, do you think it can? I'm pretty vocal about the fact that I believe these games have a difficult time appealing to someone outside of the player base. Remarkably, both SC2 and SF4 (maybe even MvC3 and MK9) have proven to have this "magic" which draws non-players to the games. I give credit to DotA for being an intense game of complexity... but I feel like it's like trying to cram a 1000 page book into a 2 hour movie. The last part is very much true. But at the same time it is Dota's biggest potential. Take a shoutcast at any given point and it will leave things to be desired. To answer your question regarding the mainstream - no. Not at this point. Or rather not yet. But I firmly believe, that there is so much more you can do as caster. Dota lives from its developtment, it is a soccer game rather than a big clash. If casters learn to tell the story, it will make it easier. On August 03 2011 12:36 djWHEAT wrote: - Who is your favorite team? Just wanted to see if there was a "dominate" answer. Ks.int, sadly not existing anymore. | ||
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Darthozzan
Sweden136 Posts
 Sent WHEAT a massive email with my answers, glad to see there are DotA fans here on TeamLiquid! | ||
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djWHEAT
United States925 Posts
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Yeaaaah
Belarus27 Posts
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Evermourn
227 Posts
http://www.playdota.com/forums/505503-page3/help-djwheat-understand-dota-scene/#post2690936 | ||
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Zhang
United States129 Posts
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Slasher
United States1095 Posts
Live On Three #82 will recap what was the most momentous, passionate, and pure largest weekend in eSports/Competitive Gaming history with the EVO 2011 World Finals, MLG Anaheim, and the GSL July finals. As was expected by many, Korea dominated MLG, Japan won Arcade Edition at EVO (though America stepped up), and the GSL finals was another 4-0 sweep. We examine why all of this happened and if the American/Foreign players for Starcraft 2 and Fighting Games will be on notice from these events and work harder, or continue to fluster when it comes to playing fierce competition. EVO official streamer Victor "Spooky" Fontanez will join the show to discuss all of the weekend's events in Marvel vs Capcom 3, SSF4AE, Mortal Kombat 9, and how it felt to stream EVO for the very first time. We will also be previewing this weekend's QuakeCon event which might be the final major Quake event for some time with special guest QuakeCon caster Jay "2GD" Harding. Additionally, DotA2 will make its reveal at GamesCom in two weeks with a debut 1.7 million dollar prize purse. We have asked lead caster Tobi to come on the show to discuss the game and genre we have largely ignored up until now. Other topics tonight include: Other topics tonight include: - Preview of East Coast SBO qualifiers by Spooky - MLG/IEM date conflict - MVP & Bomber confirmed for MLG Raleigh - EG drop fRoD and Storm without much announcement - GSL Code A/S brackets released & more! | ||
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Slasher
United States1095 Posts
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Grettin
42381 Posts
On August 04 2011 06:46 Slasher wrote: Updated other topic list slightly, get ready bitches! Fuck you Wheat Destiny sucks! Oh no you didn't! Can't wait for Lo3 tonight. Dota/Dota 2 topic is going to be interesting since Tobi is coming. | ||
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Crais
Canada2136 Posts
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